Just Saying No?

[cyclenut]

Thought about this while I was waking up this morning. I am getting tired of the argument that this is just a supply and demand issue, because to be honest they could raise their prices more and still fill the ships. What DCL is really doing is determine economic status of the people that they have on board (couldn't think of a better word). Back when we first started sailing them the cruises were available to people from many economic classes with the concierge suites topping it off. What they have started to do now is push people in the lower middle class to other lines by raising their prices. This is a move, not sure it is a good one.

What Disney needs to decide is what is their target market, a family that pulls in 100 to 150K a year or families that make 50 to 150k a year. It does appear now that they are starting to make a move to target the wealthier cruisers. At this point they really don't need to grow their brand anymore, it is pretty well ingrained in our thoughts and lives.

I just can't bring myself to let this one go. I don't agree with the notion that DCL is targeting a specific economic class of people for their ships. Disney is laser focused on their target market. Families. They have a variety of vacation options with the intent of capturing those family vacation dollars often. Whether it's the parks, resorts or cruise lines, they are targeting any family of any economic class that values a friction-less vacation experience. Creating that costs money. Lots of money. More money every year.

 

[Diss DIS]

I totally agree with this post. I actually came across this board because I was seaching on Google for any websites commenting on 2019 prices as I was curious if anyone else felt the same way I did. My family and I have been loyal Disney customers for many years, 7 cruises and 6 visits to WDW. However, the shock from 2019 prices has caused me to no longer be a loyal customer. Can I afford the higher prices - yes; however, I cannot in good conscience pay what they are asking. It is unreasonable in my opinion. Time will tell if Disney has gone too far. I certainly hope others are confident enough to say no, I definitely told the Disney representative that I was speaking with that I would not be booking a future cruise as it was too expensive. Thank you to dclcrazy64622 for starting the conversation.

 

[cruiser21]

I just can't bring myself to let this one go. I don't agree with the notion that DCL is targeting a specific economic class of people for their ships. Disney is laser focused on their target market. Families. They have a variety of vacation options with the intent of capturing those family vacation dollars often. Whether it's the parks, resorts or cruise lines, they are targeting any family of any economic class that values a friction-less vacation experience. Creating that costs money. Lots of money. More money every year.

Why do they send out surveys asking about income, assists and net worth? I can't be the only one that got this survey.

 

[geoly1]

Hi! Like other posters I did not even look at opening day cruises with DCL. My son is graduating High school & turning 18 but wanted one last cruise (April 2018) before that happened so he could have the fun in the “kids” club. This is where I believe DCL drops the ball with young adults too old for the clubs. I know there are the 18-20 meet ups but next to ice rinks, flow riders, zip lines, climbing walls etc on other ships it’s tough to justify the cost vs. amenities for young adults.

 

[P'colaBeachBum]

I didn't vote because after seeing the concierge prices for 2019 our last cruise ( gold) will be in 2018. We love concierge but have finally hit the limit on how much we will spend. We are also not interested in cruising on other cruise lines or military discounted last min. deals. Will take longer or more frequent stays at WDW.

 

[cyclenut]

Why do they send out surveys asking about income, assists and net worth? I can't be the only one that got this survey.

It is important for any company to understand the demographics of it's customers. That doesn't mean they specifically target by income level. I have no doubt they are after everyone's money, but I don't think they much care about the socioeconomic bracket of passengers.

It's important to differentiate marketing from pricing strategies. Disney sells experiences. They are not just selling you a room on a ship. They are not just selling you a vacation. I buy Disney for the vacation experience. The escape from all reality. Those that are interested in buying experiences are most often in a higher socioeconomic class. People who struggle to keep food on the table and a roof over their head, are not going to be interested in paying for an experience, but will still want a vacation. Disney will happily take their money, but they are not going to spend money marketing to them.

None of us here really know for sure the rationale behind Disney's pricing strategies. We can see that price increases exceed the inflation rate so it's reasonable to conclude that it isn't just about cost. I believe it is simple economics. Disney knows down to the penny how much everyone on board the ship paid and when they first agreed to pay that price. There are threads that provide a more rudimentary pricing analysis for us. We know that prices generally go up as cabins become more scarce. That's actually bad news for Disney. It means that they could have charged more for those cabins on opening day. They take a close look at what they could have charged passengers and use that to determine pricing for the next time. It's a more complex set of data analytics than simple supply and demand.

A well balanced business plan will put everything into the final mix. The product being sold, who it is being sold to and the price charged for the product must align. A product that does not appeal to a certain demographic should not be marketed to them. That's a waste of advertising dollars. A price that is too high will mean the product does not sell. A price that is too low will sell too quickly and undermine the marketing plan, potentially harming sales in the long run.

 

[lds0191]

Yes, DCL prices are high and they have risen a lot since our first cruise in 2005. We have looked at other cruise lines and for the times we can book the costs are cheaper on RCCL and NCL (will not even consider Carnival even though I have friends who love cruising them) but we prefer to stick with Disney. We feel like we have come home every time we board. I can not afford most of the advertised rates but we do OBB, pay with gift cards from Target, assign placeholders to a travel agent for shipboard credit, save our change to cover tips and make use of Florida Resident rates as often as we can. It does help living in Florida as we do not have to pay for airfare, hotels and renatal cars. All of that being said, I do wonder if DCL can continue to fill their ships especially when there are 7 in operation. Time will tell. We only cruise when we feel like we are getting a decent deal. There is no way I can or will pay $4000 for a 4nt cruise for 2 people. I just choose to say home.

 

[cgolf]

I just can't bring myself to let this one go. I don't agree with the notion that DCL is targeting a specific economic class of people for their ships. Disney is laser focused on their target market. Families. They have a variety of vacation options with the intent of capturing those family vacation dollars often. Whether it's the parks, resorts or cruise lines, they are targeting any family of any economic class that values a friction-less vacation experience. Creating that costs money. Lots of money. More money every year.

We can agree to disagree. I know that when my company releases a new product, they determine the price by not only profit margin, but the market they are selling into. Sometimes we will sacrifice profit to sell more units. DCL is in an interesting spot because at least right now they don't have a lot of ships.

DCL isn't unattainable by everyone, they may just have to save up to do it. We chose to move on because we couldn't do 2 Cruises a year or one and pay for college tuition. Realistically the fact that we are talking about cruising at all means we are all doing ok. We will likely sail the new DCL ships when they come out and anytime we find a competitive price. The Magic is still our favorite ship

 

[cruiser21]

It is important for any company to understand the demographics of it's customers. That doesn't mean they specifically target by income level. I have no doubt they are after everyone's money, but I don't think they much care about the socioeconomic bracket of passengers.

It's important to differentiate marketing from pricing strategies. Disney sells experiences. They are not just selling you a room on a ship. They are not just selling you a vacation. I buy Disney for the vacation experience. The escape from all reality. Those that are interested in buying experiences are most often in a higher socioeconomic class. People who struggle to keep food on the table and a roof over their head, are not going to be interested in paying for an experience, but will still want a vacation. Disney will happily take their money, but they are not going to spend money marketing to them.

None of us here really know for sure the rationale behind Disney's pricing strategies. We can see that price increases exceed the inflation rate so it's reasonable to conclude that it isn't just about cost. I believe it is simple economics. Disney knows down to the penny how much everyone on board the ship paid and when they first agreed to pay that price. There are threads that provide a more rudimentary pricing analysis for us. We know that prices generally go up as cabins become more scarce. That's actually bad news for Disney. It means that they could have charged more for those cabins on opening day. They take a close look at what they could have charged passengers and use that to determine pricing for the next time. It's a more complex set of data analytics than simple supply and demand.

A well balanced business plan will put everything into the final mix. The product being sold, who it is being sold to and the price charged for the product must align. A product that does not appeal to a certain demographic should not be marketed to them. That's a waste of advertising dollars. A price that is too high will mean the product does not sell. A price that is too low will sell too quickly and undermine the marketing plan, potentially harming sales in the long run.

I've only gotten that survey once and I thought it was very noisy and in poor taste. I did the survey, but I basically put false answers. Hopefully they stopped sending it out. I doubt most people would answer the questions at all. Asking people how much they have in savings and investments is a little out of line.

 

[AquaDame]

Why do they send out surveys asking about income, assists and net worth? I can't be the only one that got this survey.

Mine have always ended asking what our income level is (as have many companies that have sent out surveys) but never any further details. Maybe they quickly pulled that one.

 

[cruiser21]

Mine have always ended asking what our income level is (as have many companies that have sent out surveys) but never any further details. Maybe they quickly pulled that one.

I got it in May after the Dream. The survey I got after Alaska asked a lot of questions about food and service. It didn't ask income level which was odd too. I'm guessing they have a bunch of different surveys they send out.

 

[AquaDame]

I imagine so... I always get them after every cruise or stay at the parks. The surveys I get from airlines also ask about our income level as well as age and zip code. Disney requests ethnicity as well which makes me pause - that one seems less frequent though I've also seen it on surveys from our metro services.

aaand now I went off topic myself. Sorry!

I'm not sure I commented about the options on the poll yet... I chose neither as neither one is right for us. So far we're still DCL people but I don't have endless money...

 

[Neptune's Fork]

I have a theory on the price increase. DCL knows they can't keep raising at the rate they have in the last couple years, otherwise, within a decade they'd probably price out about 80% of families. They have a DCL corporate life changing event coming in a couple years, they will just about double their passenger capacity within a two year span when the new ships come on line. So there's a lot of uncertainly how the business model will react to that. It could very well put them in a position where they can't feasibly raise rates for a while, or at least not at the present rate. So we could just be seeing a final push on the rates now, trying to get them up before the new ships start service.

Just a theory.

 

[cruiser21]

I can't answer yes or no either. There's just way to many variables. There are DCl cruises that are out of my budget others are not. It also depends on how many people are going. I cruised twice this year with just two prople in the off season. The price wasn't too bad. I would not spend 10k to 20k on a Summer or Spring break cruise.
I tend to be more spontaneous when it comes to vacations. The less time I have to mull over the cost the less painful it is. My dh just got a unexpected bonus so we just booked a vgt rate on the Magic. Probably should get the house painted, but going on a Disney cruise is just so much more responsible Lol.

 

[Dug720]

Mine have always ended asking what our income level is (as have many companies that have sent out surveys) but never any further details. Maybe they quickly pulled that one.

And every survey I've ever seen that did ask about income level has a "decline to answer" button. No one is forcing you to answer those questions.

If the whole survey is about finances and you're not comfortable with it, nothing says you have to take it. Most online surveys are set up so that if you don't complete the survey none of the answers record.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

And every survey I've ever seen that did ask about income level has a "decline to answer" button.

The ones I got did.

 

[bobbiwoz]

And every survey I've ever seen that did ask about income level has a "decline to answer" button. No one is forcing you to answer those questions.

If the whole survey is about finances and you're not comfortable with it, nothing says you have to take it. Most online surveys are set up so that if you don't complete the survey none of the answers record.

The ones I got did.

And nearly all the time I choose “ prefer not to answer.”

 

[Dug720]

And nearly all the time I choose “ prefer not to answer.”

Yep!

Unless someone is standing there with a gun to your head, no one is MAKING you answer the questions.

 

[JW9DVC]

No gouging is happening when supply and demand are a portion of the market.

That’s like saying a meal at fast food is price gouging because costs in general are going up.

Real estate has increased, minimum wages have increased. It all works.

 

[cyclenut]

We can agree to disagree. I know that when my company releases a new product, they determine the price by not only profit margin, but the market they are selling into. Sometimes we will sacrifice profit to sell more units. DCL is in an interesting spot because at least right now they don't have a lot of ships.

DCL isn't unattainable by everyone, they may just have to save up to do it. We chose to move on because we couldn't do 2 Cruises a year or one and pay for college tuition. Realistically the fact that we are talking about cruising at all means we are all doing ok. We will likely sail the new DCL ships when they come out and anytime we find a competitive price. The Magic is still our favorite ship

I understand what you are saying and I did try to include the target market price adjustment in my note. It isn't the first thing that should be looked at, but it must be a consideration.

DCL has an interesting problem. First day demand is skewed by their fully refundable deposit and the perception that prices will only go up. People scramble to book, just trying to get in on "the deal" The feeding frenzy creates a false demand. Unlike many products though, nobody owns anything yet. It's basically a purchase intention rather than a purchase.

There are so many analytics tools these days, they are probably trying to set prices at a rate that will change this behavior. It's really a strange problem. I'd love to talk to their marketing department, but pricing strategies are some of the most confidential things a company has.