Lawsuit over Disneyland's Magic Key Passport

[GreatLakes]

So what Is the big win. Higher AP prices, more blockout dates or no APs. The old system is not coming back

The win should be if there is still park capacity anyone with valid media, whether it is a one day pass or an AP that isn't blacked out that day, should get the reservation on a first come bases. No prioritizing one kind of media over another.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

So what Is the big win. Higher AP prices, more blockout dates or no APs. The old system is not coming back

Probably APs shouldn't be sold period to anyone local or otherwise for the foreseeable future at DLR. Higher prices won't solve anything and Disney would be just doing that only to gain more money not to alleviate the issue. If they can't reasonably accommodate during a busy season they should not sell a product that has that in there but if they do have an AP with blockout dates during the holidays a discounted ticket to those who are local would be at least something.

In the end I would just hope that the marketing and advertising and language is updated to be more transparent. Separate buckets aren't customer friendly in the end but if they are going to keep that around state that although we know companies in general don't want to necessarily put out something like that because it makes their product less desirable and Disney (or any company) would still want enough people to purchase it.

 

[longboard55]

They are not going to lose live ticket sales to keep AP holders happy. I have always felt sorry for the full fare visitor stuck in the two hour cars line

 

[longboard55]

There's never a big win unless you're lead plaintiff or prevailing counsel

I'm just here for the entertainment factor, looking forward to all the court filings to come!

Not sure the case is so great. It is not an issue getting reservations unless you want to go twice a week every week. They will make the plaintiff look greedy

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

They are not going to lose live ticket sales to keep AP holders happy. I have always felt sorry for the full fare visitor stuck in the two hour cars line

I was the full fare visitor twice in 2019..well I bought our tickets through UT (3 days park hopper each time plus ended up with 5 days of MP out of the 6 days we were there total in 2019)..I certainly never felt sorry for myself

 

[disneychrista]

Not so much at DLR.

No not for Disneyland but has WDW had the same issues? I am sure Disney management looked at the experience of WDW and applied it to Disneyland. Of course Disneyland has a more local clientele so they weren’t comparing apples to apples. But it wasn’t unprecedented.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

The win should be if there is still park capacity anyone with valid media, whether it is a one day pass or an AP that isn't blacked out that day, should get the reservation on a first come bases. No prioritizing one kind of media over another.

I don’t see that happening without it hurting APs. Nobody has had a problem with the separate buckets until now, even when on-site had more access. And the solution is to not block people out who are coming on tickets. Doing it your way means they go right back to what they had before, prepandemic, which they’ve been clear they didn’t want.

There are a few ways I see Disney handling this, if they’re required to change anything (settling out of court likely allows them to keep things as is.If they have to merge the buckets, I could see them lowering the number of reservations an AP holder can have at one time. Or they start charging for canceled reservations, so that APs don’t use them as place holders all the time. Or they simply get rid of APs all together.

* yes I know they’re Dream Keys now. AP is easier to type.
And prior to the closure, I had been an AP holder for roughly 15 years. I’m not hating on AP holders.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

No not for Disneyland but has WDW had the same issues? I am sure Disney management looked at the experience of WDW and applied it to Disneyland. Of course Disneyland has a more local clientele so they weren’t comparing apples to apples. But it wasn’t unprecedented.

I can see where you're coming from here but this lawsuit is talking about the language used, advertising and whatnot. For many years on this Board people have spoken about how the two parks have operated differently for a reason. I don't think using WDW and saying "well we had different buckets there so yeah this customer in CA or a customer who bought DLR's highest tier can't complain" because it's immaterial what WDW did. Now it would be if a person was a WDW AP holder and filed lawsuit with WDW and the day is young yet someone could. Usually state laws come into play too as companies can structure and have to structure around things like that. Here the lawsuit is calling out CA consumer protection laws among other things.

Disney stopped selling new APs for WDW a day before they announced they stopped selling new APs for DLR both listed as "high demand for the holidays" in a nutshell though I'm paraphrasing and both are an unclear sometime in 2022 to bring them back. It seems interesting, just looking at it objectively, that a launch of a new AP has to be suddenly a few months later halted because they cannot accommodate the number of people means something is up with both in how it's working and interacting with the system.

I can't purchase an AP for either DLR or WDW (I mean I physically can't right now) and the AP that was available to me anyways was the highest tier with no blackouts. As a non-CA resident, as a non-FL resident and as a non-DVC owner my only choice has been the no-blockout option anyways, that's hardly my fault.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I could see them lowering the number of reservations an AP holder can have at one time.

I've been wondering though just how much of a problem that is since you mentioned it before. It's 6 days on a rolling basis out of 365 days available to the highest tier. Literally 1.64-ish% of the year can be reserved at any given time for this highest tier. 6 is obviously just an arbitrary number they chose. I'm assuming they thought offering 1 reservation as a time for the lowest tier was kinda ridiculous so they offered 2 but the next level is 4, next level is 6 and highest level is 6. I suppose they could keep 2 for the lowest tier do 3 for the next tier and 4 for the next and 5 for the highest but in the end would that really make the difference to suddenly curb the pesky behavior of locals overrunning the parks (as people like to describe it)? Or would this be something a non-local sees as a feel good gesture to make it seem like the very local people won't be overrunning the parks as much?

Or they start charging for canceled reservations, so that APs don’t use them as place holders all the time.

I agree a placeholder is not good for anyone really because it takes away from other APs and it makes Disney have an inaccurate picture and yet at the same time for the honest folks plans change. Maybe they could do a penalty if not cancelled in X amount of time (but a reasonable amount of time) before the reservation but charging a penalty just for canceling a reservation would be really bad business practice for the life that is well life when things change.

 

[longboard55]

So next week which is the busiest week of the year, everyday is available except the 26 and NYE. We easily made NYE ressies weeks a go with one of our 6 dates. The system works fine. Leave it alone. We have DVC at California Grand, if they drop Annual Passes we are scruuuued

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

So next week which is the busiest week of the year, everyday is available except the 26 and NYE. We easily made NYE ressies weeks a go with one of our 6 dates. The system works fine. Leave it alone. We have DVC at California Grand, if they drop Annual Passes we are scruuuued

Well it clearly didn't work for the person who when she looked over half the month in November was unavailable to her.

As always things work fine..until they don't.

Also a PP mentioned the coincidental timing of opening up availability for future dates after the lawsuit and PR got out about it..

Interestingly that most of us here are in favor of not having AP at DLR or not having an AP with a no-blockout but you who has a stake in something and would be negatively impacted don't want anything to change and are making multiple comments on this thread about what's to gain or similar-type comments, it makes sense now why you would say these things.

I don't know why you would be screwed either. You could just purchase tickets like everyone else then you'd be in the much larger bucket of availability anyways

I actually know a decent amount of DVC owners who opt to not go in the parks at all. Actually I'd say the clientele who is most likely to make a resort only reservation is the DVC owner. Unfortunately for you DVC is almost non-existent at DLR compared to WDW.

 

[longboard55]

My preferences are not unusual. The current system works for once every weekend, it works for a 3 day trip once a month, it works for a 5 day trip 4 times a year, it works for the last minute trip. It does not work for someone who wants a reservation every Saturday and Sunday all year long. I think that was the design

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

My preferences are not unusual. The current system works for once every weekend, it works for a 3 day trip once a month, it works for a 5 day trip 4 times a year, it works for the last minute trip. It does not work for someone who wants a reservation every Saturday and Sunday all year long. I think that was the design

It was not available every weekend for the plaintiff in November.

Are you just going to continue to tell us how the system works just peachy so long as you're exactly this or that? Like really when someone buys a pass and Disney creates a pass as well as one they chose to have the option to visit whenever someone wanted to you're like "well so long as you didn't want availability to be there on the weekend, so long as you're doing a short trip just 1 time in a month, so long as you just do a few days trip several times a year, etc the system works voila just like that. It doesn't work last minute if last minute has no availability. Honestly you're making a great case for the plaintiff, talking about how the system works so long as you don't actually use it like the pass is advertised and marketed as creating a misleading pass available to purchase.

Every comment you make seems to be how this system works out just fine..for you that is..so it shouldn't change because it works for you (which that's great it works for you, you're not presumably part of the class action suit then) but you're hardly screwed if the AP goes away. You just suddenly become like everyone else needing to purchase tickets to attend and if there's no availability on the day you want to visit you'll have no one to point the finger at if there's no APs. I don't see how your experience will be any less if no APs were there other than discounts available to AP holders (which can be a good perk understood). You'd have the same responsibility as the next person and as you did with APs to ensure you booked your reservation early enough or that you kept checking the system for availability to open up if it was not when you checked.

 

[DLgal]

APs will never go away. Did you see how quickly they brought them back after saying they were going to develop a whole new system? Yeah. They NEED APs, whether they like it or not, APs are what keep the parks afloat in the slow times.

I think, if anything, they will abandon the entire reservation system sooner rather than later. They STILL have people showing up every day at the ticket booths wanting to buy tickets for that day. That's a problem.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

They NEED APs, whether they like it or not, APs are what keep the parks afloat in the slow times.

That's been my thoughts, a lot of bemoaning, but in the end attendance at DLR is made up more of people who live close by. At WDW the opposite.

they will abandon the entire reservation system sooner rather than later.

The only thing is they've been on record that they are here to stay. I'm not sure they'll drop it unless it is a part of the settlement or a court order to do so. It'd be a lot of eating of the words to voluntarily drop the reservation system but the possibility is out there I guess.

At DLR right now you can only see park reservation availability through the end of April 2022 for normal park tickets and towards the end of March 2022 for AP whereas with WDW it's loaded up through mid-January 2024 for normal park tickets and through the end of December 2022 for AP. It would be easier to drop the reservation logistically for DLR just because the date availability isn't as far out (by a good amount). I do think it would be best for DLR especially to do either/or with the reservation system and APs not both.

 

[DLgal]

That's been my thoughts, a lot of bemoaning, but in the end attendance at DLR is made up more of people who live close by. At WDW the opposite.


The only thing is they've been on record that they are here to stay. I'm not sure they'll drop it unless it is a part of the settlement or a court order to do so. It'd be a lot of eating of the words to voluntarily drop the reservation system but the possibility is out there I guess.

At DLR right now you can only see park reservation availability through the end of April 2022 for normal park tickets and towards the end of March 2022 for AP whereas with WDW it's loaded up through mid-January 2024 for normal park tickets and through the end of December 2022 for AP. It would be easier to drop the reservation logistically for DLR just because the date availability isn't as far out (by a good amount). I do think it would be best for DLR especially to do either/or with the reservation system and APs not both.

They have gone on record about a lot of things they later changed. And honestly, anything Chapek has said is game to change as soon as he is fired and replaced (which is going to happen soon, if the company's stock price continues on this downward path).

They also said "on record" that they expected to *announce* the new Disneyland "membership program" before the end of 2021. And while, technically that was true, we all know that's not what they meant when they said that.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

They have gone on record about a lot of things they later changed. And honestly, anything Chapek has said is game to change as soon as he is fired and replaced (which is going to happen soon, if the company's stock price continues on this downward path).

They also said "on record" that they expected to *announce* the new Disneyland "membership program" before the end of 2021. And while, technically that was true, we all know that's not what they meant when they said that.

I get what you're saying and don't disagree it's a possibility I'm just leaning more towards them less doing it voluntarily especially if legal action means they get to pass the buck on it. It's possible that they announce it but the reasonings behind it are beyond what we would be privy to (meaning if they were essentially forced to but it'll look like to the public they dropped it all on their own). But sooner rather than later is also subjective. If they got rid of it in the last month or two of 2022 that could still be sooner rather than later but so could getting rid of it in the first month or two of 2023 or sooner rather than later could mean middle of 2022. I'll give ya that if they drop it in 2022 though it would be at odds with the "here to stay" statements.

I have been hearing rumblings about Chapek, I think I saw a thread on that too but didn't really look into it.

 

[DLgal]

Well, they just released a TON of park reservations again for magic keys Jan-March. They have also announced a weekday so cal ticket promo, but it appears that they are either:

1. Continuing to anticipate low demand (maybe due to omicron) in the first few months of 2022

OR

2. Significantly increasing capacity

Or, I suppose it is also a possibility that they are proactively "fudging" the reservation system in favor of Magic Keys in anticipation of the increased legal scrutiny to come. I wouldn't put it past them, to be honest.

 

[longboard55]

It was not available every weekend for the plaintiff in November.

Are you just going to continue to tell us how the system works just peachy so long as you're exactly this or that? Like really when someone buys a pass and Disney creates a pass as well as one they chose to have the option to visit whenever someone wanted to you're like "well so long as you didn't want availability to be there on the weekend, so long as you're doing a short trip just 1 time in a month, so long as you just do a few days trip several times a year, etc the system works voila just like that. It doesn't work last minute if last minute has no availability. Honestly you're making a great case for the plaintiff, talking about how the system works so long as you don't actually use it like the pass is advertised and marketed as creating a misleading pass available to purchase.

Every comment you make seems to be how this system works out just fine..for you that is..so it shouldn't change because it works for you (which that's great it works for you, you're not presumably part of the class action suit then) but you're hardly screwed if the AP goes away. You just suddenly become like everyone else needing to purchase tickets to attend and if there's no availability on the day you want to visit you'll have no one to point the finger at if there's no APs. I don't see how your experience will be any less if no APs were there other than discounts available to AP holders (which can be a good perk understood). You'd have the same responsibility as the next person and as you did with APs to ensure you booked your reservation early enough or that you kept checking the system for availability to open up if it was not when you checked.

I had no issues getting reservations in November, but I booked early. Guess what many things in Disney require early booking. My problem is I get tired of people complaining about everything. As I have stated numerous times the old system was not working. Disneyland was getting over run with AP holders. They had to make a change. My first pass was $125 all days including parking, that will not work anymore, the keep raising prices, they is not working anymore, the reservation system works. It balances the crowd and puts a cap on attendance. Yes it takes some learning, just like planning a WDW trip takes learning, booking DVC has a learning curve. No one will get it from day one.

You want to see complaints, end the AP system. Too many people love it

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I had no issues getting reservations in November, but I booked early. Guess what many things in Disney require early booking. My problem is I get tired of people complaining about everything. As I have stated numerous times the old system was not working. Disneyland was getting over run with AP holders. They had to make a change. My first pass was $125 all days including parking, that will not work anymore, the keep raising prices, they is not working anymore, the reservation system works. It balances the crowd and puts a cap on attendance. Yes it takes some learning, just like planning a WDW trip takes learning, booking DVC has a learning curve. No one will get it from day one.

You want to see complaints, end the AP system. Too many people love it

Just because you didn't have an issue that means what? It can't possibly be an issue?