Love to Hate Disney?

[Eoghann]

I don't think it's so much that people are negative as that they're basically saying the same things again and again. As are those on the other side.

When I look at this forum I basically see the same arguments that were going on last year (Frozen in Norway, I don't like Avatar, Universal is so much better than Disney, FP+ suck!, FP+ Is awesome!).

This is partly perhaps due to a lack of new news. But also because people who bother to post on boards like this are kind of obsessive and just can't let things go. It gets old fast, which is why I rarely post.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I don't think it's so much that people are negative as that they're basically saying the same things again and again. As are those on the other side.

When I look at this forum I basically see the same arguments that were going on last year (Frozen in Norway, I don't like Avatar, Universal is so much better than Disney, FP+ suck!, FP+ Is awesome!).

This is partly perhaps due to a lack of new news. But also because people who bother to post on boards like this are kind of obsessive and just can't let things go. It gets old fast, which is why I rarely post.

I have to say I agree with your point, reasoning, and your point

 

[a11ie]

As long as youre expressing your opinion politely I'm all for it; positive or negative. Its when people get nasty about it that makes all the difference. You can express a negative opinion very positively, or a positive one negatively. Its all in the wording and delivery, my dears.

I can see why people are critical of Disney but I also understand those defending it. I miss the "good ol' Disney" days as much as the next guy but I'm so in love with WDW that I can't stop giving them the benefit of the doubt. However, everyone has a breaking point. I'm not thrilled at all with FP+ and having to plan everything out. I liked being able to go and just "do" but I realize that's from my spoiled life as a Dis regular. I'm sure there are many families who feel at ease being able to plan every last second of their trip months in advance.

Win some, lose some. I can deal with it.. Until I can't. ;-)

 

[PuppyJonathan]

Yes but they take their news and rumors board seriously. That site breaks news more than anyone else.

I know this is a little late to the game but the I love going to the non-forums because the quality of the updates

 

[PuppyJonathan]

Sorry to double post but I just found this:

I also don't know why there was a change from cool area specific merchandise to generic Disney Parks products (actually I do know why and it wasn't consumer driven)

This was something that I missed a lot actually, and I'm glad it's starting to come back. Although I'm not sure my wallet likes this

 

[DDLand]

You know, I try to straggle the line. I'm willing to be positive towards WDW, but I'm also willing to criticize it where I find it's due. I do think sometimes people (including myself) take it over the top. I sometimes see people (including myself) take positions that are just hard to justify, either negative or positive.

Why?

Because as people make statements and take positions that are radical, it makes us swing to the other side. I know sometimes I'll take a more radical position because this place is polarizing. Very polarizing.

Of course none of this matters. With Avatar, Disney has a lot to prove. They can silence their toughest critics if this land is great. Disney fans are forgiving. All Disney has to do is deliver an amazing product.

It's that simple.

Disney can amaze if they choose, all eyes are on Anaheim, let's hope they go for the best.

 

[iamsarahpotts]

Do any of you folks have any recommended reads on the Disney Co. that could maybe put some more of your thoughts into context? Some good websites or books that would illuminate for me the changes that have occurred over the last couple decades that so many people are referencing? (especially in regard to the leadership at Disney)

Thanks!

 

[DDLand]

I think we should be open and respectful to new posters opinions, but new posters should also be open to new ideas themselves.

Sometimes I see new posters get slammed in unnecessarily harsh ways. Anything from a condescending response to questions, to outright hostility to new posters are some of the things I've observed. Instead of curating a place where everyone can share ideas and perspectives, they're dismissed in an unfortunate manner. I'm pretty sure you have to have a pretty thick skin to ever become a "veteran." That's a shame.

At the same time, I do see new posters who are a bit grumpy themselves. Far from innocent questions, they have every intention of creating tension.

Respect is needed on both sides. I've learned a lot in the last few months of posting. I feel like my opinions were alright back in January, but they're more refined now. The more you post, the better you get. So new posters need to remember that. At the same time, veterans need to remember the only way to become a veteran is by being a new member with 10 posts.

So keep it civil!

 

[socrateze]

Do any of you folks have any recommended reads on the Disney Co. that could maybe put some more of your thoughts into context? Some good websites or books that would illuminate for me the changes that have occurred over the last couple decades that so many people are referencing? (especially in regard to the leadership at Disney)

Thanks!

Walt Disney by Neal Gabler

Disney War by James B Stewart


I also like listening to the Unofficial Guide's Disney Dish Podcast with Len Testa and Jim Hill

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Walt Disney by Neal Gabler

Disney War by James B Stewart


I also like listening to the Unofficial Guide's Disney Dish Podcast with Len Testa and Jim Hill

Agree...

Project future and married to the mouse are also fantastic wdw specific books that provide enough hard info to make it worthwhile...

If you want some salt on it...team
Rodent...which has an agenda but alot of "matter of fact" real info that goes to the ethos in a small read.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

You know, I try to straggle the line. I'm willing to be positive towards WDW, but I'm also willing to criticize it where I find it's due. I do think sometimes people (including myself) take it over the top. I sometimes see people (including myself) take positions that are just hard to justify, either negative or positive.

Why?

Because as people make statements and take positions that are radical, it makes us swing to the other side. I know sometimes I'll take a more radical position because this place is polarizing. Very polarizing.

Of course none of this matters. With Avatar, Disney has a lot to prove. They can silence their toughest critics if this land is great. Disney fans are forgiving. All Disney has to do is deliver an amazing product.

It's that simple.

Disney can amaze if they choose, all eyes are on Anaheim, let's hope they go for the best.

Ok...

The last line is telling though...

"If they choose"...

Traditional Disney never did
Anything in half measures...sometimes to their own detriment...but as a consumer you knew what you could count on.

Even to suggest that the quality is "optional" is a huge issue...imho

 

[DDLand]

Ok...

The last line is telling though...

"If they choose"...

Traditional Disney never did
Anything in half measures...sometimes to their own detriment...but as a consumer you knew what you could count on.

Even to suggest that the quality is "optional" is a huge issue...imho

To nit pick slightly, I do think whatever Disney puts in will be "quality." I don't think anyone would say Mine Train is low quality, but it is relatively unambitious. In the same way Disney has the potential to to amaze, they also have the ability to just meet expectations.

So in a nutshell, quality isn't an issue in my book, but ambition is.

I'm just hoping that they amaze.

 

[socrateze]

To nit pick slightly, I do think whatever Disney puts in will be "quality." I don't think anyone would say Mine Train is low quality, but it is relatively unambitious. In the same way Disney has the potential to to amaze, they also have the ability to just meet expectations.

So in a nutshell, quality isn't an issue in my book., but ambition is.

I'm just hoping that they amaze.

Mine train isn't low quality, but I was disappointed. I wasn't expecting a headliner. But why make the train rock back and forth, and make it unnoticeable for most passengers?

 

[iamsarahpotts]

Walt Disney by Neal Gabler

Disney War by James B Stewart


I also like listening to the Unofficial Guide's Disney Dish Podcast with Len Testa and Jim Hill

Agree...

Project future and married to the mouse are also fantastic wdw specific books that provide enough hard info to make it worthwhile...

If you want some salt on it...team
Rodent...which has an agenda but alot of "matter of fact" real info that goes to the ethos in a small read.

Thanks!

 

[DDLand]

Mine train isn't low quality, but I was disappointed. I wasn't expecting a headliner. But why make the train rock back and forth, and make it unnoticeable for most passengers?

Agreed, they sold it completely wrong. Really a more apt name would be the Hype Train.

Though before completely dismissing the swaying, I'd be interested in riding it without that feature. Perhaps it plays a larger role than most realize, and it is integral.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I think mine train is riding in the boat with soarin and midway mania...

Good additions...but not headliners.

The wait times and lemming travelers have created an environment where the hype is forming the truth...where the truth should debunk the hype.

Because they have two hours waits...people get whipped up into a frenzy during trip planning and the "reality" of the ride has been thrown out of whack.

Certain...umm... Webboards...have all but encouraged such behavior.

Mine train should have been treated
Like little
Mermaid or the new dumbo, frankly...a good solid addition but in no way a headliner.

 

[LaidBackDad]

I'm totally confused as to why some people automatically equate a few critical post by a member to mean that they hate WDW. I also don't like singling out one member; but, since lockedoutlogic has already been mentioned numerous times, I will use him as an example. It seems clear to me that anyone who reads his post can see the guy is a hugely passionate Disney fan. It is equally apparent the guy has more insight and knowledge about all things Disney than the average customer at WDW. I also find his most of his post to be quite entertaining even if I don't agree with them. He can be critical of WDWC, is a wordsmith, and he may go overboard with some of his colorful colloquialisms; but, none of that would give me any inclination that he "hates" WDW. Actually, I get the opposite impression.

All of that makes me wonder where I may fall on the spectrum. I just returned from WDW. My last stop before heading home was DTD. I have to say, I was completely blown away. Not by DTD itself, but by the parking garage. That is the most kick a$$ parking garage I have ever been in. It is amazing how it tells you how many spaces are left on each level and even each row. I was blown away by how nice it was, all of the technology involved, and how much easier it was to find a good parking space. I can't say enough good things about the garage. That said, it's a freaking parking garage! Why can't WDWC put that kind of effort into developing a new attraction that blows me away as much as the garage does? WDW has so many wonderful things and does so many things so well; but, it's not perfect. If someone points out one of WDW's mistakes or expresses an opinion that is not complimentary, why does that make them a WDW hater?

 

[iamsarahpotts]

I'm totally confused as to why some people automatically equate a few critical post by a member to mean that they hate WDW. I also don't like singling out one member; but, since lockedoutlogic has already been mentioned numerous times, I will use him as an example. It seems clear to me that anyone who reads his post can see the guy is a hugely passionate Disney fan. It is equally apparent the guy has more insight and knowledge about all things Disney than the average customer at WDW. I also find his most of his post to be quite entertaining even if I don't agree with them. He can be critical of WDWC, is a wordsmith, and he may go overboard with some of his colorful colloquialisms; but, none of that would give me any inclination that he "hates" WDW. Actually, I get the opposite impression.

All of that makes me wonder where I may fall on the spectrum. I just returned from WDW. My last stop before heading home was DTD. I have to say, I was completely blown away. Not by DTD itself, but by the parking garage. That is the most kick a$$ parking garage I have ever been in. It is amazing how it tells you how many spaces are left on each level and even each row. I was blown away by how nice it was, all of the technology involved, and how much easier it was to find a good parking space. I can't say enough good things about the garage. That said, it's a freaking parking garage! Why can't WDWC put that kind of effort into developing a new attraction that blows me away as much as the garage does? WDW has so many wonderful things and does so many things so well; but, it's not perfect. If someone points out one of WDW's mistakes or expresses an opinion that is not complimentary, why does that make them a WDW hater?

As the person who started this thread, I will (again) use a perfect example of the kind of thing I was talking about that was actually posted on this thread in response to my original post. Someone used the phrase people will "unhappily visit" WDW. To me that is on another level than criticising one mistake or express an uncomplimentary opinion.

I have a hard time relating to what would drive a person to spend a bunch of their hard earned money and time to "unhappily visit" WDW when there is a whole world to explore.

Throughout this thread though people have explained that there is a history which compels them to visit even if they have become somewhat disenchanted. Doesn't mean they hate it, but doesn't mean they are great with the current state of things either. Which again, I don't really relate to but I can understand.

The whole point of starting this thread was to dig deeper into that. Now I obviously recognize I don't speak for everyone, but you can at least know where I'm coming from.

 

[socrateze]

I have a hard time relating to what would drive a person to spend a bunch of their hard earned money and time to "unhappily visit" WDW when there is a whole world to explore.

Well, I can give an example: a colleague hates Disney passionately, but he took his grandkids because it made them happy.

 

[iamsarahpotts]

Well, I can give an example: a colleague hates Disney passionately, but he took his grandkids because it made them happy.

Grandparent of the Year!