I would be all in favor of putting an end to comparisons between paper FP and FP+ now that the last paper FP machine has been gone for over a year.
But, I'm not sure it's possible to completely separate people's feelings about FP+ from their feelings about paper FP. Just look at how many posts there are from people who say that they dislike FP+ because they think it has reduced what they think they can get out of their WDW vacations. There are some posters who are so passionate about these feelings that they will repeat their dislike for FP+ several times a day virtually every day.
Comparisons are also inevitable because people who are planning their trips, but haven't yet experienced FP+, want to know how they might have to alter their approach to the parks.
We'll never know how people would have reacted to FP+ if it had been the first iteration of FP and the only basis for comparison were the standby only approach that existed for decades before paper FP came along. We could ask now if people would prefer FP+ to a standby only system, but I think those responses would be colored by the opinions people have already formed about FP+. People who really hate FP+ because of the advance planning and the elimination of the "clean slate" would presumably still prefer a standby only system because that provides the most spontaneity. But people whose hate of FP+ is based mostly on the fact that it keeps them from getting as many FPs as they got before might have a more difficult time answering if they are really honest with themselves.
As for when people formed their feelings about FP+, I think you would agree that a lot of those opinions were formed without any experience with the system at all. Some of the most ardent opponents of FP+ have still not tried it, but that doesn't keep them from having strong opinions about when FP+ works well and when it doesn't.
Speaking for myself, I don't love or hate FP+. I have always loved visiting WDW and that hasn't changed. I PREFER FP+ to paper FP, but that brings in that darn comparison again. When I first heard about paper FP years ago, I initially thought it was strange to get a reservation to get on a ride later instead of the old fashioned way in which you stood in line like everyone else. But, we dealt with it and it didn't have a significant impact on our trips one way or the other.
I had a similar reaction when I first heard about FP+, but then I got to thinking that it could be pretty good because we could pick out rides to do at times that we could pick and at times of day at which we knew lines would be long. I also knew it would be great for arrival days. But, another one of my initial reactions was that they wouldn't allow us to get FPs in advance for all of the most popular attractions in a park. In other words, I expected numerical limits and I expected some sort of tiering. But, because I recognized that limits like this would be necessary to give everyone a reasonably equal shot at desirable FPs, I didn't care.
My actual experiences with FP+ came in various trips in November, 2013, Christmas week 2013, August 2014, and November 2014. In other words, a peak time (Christmas), a busy but less than peak time (August) and moderate times (November). I have yet to experience FP+ with crowd levels in the 1-4 range. All of those visits did nothing to change my expectations or opinions about FP+. I still have enjoyed all of my visits but I don't see FP+ as a major factor affecting the trips one way or the other. On the whole, though (and here comes another one of those comparisons) I think we were able to do more with FP+ than we would have been able to do without it, but how could I know for sure. A big factor in this is that we rarely spend all day in one park, and that was really essential to get maximum value out of the paper FP system. I have never measured my enjoyment by counting rides anyway.
I think this is possibly my favourite post of yours Wis.
I was coincidentally thinking about this same thing today: How would I feel about FP+ if I never experienced FP- ?
I thought about a bunch of stuff, if I was a first timer, or if I was a repeater ... ultimately I realized you were right, its REALLY hard to do that comparison having experienced FP-.
I don't "Hate" FP+ either, I believe my intention on our last trip was to "break the system" ... maximize the hell out of it, not to hate it or love it ... but to make the most of it. But I found that the total sum of its impact is to make our trip worse than it was before, because we are ride centric, and because that extra level of planning just pushes it beyond the threshold we are willing to accept, also the impact on wait times is a serious factor for us. For the record we FP+'d the hell out of stuff, we rode a LOT, did a ton, but it took more planning and much more effort while in the parks to maximize the system than FP- did.
Ok, but honestly, lets pretend I had never experienced FP- .... or try to.
I imagine when FP was introduced there were some big complaints, because I imagine that FP increased SB wait times, just as FP+ has ...
So ... I would not like the increased SB wait times, but would probably like the ability to select a few rides ... But imagine the jump in SB from NO FP ... to FP+ with the expanded use and expanded attractions ... it would be CRAZY.
As Fuzzy and Lake have both pointed out the overall impact would be about the same average wait time, BUT, it would be in spikes. Right, you would skip a few lines meaning little or no wait, BUT, it would dramatically increase the waits on other rides. SO Pre FP+ you would be waiting 20 mins and 20 mins, post FP you would be waiting 0 mins and then 40 mins. I would not want to wait 40 mins. I know there is no difference in average, but the overall impact, I wouldn't like. I would rather stand in 2 20min lines than one 0 and one 40. Does that make sense ?
I think to a certain extent we are seeing that now, overall. I know for some people its actually increasing their overall wait times, for some significantly, especially people like me, even people who have said they really LIKE FP+, many (and I would hope the FP advocates could admit this) MANY of those folks have noted they do less in the parks, fewer attractions, but they are enjoying their trips more. That's fair. But the overall impact of FP+ for the average person is skipping some lines (for those who didn't use FP- before) but then waiting in long
er lines. That is the absolute, undisputable, undeniable, outcome of FP+ (as it was for FP), longer SB lines. Its not just that this is what people observe, or some theory of what's happening, its the logical conclusion of the system. It MUST happen, you let some people skip lines without increasing capacity, the others have to wait longer.
And that's what it ultimately comes down to, capacity. WDW wasn't ready for FP+. IF there was enough capacity, you wouldn't even have to pre-book FPs. You could always book them the night before. I imagine if I could go during a 1 or 2 day .... I imagine FP+ would work just like FP during the lowest seasons, although the perception might be that it doesn't the perception that you have to pre-plan for some could be offputting. But on a 1 or 2 day or even a 3 perhaps, you don't need to prebook. - However, the rest of the time, you must, if you don't you pay a higher penalty now than you did before (yes kind of an FP vs FP+ comparison, but CERTAINLY true of FP+ vs no FP at all) ...
This is why FP+ is a net negative for us, because it -requires- the pre-planning, the locking yourself in to certain parks and rides on certain days. And if you deviate from that plan, you now pay a significant penalty ... for most of the year. Because the capacity isn't there for people to pre-book 3 rides, and still have a lot of availability or short SB wait times.
If there was enough capacity that FP+ could be used to pre-book OR you had just as much of a shot by going to whatever park you wanted to day of and booking your FPs then, (or on the bus ride to with the app) ... ok, not as bad. IF they had kept the FP kiosk locations so you didn't have to criss-cross the parks to get to one, only to find out what FPs were available and then back track or cross the park again, IF there was no penalty for not using FP+ or at least no pre-planning .... I could get behind it.
But that's not how its panned out. Capacity is the heart of the issue.
Oh, and it doesn't help that WDW has increased prices at like 10X the rate of inflation (ok I made that up, but it actually might be accurate) all while their system changes have decreased what I get out of my trips ... and while it takes more effort on my part to get what I do out of them.
