Latest School Shooting

[tex1989]

Yes, of course it is apples to oranges. We can and do legislate everything to protect our children, but we can’t do that when the medium is a gun due to it’s second amendment protection.

Sorry this is my comment and not part of the quote, can't figure out how to seperate the two.

The biggest problem we have protecting our children and everyone else for that matter is that you cannot legislate stupid. People who don't take the responsibility to raise their kids right and people following the regulations. Rules, laws, regulations are meaningless if people do not follow them and authorities do not enforce them. Texas passed a law that you cannot text while driving, big deal! Has it stopped anyone from doing it? Based on my unscientific poll taken during my daily commute it has had zero effect on the population as a whole. Police say "how do I know if they are texting or just making a phone call, which is still legal to do while driving". So 0 citations issues since the law went into effect.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Yes, of course it is apples to oranges. We can and do legislate everything to protect our children, but we can’t do that when the medium is a gun due to it’s second amendment protection.

So will there ever be a point at which people are willing to give up some of their gun ownership rights? How many children have to die due to gun violence before we come together and change? I think the responses here are representative of the US as a whole. I get the argument that guns don’t kill people—people kill people. But if we continue to have mass shootings in school and our children continue to die, will people ever decide that the right to bear arms to protect itself from the State isn’t worth the violence and death that comes with it?

So why do individuals (of varying ages) shoot inside a school?

You've got individuals who aren't legally allowed to own a gun because of their age using a gun either to commit suicide, shoot at random people in their school, shoot at specific people in their school, etc.

You've got individuals who are using guns that are legal in other countries and has been pointed out numerous times what's wrong with the US.

Respectfully what I'm seeing is you're not really caring about why so much as you've already made judgement calls and decided it's laws that pertain to gun ownership. I'm not saying nothing should be done but I don't have the knowledge to know that adjusting laws on the books will work because I don't have enough information in why people do what they do. It's sorta in my mind like a parent saying "Because I told you so" when they really have no other explanation to give.

 

[tinkerdorabelle]

It is surely a lot of money when compared to my income.
But;
In the area of Political spending in the U.S. the amount spent by the NRA is hardly worth mentioning.

US Chamber of Commerce $82,190,000
National Assn of Realtors $54,530,861
Business Roundtable $27,380,000
Pharmaceutical Research & Manufacturers of America $25,847,500
Blue Cross/Blue Shield $24,330,306
American Hospital Assn $22,094,214
American Medical Assn $21,535,000
Alphabet Inc $18,150,000
AT&T Inc $16,780,000
Boeing Co $16,740,000
Open Society Policy Center $16,110,000
DowDuPont $15,877,520
National Assn of Broadcasters $15,460,000
Comcast Corp $15,310,000
Lockheed Martin $14,464,290
Amazon.com $13,000,000
Southern Co $12,970,000
National Retail Federation $12,890,000
NCTA The Internet & Television Assn $12,790,000
Oracle Corp $12,385,000

The NRA is also tax exempt, supposedly so they don't try to put money into politics also. Please cut me a break. They have incredible influence and totally get over. And just listen to LaPierre talk his crazy nutjob conspiracy theory stuff to get people to buy more weapons.
"The NRA has multiple organizations. They have a 501c3, but they also have a 501c4 and PAC. The activities they do when they endorse candidates is not with the 501c3. That organization can take tax free money but are limited in what they can do in terms of electoral advocacy and lobbying. They can do issue campaigns about gun control. They can also do “grassroots lobbying” but only 20% of their budget.

Their 501c4, however, is what you sign up for with membership. 501c4s can do unlimited electoral advocacy to their members. And they can do electoral advocacy as long as it is not their “primary purpose”. They can do unlimited lobbying. This is their main political arm.

Their PAC can give money directly to candidates and say who to vote for and vote against. Many organizations like the NRA have multiple tax statuses that do different things and spend a ton of money on election lawyers to keep it all straight.

I would recommend interviewing the Alliance for Justice which gives this type of guidance to progressive organizations. http://www.afj.org/"

 

[tinkerdorabelle]

Sorry double post

 

[3 MEN AND A BOAT]

The NRA is also tax exempt, supposedly so they don't try to put money into politics also. Please cut me a break. They have incredible influence and totally get over. And just listen to LaPierre talk his crazy nutjob conspiracy theory stuff to get people to buy more weapons.
"The NRA has multiple organizations. They have a 501c3, but they also have a 501c4 and PAC. The activities they do when they endorse candidates is not with the 501c3. That organization can take tax free money but are limited in what they can do in terms of electoral advocacy and lobbying. They can do issue campaigns about gun control. They can also do “grassroots lobbying” but only 20% of their budget.

Their 501c4, however, is what you sign up for with membership. 501c4s can do unlimited electoral advocacy to their members. And they can do electoral advocacy as long as it is not their “primary purpose”. They can do unlimited lobbying. This is their main political arm.

Their PAC can give money directly to candidates and say who to vote for and vote against. Many organizations like the NRA have multiple tax statuses that do different things and spend a ton of money on election lawyers to keep it all straight.

I would recommend interviewing the Alliance for Justice which gives this type of guidance to progressive organizations. http://www.afj.org/"

What crazy conspiracy stuff?

I’m a member and the only correspondence I receive is a monthly magazine and letters trying to get me to renew my membership. Their publications/magazines are mostly reviews of new products, articles about techniques, or a look back at historical firearms. It’s not a brainwashed cult.

 

[luvsJack]

What crazy conspiracy stuff?

I’m a member and the only correspondence I receive is a monthly magazine and letters trying to get me to renew my membership. Their publications/magazines are mostly reviews of new products, articles about techniques, or a look back at historical firearms. It’s not a brainwashed cult.

I am not a member of the NRA but it sounds like to me, some folks have this odd idea that its a secret club, meeting in a basement trying to figure out how to brainwash all of America so that everyone is armed to the teeth with "military" weapons. Or some other, just as crazy, scenario.

 

[tinkerdorabelle]

Sorry it went over your head that the NRA is TAX EXEMPT and LaPierre endlessly talks his crazy stuff after shootings benefitting and exploiting it to his benefit.

What crazy conspiracy stuff?

I’m a member and the only correspondence I receive is a monthly magazine and letters trying to get me to renew my membership. Their publications/magazines are mostly reviews of new products, articles about techniques, or a look back at historical firearms. It’s not a brainwashed cult.

And every time there is a shooting he goes out and talks that we need more guns, enriching himself. You don't see a problem with that and them being TAX EXEMPT? I thought he wasn't suppose to talk politics? Tells the country that they are going to take away all your guns and all his other fear mongering baloney. Getting people to buy more guns. Really listen to him talk. He's nuts. He came out right after the Parkland shooting benefitting and exploiting the shooting to enrich himself like the worm that he is. Talking and blaming socialism omg what a crackpot and sleazy guy.

 

[luvsJack]

Sorry it went over your head that the NRA is TAX EXEMPT and LaPierre endlessly talks his crazy stuff after shootings benefitting and exploiting it to his benefit.


And every time there is a shooting he goes out and talks that we need more guns, enriching himself. You don't see a problem with that and them being TAX EXEMPT? I thought he wasn't suppose to talk politics? Tells the country that they are going to take away all your guns and all his other fear mongering baloney. Getting people to buy more guns. Really listen to him talk. He's nuts. He came out right after the Parkland shooting benefitting and exploiting the shooting to enrich himself like the worm that he is. Talking and blaming socialism omg what a crackpot and sleazy guy.

I must admit, he is one of those people that I don't listen to closely. But the speech I read/heard after Parkland mentioned having armed guards at the schools. He isn't the only one to speak on that. He does talk a lot about strengthening the safety of schools. Of course he could have said a whole lot more, like Oliver North, not someone I really listen to and the NRA really isn't something I pay a whole lot of attention to.

I haven't actually heard him say anything about taking all the guns away but he did say that the other side just wants to use these tragedies as a political stance on gun control. Which is true to a point.

There are people on both sides of the argument using these tragedies to prove their own point.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Sorry it went over your head that the NRA is TAX EXEMPT and LaPierre endlessly talks his crazy stuff after shootings benefitting and exploiting it to his benefit.


And every time there is a shooting he goes out and talks that we need more guns, enriching himself. You don't see a problem with that and them being TAX EXEMPT? I thought he wasn't suppose to talk politics? Tells the country that they are going to take away all your guns and all his other fear mongering baloney. Getting people to buy more guns. Really listen to him talk. He's nuts. He came out right after the Parkland shooting benefitting and exploiting the shooting to enrich himself like the worm that he is. Talking and blaming socialism omg what a crackpot and sleazy guy.

He may hype the heck out of it, but to claim there aren’t people attempting to do EXACTLY the things he says they’re trying to do is just flat out dishonest.

 

[tinkerdorabelle]

He may hype the heck out of it, but to claim there aren’t people attempting to do EXACTLY the things he says they’re trying to do is just flat out dishonest.

Well the Parkland kids called "BS!" on him big time. The thing about kids or young adults, is they haven't had the time to get brainwashed and they just see clearly through the baloney.

 

[Domo]

People are inherently stupid. If I had it my way, I wouldn't trust them with anything more than a squirt gun.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Well the Parkland kids called "BS!" on him big time. The thing about kids or young adults, is they haven't had the time to get brainwashed and they just see clearly through the baloney.

No offense to those kids, but they really don’t know anything about the topic.

 

[3 MEN AND A BOAT]

Sorry it went over your head that the NRA is TAX EXEMPT and LaPierre endlessly talks his crazy stuff after shootings benefitting and exploiting it to his benefit.


And every time there is a shooting he goes out and talks that we need more guns, enriching himself. You don't see a problem with that and them being TAX EXEMPT? I thought he wasn't suppose to talk politics? Tells the country that they are going to take away all your guns and all his other fear mongering baloney. Getting people to buy more guns. Really listen to him talk. He's nuts. He came out right after the Parkland shooting benefitting and exploiting the shooting to enrich himself like the worm that he is. Talking and blaming socialism omg what a crackpot and sleazy guy.

It didn’t go over my head. You’re not a fan, gotcha.

 

[UncleMike101]

Sorry it went over your head that the NRA is TAX EXEMPT and LaPierre endlessly talks his crazy stuff after shootings benefitting and exploiting it to his benefit.


And every time there is a shooting he goes out and talks that we need more guns, enriching himself. You don't see a problem with that and them being TAX EXEMPT? I thought he wasn't suppose to talk politics? Tells the country that they are going to take away all your guns and all his other fear mongering baloney. Getting people to buy more guns. Really listen to him talk. He's nuts. He came out right after the Parkland shooting benefitting and exploiting the shooting to enrich himself like the worm that he is. Talking and blaming socialism omg what a crackpot and sleazy guy.

You really need to research what the NRA stands for and exactly what they do.
At NO time since the organizations founding (1871) has it EVER sold or transferred firearms, or profited from the sale of firearms.
Mr La Pierre doesn't, to my knowledge, own a retail or wholesale firearms distribution point and profits exactly ZERO from the sale of firearms.
The NRA is an information distribution outlet that keeps it's members abreast of current trends and advances in firearms technology and firearms related legislation.
They DO NOT NOW NOR HAVE THEY EVER SOLD FIREARMS.
PERIOD.................
That idea is a product of fertile, but uninformed, imaginations, most of which reside in the Press or Congress.

 

[luvsJack]

Well the Parkland kids called "BS!" on him big time. The thing about kids or young adults, is they haven't had the time to get brainwashed and they just see clearly through the baloney.

The thing about kids and young adults is they haven’t matured enough or had enough life experience to know that one side is rarely 100% right. They believe they are right and anything that doesn’t go exactly along with that is wrong. They don’t see all the gray areas in any thing.

No one is trying to brainwash anyone and I can assure you that just because someone believes in their right to own a gun they are not in any way brainwashed.

 

[Suger Mag]

The thing about kids and young adults is they haven’t matured enough or had enough life experience to know that one side is rarely 100% right. They believe they are right and anything that doesn’t go exactly along with that is wrong. They don’t see all the gray areas in any thing.

No one is trying to brainwash anyone and I can assure you that just because someone believes in their right to own a gun they are not in any way brainwashed.

Are you sure you are not talking about discussions on the DISboards? Seems that this is a common phenomenon not just limited to children and young adults. Too many people are entrenched in a position and no one wants to look to the middle ground.

 

[luvsJack]

Are you sure you are not talking about discussions on the DISboards? Seems that this is a common phenomenon not just limited to children and young adults. Too many people are entrenched in a position and no one wants to look to the middle ground.

Lol. You are right about that.

for this particular subject, There are some that don’t even want to consider anything except gun control. Nothing to make schools safer, just guns.

And I do know that there are some that don’t want to consider any kind of gun control. But I have to say that I haven’t seen that here. Most “pro gun” posters have said some things they think should happen.

My hope is that once Texas implements the changes the governor wants, the rest of the US will take the same actions. From what I read it seems like a good mix of better control and action to make schools safer. We will see I guess.

 

[3 MEN AND A BOAT]

Are you sure you are not talking about discussions on the DISboards? Seems that this is a common phenomenon not just limited to children and young adults. Too many people are entrenched in a position and no one wants to look to the middle ground.

It can seem that way at times but Let me ask you something.
What exactly are those calling for more gun control offering up as compromise? Anything or just an attempt at doing something in the name of safety that I personally don’t believe will help. Look at whenever suppressors are brought up, or national concealed carry reciprocity. To meet in the middle it takes both sides, and it seems one side only wants to take something away from the gun owners of America. You want bumpstocks banned, give national conceal carry and I’ll be on board in a heartbeat. All I would be asking for is not to be made a criminal by crossing a state line.

 

[3 MEN AND A BOAT]

My hope is that once Texas implements the changes the governor wants, the rest of the US will take the same actions. From what I read it seems like a good mix of better control and action to make schools safer. We will see I guess.

Alabama’s governor signed an executive order allowing school administrators to carry, it’s a start. They have to meet certain criteria but people are trying and that’s a move in the right direction.

 

[Suger Mag]

It can seem that way at times but Let me ask you something.
What exactly are those calling for more gun control offering up as compromise? Anything or just an attempt at doing something in the name of safety that I personally don’t believe will help. Look at whenever suppressors are brought up, or national concealed carry reciprocity. To meet in the middle it takes both sides, and it seems one side only wants to take something away from the gun owners of America. You want bumpstocks banned, give national conceal carry and I’ll be on board in a heartbeat. All I would be asking for is not to be made a criminal by crossing a state line.

I have been lurking on this thread since the beginning and the passion about their particular position for many of the posters is pretty apparent, and I am not going to get pulled into a this side against that side... as that is the heart of my comment, all snark aside..

I think so far the best answer was given by Condoleeza Rice, that the problem is many faceted, and there is not going to be an easy one size fits all solution. But we have to be willing to talk and try things out, and be willing to look at what is and is not working. It is going to take time and it is not so simple as banning guns.