Luring VWL/BCV/BWV lovers to the next DCV

[salmoneous]

In all honestly, not trying to cause any trouble here and I hope this conversation will stay "fun". Let me start by laying out a few thoughts that I hope aren't controversial:

1) We can break the DVC resorts into two groups. Those associated with a "Deluxe" Disney hotel (VWL/BCV/BWV) and those in stand-alone DVC resorts.

2) DVC will work best when there is balance. For every 100 points hotel-associated owners want to use at stand-alones this year, you ideally have 100 points that stand-alone owners want to use at hotel-associated resorts.

3) In the future, DVC will add more stand-alone units than hotel associated. (This may be a bit controversial, but just from a space standpoint you can only build so many DVC's near the existing deluxe hotels; but you have almost unlimited space to build stand-alones).

4) You've got two options to keep balance should DVC add more stand-alone units. You'll either need to attract lots of owners to the stand-alones who aren't all that interested in the hotel-associated DVC's, or build stand alones that are attractive to hotel-associated owners.

5) For the first option, I can see something like a DVC-Hawaii attracting owners who aren't necessarily interested in staying at a hotel-associated DVC. But I'll save discussion of that option for another day, and focus on the second option.

What can Disney do when they build new stand-alone DVC's that will make them attractive to owners of hotel-associated DVC's. In particular, for those current hotel-associated owners who haven't been lured to the existing stand-alones, what features would, say, an EP resort have to have to lure you away from the hotel-associated.

Bigger units?
Cheaper (points/night) units?
Amenities you can't get at the hotel associated?
Interesting designs and theming?

 

[crisi]

Stand alone resorts that are hotel like - interior hallways, restaurants, etc. Alternatively, stand alone villas or buildings that are much smaller - like OKW (which is a lot like CBR, but with Villas instead of rooms). The combination of large complexes with exterior halls is off putting to a lot of people, but a lot of people are still intrigued by the Treehouse Villas.

Lower point costs if you are farther away from the theme parks.

Bigger rooms if you are far away from the theme parks.

Location is one of the huge drivers for BWV/BCV (and to a lesser extent - VWL) lovers. Its hard to compensate for "you can walk to Epcot five minutes before Illuminations starts, see Illuminations, and walk back to your room" for people who enjoy that. That doesn't mean this is a universal charm, but it does seem to be attractive to many. Since there isn't a lot of real estate close to the parks, DVC may have to give up the idea of balance.

A "grand old" resort. More hotely than timesharey - I think what it often comes down to is that BCV/VWL/BWV lovers like HOTELS. We like a valet and a bellhop (and, yeah, you can get a Bellhop at OKW or SSR, but the golf cart isn't the same) and the grand lobby and room service. Some of us would have never bought a "timeshare" - we bought a "prepaid hotel." A DVC hotel that offered an even more hotelish experience (concerige services, turndown, etc) might go over.

Unfortunately, with SSR I think Disney painted itself into a corner. Adding a resort with bigger rooms for less points (and OKW like resort) will devalue SSR. And with the BWV Standard View rooms, its really going to be tough.

By the way, I like balance, but I don't think its a criteria for DVC. Nor do I think that at this point in the development it can be. They've knocked it out of achievability - they did way back when they built VWL - if not before when they caved to the idea of Standard View rooms. SSR made it worse, but they system lacked balance before then.

 

[spiceycat]

most of the hotels ones are near a theme park.... that is the draw...

now if DVC put on with PO - I don't see this one being more popular than SSR or OKW....

It is being able to walk or boat to a theme park that makes BWV, BCV and VWL so popular..... of course I do appreciate room service....

besides I am still hopping for the Cont or some other monrail resorts to join the DVC.....

 

[Chuck S]

I think there is a lot that can be done with condo style resorts similar in size to SSR at WDW. Theming is one option..a Hawaiian style with exotic landscaping and a well themed pool would probably be an attractive resort. I think the Southwest Theme of Eagle Pines is nice idea that could have added features, a desert themed zero entry pool...maybe the slide could wind past imitation cactus and desert wildlife.

Better use of the remaining "institute" buildings at SSR would be a plus, maybe a nice dinner show in the theater. Personally I'd love to see the Turtle Shack at OKW turned into a nice walk up ice cream parlor and specialty drink type facility. (Sort of like Gurgling Suitcase with ice cream.)

Things can be done at every DVC resort, both condo and hotel style, to improve them. And they don't have to be major, costly renovations.

 

[dianeschlicht]

I agree with Chuck that there is much that can be done to improve the existing standalones to make them more of a draw, but in reality, I think the real draw that OKW has over SSR is the larger units for less points in smaller buildings with parking outside your door.

I know when they were getting ready to start SSR, they asked a lot of questions of members about what they would be interested in. I think the larger rooms and less points and parking outside the door came up a lot, and that's why we see each building at SSR having stand alone parking and lower point costs than the DVCs attached to hotels. Unfortunately, they still kept the units the same smaller size and made the buildings hotel like, so you still don't park outside your door.

If DVC was going to add a new stand alone resort that was going to attract me, it would need the following things (in no particular order)...
1. vacation home type units that don't feel like a hotel/
2. A getaway feel to the resort that gives a good respit from the hubbub of the parks.
3. Buildings with elevators but no long hallways.
4. Be an "all inclusive resort", so if I chose not to go to the parks, there would be plenty to occupy me and hold my interest. This would include great themeing and possibly activities related to the theme.
5. Put it in another great destination, like Hawaii.

 

[bobbiwoz]

A pool to rival SAB would "do it" for me. I like to swim and not just enjoy the pool chairs, and I could stay in SAB for more time than anywhere else. 2nd choice is the villa pool at VWL, just for the atmosphere as I swim.

I know you're talking about the future, and right now, I'm very happy with what there is. I do think that parking at SSR was convenient, and I like/need elevators, however, if I'm given a choice of SSR or OKW it's my DH who has the preference, OKW, and I ask for first floor or elevator building.

IF my extended family comes again next year, we would opt for SSR because of the ages of the DGC and the 0 entry pool, and Donald Duck area and try to get a dedicated 2 bedroom, and the points would be less than what we are using this year at VWL.

My tag says that I have 2 opinions, well, I have many opinions, and what I can say is that while I think VWL is my absolute favorite, and SAB is my favorite pool, I have not at any time on any visit said to myself, "Boy, I'm sorry I'm staying at ________, this place isn't really DVC for me."

Bobbi

 

[LisaS]

I would definitely be lured by a new resort that was nicely themed and was a destination in and of itself that featured:
- villas the size of those at OKW with verandas (or at least larger balconies than those at most DVC resorts)
- three restaurants: one counter service, one casual, one fine dining, plus an ice cream/snack shop
- large main pool area with lazy river plus at least one quiet pool (or more depending on resort size)
- fitness center and spa (jacuzzis, sauna, etc.)
- other activities right at the resort: mini-golf, boating, bike riding, how about a place to rent and ride Segways?
- lots of places to walk around on the resort grounds for those after-dinner strolls

 

[MiaSRN62]

of course I do appreciate room service....

Things can be done at every DVC resort, both condo and hotel style, to improve them. And they don't have to be major, costly renovations.

Agreed....and there's absolutely no reason OKW & SSR can't have room service ? This is just one of the things that bugs me. I own an offsite timeshare as well (Vistana). This resort is set up like OKW...various 2-5 floor buildings scattered in a neighborhood-like setting. And Vistana is at least 2-3 x bigger than OKW. There are 2 restaurants and a Pizza Hut on the Vistana property----you can order room service from all them with delivery right to your villa door for a $3 nominal fee. I just don't understand why OKW/SSR cannot do this ? Makes no sense to me. We order room service at OKW often from offsite restaurants. I just think about others who must do the same and how much disney loses out on revenue here ?

 

[Chuck S]

Agreed....and there's absolutely no reason OKW & SSR can't have room service ? This is just one of the things that bugs me. I own an offsite timeshare as well (Vistana). This resort is set up like OKW...various 2-5 floor buildings scattered in a neighborhood-like setting. And Vistana is at least 2-3 x bigger than OKW. There are 2 restaurants and a Pizza Hut on the Vistana property----you can order room service from all them with delivery right to your villa door for a $3 nominal fee. I just don't understand why OKW/SSR cannot do this ? Makes no sense to me. We order room service at OKW often from offsite restaurants. I just think about others who must do the same and how much disney loses out on revenue here ?

Olivia's kitchen is on the small side. They would more than likely have to build a new facility or do a major renovation to offer room service at OKW, unless it were pre-made sandwiches or something. The smart thing, though non-Disney, would be for Earl of Sandwich to offer delivery to OKW and SSR for an additional fee. For quasi-Disney room service, the pizza place at Port Orleans does deliver to OKW.

 

[MiaSRN62]

Hi Chuck,
I wasn't aware the kitchen was small at Olivia's. Believe me, the restaurants onsite at Vistana are quite small as well. The seating area holds much less tables than at Olivia's, but of course that says nothing about kitchen size. It all just seems to run so smoothly at Vistana and with that being an even larger resort, I guess I just wish Disney/OKW could work something out. It is a problem that Goods To Go closes at 10 pm too ? I really feel they should remain open until at least 11pm or midnight for dining options after returning from the parks. It's one of the things I prefer about Vistana----much more onsite dining options. And, yes, we have ordered from Sassagoula Pizza as well as offsite restaurants. One of our fav offsite places is : http://www.giordanos.com/menu.php
But I'd much prefer to order from Olivia's......though I do love your idea about the Earl of Sandwhich delivering to OKW/SSR. That would be terrific. I just think disney let the ball drop as far as dining options at OKW.

 

[Debi]

For me, it's all about location. I'm very spoiled by being able to walk to 2 Disney theme parks (Epcot and MGM). If DVC would build a stand alone resort in the Epcot area, I'd seriously consider buying an add-on. I love the setup of OKW, but the location of BWV is the reason why I bought there.

 

[lisareniff]

Hello I'm Lisa and I am a hotel type DVC lover.

When I choose where I want to stay on vacation... it is where I'm going to vacation. I don't want to travel to my vacation. So location is prime.

I will us BCV as an example since I have only stayed there so far. When we stay at BCV our vacation is centered on spending time at the pool, Epcot, MGM, Mini golf with the various restaurants in the area. I also enjoy the architecture of the buildings themselves as well. The architecture inspires me and is not over a powering size in relation to people. It is more intimate and personal.

We will be staying at VWL and BWV next trip. I haven't even seen either OKW or SSR, but I have a harder time wanting to have our vacation there.

If DVC builds another resort I hope it creates a resort that I want to spend my vacation. Having it attached to a park is an easy way to make this happen. If it is not attached to a park having other aspects at the resort that are worth spending my vacation. Lisa S had a nice list.

 

[Chuck S]

Hi Chuck,
I wasn't aware the kitchen was small at Olivia's. Believe me, the restaurants onsite at Vistana are quite small as well. The seating area holds much less tables than at Olivia's, but of course that says nothing about kitchen size. It all just seems to run so smoothly at Vistana and with that being an even larger resort, I guess I just wish Disney/OKW could work something out. It is a problem that Goods To Go closes at 10 pm too ? I really feel they should remain open until at least 11pm or midnight for dining options after returning from the parks. It's one of the things I prefer about Vistana----much more onsite dining options. And, yes, we have ordered from Sassagoula Pizza as well as offsite restaurants. One of our fav offsite places is : http://www.giordanos.com/menu.php
But I'd much prefer to order from Olivia's......though I do love your idea about the Earl of Sandwhich delivering to OKW/SSR. That would be terrific. I just think disney let the ball drop as far as dining options at OKW.

I agree room service would be a nice option at OKW.

Although Olivia's kitchen has gone through one renovation, it is still quite small. During the first renovation they brought in a "finger food buffet" from another location (yuck!). No way could that kitchen handle a rush of room service orders. Another option would be for Disney to build a central room service kitchen for PO, OKW and SSR. I imagine a custom designed kitchen that does nothing but room service could offer a nice selection and be quite efficient. Maybe run a single shift from 4pm to midnight.

 

[CarolMN]

We bought BWV in 1999 for the location and are not yet interested in staying at any of the other WDW DVC resorts. Maybe we won't ever be. We did use points once to stay at VB, but probably will not do that again. I'd rather pay cash there.

To entice me, the new stand alone resort would have to have a lower point schedule than BCV/VWL & PV at BWV, and offer a perk unique to those who actually stay there. Something akin to a free round of golf (or a significatly discounted round) for each stay that was 5 days or longer. Actually that wouldn't influence me personally, but it would greatly influence my DH and I do have to occasionally defer to him to keep the peace, LOL. FWIW, he's the one who insisted we buy BWV over OKW.

Best wishes -

 

[Granny]

I would definitely be lured by a new resort that was nicely themed and was a destination in and of itself that featured:
- villas the size of those at OKW with verandas (or at least larger balconies than those at most DVC resorts)
- three restaurants: one counter service, one casual, one fine dining, plus an ice cream/snack shop
- large main pool area with lazy river plus at least one quiet pool (or more depending on resort size)
- fitness center and spa (jacuzzis, sauna, etc.)
- other activities right at the resort: mini-golf, boating, bike riding, how about a place to rent and ride Segways?
- lots of places to walk around on the resort grounds for those after-dinner strolls

This sums up my feelings very well. If they could build something unique, and a destination unto itself then I think they could do very well. And it would have to be a destination that the entire family would enjoy or else you would only attract a particular group of DVCers.

So that rules out EPV unless they build an SAB-type mega-pool.

Of course, they could just build something and then make the point structure lower to attract people. But the lower the point structure, the fewer points they can sell for the entire resort so that would restrict their revenue stream a bit.

 

[tomandrobin]

Give me a big lazy river. I don't need a mega pool with slides. Add some misters and shade trees around the perimeter so I don't bake in the sun all day and I'm good!

As far as SSR, I'm sure there is some future plans for all the space that the DVC operations are using. I'm guessing they can add some more dining, they'll need when the other 8 buildings come into the system. Maybe shows of some type or like the above post said, a dinner show.

 

[Divamomto3]

I love the hotel atmosphere and do miss certain things about it at SSR. I miss the grand lobby, bell hop, room service, and sit down restaurant. (I haven't seen the sit down Turf Club yet, but I don't think it compares to an Artist's Pointe or Yachtsman Steakhouse.) But I love the relaxing atmosphere of SSR very, very much. I also love the rooms and decor of SSR. I do like being close to downtown Disney and while staying at BCV, I adore walking into Epcot, I can live with taking the buses from SSR.

What SSR needs for me to be really great is: (in no particular order)
1) a signature restaurant
2) an ice cream shop
3) the ability for my husband or I to either get 2 drinks up at the bar so we don't have to trek there together every time, or poolside bar service like at BC/YC and GF. I promise not to give a margarita to my 6 year old. And before you flame me, I can order as many drinks as I want at Mexico's Cantina in World Showcase and shlep them over to my waiting husband, sister, etc at our fireworks perch so why can't I do that poolside at a Disney resort?
4) a dinner show as suggested would be great
5) another theme pool over near the new buildings
6) more reliable resort transport service to go from the far Congress Park buildings to the Carriage House or from the Springs to the DD walkway, etc. I know it's not that far, but honestly, sometimes I find the Florida humidity unbearable.

The next DVC I'd be most interested in would be one attached to a deluxe hotel like the Poly, AK, Contemporary, or Grand Floridian.

 

[diznyfanatic]

We would be attracted to a stand alone DVC property if, as others have mentioned, Disney designed it as a quasi attraction of it's own. I think it would be really wonderful if Disney would combine some of the best features of each of the current resorts and then added something unique to the new resort. So, as long as we're dreaming:

It would be awesome to incorporate a pool area styled after SAB at BC, or a Lazy River, themed appropriately to the resort and it's unique style.

We love the campfires, star gazing, turtle walks, pool contests, etc at VB. They also have a really lovely greens area where all of the kids gather to play kickball, softball, dodgeball, etc. Would love to see more daily community inspired activities offered.

We really appreciate all of the dining options available at BWV, which would be a wonderful addition to a new resort.

We love the beauty of the theming at VWL, and the attention to detail that went into it thoughout the entire resort. Love all of the quiet nooks and crannies to escape to in the villas. A uniquely detailed theme would definitely appeal to us.

The larger room sizes at OKW are so nice and comfortable.

The spa at SSR would be a nice addition as well.

Really enjoy all of the watercraft, bikes, walkways to stroll, volleyball, shuffleboard, mini-golf etc.

Elevators would be really nice to have.

Screened porches to keep all of those nasty bugs away

An ice cream or soda shop.

Charcter meals or dinner shows.

An old time "hometown" movie theatre offering all of the Disney old and new classics as well as some first run movies.

On onsite General Store stocked with basic food supplies and drug store essentials. Every single trip, we end up having to go to the drugstore or grocery store for something we couldn't find on property. At Christmas time, it was for wrapping paper (I stupidly forgot it at home). Called every gift shop on property and no one had any!

Supervised activities designed for children ages 3-12 with child care offered for short durations.

If it would be a large resort such as SSR, then I'd like to see an enhanced internal shuttle system to take guests back and forth from all the main activities, dining and pool areas. I don't like having to load the car up, and try to find parking to go to the pool or enjoy activities it it's too far to walk with little ones

I would dearly love somewhere that I could spend all day simply relaxing and letting the resort be the star attraction, without going to the parks at all on a couple of days. Especially for those adults only trips.

 

[starbox]

I'd like to see an internationally themed DVC resort, something that has not been covered yet.

I also think it would be very cool if SSR added in a pony barn and pony/horse camp as a recreation option. Horses plus the mommy and me services at the spa plus access to the bibbidi bobbidi boutique would = little girl heaven. I'd have given up a trip to Disney if it had meant I could ride a pony when I was 7.

 

[Chuck S]

I'd like to see an internationally themed DVC resort, something that has not been covered yet.

Taking that a step further, they could have 11 groups of buildings, wth each group being themed after an Epcot World Showcase country. At least, I think it would be interesting.