Leverage: anyone considering SSR purchase:

[sjdisneywedding]

Sure, but the inference is that those who have the guarantee (which, buy your definition would be only those who are owners at the resort) will get what they want, while others are left to fight over the scraps. If I'm a potential customer who is as opinionated about non-smoking room as some here, it's meaningless to say I can book BCV at 7 months. Someone here said that about 20% of rooms are smoking optional. As things stand today, I know I have a greater than 80% chance of getting what I want (because many guests will be smokers who will request such a room.) If I'm booking a non-home at 7 months, those odds could be 50% or they could be 0% depending upon the (unknown) occupancy level and request status of those who booked before me.

this is certainly true, I have thought about this myself.
Its tough to figure

 

[TCPluto]

For what it's worth.....I just want to go on the "record" as saying I totally sympathize with posters like Shan, DivaMom, sjdisneywedding in regards to allergies/asthma and cigarette smoke. I think some posters here have totally trivialized the effects just simply smoke on furniture and drapery etc can have on someone who suffers with allergies/asthma. "Some" of the comments I've read in regards to this issue have really suprised me. I want to thank Kathleena for taking the time to post some of the statements from the American College of Asthma, Allergies and Immunology. I can't state the facts any better than that. I am a nurse and would like to add that children are much more susceptible than adults even. For anyone to question or doubt the seriousness of this needs to do a little more research before posting about it I feel. And I'm saying this in a most respectful way....but please do the homework first. Maybe it seems like we're hearing more and more about this problem and it's probably a direct effect of our world becoming more and more polluted. But to insinuate the statements are exaggerated or made up ????
Children are more sensitive to it because they breathe in more air in comparision with their body weight. Here's just a exert from this site : http://www.smoke-free.ca/Second-Hand-Smoke/health_kids.htm (and I'm sure I could find many more sources, but this one from a Canadian source just spelled it out nicely):
Young children are especially vulnerable to second-hand smoke in the home because:
they breathe more air relative to body weight (and for the same level of exposure will absorb more tobacco smoke toxins)
they are less able to complain (either because they are too young, or because their complaints are ignored)
their immune system is less protective
they are less able to remove themselves from exposure
I can't list all the substances and carcinogens in cigarettes here on this post but just want to add this from that site also :
Even if smoking is restricted to a single room, the harmful constituents of cigarette smoke can be dispersed throughout the house. Many of these highly dangerous chemicals are in invisible gas form.

This article directly states even "smelling" the smoke is bad :http://www.drgreene.com/21_769.html


So, again, just for the record and for what it's worth, I feel NS rooms should never be taken lightly for a medical reason and this includes asthma (and even allergies....particularily where they involve children or are severe). Noone should be made to feel guilty or have insinuations of exploitation (of their family member) thrown at them for reguesting this. I just made a ressie about 2 weeks ago and I requested NS. MS asked if it was for medical reasons and I stated "no". My 18 yo son does have very bad allergies, but he's had them for years and never developed asthma. I get awful migraines (and did mention this), but still didn't put myself down as "medical necessity". IF, I get a room that smells of smoke, I will just have Disney bring down the ionizer or whatever they use. But to just spray the room is ridiculous to me. This was actually suggested on another thread. This just disguises the problem---doesn't get the pollutants that cause the problems out of the air. If we have to, we'll even go out and buy an ionizer, but we won't tolerate smoke smell no matter how many people want to trivialize it. When you're in those villas you're in an enclosed space. We have to sleep in there all night....it's not the same as walking into a store to buy something where someone is smoking or whatever scenario you want to bring. We don't live in a smoking environment at home, so why should we when we're on vacation ?
But granted, I still won't say I need NS for medical reasons---though in my mind and heart I feel I shouldn't have to make this choice. We just took care of my mil this past summer who died in our home from lung cancer. It's hard for us to not see smoke as a major hazard (direct or indirect). I wouldn't stomp my feet and complain at the Front Desk if we're assigned smoking because I realize it's only a request, but I will do my best to get rid of the smell because it's pure toxins and pollutants causing that "smell".
Thanks for listening.

Thanks for weighing in Maria. This is the information that at least I was looking for. I wanted to know if there was a difference between actual smoke and the odor of stale smoke in a room.

 

[TCPluto]

It's not a personal attack. You stated you were not a doctor. I stated that I could tell.

If you can say that was not a personal attack with a straight face....please, I'm not buying it.

I was asking for the information, that's all.

And no where have I ever suggested that a child with asthma be forced to stay in a smoking room. You're just filling in the blanks to fit your own needs/agenda.

 

[DVCconvert]

At the risk of being branded a heretic, I have to say that these posts on this website are really useless except for the venting opportunities they offer.

{the following is mostly in jest:

WHAT!?!?!?!??!!?!??!?!?!?!??

I'm a DVC'er!!!!!!!!!!!! I EXPECT nothing but PERFECTION in renting MY room!!!
I...CAN tell if someone smoked in my room 3 years agos for a 2 night stay!!!!

I Want EVERY Cast Member to KNOW ME, and THANK ME for "saving Disney" by my MEGA purchase of a fractional real estate interest!!!

There should be NO dead leaves on the ground - ANYWHERE (that would SPOIL the Magic).

EVERY MEAL should be AT LEAST 50% off. They HAVE computers, and should KNOW my every Wish and Desire BEFORE I make my reservation!!!!!....What are they Doing with my MEGA-BUCKS!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?????

I do NOT care about others needs or wants...only, soley and exclusively mine OWN! and THEY should KNOW that!!!! 50 points or 50,000 points - it doesn't matter!!! I want no bathrooms with hand rails, I want no room that have ever has EVEN the slightest abuse in the (cough) smoking department, I want the Mousekeepers to treat me as if they have NO ONE ELSE staying at the resort. I want Door to turnstile bus portage- ON DEMAND. I want $300 off my AP, with built-in DDE discounts. I want, customized PS'es. I want views ONLY that are acceptably to ME. I want, I want, I want, I want, I want LIFE to be PERFECT!!!, AND, I want it NOW!!!!!!!!! I don't CARE about the fact that my wants are not in the majority, I am ME and I count. I count more that anyone, or any reality, because I am ME! ME! ME! ME!

I'm paying the equivalent of the GDP of some small countries to stay there!!!! I DESERVE service as if I were GOD ON EARTH!!....Cast Members should genuflect upon my very appearance!!!!!

 

[SoCalKDG]

I see a huge difference between smoke/non-smoke and HA/non-HA, and they shouldn't be lumped together.

First, I believe smoke/non-smoke should be guaranteed. Having said that, many of the Dr's quotes listed here state 2nd hand smoke is bad, which I agree. They don't state anything about the actual effects of a room that had been smoked in, but was then cleaned.

I'm pretty sure that having a non-smoking room next to smokers room would be worse than a previously smoked in room. I say make the all of DVC non-smoking to guarentee non-smoking. Maybe allow on balconies???

They should try their hardest to give people HA/non-HA. It shouldn't be guarenteed. If you get stuck with the room that you didn't prefer, at least it only affects you the 10 minutes each day you go to shower/bath.

 

[TCPluto]

Wow, DVCconvert, you have summed up the attitudes of many quite nicely! Even in jest.

 

[DVCconvert]

at least it only affects you the 10 minutes each day you go to shower/bath.

BUT, Ken...that's SOoooooo Unacceptable to some folks!! They feel like they're being abused!!

They don't state anything about the actual effects of a room that had been smoked in, but was then cleaned.

That doesn't matter!!! not to ME..I paid MEGA bucks for a PERFECT world!! I would no more accept that than a CM that didn't give me a heart felt "welcome home"!!!!! It's just not the DVC 'way' !!!

 

[DVCconvert]

Wow, DVCconvert, you have summed up the attitudes of many quite nicely! Even in jest.

pretty sad isn't pluto.

 

[TCPluto]

I see a huge difference between smoke/non-smoke and HA/non-HA, and they shouldn't be lumped together.

First, I believe smoke/non-smoke should be guaranteed. Having said that, many of the Dr's quotes listed here state 2nd hand smoke is bad, which I agree. They don't state anything about the actual effects of a room that had been smoked in, but was then cleaned.

I'm pretty sure that having a non-smoking room next to smokers room would be worse than a previously smoked in room. I say make the all of DVC non-smoking to guarentee non-smoking. Maybe allow on balconies???

They should try their hardest to give people HA/non-HA. It shouldn't be guarenteed. If you get stuck with the room that you didn't prefer, at least it only affects you the 10 minutes each day you go to shower/bath.

Let's not get all reasonable here. But, if that's what you want to do, your plan does make sense. These two issues are quite different, you make a great point.

 

[Divamomto3]

If you can say that was not a personal attack with a straight face....please, I'm not buying it.

I was asking for the information, that's all.

And no where have I ever suggested that a child with asthma be forced to stay in a smoking room. You're just filling in the blanks to fit your own needs/agenda.

Oh for crying out loud. LMAO. I don't have an "agenda!" It'll take a while, but please reread the thread and you tell me with a straight face that you didn't insinuate that people with asthma can in fact, stay in a smoking room but JUST DON'T WANT TO! I don't need to thinly veil anything I say. If I want to tell you what I think you're saying is ridiculous, I'll do it in plain English.

Don't make me go back and cut and paste all of your misinformed comments. It'll take too long and the Oscars are on.

I'm not mad at you or personally attacking you. As a matter of fact, I agree that perhaps I was heated in my responses here. That's because I know for a fact that my son would have respiratory problems in a smoking optional room, and I've had to stay up all night giving him breathing treatments more times than I care to remember.

Seriously...read back. I have no agenda. I'm not trying to change the DVC reservation system. I have no problem with the DVC reservation system. I haven't even ever been assigned to a smoking optional room or a handicapped room! I have NO PROBLEMS WITH DVC. I LOVE DVC. I don't care if I look at the WL dumpster..I feel so darn blessed to be able to afford to go to Disney World twice a year and almost embarrassed by it sometimes that I keep my mouth shut. I'm just refuting the notion that second hand smoke, stale smoke, old smoke, smoke smell, whatever you want to call it, does not cause asthmatics to have attacks. I work with nurses who have asthma attacks when they strip the floors at night in the hospital. Odors cause asthma attacks. That's why the staff in my unit can't wear perfume or scented lotions. We can't even use baby powder on the patients when we wash them.

I'm sure you're a lovely person in real life and that's the thing about the internet. If I was at a cocktail party with you and heard you spouting off about how people can't really get an asthma attack from the old smoke smell in a room (although in real life would your really tell the parent of an asthmatic that they were full of you-know-what to their face??) I'd either politely correct you or roll my eyes at you behind your back and hope we didn't end up at the same cocktail party again. But most likely, we'd just end up talking about how much we love Disney World, instead of wasting time arguing about the DVC reservation system. Which can I once again say THAT I HAVE YET TO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH.

 

[TCPluto]

As a matter of fact, I agree that perhaps I was heated in my responses here.

I'm just refuting the notion that second hand smoke, stale smoke, old smoke, smoke smell, whatever you want to call it, does not cause asthmatics to have attacks.

If I was at a cocktail party with you and heard you spouting off about how people can't really get an asthma attack from the old smoke smell in a room (although in real life would your really tell the parent of an asthmatic that they were full of you-know-what to their face??) .

If you reread my posts, I never said that the stale smoke wasn't the same as the smoke. I did ask the question however. So because I asked the question, I'm advocating?? Seems twisted thought to me.

While at that cocktail party you would never hear me degrading someones disability. If you reread my posts, you might see why (or just look in my signature). I have not expressed anything like suggesting that asthmatics just buck up ans stay in the smoking room. I have seen many people take advantage of alledged medical conditions for some gain such as this.

And while your at the bar, I'll have another Rum and diet!!

 

[wide awake]

This isn't just a smoking/non-smoking issue. If you've read all the posts you'll see that I posted that my autistic child NEEDS a tub...and we are set to buy 150 points, so please don't tell me that I can get a one or two bedroom. And no, this does not matter only ten minutes per day. If my child cannot relax in the tub for at least an hour in the morning our day is worthless. No, I don't want a smoker's room either...we're from CA with strong anti-smoking laws...it is not my dream to walk around smelling like an ashtray. BUT WE HAVE TO HAVE A TUB, NO IFS, ANDS, OR BUTS ABOUT IT !!! WHY IS THAT SO HARD FOR SOME TO UNDERSTAND ? IF MY CHILD WAS IN A WHEELCHAIR ALL OF YOU WOULD SAY HE NEEDS A HA ROOM...BUT TO US A NON-HA ROOM IS JUST AS IMPORTANT.

 

[TCPluto]

I don't think anyone is saying you should be denied. If they did, I missed it. I'm quite familiar with autism, and can appreciate your needs. I would agree with you, given the nature of your childs needs.

The discussion is about seperating needs from wants. Sounds like you have a need for the tub, while lenny "wanted" a tub. You don't want a smoking room, others, apparently "need" to have a non-smoking room. There were others that posted that they bathe their young kids and didn't want to alter this at DVC. That is far different from your situation, and I think the response was meant for them.

 

[doubletrouble_vb]

There is NO system that will make everyone happy.

Apparently the current system makes more people happy than the prior system.

I can see why attempting to guarentee rooms at reservation time would be difficult because the DVC inventory is quite fluid. You have some dedicated 2 bedrooms, 2 bedrooms made up of a 1 bedroom and a studio, one bedrooms, and studios. It is NOT like a hotel where the rooms consist mainly of rooms with two doubles or a king. And unlike many other timeshares the length of stay is fluid as well.

And unlike the rest of the Disney system DVC only uses (and rightly so) its own inventory to satisfy its members. In a resort with a high occupancy rate like BCV it would appear that the only reasonable solution DVC (that is US/WE) would have is offer a person who can't get their medically required preference at one resort the option to move to another. Given that people work hard to get into BCV I suspect that solution will not be satisfactory.

Finally what I think everyone should take away from this is an agreement to disagree. For those people with major medical issues with stale smoke or fresh smoke (we all have issues with it to one degree or another) present your argument to DVC to go non-smoking. However what you see here is that some...possibly many of your fellow members don't see the problem as being as much of an issue as you do. I have to agree with the notion that if DVC did go non-smoking people would smoke in the rooms anyway. Maybe it would be for the best and we all just pay to get individual ionizers for every room. They are only about $325 apiece.

Now to make sure that I get flamed I have to agree with the notion that if you need a guarenteed tub get a one bedroom. Not being able to afford it is not a counter argument. There are plenty of people who can't afford DVC at all who would like a two bedroom condo onsite. Guess what...they don't buy it, they stay offsite or they save longer so they can stay in it for cash.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Let's go back the the previous poster who recommended writing Disney to make your needs heard. We've heard them. We don't all agree. You don't need to keep telling us about your needs and why you need them. We really don't care. I don't care. Let the people who might be able to do something about your request know your need. Why waste another minute here? Most of us have no problem with the way the rooms are handled now, so we don't really see the need for improving the method.

But if you have a genuine need, let the people who can make it happen for you know. We can't help you.

 

[MiaSRN62]

Maybe it would be for the best and we all just pay to get individual ionizers for every room. They are only about $325 apiece.

Naaahh.....you can get 'em cheaper than that
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/sear...rget=searchresults&gobutton.x=11&gobutton.y=8

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...elevance&mipp=25&uq=ionizer&_requestid=101131

Provided some links just in case some of us want to budget it into our vacations

 

[iankh]

I want, I want, I want, I want, I want LIFE to be PERFECT!!!, AND, I want it NOW!!!!!!!!! I don't CARE about the fact that my wants are not in the majority, I am ME and I count. I count more that anyone, or any reality, because I am ME! ME! ME! ME!

Sounds not just a little bit like Veruca Salt from Willy Wonka:

Veruca Salt:
Gooses! Geeses!
I want my geese to lay gold eggs for Easter

Mr. Salt:
It will, sweetheart

Veruca:
At least a hundred a day

Mr.Salt:
Anything you say

Veruca:
And by the way

Mr. Salt:
What?

Veruca:
I want a feast.

Mr. Salt:
You ate before you came to the factory

Veruca:
I want a bean feast!

Mr. Salt:
Oh, one of those

Veruca:
Cream buns and doughnuts and fruitcake with no nuts
So good you could go nuts

Mr. Salt:
You can have all those things when you get home

Veruca:
No, now!!

I want a ball
I want a party
Pink macaroons and a million balloons
And performing baboons and ...
Give it to me
Rrhh rhhh
Now!

I want the world
I want the whole world
I want to lock it all up in my pocket
It's my bar of chocolate
Give it to me
Now!

I want today
I want tomorrow
I want to wear 'em like braids in my hair
And I don't want to share 'em

I want a party with room fulls of laughter
Ten thousand tons of ice cream
And if I don't get the things I am after
I'm going to scream!

I want the works
I want the whole works
Presents and prizes and sweets and surprises
Of all shapes and sizes
And now
Don't care how
I want it now
Don't care how
I want it now

 

[TCPluto]

Hi I am Colorado Belle's daughter...
She wanted me to tell the Pluto dude that he did say that he wasn't a doctor and that the poster who agreed with him was just trying to be agreeable...and yet Pluto felt flamed by her agreeing with him. Mom wonders Iif the same person had disagreed and said NO NO PLUTO YOU ARE A DOCTOR AND YOU ARE LYING ABOUT IT...she wonders if that would have make Pluto feel better?

Well I am tired of typing now so I am going to quit. BYE.
daughter of Colorado Belle.

If this is colorado bell typing and saying it's her daughter, that's twisted. If this post was made by her daughter, how sick is that? Drawing a child into an adult conversation, for the purposes of making fun of someone??

I know these people exist, I just didn't really expect to find them on the this board. I feel so sorry for you and your family...

 

[crisi]

wide awake.

I'm going out on a limb. DVC is not for you unless you will commit to one or two bedroom units. Under the current system they cannot guarentee a tub in a studio, no matter what your Guide or MS tells you. This is especially true if you arrive late (with early you have some flexibility to just say NO - late and it may be all that's left). The chances of ending up in a HA room are slim, but since you require a tub, I wouldn't risk that slim chance.

Edited to add: And since this sounds like a major purchase for you, you probably can't afford to just stay for cash a loose the points if you get an unacceptable room. There is no guarentee you will get a CM who says anything but "sorry, can't do anything" while you are forced to shell out money to stay over at the All Stars for a night and lose your points. I'd like to believe Disney will do everything they can to make you happy, and you may never have a problem that isn't taken care of quickly and politely, but - this is the part I'm concerned about - you are entering a legal contract with a business where they hold all the cards and have no legal obligation to meet your needs (unless you are willing to sue them under the ADA).

 

[JimMIA]

Let's go back the the previous poster who recommended writing Disney to make your needs heard. We've heard them. We don't all agree. You don't need to keep telling us about your needs and why you need them. We really don't care. I don't care. Let the people who might be able to do something about your request know your need. Why waste another minute here? Most of us have no problem with the way the rooms are handled now, so we don't really see the need for improving the method.

But if you have a genuine need, let the people who can make it happen for you know. We can't help you.

I'm not sure whether you work for DISboards or Disney itself. If you are a DISboards cast member, it doesn't matter much what either you or I think. As you point out, what matters is the opinion of the decision-makers, and neither you nor I are in that category at DVC.

If you work for Disney, however, the "We don't care. I don't care." attitude is precisely the reason people need to go over the head of the Orlando folks - IF they have a real, actual experience (not hypothetical) which fails to meet their standards. If the line operational Disney people don't care (and I've NEVER seen that attitude expressed in all my visits to WDW), then you really do need to tell Burbank about it -- not wail about it on the DISboards. That was the crux of my previous post.

With regard to the current system, I'm fine with it too. But I don't have a special needs child, or a serious medical issue. The real world is that you and I are extremely fortunate. Many people do have those issues, and they are not trivial issues.

Also, I run a business and I know that no matter what system you have for anything, there is always room for improvement. That's how companies get better, and bigger, and more profitable. That is one of the secrets of the Disney story - they never stop trying to get better. The day you are content to rest on your laurels is the day the business starts going downhill.

I don't work with the Disney reservation/room assignment system every day, and therefore, I don't know technically how the system could be improved. But a lot of talented Disney CM's do. I'd be willing to bet that if it became important to Disney corporate offices, some bright CM would come up with an improvement to meet the kinds of needs that have been discussed here. If they can do the things they do at WDW, I have every confidence they can solve a simple ressie system issue. We're talking about tinkering around the margins of the already workable system, not throwing the whole thing out.

And rest assured, they'll solve it without adding costs - they don't have enough price elasticity to go passing additional costs on to their customers, either DVC or cash customers. That silly idea has been the ruination of more businesses in the last few years than just about any other misguided notion - you just can't pass increased costs on to customers, the marketplace simply will not tolerate it. Orlando is one of the most competitive markets in the world, and every time they raise costs to anyone one penny, business goes elsewhere, stays get shortened, etc. People have a certain amount of money to spend on vacation, and if they have to spend more on lodging, that's just a little less they'll spend on trinkets or in the theme parks - so Disney will make improvements without raising costs.

I have a lot more confidence in Disney than some on these boards. They are very good at what they do, and I am confident they can fix anything, provided the decision-makers are aware that there is an opportunity for improvement.