LET THE FLAMES BEGIN>>>adult only dining

[Ariel Wanna-be]

To call me a bad parent because I dare to not judge other parents, is well, judgmental, but hey whatever makes you feel good.

Since I have been put on the defense, then I will say in a loud voice:
"PARENTS DON'T LET YOUR KIDS RUN ALL OVER A RESTAURANT THEY MAY GET HURT AND YOU WILL BE AT FAULT" . Yes, I actually believe that. Everyone feel better now?

Meeeooowww.

Sounds like someone doesn't like being "on the defense." Ironic. You seemed quite comfortable being on the offense.


And where, exactly, did I call you a, quote, bad parent because you dare not judge other parents? You seem very concerned that judgements are being passed, but when you make a false statement such as that one, it really doesn't help your case.

 

[chobie]

Meeeooowww.

Sounds like someone doesn't like being "on the defense." Ironic. You seemed quite comfortable being on the offense.


And where, exactly, did I call you a, quote, bad parent because you dare not judge other parents? You seem very concerned that judgements are being passed, but when you make a false statement such as that one, it really doesn't help your case.

I stand corrected. It was not your post that brought into question other people's parenting based on them not joining in on the condemning of some children's behavior.

The earlier posts in this thread starting with the OP were judgmental of people who brought small kids to some of these places at all. As a parent who once brought a 3 year old and an infant to Artist Point, I did take offense.

edited to add: since I too enjoy a little snottiness, let me smugly inform people that I will continue to bring my children into signature restaurants whether you like it or not.

 

[NeverlandClub23]

I do believe that Disney is for kids AS WELL AS adults who love the Disney atmosphere. I've noticed a couple of places I have gone to eat at Disney some parents tend to take the whole "we're on vacation" a little too much. I've seen kids standing on top of tables screaming, getting food from a buffet by themselves and spilling food all over the buffet, and much worse. I remember a couple of years ago we went to Rain Forest Cafe and we sat beside a table of 5 little kids and there parents. We just sat in awe at how quiet and respectful they were, it was amazing. Then this little girl on the other side of us was screaming at the top of her lungs because her mom apparently didn't buy her the stuffed animal she wanted. They just ignored her and she continued to scream through their entire meal, it was so loud we had to move. I don't think that there is anything that can be done because you can never predict what a child is going to do I just know that when I was little (which wasn't too long ago) if I ever would've screamed at the top of my lungs out in public or stood on top of a table my parents would never have let it happen and if it did they always left or took us to the bathroom to "discuss" our problem.

 

[JoiseyMom]

It isn't the kids, it is the parents. Children are just that children. When my kids act up, be it in McDonald's or a nice restaurant, they are removed. My DH and I will take turns going to the car or the lobby. We will not ruin other patron's meals, with our misbehaving child, even when it is just a child being a child. My kids are not allowed to scream or run around in a restaurat. Any restaruant.. family or otherwise. When our DD was 5 and our DS was 8 months, she was taken to the Neverland club, and he went with us to the Yahtsman Steakhouse. When he got cranky, I took him to the lobby and fed him (I was nursing, so I felt that was a better place then the restaurant). I got back inside 20 minutes later. The waiter had them hold my food, which I didn't expect, and he was very gracious. Our ds was better after that. My DH and I have left the Olive Garden with our food to go, and left his family there when our kids have acted up.

If children aren't going to be behave, then it is the parents responsiblity to take them out. Yes, kids are kids, but there is a line that gets crossed when it comes to behavior. Children shouldn't be screaming, crying, running around like banshees, throwing things, or doing things that annoy any of the other patrons. Taking care of unruly children should be common courtesy. I have found that most parents just don't give a damn.

If the kids behave, great..bring them, yes, even to V&A's. Once they stop behaving, please, remove them. It is really that simple.

 

[gina2000]

As long as the parents are trying to control crying and whining, I have no problem with it. Usually a quick stroll outside just to refresh a child will work. Unfortunately, it's been my experience that some parents are able to ignore crying and whining for long periods of time. At that point, most other patrons are at the breaking point. That's just bad parenting.

I've also seen kids whining and crying on the floor near the parents' table. (Recently, not at WDW.) I've seen parents able to ignore that until the child moves directly under the parents' noses. Then they notice.

If you call these observations judgmental, so be it.

 

[Wee Annie]

I tried to make peace about 10, or maybe by this time 20, or so posts back.

Miserable failure.

I think the vast majority of people subscribing to this thread would agree on what is appropriate behavior for a child in a nice restaurant, and what should be done when it crosses the line into inappropriate behavior.
Running around like a wild banshee? inappropriate. Occasional melt-downs, whining, or crying attended to by the parents in the best way they know how to? fine.

Is anyone out there really in disagreement about this? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

 

[tomerin]

i think maybe it is time for the moderator to close down this thread. the tone is getting a bit un DIS-ney like.

a raw nerve has been touched here and i do not see it going to stop anytime soon.

BTW i was the one who asked why disney doesnt have an adult resturant at each resort or adult only hours. i have read this entire thread and see this is becoming a bit destructive and defensive


just my opinion here. i see both sides here and both have valid points and have both made them.

 

[antkim]

I'm sorry, did you not tell others to be a parent and take their kids out of the restaurant because their crying means they are tired? If you did not, then I most certainly apologize.

Edited to add: boring your children with a restaurant choice does not bad parenting make.

Nope...never said that. I did however say a tired child is understandable especially at WDW...so choose your dining accordingly.


boring your children with a restaurant choice does not bad parenting make.[/QUOTE]

Just a selfish one at the moment.

 

[chobie]

I tried to make peace about 10, or maybe by this time 20, or so posts back.

Miserable failure.

I think the vast majority of people subscribing to this thread would agree on what is appropriate behavior for a child in a nice restaurant, and what should be done when it crosses the line into inappropriate behavior.
Running around like a wild banshee? inappropriate. Occasional melt-downs, whining, or crying attended to by the parents in the best way they know how to? fine.

Is anyone out there really in disagreement about this? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I do agree. The problem is what people define as attending to a whining, crying child in the best way they know how. To some people that means immediately leaving the restaurant or better yet, not having brought kids there in the first place and anything other than that is bad parenting or being rude.

 

[chobie]

Nope...never said that. I did however say a tired child is understandable especially at WDW...so choose your dining accordingly.


boring your children with a restaurant choice does not bad parenting make.

Just a selfish one at the moment.[/QUOTE]

How is it selfish to have to to come up with ways to keep your child from being bored in anicer restaurant so they can learn how to behave and how to enjoy fine dining? It seems to me that would take away from savoring my dinner to keep them entertained and from annoying others. Yes, letting them run all over or scream is selfish to others, just having them there in the first place is not.

 

[lyeag]

Or they are bored. Be a parent and engage them in a quiet activity or conversation about their day at Disney, while at the same time teaching them about how to behave in restaurants and not freaking ou at a moment of ill-behavior.

That's wonderful that you would leave a restaurant if your kids were not behaving perfectly, unfortunatley you do not have the right to decree that other parents follow suit. You can proclaim it on an internet forum and pat yourself on the back about your own parenting skills, but that is all you can do to.

Possibly bored. Possibly sick. Possibly anything under the sun. My point was, and still is, that as a parent after you have tried all the tricks in the bag to get them calm and there is still a problem, you have to think about packing it up. I never said I don't take my children to nice places. I chose not to at WDW. We had long days and I knew they were tired. I don't freak out over bad behavior, I do choose to show my children that it is not acceptable either by redirection, a trip to the lobby to have a talk, and when all else fails, by leaving. I am sorry that my posts offend you personally. I don't know you or your children. My posts that are meant to be about the general public, not about any one poster on this board.

 

[panthergirl]

I stand corrected. It was not your post that brought into question other people's parenting based on them not joining in on the condemning of some children's behavior.

The earlier posts in this thread starting with the OP were judgmental of people who brought small kids to some of these places at all. As a parent who once brought a 3 year old and an infant to Artist Point, I did take offense.

edited to add: since I too enjoy a little snottiness, let me smugly inform people that I will continue to bring my children into signature restaurants whether you like it or not.

Your way or the highway right? You have absolutely no respect for anyone else's opinions and you make that very clear by your "snotty" (your word, not mine) responses. All most of these good people are saying is please respect others in a public place like a restaurant. Be polite and make sure your children do the same. It's the good old golden rule - do unto others.... You keep saying you won't judge other parents based upon their childrens' behaviour but you are proving yourself to be one of the most judgemental posters on this thread. Perhaps a little understanding of the other side is in order.

 

[lyeag]

Since when are good manners snottiness? Boy times have changed........

 

[robinb]

I have NO problem at all with children dining at any of these restaurants...if they can behave. Also, I would have no problem with a child misbehaving as long as the parents "be a parent" and act accordingly....no need to ruin someone else's expensive meal. It's the parent that takes their child to a nice restaurant KNOWING that they will be disruptive that get to me. I'm not talking about a little "meltdown".....I'm talking about the full blown unacceptable behavoir.

I don't think that anyone here condones full blown unacceptable behavior. I know I do not with my own child. The point that I am trying to make is that one person's "normal kid behavior" is another person's "disruptive behavior". Some people (for instance some Childfree Couples and Empty Nesters) have unreasonable expectations when it comes to how children should behave. When their meal is ruined by a whining child, they don't know or don't remember what it is like to eat a meal with a small child and become annoyed. Believe me, I had more than one meal ruined when I went to WDW as a DINK. Now, as a SAHM I cut other parents slack when it comes to non-perfect kids. I know that the vast majority of them are just doing the best that they can in the current situation. I also know that I am in charge of my own happiness.

 

[antkim]

Your way or the highway right? You have absolutely no respect for anyone else's opinions and you make that very clear by your "snotty" (your word, not mine) responses. All most of these good people are saying is please respect others in a public place like a restaurant. Be polite and make sure your children do the same. It's the good old golden rule - do unto others.... You keep saying you won't judge other parents based upon their childrens' behaviour but you are proving yourself to be one of the most judgemental posters on this thread. Perhaps a little understanding of the other side is in order.

AMEN!!!

 

[chobie]

Your way or the highway right? You have absolutely no respect for anyone else's opinions and you make that very clear by your "snotty" (your word, not mine) responses. All most of these good people are saying is please respect others in a public place like a restaurant. Be polite and make sure your children do the same. It's the good old golden rule - do unto others.... You keep saying you won't judge other parents based upon their childrens' behaviour but you are proving yourself to be one of the most judgemental posters on this thread. Perhaps a little understanding of the other side is in order.

That is my golden rule. I know my children act up occasionally and so I am tolerant of other people's kids when they do to. I will repeat this yet again. The OP calls into question even bringing a child into a place like Jiko. Other people have stated that people should leave the restaurant if their kids up and there is no exceptions. If its ok with you that they say that, why is not okay with you that I say I will continue to bring my kids to these places? I did not say I would allow them to act unruly, just that I would allow them to be there.

And how do you know who is good and who is not good?

Edited to add: I have said several times now I respect the opinion of people who think Disney should create more adult-only venues. My showing respect is to not judge others for which WDW place they dine out or what kind of parents they are based on the few moments I see them in action.

 

[panthergirl]

I have absolutely no quarrel with your opinion. You have every right to it. My problem is with the tone you use towards those with whom you do not agree. Do they not have a right to feel the way they feel? If you truly wish not to judge, you should start right here with your fellow posters.

 

[Luv2Roam]

DH and I have no kids.
We are at restaurants are remark how one table with kids will be a near disaster. The next table has kids so quiet we dodn't even know they are there.
I always say it is not the kids who bother me. It's the parents who act as if their darlings are invisible. They don't want to be around them either.
Kids will be kids. And some parents allow them to act as if they are at a playground anywhere they go. And sometimes they take them to places that are not appropiate, and long past the kid's nap or bed time.
I have seen toddlers having meltdowns in a stroller late at night as the parents are dragging them out to PI. They need tp get a babysitter when necessary. Everyone will be better off -- the kids, the parents and everyone coming into contact.

 

[robsmom]

Well, yes, if they are bored you should try to keep them entertained. I often brought bags with little toys for the little ones when we went out. I am saying as a last resort, if nothing else has worked you leave out of respect for others. I am not saying at the first problem you pack up and leave. At some point you have to consider others. Maybe my point is different than yours. I actually worry about small children getting hurt as they crawl under tables or run around. Wait staff are carrying heavy trays of hot food. It is dangerous for a small child ( and most small kids aren't worrying about hot food being dumped on them) to be running around in a restaurant. Not only for themselves, but others.

One word for this: GAMEBOY. I have found that it is a good restaurant dinner companion for a 5 yr old only child! Seriously, I would never let him use it at dinner at home, but with waiting for tables, waiting for food, etc. I find that with the volume off it is a good distraction and keeps him under control so that we can dine without disturbing others. But on the rare situatino where this is not working, I totally agree and will leave. I have only had to do this once and to be honest it was my fault. we had been out all afternoon shopping and said child was tired, grabbing dinner at red lobster was a bad idea! I learned from it and can usually determine in advance the right tolerance level for my kid. Sometimes we can go to a little nicer place, sometimes the McDonald's drive thru is a nice as I am going to get that night!!

 

[chobie]

I have absolutely no quarrel with your opinion. You have every right to it. My problem is with the tone you use towards those with whom you do not agree. Do they not have a right to feel the way they feel? If you truly wish not to judge, you should start right here with your fellow posters.

It's a bit hard to detect tone when your not in person. If you went back through all the posts starting with the original you would see the same tone you feel I have with people who have the opposing viewpoint. My hunch is that you don't pick up that same tone with the others because you agree more with their opinion than you do mine.

What do you think is the tone of "subjecting a child..."?,

Edited to add: How many times have the words rude and bratty been used to describe people adn children in this thread? Do those words not imply a hostile tone to you?