Just Back - ***TOUR GROUP RANT!!**

[NJ2Boardwalk]

I can't believe the Cast Members didn't do anything about them, despite all their warnings and these group leaders not listening to them.

I couldn't believe it either. I was walking directly behind the line of CM's leading the crowd to Soarin. The CM's (at least 3) in front of me shouted at the 3 group leaders to please stay behind the CM's, she used her hand gestures as if to say "back up and please wait". The tour group leaders flatly ignored them as if they didn't hear a thing. They barged right through in front of the CM's and walked directly the FP machines and took up 3 machines with 50+ tickets each. I don't know what the CM's can do differently??? Unless a CM physically stopped them, but I'm sure they are told not to lay a hand on guests. But beyond that...there was nothing they could do.

 

[Tiger926]

Disney did do something about this about 7 years ago when they closed their Brazillian tour offices. They knew about the complaints and the behavior and that was the solution. Unfortunately this is about money and they recently reopened the offices when it became obvious how much money they generate.

That is very interesting that you equate closing the office, to mean that there was a problem with the behaviour of the groups. There could have been other reasons too, don't you think? Frankly, none of the Disney parks are set up for large tour groups at all, IMHO. Whether that be a church group, Brazilian tour group or Grand Gathering. We saw one family of 32 (I counted) members from Alabama on a Family Reunion, who were absolutely causing problems, as they were disorganized, confused, kids with no supervision, 6 people in scooters, etc. They were holding up lines, and affecting traffic patterns in a big way. But, what else is Disney to do? Limit certain groups, not accept visitors from certain countries, cap Grand Gatherings? That could all be a disaster in the making for Disney on a PR level.

I couldn't believe it either. I was walking directly behind the line of CM's leading the crowd to Soarin. The CM's (at least 3) in front of me shouted at the 3 group leaders to please stay behind the CM's, she used her hand gestures as if to say "back up and please wait". The tour group leaders flatly ignored them as if they didn't hear a thing. They barged right through in front of the CM's and walked directly the FP machines and took up 3 machines with 50+ tickets each. I don't know what the CM's can do differently??? Unless a CM physically stopped them, but I'm sure they are told not to lay a hand on guests. But beyond that...there was nothing they could do.

But this is the same situation with smokers or kids who wear Heely's in the parks. I've spoken to many CMs about offending behaviours, whatever those may be - regular CMs are afraid that they will be accosted by guests (especially smokers and crazed parents), as it happens often. So, they don't get involved. It is for fear of their own safety, that they have to step away. What was needed at that Fast Pass area were 3-4 Disney Supervisors, and security. Everyone can recognize the supervisors as they wear their badges hanging from their necks, and they are dressed in nice clothes (no uniforms). We had an issue at the Toy Story Mania FP machine, as well as too many FP returnees - they converged on the area, and had it worked out in about 8 minutes flat, and there were way more people than the 50 you decribed in your example. It took the regular CMs to alert them to a problem, plus, some of them were called by other supervisors, or they happened upon the area. Either way, that is their job - to monitor park happenings and assist with issues at all times.

If there is such a concern, and I honestly haven't seen a major concern, or I would have spoken up, but it doesn't mean they don't sometimes happen this way, then Disney, as the host country, must fix the problem. So, again, I would highly advise you all contact them about it.

Tiger

 

[klj27]

That is very interesting that you equate closing the office, to mean that there was a problem with the behaviour of the groups. There could have been other reasons too, don't you think?

There definately could have been other reasons but that is what I read back when they closed the offices. I had forgotten about it until some castmember were discussing it when I was there this month.

I don't think closing the office means limiting people from coming it just means not actively recruiting their business.

 

[Tiger926]

We are also frequent July travellers. It is the only month my husband has off work so that is when we go or we don't get to go at all. We have always been able to make the best of the tour group situation and ignored the chanting, crowds, rudeness.

This July was unlike anything I have ever seen before. We spent three days with some castmember friends and they confirmed that the tour crowds were greater than any other year and that many complaints were being logged by castmembers themselves.

Some thoughts:

1) Why do they travel together? They are creating their own wait anywhere they go. My husband and kids got in line for star tours and the wait said 10 minutes. As soon as they entered the building part of the line they were told by a castmember that due to tour groups the actual wait would be 45 minutes. They left the line.

2) I got in the habit of counting tour groups throughout the day. Once I got to 17 in the MK one day I gave up. Some of these were very large groups were their shirts numbered up to 200.

3) There needs to be some sort of group dining option for these large goups. I don't know why Disney doesn't offer/provide this. Take out the Diamond Horseshoe makeshift counterservice (and the one near Aloha Isle) and turn them into a group counterservice. Make it a part of the package they are purchasing. This alleviates the dread on the cm's faces when a tour group is herding to Pizza Planet and tour groups taking up huge amounts of seating at one time while making the lines grow huge.

4) Shoplifting - this is a common complaint I heard among cm's. They said they were being wiped out when a tour group would come in. I had a hard time thinking that the rude groups would take part in theft until I witnessed them being watched like hawks in the store. The cm's would not take time to follow and watch these groups unless they know of a reason why they should. I witnessed this offsite also.

5) Hollywood Studios - This park can not handle tour groups. I was there with 11 groups (that I noticed) one day and it was insane!

6) I also agree with the stopping in the middle of anywhere, sitting on the ground and not letting others pass.

7) The video crews they bring with them. I have never noticed tour groups with their own video crews and photographers running around with press like badges trying to get footage of everything, like I did this July. I noticed at times they would meet just to get footage. There was a group of grey shirts that was subdivided by color sleeves. I noticed there were at least 6 color sleeves of the grey group and around thirty kids in each color that was doing this and creating large bottlenecks. I have a hard time believing if I brought my own video crew with large equipment to the park to film my family Disney would allow it.

8) Thank God for castmembers who would send empty vehicles (jungle cruise, great movie ride) through on attractions so the general public was separated from large tour groups when they were rowdy. How unfortunate that poor behavior creates even longer waits for others because of this though.

This is all interesting, as we were there from July 1 - 12, and the groups were very low. A few years ago, at this time, they were extremely high, so it seems more tour groups arrived the day after we left. We have noticed they are cycylical in nature though, as some weeks are higher. I think the 2nd - 3rd weeks are the highest. My hubby's birthday falls right in here, so we've been to WDW many times during these weeks. Crowds were very low, period, this trip for us though, even the 3rd and 4th were much lower than usual.

As I said, no Disney parks are set up to handle any tour groups, IMHO. Not sure what they can do though?

Shoplifting is a concern, no matter who does it. I would say that Disney should limit the amount of people who are in a store, but they don't do that.

Listen, this is all within Disney's power to do something about, if indeed it is that serious of a problem. They monitor traffic patterns and guests patterns every minute of the day. They know exactly when the Brazilan tour groups are arriving, where they are staying, and what parks they are visiting, so they can place more supervisors in the parks, or, make it mandatory that each Brazilan tour group, or any group, for that matter, over like 20 people, must have a Disney CM/s attached to them. Disney can charge a fee for this - if you don't want to pay it, then you don't come as a group. But, we all know that Disney loves to make money, so, I'm not sure if they would actually turn away business.

1 million Brazilan teens = a ton of profit for Disney! Tiger

 

[klj27]

I think we will have to agree to disagree about the amount of tour groups this summer. I was there from July 2-16, which was most of the same time as you. I was told by castmembers I knew, castmember I didn't know in guest services and many other posts on the boards that they were crazy high, along with my own experiences. I want to follow your touring plans next time if you were able to avoid the masses.

 

[WDWangela]

Just returned from WDW. As stated, there were a tremendous amount of tour groups. We have been in June before and have seen a few groups, but nothing like I witnessed this past week. We will never go back in July.

 

[DISNEY1975]

I think we will have to agree to disagree about the amount of tour groups this summer. I was there from July 2-16, which was most of the same time as you. I was told by castmembers I knew, castmember I didn't know in guest services and many other posts on the boards that they were crazy high, along with my own experiences. I want to follow your touring plans next time if you were able to avoid the masses.

I can believe the number was high this year. The dollar value has dropped in Brazil. $1 = R$1.70 ish. Just a few years ago it was $1 = R$2.50 and in the early 2000's $1 = R$4.25.

In addition, with the upcoming World Cup and Olympics being held in Rio, there are many more jobs and their economy is booming!

 

[Lou Holtz]

The only thing I don't understand is, if someone is pushing you or trampling you, why do you just tolerate it? If someone stepped on me, I would throw them off. If you just let people do things, they are going to keep doing it. If people start pushing back, they'll be more apprehensive. If they're standing hand in hand walking around World Showcase so that NOBODY can get through, don't move out of the way. Walk aggressively through them. You cannot let people walk over you. There are some things only you can take care of, not CMs.

 

[klj27]

The only thing I don't understand is, if someone is pushing you or trampling you, why do you just tolerate it? If someone stepped on me, I would throw them off. If you just let people do things, they are going to keep doing it. If people start pushing back, they'll be more apprehensive. If they're standing hand in hand walking around World Showcase so that NOBODY can get through, don't move out of the way. Walk aggressively through them. You cannot let people walk over you. There are some things only you can take care of, not CMs.

I think the litiguous society we live in has taught us not to "fight" back for fear of being sued. Not saying the linked in arms tour groups is going to stop and press charges, but that is why we have a lot of the reactions we do.

 

[Hollywoodhaha]

Can you imagine The Wizarding World of Harry Potter with the crowds and waits [8 hours!] with tour groups?!

 

[DISNEY1975]

The only thing I don't understand is, if someone is pushing you or trampling you, why do you just tolerate it? If someone stepped on me, I would throw them off. If you just let people do things, they are going to keep doing it. If people start pushing back, they'll be more apprehensive. If they're standing hand in hand walking around World Showcase so that NOBODY can get through, don't move out of the way. Walk aggressively through them. You cannot let people walk over you. There are some things only you can take care of, not CMs.

If you even look at them funny, you will be labeled a racist and they will cry "Discrimitation".

I just read an article about how a group went to Sea World and everyone was enjoying the chants/songs and video taping them. They loved the attention and were proud to be "an attraction" themselves. Maybe ignoring them would help a little?? No sense in putting on a show if there is no audience.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...an-restaurants-brazilian-tourists-theme-parks

 

[declansdad]

Lets throw all these threads into one big pile - tour groups, cheerleaders, Pop Warner, large grand gatherings. May as well discuss it all.

 

[2Tiggies]

As a CM, we basically are powerless to do anything. No matter how hard we try, they refuse to listen to us.

I was working on Commissary Lane in DHS, and was the only CM back there at that time, and twour o tour groups basically just plopped down in the middle of the road to take a break.

I can't believe the Cast Members didn't do anything about them, despite all their warnings and these group leaders not listening to them.

It's hardly reasonable to expect the CMs to do anything. If a tour group of 50 intimidates your party of 5, it is no less intimidating to a small number (or just one) CM.

 

[divawife]

This is insane. Disney tolerates it because of the money they bring in. However, how hard is it to prepare CM's for this? Have a manager stationed at FP areas. Teach them all a few key phrases in portuguese "You must wait your turn" "Please stay in line" "Please make room for other guests".

 

[sleeping beauty 1]

I was told a few years ago by CMs to report the color of the tour group flag to Guest Relations of the park (or to the person with the flag in the group - personally I don't think that will go anywhere). If they get too many complaints they will remove the group from the park at least for that day and maybe refuse them the next day entry depending on the offense.

I actually got a group to return to the end of the line a few years ago. A few members of the group went in the stand-by of ToT. Then a part of that group entered 10 minutes later in stand-by, jumped over to FP and ran up past those of us in Stand-By to join the original 2-3 that entered earlier and not wait in line. I told the group "No" and to go to the end of the line. The told me they wanted to be together -- I said - fine all of you go to the end of the line to be together, but cutting is not allowed. Everyone around me started complaining and telling them no and yelling at them. Most of those that ran up actually turned around and went back -- not all, but we made our point.

On a different note-- they also go into the single-rider lanes and try to sit together. I yelled at a tour group girl that tried to move my DS10 in RNR to a different row further back (I had to sit with DS7) and she said she had to sit by her friend. I told her NO - that she was in single rider to the seat assigned and should not expect to not sit with her friend and my daughter WOULD sit behind me and I would notify a CM and Guest Relations of the unacceptable behavior if she continued. She didn't argue and sat in the row she was originally assigned. So they must know something, but most people just don't complain enough.

I tell everyone going in July about the groups, but to turn in the group color to Guest Relations for any problem at all. I was also telling lots of people in the parks complaining about them to do the same thing. If they get enough complaints about a group (or maybe all combined) they are given some sort of reprimand.

 

[KellyNY]

I did not read all pages but I must say, I would blame team leaders/ tour guides. Couple of years ago, I decided to visit Niagara Falls. Since it is quiet a ride, we took a tour bus, our local American tour bus. Tour guide was running around like headless chicken with his colorful umbrella so everyone could see and keep up with him, why? It was completely pointless to make 60 people run around the park, just to tell them, here, those are the falls. I told him we going to tour park on our own and he replied, you will get lost. How? How could we possibly get lost there, our hotel was 2 blocks away anyway. So as he turned around, we did "get lost" and had a wonderful time instead of running around. My point is, I am pretty sure those guides rushing tour groups to keep them together and make them go with a program, why, to create the feel that those people would never do it on their own and to make more groups to book their vacation this way. Do not forget how scared we all were the first time we went to Disney, same with them. They are not given a chance to do it normal way and being from another country just makes their fears worse. I doubt any of them even saw park maps as they made to run and follow their only way to survive Disney, a Person with a Colorful Umbrella.

 

[Beauty & the Best]

Earlier on this thread someone had the idea of writing a letter to Disney complaining about the behavior of tour groups.

I think we should do this. Anyone want to volunteer to draft a letter?

 

[KellyNY]

Earlier on this thread someone had the idea of writing a letter to Disney complaining about the behavior of tour groups.

I think we should do this. Anyone want to volunteer to draft a letter?

There is a small group of us on this thread. I do not think letter may actually help.

 

[RickyMouseMom]

Here is my point of view. Please read. Sorry about the length...

We were at WDW 7/8 - 7/18 (knowing about tour groups. We have traveled alot in July). I came mentally armed, and decided to take a less judgemental view of the groups. At the beginning of the trip I found fewer tour groups than normal, but that RAPIDLY changed by 7/11+. I think there might have been more than I recall in past years. Anyway, I decided to really examine their behavior...

The kids are, I believe, 15 years old (trip for their quincinera - spelling wrong I know!). 15 year old girls are annoying, no matter what culture. Im sorry, but true . I was annoying at 15 years old. A group of 15 year old girls is unbearable to tolerate, through no fault of their own. Seperately, these kids are nice and polite (for the most part). As a group, the mob mentality sets in and that '15 year old' behavior is magnified...

I think alot of this inappropriate behavior is egged on by the tour guides (who SHOULD know what is appropriate behavior). So, when tour guides start chants, or generally encourages this behavior, the kids follow suit. In addition, I personally witnessed SEVERAL times this past trip of tour guides telling the kids to sit in the middle of the streets, just outside of an attraction exit, etc to give instructions and to do their head counts. This causes a HUGE disruption in crowd flow for the rest of us and I am IRRIATED by the tour guides and their policies (whom a majority of didnt seem much older than the kids).

I am also irritated by Disney. 18+ years ago I was part of a 250 group band that traveled to Disney for the 'Magic Music Days' program. I CLEARLY remember being grouped into groups of 5-7 with a student 'leader'. We were not allowed to be in larger groups touring the park (our school said it was as Disney rule. Don't know if it was true) and we had set times we had to meet with our tour guides. It seemed to work, and although we were annoying (we were, afterall, 15 years old) - it was not magnified by a group of 200 but just 5 of us.

I DO NOT agree with large groups traveling together at a theme park. It interferes with crowd flow imho, and is disruptive to other paying customers. I DO NOT agree with tour guides innundating the fast pass machines (I witnessed SEVERAL times 4 tour guides taking up 4 out of the 5 machines getting hundreds of fast passes). I understand everyone has a 'right' to the fastpass, but there has to be a better way than 200+ kids having to HAVE to get on a ride at the same time. I DO NOT agree with ENTIRE groups innundating a counterservice restaurant. This applies to ANY group from ANY culture and ANY nation.

What about the way we were required to be split up in smaller groups? How about a tour guide 'responsible' for the touring, eating, and fastpasses for about 15 kids at a time? The tour guides can communicate with each other through those fantastic walkie talkies they have if there is a problem. Only one flag needed at the end of the night to gather all of those mini-groups together. Why the 'need' to travel in huge groups? A HUGE unified group? I think this would appease both us non-tour group visitors, CM's, and general theme park crowd flow and control. The kids would still be supervised, probably better so, in smaller groups.

Just my opinion. I don't think we will be back in July next year though. Definitely August instead

 

[tony609]

In a nutshell...

Aviod WDW in July,January..for tour groups. Any other months to avoid?