Lack of Ethics

[delicious]

I am really tired of trying to make trades with some people on here. I have three major issues. And please believe this is not about everyone on the board, it is a problem I have run into several times. Get mad at me if you want, I don't care, I am tired of all the bull!!

1. People that ask people on the board to buy stuff for them while they are away. ie, I will not be here this weekend could someone please buy me the weekend pins?
You reply to these people and you agree to purchase for them and they agree to buy from you on their return, then when they return they do not buy the stuff from you. (i am talking about having actual contact with the person before they leave)

2. People that post trades and never see fit to make any reply to your offer, I have had some threads on my list for weeks at a time waiting for someone to reply to any of the people posting offers. How hard is it to simply say no if you are not interested in a trade.

3. People that ACCEPT offers then before you can meet up with them they refuse to trade. (and I am not talking a week to meet up I am talking about a matter of a few days-not all people are on the same time zone you know) And of course view the post you will find that the person recieved what they thought was a better offer before you could meet up. If you want to wait for better offers I am not complaining about that, I am, however, complaining about you accepting an offer then backing out. Where are your ethics?

Maybe it is just that you don't know the meaning of the word accept, in that case let me give you a copy of the dictionary version: pay close attention to the definition in bold.

ac·cept /ækˈsɛpt/ –verb (used with object) 1. to take or receive (something offered); receive with approval or favor: to accept a present; to accept a proposal. 2. to agree or consent to; accede to: to accept a treaty; to accept an apology.
3. to respond or answer affirmatively to: to accept an invitation.
4. to undertake the responsibility, duties, honors, etc., of: to accept the office of president.
5. to receive or admit formally, as to a college or club.
6. to accommodate or reconcile oneself to: to accept the situation.
7. to regard as true or sound; believe: to accept a claim; to accept Catholicism.
8. to regard as normal, suitable, or usual.
9. to receive as to meaning; understand.
10. Commerce. to acknowledge, by signature, as calling for payment, and thus to agree to pay, as a draft.
11. (in a deliberative body) to receive as an adequate performance of the duty with which an officer or a committee has been charged; receive for further action: The report of the committee was accepted.
12. to receive or contain (something attached, inserted, etc.): This socket won't accept a three-pronged plug.
13. to receive (a transplanted organ or tissue) without adverse reaction. Compare reject (def. 7).
–verb (used without object) 14. to accept an invitation, gift, position, etc. (sometimes fol. by of).





I opened a new thread titled
DIS TRADING ETIQUETTE Guideline, your thoughts please
be sure to stop there and give your input also

 

[Disney Dreams]

Could not have said it better myself. And it SOOO needed to be said.

 

[redsfan]

3. People that ACCEPT offers then before you can meet up with them they refuse to trade. (and I am not talking a week to meet up I am talking about a matter of a few days-not all people are on the same time zone you know) And of course view the post you will find that the person recieved what they thought was a better offer before you could meet up. If you want to wait for better offers I am not complaining about that, I am, however, complaining about you accepting an offer then backing out. Where are your ethics?

Maybe it is just that you don't know the meaning of the word accept, in that case let me give you a copy of the dictionary version: pay close attention to the definition in bold.

ac·cept /ækˈsɛpt/ –verb (used with object) 1. to take or receive (something offered); receive with approval or favor: to accept a present; to accept a proposal. 2. to agree or consent to; accede to: to accept a treaty; to accept an apology.
3. to respond or answer affirmatively to: to accept an invitation.
4. to undertake the responsibility, duties, honors, etc., of: to accept the office of president.
5. to receive or admit formally, as to a college or club.
6. to accommodate or reconcile oneself to: to accept the situation.
7. to regard as true or sound; believe: to accept a claim; to accept Catholicism.
8. to regard as normal, suitable, or usual.
9. to receive as to meaning; understand.
10. Commerce. to acknowledge, by signature, as calling for payment, and thus to agree to pay, as a draft.
11. (in a deliberative body) to receive as an adequate performance of the duty with which an officer or a committee has been charged; receive for further action: The report of the committee was accepted.
12. to receive or contain (something attached, inserted, etc.): This socket won't accept a three-pronged plug.
13. to receive (a transplanted organ or tissue) without adverse reaction. Compare reject (def. 7).
–verb (used without object) 14. to accept an invitation, gift, position, etc. (sometimes fol. by of).

I totally agree with this. It is so annoying to have an offer accepted and then have them trade the item to someone else.

 

[Pirate-Emery]

I totally agree with this. It is so annoying to have an offer accepted and then have them trade the item to someone else.

There's a difference between this, and buyer's remorse.

I'd say folks have the right to have buyer's remorse, given that they are legitimately sorry for having to cancel the trade at the last minute. These are the folks that have a change of heart regarding the item they're trading, or that they made a stupid error regarding their inventory and miscounted what they had (happens to the best of us).

Those that trade the item to someone else, after promising the trade to a previous person, are completely rude. No excuses there: it's just bad form.

 

[redsfan]

I'd say folks have the right to have buyer's remorse, given that they are legitimately sorry for having to cancel the trade at the last minute. These are the folks that have a change of heart regarding the item they're trading, or that they made a stupid error regarding their inventory and miscounted what they had (happens to the best of us).

I agree with you on this so long as an offer has not been accepted. But IMO once you accept an offer then the trade needs to be completed no matter what. No excuses.

Redsfan

 

[SkippyPaul]

I totally agree. Whether your trading here on the board or in dis the key word is respect. Does it hurt to say hi bye thankyou? Same applys here. Common sense. If you strike a bargain stick to it. You make an offer follow through. Think of it like a hand shake.

If you have a trade thread and you get offers at least reply to them, show the ppl some respect.

One thing here that erks me. You have a trade thread running. To ppl who have posted within your thread decide to trade each other in your very own thread. Its hijacking and very very rude. It just seems that ppl are obsessed with rare and dont care about each others feelings.

 

[KingTryton]

I would have to agree with you on this. Sadly ethics is slipping past many of us. It is not just here on the DIS. People are more prone these days to look you in the eye and tell you one thing and then do just the opposite. This is also affecting our personal lives. Just look at the daily news.
This may be coming from the job market these days where it is more common to have had more than 5 careers in a life time.

 

[aengus]

there are many good points on this. I had talked to Lori and Mal also about making a trading etiquette thread. Not enforceable rules, but some trading do's and don'ts and educate people that there should be some honor when trading.

Rather than having the moderators put something together, maybe we as a community could come up with a set of guidelines to stick by when trading. Of course some would still refuse to live by them, but at least there would be a large group of people we all know that stick to them.

Another thing that has burned me quite a bit lately is people making offers of items they dont actually have. It's often with the best of intentions but I think most of us veterans have figured out you cant offer what you dont have.

What do you guys think of having the peeps put this together? Perhaps delicious would agree to take the lead?

 

[Maleficent2]

I am really tired of trying to make trades with some people on here. I have three major issues. And please believe this is not about everyone on the board, it is a problem I have run into several times. Get mad at me if you want, I don't care, I am tired of all the bull!!

1. People that ask people on the board to buy stuff for them while they are away. ie, I will not be here this weekend could someone please buy me the weekend pins?
You reply to these people and you agree to purchase for them and they agree to buy from you on their return, then when they return they do not buy the stuff from you. (i am talking about having actual contact with the person before they leave)

Most of your points are valid and good but I would like to comment on number#1...

IF you can not afford to purchase items for someone who needs help whether it is because they are on vacation, ill, or just unable to log on for what ever reason then DO NOT DO IT

Things happen...more players bought items for someone that was in need than they can afford to purchase afterwards, other players gifted the person in need the items they missed etc etc

So I think the rule of thumb here is if you can not afford to purchase extra and have them in your inventory if something happens and the other member does not need them anymore then do not offer or buy the items, period.

When I purchase items for people in need I do not expect payment of any kind I consider my purchase and the gift of the item to the other member just that a GIFT.

 

[BriarRosie]

Most of your points are valid and good but I would like to comment on number#1...

IF you can not afford to purchase items for someone who needs help whether it is because they are on vacation, ill, or just unable to log on for what ever reason then DO NOT DO IT

Things happen...more players bought items for someone that was in need than they can afford to purchase afterwards, other players gifted the person in need the items they missed etc etc

So I think the rule of thumb here is if you can not afford to purchase extra and have them in your inventory if something happens and the other member does not need them anymore then do not offer or buy the items, period.

When I purchase items for people in need I do not expect payment of any kind I consider my purchase and the gift of the item to the other member just that a GIFT.

But what I think happened with delicious was that she agreed to do the
favor of buying a pin while the other player was away from VMK with the
agreement that the player, upon returning, would buy the next pin as
an even exchange. Delicious was doing something nice, but I think the
other player took advantage of her kindness. If someone is going to post,
"I can't be in VMK this weekend, can someone get me XX amount of pins
and I'll buy XX amount of pins for you the following week?", then they
are obligated to follow through, IMHO.

I do this all the time with close friends who've gone to WDW or other
vacations, and they just buy me the replacement cost of the pins the
following week.

Also...

I think the trade ettiquette thread is a good idea, but I am dumbfounded
that some players are offering items they don't even have!

 

[delicious]

lol thank you, I knew I was not the only one feeling this.

Pirate Emery - buyers remorse I can understand to a point, but then again if you think you don't want to trade it don't list it. and if you accept a deal - a deal is a deal honor it. And I can totally understand about miss counting your inventory - we are all only human and prone to make mistakes. But when you suddenly get denied your trade and read down on the traders thread and see where they got more offers, then suddenly your accepted trade is denied and a trade it accepted on someone below you come on we know what happened. Again like I said if you want time to allow for all to see thread and see if better offers come in then Don't accept offers till you are ready.

Redsfan - correct, A Deal is A Deal

SkippyPaul - Respect, thats the word I was looking for. Also consideration. lol maybe we need the dictionary of these two words also. And definitely no one should cut in on your thread and make offers, people open your own thread lol

aengus - I would be glad to help out! And I can't believe people offer knowing they don't have items. I have replied to threads when vmk was down and send offers like I am interested in the following items and I have the items --- on your wishlist, then if i was not sure say the item they wanted was a set of pins I would say (i don't know which ones I have from this set but will check as soon as vmk opens and I will update offer) this way the person knows I am interested and when vmk opens I check everything and update my offer.

Mal - I understand what you are saying and gifting is fine I do it sometimes, but I can't support all of vmk lol. My point is I have done this a few times and my brother also, but no more for me. I contacted the person, I was the only one that did. I pmd and made the arrangements. they replied and agreed. I would not just go out and buy hoping they would pay back. I would make a deal directly. this is what I am talking about if you have contact and make a deal again A Deal is A Deal. The one I am referring to made the deal with me then when they got back, I was told I got them already sorry. It is not a matter if I had the money it is a matter that I agreed to do something nice for someone then got kicked in the teeth. My brother is still carrying around items he purchased for someone over a month ago. The thing with the help me threads, people should not just go buy expecting payment, but if you contact this person and an agreement is reached, honor the agreement.

BriarRosie - ty yes I made an agreement I did not just go buy stuff hoping to help. Because so many people do help I would only do so if actual contact was made and agreement made.
And I have gifted many people, gifting is great.

to everyone else that posted ty. I did not reply directly to you because I did not need to make an extra point on your post.

 

[Maleficent2]

delicious

I understand that you had an arrangement with this other member and yes they should have completed what ever arrangement you pre set. But with all threads where members ask for help because of what ever reason other members may end up gifting them what ever they missed and thus making it unnecessary for them to complete the deal. Does that leave you in the lurch, yes, that is why I said if you can not afford to gift the items then don't enter into the deal or offer. I was not putting you down it is just a matter of affordability and what you can and can not afford to do.


I am sorry you feel taken advantage of but I stand behind my previous statement, some will agree and others will not, don't offer to buy things for others who will miss them for what ever reason if you can not afford to consider them a gift.

I am not saying you have to GIFT them and I am not chastising you for gifting or not gifting, I am only saying it from a credit stand point.

Then there is always the other side of the coin:

Members post for help other members respond that they will help and member #1 returns only to find that member #2 did not for what ever reason stick to their part of the deal and member #1 is left without the items they missed.


I do think we need a trading etiquette thread and like Aengus suggested maybe you could start one where other members could add their input and then the Mods could condense it into a DIS TRADING ETIQUETTE Guideline thread.

I just wanted to add:

DISers are generous to a fault, while I love this about our members from a trading stand point it is not always in the best interest of the traders.

 

[BattyMcDoon]

Also...

I think the trade ettiquette thread is a good idea, but I am dumbfounded
that some players are offering items they don't even have!

i think what was said was something about miscounting i could see if someone made an honest mistake and miscounted their items but i think going to trade something you dont even have is just wrong

now what about the people that are hoping for a better offer? i know there are items that ive had that i dont really need and wanted to trade but havnt really gotten anything i wanted or thought was worth the trade i would hope no one would be upset with me if i said no thank you to any of the offers...

 

[delicious]

delicious

I understand that you had an arrangement with this other member and yes they should have completed what ever arrangement you pre set. But with all threads where members ask for help because of what ever reason other members may end up gifting them what ever they missed and thus making it unnecessary for them to complete the deal. Does that leave you in the lurch, yes, that is why I said if you can not afford to gift the items then don't enter into the deal or offer. I was not putting you down it is just a matter of affordability and what you can and can not afford to do.


I am sorry you feel taken advantage of but I stand behind my previous statement, some will agree and others will not, don't offer to buy things for others who will miss them for what ever reason if you can not afford to consider them a gift.

I am not saying you have to GIFT them and I am not chastising you for gifting or not gifting, I am only saying it from a credit stand point.

Then there is always the other side of the coin:

Members post for help other members respond that they will help and member #1 returns only to find that member #2 did not for what ever reason stick to their part of the deal and member #1 is left without the items they missed.


I do think we need a trading etiquette thread and like Aengus suggested maybe you could start one where other members could add their input and then the Mods could condense it into a DIS TRADING ETIQUETTE Guideline thread.

Mal you are so right, it does work both ways, and if someone had agreed to purchase items for someone while they are gone, A Deal is A Deal. back to my two new words
Consideration and Respect. Come on people, can we not get a break from the cruelty of the real world and at least here inside the virtual Disney world have some consideration and respect for each other.

 

[delicious]

i think what was said was something about miscounting i could see if someone made an honest mistake and miscounted their items but i think going to trade something you dont even have is just wrong

now what about the people that are hoping for a better offer? i know there are items that ive had that i dont really need and wanted to trade but havnt really gotten anything i wanted or thought was worth the trade i would hope no one would be upset with me if i said no thank you to any of the offers...

No BattyMcDoon, we are not talking about that you have the right not to accept an offer or to even think about the offer. We are talking about people that accept an offer then refuse to trade.

 

[BattyMcDoon]

i was just making sure i hate to hurt peoples feelings because i know how it feels

 

[delicious]

I opened a new thread titled
DIS TRADING ETIQUETTE Guideline, your thoughts please
be sure to stop there and give your input also

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1527073

 

[Maleficent2]

Mal you are so right, it does work both ways, and if someone had agreed to purchase items for someone while they are gone, A Deal is A Deal. back to my two new words
Consideration and Respect. Come on people, can we not get a break from the cruelty of the real world and at least here inside the virtual Disney world have some consideration and respect for each other.

I added this to my previous post but I will also say it here:

DISers are generous to a fault, while I love this about our members from a trading stand point it is not always in the best interest of the traders.

I am not disagreeing with you...far from it I am just trying to point out why your trade agreement may not have been followed through on.

No BattyMcDoon, we are not talking about that you have the right not to accept an offer or to even think about the offer. We are talking about people that accept an offer then refuse to trade.

This is why I do not like to trade. Everyone has the right to change their minds even after they have made a commitment...if more people exercise this right maybe we would not have such a high divorce rate in this county.

There are always two sides to every story and varying opinions to every issues.

I am not saying one way is right and the other is wrong just offering an opposing opinion and/or side.

 

[delicious]

I added this to my previous post but I will also say it here:

DISers are generous to a fault, while I love this about our members from a trading stand point it is not always in the best interest of the traders.

I am not disagreeing with you...far from it I am just trying to point out why your trade agreement may not have been followed through on.






This is why I do not like to trade. Everyone has the right to change their minds even after they have made a commitment...if more people exercise this right maybe we would not have such a high divorce rate in this county.

There are always two sides to every story and varying opinions to every issues.

I am not saying one way is right and the other is wrong just offering an opposing opinion and/or side.

So right, Mal, that is how to make a good debate, hear both sides of the story. I am not set in stone on my views, I like to hear the other side, but with the same thing happening numerous times I just thought it time to have my say lol. You are just hearing my side as the wounded party lol.

 

[crazy4cheats]

happens all the time in vmk, at least we can illiminate it on the dis