Looking for a teaching job? Rhode Island is hiring 74 at one school!

[rgf207]

My husband took a teaching job this past year after owning his own business for 10 years. He was so excited about how different it would be to have lunch time, off by 4ish...etc. Things he didn't have in his own business.

It has been an eye opening experience. He has so much paperwork to do, meetings to attend. A special ed program to learn and enforce. It has been so much more then we ever imagined.

He has been so sad because he can teach a lesson and the next day the kids don't remember any of it. The kids sleep during class and just don't care. Most can not read well, can't do basic math and can't even read a tape measure. He said it hurts his heart these are 9-12 graders. He doesn't have the time to teach basic reading and math skills and teach his program.

I don't know all the answers and how to fix things. But I do know you can't make a 9th grader learn if he doesn't want to. It has given us a huge new respect for a teacher. I admit we had no clue how much a teacher is responsible for. It is not an easy job and times sure have changed since we were both in school.

oh no, I'm sorry you are wrong.

Teaching is only for 7 hours a day. You get summers and all holidays off and you never have to do any extra work. You also get free healthcare and a huge salary. If a student fails, it's your fault.

There's teaching, in a nutshell.

*end sarcastic rant*

 

[PeterPan09]

I'm a professional at a fortune 500 company and I guess I'll be the materialistic weasle of the board. I want to be paid for every nanosecond I'm working. If I work 2.5 mins, 25 mins or 25 hours extra I want to be paid for it. My company doesn't give a darn thing away free so why should I give them my time and expertise for free?

Not gonna happen, Sure there are many times I have to work over to complete a project but I keep track of every thing I do and the time my projects run me and you better believe I'm in my directors office negotiating compensation for it.

and when your director says-"if you don't like your job, there's the door. There's hundreds of people out there that need work" what compensation will you have then?

My friends who were "lucky" enough not to get laid off from my old job are doing the jobs they were doing before PLUS the work of all of us that got laid off. They also lost 10% of their salary while their share of the benefit cost went up. Anyone who has dared comment on the situation gets the above answer.

and...because they are salaried workers that are not unionized they have to put up with it or quit.

 

[Kathi OD]

My best friend makes $56,000 a year. That's almost twice what I make since I got laid off. She has less formal education than I do and she has WAY more time off than I do. It is also one heck of a lot harder for her to get laid off than it was for me. Yes, she brings her job home a lot more than I do, but she's well aware of the up side. Real jobs in the real world paying salaries that are equal or less than teacher salaries in the same communties do not include July and August off, or the other weeks and days off that exist on most school schedules in this country. That's a reality.

I don't think for one minute that teaching is an easy job, and there's not enough money in the world to make me want to be one. However, to turn a blind eye to the clear advantages that teaching positions have over "real jobs in the real world" is short sighted.

I'm just a little confused, and don't want to respond until I have the facts straight. Are you comparing the salary of your friend to the compensation you're gettng while laid off?

As for time off, that varies from school to school. Also, what may appear as time off, isn't always what it seems. Prior to my current position, I had "off" in July & August. However, I didn't really have "off" the entire time. There were inservices to attend and additional classes to take. There were committee meetings, many held during the summer because administratively it was cheaper than hiring substitutes and having them during the school year. In my current position (and yes, I'm a classroom teacher), I have off 2 weeks in the summer (one in June & one in August); and that's IF we have no snow days to make up. Because of all the snow this year, it looks like we'll get 3 days in June.

During the school year, there were mandatory after school activities to attend. A free weekend might not end up to be so free. Parent teacher conferences were held at night to accommodate working parents. We worked a regular school day and then returned in the evening. School was over for the students at 3, and by contract our day was over at 3:50, but drive past that school on any given day, and you would find teachers working well past 5 in order to fulfill our obligations.

My original point was, and still is, appearances aren't always what they seem. The clear advantages you see, aren't universally true. It's easy to complain from the sidelines. In general, people seem to think that because they went to school, they know everything that is involved in teaching as a career, and that teachers don't do much to earn their money. Again, if someone thinks it's such an easy job, maybe they should have chosen teaching as a career.

 

[rgf207]

and when your director says-"if you don't like your job, there's the door. There's hundreds of people out there that need work" what compensation will you have then?

My friends who were "lucky" enough not to get laid off from my old job are doing the jobs they were doing before PLUS the work of all of us that got laid off. They also lost 10% of their salary while their share of the benefit cost went up. Anyone who has dared comment on the situation gets the above answer.

and...because they are salaried workers that are not unionized they have to put up with it or quit.

I'm sick of this response. Just because the economy is bad doesn't mean that people should have to work for free.

My company is doing quite well during this rough economic time. They bill the customer for my work. If I work overtime, I don't get paid but they bill the customer for every hour on my timesheet.

Why should anyone have to put up with working for free just because there are other people who would do it?

I can't walk into McDonalds and order a Big Mac and say "I'm only paying you $1 because the economy is bad." It doesn't work like that.

 

[daughtersrus]

I guess that my dentist should be fired. He taught me to floss my teeth every day but because I didn't do it well enough, I got a cavity.

 

[rgf207]

I guess that my dentist should be fired. He taught me to floss my teeth every day but because I didn't do it well enough, I got a cavity.

he should only be fired if he is a member of the union. Once you are a union member, you are no longer professional and are responsible for the actions of others

 

[shrubber]

I guess that my dentist should be fired. He taught me to floss my teeth every day but because I didn't do it well enough, I got a cavity.

If only 7% of his patients walked out without cavities, I would,nt pay him to be a dentist, would you?

Half of the students are failing every subject, with 55 percent skilled in
reading and 7 percent proficient in math, officials said.

 

[shrubber]

he should only be fired if he is a member of the union. Once you are a union member, you are no longer professional and are responsible for the actions of others

The teachers have collectively bargained as labor, have they not?

 

[daughtersrus]

If only 7% of his patients walked out without cavities, I would,nt pay him to be a dentist, would you?

Half of the students are failing every subject, with 55 percent skilled in
reading and 7 percent proficient in math, officials said.

So you're saying that the dentist is responsible for his/her patients getting cavities? Imagine how many would loose their jobs if the state or their employer kept these type of records!

 

[PeterPan09]

I'm sick of this response. Just because the economy is bad doesn't mean that people should have to work for free.

My company is doing quite well during this rough economic time. They bill the customer for my work. If I work overtime, I don't get paid but they bill the customer for every hour on my timesheet.

Why should anyone have to put up with working for free just because there are other people who would do it?

I can't walk into McDonalds and order a Big Mac and say "I'm only paying you $1 because the economy is bad." It doesn't work like that.

I'm sure my friends didn't like hearing it either-but if you want to keep your job you shut up and take it. Otherwise, you're out there on the unemployment line with the other folks that already got laid off.

Your company is doing well, but that's not the reality for many others. Then there's also what I call "recession syndrome". People are so afraid of losing their jobs that they will take more of what management dishes out-and management uses that fear to their advantage.

 

[PeterPan09]

I'm just a little confused, and don't want to respond until I have the facts straight. Are you comparing the salary of your friend to the compensation you're gettng while laid off?

Sorry that was unclear. I was making the same as she was before I got laid off. After being laid off, I had to take a job at a MUCH lower salary in order to have a job at all.

 

[daughtersrus]

The teachers have collectively bargained as labor, have they not?

So have nurses, police, firemen...

Nurses should be fired if their patient gets sick because he/she gets sick because they didn't follow the discharge orders that they were given by the nurse.

The police officer should be fired because someone broke the law.

Firemen should be fired because a building caught on fire.

 

[shrubber]

So you're saying that the dentist is responsible for his/her patients getting cavities? Imagine how many would loose their jobs if the state or their employer kept these type of records!

No, I am saying that a dentist who has 93% of his patients show up with cavities after he has treated them, is not a good dentist.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I'm sick of this response. Just because the economy is bad doesn't mean that people should have to work for free.

My company is doing quite well during this rough economic time. They bill the customer for my work. If I work overtime, I don't get paid but they bill the customer for every hour on my timesheet.

Why should anyone have to put up with working for free just because there are other people who would do it?

I can't walk into McDonalds and order a Big Mac and say "I'm only paying you $1 because the economy is bad." It doesn't work like that.

I'll bite....

In the story in this example--it has been stated that the teachers that were fired make about $70-$80K per year.

Now assuming they work all of 52 weeks per year....

And they put in 80 work weeks...that is $16/hour.

Now there is absolutely no way that a teacher works that much non-stop. But let's assume that is the case.

They are making a decent "wage".

The only problem is--they are salaried. The "would you want to work for free" argument is weak.

It is used to defend any additonal request to a teacher under some premise that they are being robbed. But they aren't.

If a teacher is working 80 hour weeks...something is up and it isn't the problem of the district. I don't know a teacher or really...a college professor, that puts in that much time non-stop for peanuts.

In fact, there was a poster recently who had posted regarding working a weekend convention situation and how other people's companies would compensate. Many people posted that not only would they not get comp time, it was considered part of their duties and their salary. The only agreement was that if she were hourly, it would be illegal to require her to work for free?

It is nauseating when teachers complain about how they are not paid to grade papers or attend inservices and what not.

They are. They are provided a salary that covers their teaching career and all that is involved with it.

I've got nothing against teachers. I realize it is a difficult job. I had always wanted to be one until I discovered that I'm not all that keen on dealing with other people's kids. I realize it isn't "every summer off'--but I know quite a handful of educators that get more than the average 1 week of vacation that the regular work force does not receive.

Sure--not all teachers make $70K--but the teachers in this story do.

I agree with others that this may not amount to much in the long run and was probably throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I've heard enough teachers complain about how little control they do have b/c their hands are tied by district demands that may or may not be in the best interest of the students. So I don't believe it is all the teachers' faults at all.

But they were given an opportunity and they did vote no on it over a pay issue. I just don't have all that much sympathy when that occurs.


*****

Some others have mentioned "where are the parents"?

If I failed my math class in high school, I would have been screwed. My mother didn't know what a fraction was let alone able to help me with simple algebra. I was literally on my own. Thankfully, it was a subject I excelled at, so no issues.

But if the parent can't speak English--how exactly can mom or dad help Junior analyze Romeo and Juliet? And how precisely is that their fault?

I think we can only blame either party so much. But as long as education remains compulsory and in the hands of the counties/states--when there is a shortcoming, the county can't sit around and wait for the doting parents to fill in the gaps. They have to do something.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

No, I am saying that a dentist who has 93% of his patients show up with cavities after he has treated them, is not a good dentist.

That would be pretty bad.

Though I just wanted to mention that some people despite the best of dental care, remain more prone to cavities than others. It isn't 93%. But short of having the mouth sit in flouride, 24/7--there will not be a single dentists whose patients all have perfect, cavity-free teeth.

 

[shrubber]

So have nurses, police, firemen...

Nurses should be fired if their patient gets sick because he/she gets sick because they didn't follow the discharge orders that they were given by the nurse.

The police officer should be fired because someone broke the law.

Firemen should be fired because a building caught on fire.

Fireman are paid to put out fires, if half of the buidings in town burn to the ground, I would think seriuosly about replacing the fire department.

Nurses are paid to treat the sick. If the patients all end up with a staph infection, I would not go to that hospital.

Police are paid to prevent crime and catch criminals. If my town starts to look like downtown Detroit, I would say that the police are not doing their job.

If only 7% of the kids in the school are proficient at math, the teachers shoulder the responsibility.

 

[StefnMike]

Does anyone know of any districts that have done this and has been determined a success?

 

[eliza61]

and when your director says-"if you don't like your job, there's the door. There's hundreds of people out there that need work" what compensation will you have then?

My friends who were "lucky" enough not to get laid off from my old job are doing the jobs they were doing before PLUS the work of all of us that got laid off. They also lost 10% of their salary while their share of the benefit cost went up. Anyone who has dared comment on the situation gets the above answer.

and...because they are salaried workers that are not unionized they have to put up with it or quit.

Of course he has that option and that's the risk I take but.... he also has to factor in will he get the same quality of work and how much does he lose when he has to train the new person outside of the initial cost post and hiring. It's a balancing act. I'm very lucky in that I'm specialized so there's a cost involving with just "showing" me the door.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

If only 7% of the kids in the school are proficient at math, the teachers shoulder the responsibility.

I had a chem teacher that was...retired early...once.

We were all "proficient". But he was teaching quite slowly. I had no idea--I thought it was a tough class and liked the pace, but it turned out it was not even to state standards. I don't know how the school figured it out b/c one day--we had a new teacher. Our old teacher was later able to come in and do a proper goodbye to all of his students. It was very sad.

Then it was the most BRUTAL and speedy 9 weeks to catch up.

My parents wouldn't have had a clue. This was a regular chemistry class, not AP or anything. Me not knowing chemistry, was not my fault or my parents fault.

In this case--it would have been the teachers fault, despite the good grades on my report card.

Yes he was union. Yes the school was right. Very nice guy--and probably an excellent teacher "back in the day"--but my own real life example where indeed the teacher could be blamed for the shortcomings of his students.

Sometimes I feel that entities going about trying to "fix" education the wrong way.

Maybe not all the teachers should have been fired. (I mean--really--Art? PE?)

But something is not right when that many students are doing so poorly.

Blaming socio-economics can only get us so far. And as I said earlier. As long as school is required--at some point the school system has to figure out how to connect with their students to get them to learn.

 

[SaraJayne]

Half of the students are failing every subject, with 55 percent skilled in
reading and 7 percent proficient in math, officials said.

It seems pretty obvious that they are not doing their job. I don't think it takes an insider to figure that out.

Once again, since my previous post was ignored, what responsibility do the students hold for their own failure??