Jon and Kate Plus 8, Official Thread--Part 7

[madge]

Madge..what is likely to come out about what TLC has done illegally? I know that a lot here are not pleased with TLC's filming tatics, but have they done anything illegal that we know about? This is going to be a very interesting case if it goes to court.

I never said that TLC did anything illegal ... I just said they weren't 100% innocent in this case... any maybe that's the wrong word, because I don't mean innocent in the legal sense. I just mean that TLC isn't completely without ____ (I can't come up with a word I want) in this.

When it's all said and done, I think that there is a very real possibility that TLC took advantage of Jon and Kate being young and naive. Look at how much TLC has made off them over the last 2 years and compare that to what they paid Jon and Kate.

I think Jon did wrong in not following the contract, but at the same time, I don't believe TLC is any better. My guess is that they'll cancel each other out.

Jon was smart to set up that JKIG corporation... he might be able to protect some of his personal assets that way. But I also wonder how much of this money would/should have been the children's and is being used for this lawsuit instead?

 

[walden]

I wonder what the possibility is that this will be settled and never actually see a courtroom. While TLC has Jon under the gun right now for the alleged breach of contract ... they're not 100% innocent in this case. And that will come out at some point.

I would seriously hope it will be settled out of court, the legal fees are probably already astronomical. I hope that part of the settlement is not Jon's agreement to continued filming of the kids. That is JMO.

TLC/Discovery is not only suing Jon but also JKIC. There are 2 defendants named, per the affidavit filed by Edward Sabin here: http://www.radaronline.com/sites/default/files/GosselinAffidavit.pdf

That JKIC is the second defendant is clearly stated if you scroll down to section 7. JKIC seems to be a corporation set up by both Jon and Kate, and there is some legal language in that paragraph about the specific type of corporation that I don't quite understand. Now, I don't know much about corporations, or corporate law, but even I know that it makes sense to set one up to get tax breaks in many situations. I don't know whether there are other benefits like limited liability for individuals.

I'd guess that Jon and JKIC will need to retain different attorneys if this case goes to court. So Kate is also being burned financially by TLC's pursuing this through her connection with JKIC.

Got to run.

 

[DMRick]

I thought someone posted today or yesterday that they had both their lawyer and manager at the contract signing. While I'm not defending what people think TLC did wrong, they are a business. I doubt they ever meant to be their friends. I think it was always a money making show. If it didn't make money, they would cancel it.

In the past, everyone kept saying how much free stuff, trips etc, Kate and Jon got. How good they made out. I don't think we can now say, TLC was bad, Jon and Kate were underpaid. At least I couldn't.

I don't think (we'll have to wait to see) a judge or jury will think they canceled each other out. Oh, they may (and I hope they do) settle, but this goes back to J & K signed a contract. One they were very happy for. TLC accepted it, and I'm sure J & K were happy for it when they signed. Both J & K and TLC got what they wanted out of it (TLC great advertising money, J & K plenty of money and trips etc, or at least that was what everyone here kept saying). Jon apparently wanted more (or something different) and didn't want to wait for a new contract.

They were adults..it was up to them to decide if this was enough payment (and I don't ever think the payment amount was in dispute for Jon, I think he wanted to move on to what he thought would be bigger and better for him. Thoughts of stardom, I guess). TLC took a chance on them, and just because it paid off, they (IMO) shouldn't be the bad guys. It wasn't just the TLC money they made. Without this show, the books would prob have been worthless, since no one would have known them, and they seemed to make a lot off the books. There would have been no money in speeches, cause again, not one would have known them. No free clothes, no spectacular house, etc. I just can't do a turn about here now and say, poor young kids, they were taken advantage of.

I just hope the other shows (Duggars, Roloffs, family of 12 or however many they have) are taking a good look at this, because I'm thinking they are the reason TLC is taking this so far.

I never said that TLC did anything illegal ... I just said they weren't 100% innocent in this case... any maybe that's the wrong word, because I don't mean innocent in the legal sense. I just mean that TLC isn't completely without ____ (I can't come up with a word I want) in this.

When it's all said and done, I think that there is a very real possibility that TLC took advantage of Jon and Kate being young and naive. Look at how much TLC has made off them over the last 2 years and compare that to what they paid Jon and Kate.

I think Jon did wrong in not following the contract, but at the same time, I don't believe TLC is any better. My guess is that they'll cancel each other out.

Jon was smart to set up that JKIG corporation... he might be able to protect some of his personal assets that way. But I also wonder how much of this money would/should have been the children's and is being used for this lawsuit instead?

 

[madge]

In the past, everyone kept saying how much free stuff, trips etc, Kate and Jon got. How good they made out. I don't think we can now say, TLC was bad, Jon and Kate were underpaid. At least I couldn't.

I've been saying for months that TLC is as much of a player in this as Jon and Kate, and I still believe that to be true. There are way too many questions and not enough answers for now... we'll have to wait and see how this all plays out.

 

[DMRick]

I've been saying for months that TLC is as much of a player in this as Jon and Kate, and I still believe that to be true. There are way too many questions and not enough answers for now... we'll have to wait and see how this all plays out.

I'm not really sure what that means, but yes, that we will.

 

[madge]

I'm not really sure what that means, but yes, that we will.

there's been Jon's side, Kate's side, and TLC. It's been that way since the beginning. I've said that all along. And in this most recent mess, something (more than one something) doesn't sit right with me where TLC is concerned. I think there are things that they, and possibly Jon & Kate, don't want to come out. Like how much they paid J & K in the beginning, were the children included in the contracts, were the children paid, why is TLC so commited to Kate Gosselin, how many hours were the Gosselins really filming, why such an airtight gag order on what Kate or Jon could say or participate in outside of TLC?

Maybe all of these things are normal when working on this kind of show. I have NO idea.

 

[WaltD4Me]

I don't think Jon would be in this lawsuit mess if it weren't for Creepy lawyer. Jon is an adult who has to take responsibility for his own actions, but I think Creepy Lawyer talked him into most of things that got him in trouble recently. Jon said he met Creepy Lawyer through Michael Lohan. At that time the Divorced Dads Club was being discussed and ML needed to get Jon out of his TLC contract to do that. He hooks him up with Creepy Lawyer who told Jon he would take care of everything and not to worry about it. Jon started do the non-stop interviews after hooking up with the lawyer and his brother the agent. They are getting a cut of whatever Jon is making on the interviews, but now there is the lawsuit and Creepy Lawyer is in over his head. Jon needs to get a real attorney.

 

[C.Ann]

Yes, that surprised me too. He can choose to not answer certain questions based on attorney-client privilege. He must not be representing Jon in Maryland, although we haven't heard who will be.

As for the money issue, I can't help but believe that all of this isn't somehow orchestrated to work together eg. Jon being sued by TLC while the divorce proceedings are delayed as the arbitrator deals with Kate's accounting of all of the bank accounts. We know that Kate wants to do the show, and I think TLC is trying to rake Jon over the coals in order to make a deal with him to allow the kids to film -- much of their claim is disputable ie. not an open/shut case, but it will be expensive and time consuming.

Yes, TLC is suing JKIG too -- that's actually the bank account where they had all of the trouble last month.



Funny how people love to make excuses for Kate The "Kate must have had a reason to do what she did" thing is getting old real fast, considering none of us know her (or Jon) or what was really going on at their home.

Are you saying that money is being drained for this lawsuit from the account that Kate stated wasn't available to her to pay the bills with that she was carrying around in her purse?

In Kate's own words, the decision to separate was actually made some time last year -- Jon confirmed this, but also said they kept it secret because of the show. We don't know why, or what was happening at home at that time, even less than we know what has gone on since then. Which is why I have a problem with people making excuses for everything Kate does. I'd rather just stick to the facts. For example, we know for a fact that Jon stopped the filming but none of us really knows why -- then again, some of us don't care.

IMO, Kate and Jon taking money from the bank account is all part of the chaos that happens as the divorce proceedings approach. Both of them removed money from the account thinking the other was removing money from the account. They should have had a provisional division of assets as soon as the arbitrator was assigned ie. $100,000 or so given to each spouse, or arrangements made for pay from TLC to be given directly to each spouse rather than deposited to the JKIG account.

As for Kate's accounting info, it was submitted but never reviewed -- she doesn't have carte blanche to spend as she pleases since half of every dollar in that bank account is Jon's. The accounting info for all of the other accounts has never been reviewed by either Jon's team or the arbitrator.

I really would have liked to see that accounting.. It's difficult for me to wrap my head around $55,000 (was that the amount?) being needed for a months worth of bills..

I wonder what the possibility is that this will be settled and never actually see a courtroom. While TLC has Jon under the gun right now for the alleged breach of contract ... they're not 100% innocent in this case. And that will come out at some point.

I think it's an attempt to twist Jon's arm and get him to allow the children to be filmed again.. They are slowly leaking out info on what will be presented in court in the same manner that someone would who is trying to use "scare tactics"..

there's been Jon's side, Kate's side, and TLC. It's been that way since the beginning. I've said that all along. And in this most recent mess, something (more than one something) doesn't sit right with me where TLC is concerned. I think there are things that they, and possibly Jon & Kate, don't want to come out. Like how much they paid J & K in the beginning, were the children included in the contracts, were the children paid, why is TLC so commited to Kate Gosselin, how many hours were the Gosselins really filming, why such an airtight gag order on what Kate or Jon could say or participate in outside of TLC?
.

I'm sure there is much that ALL of them would prefer "never see the light of day".. We'll just have to sit back and see if there is an out of court settlement prior to Dec. 14th - if the court date is postponed - or if they (TLC) actually go ahead with the lawsuit..

The only thing I'm sure of is that I am going to be very, very upset if Jon "caves" out of court and agrees to let the filming of his children resume..

 

[TanyaLovesPooh]

I don't think Jon would be in this lawsuit mess if it weren't for Creepy lawyer. Jon is an adult who has to take responsibility for his own actions, but I think Creepy Lawyer talked him into most of things that got him in trouble recently. Jon said he met Creepy Lawyer through Michael Lohan. At that time the Divorced Dads Club was being discussed and ML needed to get Jon out of his TLC contract to do that. He hooks him up with Creepy Lawyer who told Jon he would take care of everything and not to worry about it. Jon started do the non-stop interviews after hooking up with the lawyer and his brother the agent. They are getting a cut of whatever Jon is making on the interviews, but now there is the lawsuit and Creepy Lawyer is in over his head. Jon needs to get a real attorney.

Totally agree with this. I think Hailey had her part in that decision as well.

 

[daughtersrus]

100%



That is exactly what Jon said. On The Insider, the woman asked Jon if they have any money put aside for the kids. Jon's reply was they had a revocable trust and that 80% of the earnings went to the kids. She went on to ask if they (Jon/Kate) could use that money if need be and his exact answer was "Absolutely!".

My knowledge of trusts is very limited. My only experience is with one that we have set up for our disabled DD and is a special needs trust, not a revocable trust. From what our lawyer told us, only one of us could be the grantor while the other could be the trustee.

Maybe in the case of J&K, they may have each set up separate trusts. This way, Kate would be in control of her money that she contributes to the trusts and Jon would be in control of his money that he contributes. Control would not only include money being taken out but how the money is invested.

I believe that Kate said that the accounts were set up fairly recently so I wouldn't imagine that Jon would give his money over to her control and visa-versa.

I don't ever remember seeing the trust documents posted so we really only have what they've said to go on.

 

[DMRick]

You may very well be right. I just don't know how much he is being talked into and how much is what he has wanted for awhile, and he just thought he found someone who could help him get it. My mom always used to say, if you lie down with dogs, you are going to get fleas..and right now, I'm thinking Jon has fleas.

I don't think Jon would be in this lawsuit mess if it weren't for Creepy lawyer. Jon is an adult who has to take responsibility for his own actions, but I think Creepy Lawyer talked him into most of things that got him in trouble recently. Jon said he met Creepy Lawyer through Michael Lohan. At that time the Divorced Dads Club was being discussed and ML needed to get Jon out of his TLC contract to do that. He hooks him up with Creepy Lawyer who told Jon he would take care of everything and not to worry about it. Jon started do the non-stop interviews after hooking up with the lawyer and his brother the agent. They are getting a cut of whatever Jon is making on the interviews, but now there is the lawsuit and Creepy Lawyer is in over his head. Jon needs to get a real attorney.

 

[madge]

Michael Lohan helps contribute to the madness, and he's the first to start blabbing.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ohan-testify-against-jon-gosselin-tlc-lawsuit

 

[3prettyprincesses]

Michael Lohan helps contribute to the madness, and he's the first to start blabbing.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ohan-testify-against-jon-gosselin-tlc-lawsuit

Oh wonderful. Geez, it's like Jon has a manual of 'who not to trust'! Let's see...

Trashy babysitter Stephanie who sells her story to tabloids, check!
Crazy tabloid reporter Kate2 who sells her story on tv, check!
Trashy young Gf Hailey who berates you on tv, check!
Slimy lawyer Mark Heller who's been previously suspended from practicing law, check!
Deadbeat dad Lohan, check!
Paparazzi turned bodyguard, check!

Jon, Jon, Jon, where is your discernment? I can't believe Lohan is talking like this about his supposed friend Jon. Boy, I have a feeling he's going to sing like a canary when he's deposed.

 

[redrosesix]

I thought someone posted today or yesterday that they had both their lawyer and manager at the contract signing. While I'm not defending what people think TLC did wrong, they are a business. I doubt they ever meant to be their friends. I think it was always a money making show. If it didn't make money, they would cancel it.

In the past, everyone kept saying how much free stuff, trips etc, Kate and Jon got. How good they made out. I don't think we can now say, TLC was bad, Jon and Kate were underpaid. At least I couldn't.

I don't think (we'll have to wait to see) a judge or jury will think they canceled each other out. Oh, they may (and I hope they do) settle, but this goes back to J & K signed a contract. One they were very happy for. TLC accepted it, and I'm sure J & K were happy for it when they signed. Both J & K and TLC got what they wanted out of it (TLC great advertising money, J & K plenty of money and trips etc, or at least that was what everyone here kept saying). Jon apparently wanted more (or something different) and didn't want to wait for a new contract.

They were adults..it was up to them to decide if this was enough payment (and I don't ever think the payment amount was in dispute for Jon, I think he wanted to move on to what he thought would be bigger and better for him. Thoughts of stardom, I guess). TLC took a chance on them, and just because it paid off, they (IMO) shouldn't be the bad guys. It wasn't just the TLC money they made. Without this show, the books would prob have been worthless, since no one would have known them, and they seemed to make a lot off the books. There would have been no money in speeches, cause again, not one would have known them. No free clothes, no spectacular house, etc. I just can't do a turn about here now and say, poor young kids, they were taken advantage of.

I just hope the other shows (Duggars, Roloffs, family of 12 or however many they have) are taking a good look at this, because I'm thinking they are the reason TLC is taking this so far.

In TLC's petition, it states that J & K had a lawyer and their manager present when they signed the contract for season 4 -- same with the most recent releases. Even if this lawyer was not impartial, I agree that is no excuse -- they were signing on behalf of their children in a multi-year deal. There was no excuse for doing so without adequate representation.

The only way I think lack of representation might be relevant is that J&K might have agreed to certain clauses in the contract which wouldn't be considered valid under Maryland law ie. a good lawyer might have said "you know, they can't actually make you do that" Not having seen the contract, I don't know if this was the case. However, there are some statements in TLC's petition which would contradict basic rules of common law (but again, that is not necessarily the wording in the actual contract)

I've been saying for months that TLC is as much of a player in this as Jon and Kate, and I still believe that to be true. There are way too many questions and not enough answers for now... we'll have to wait and see how this all plays out.

ITA with this

there's been Jon's side, Kate's side, and TLC. It's been that way since the beginning. I've said that all along. And in this most recent mess, something (more than one something) doesn't sit right with me where TLC is concerned. I think there are things that they, and possibly Jon & Kate, don't want to come out. Like how much they paid J & K in the beginning, were the children included in the contracts, were the children paid, why is TLC so commited to Kate Gosselin, how many hours were the Gosselins really filming, why such an airtight gag order on what Kate or Jon could say or participate in outside of TLC?

Maybe all of these things are normal when working on this kind of show. I have NO idea.

There really aren't many shows like this.

Are you saying that money is being drained for this lawsuit from the account that Kate stated wasn't available to her to pay the bills with that she was carrying around in her purse?

I really would have liked to see that accounting.. It's difficult for me to wrap my head around $55,000 (was that the amount?) being needed for a months worth of bills..

I think it's an attempt to twist Jon's arm and get him to allow the children to be filmed again.. They are slowly leaking out info on what will be presented in court in the same manner that someone would who is trying to use "scare tactics"..

I'm sure there is much that ALL of them would prefer "never see the light of day".. We'll just have to sit back and see if there is an out of court settlement prior to Dec. 14th - if the court date is postponed - or if they (TLC) actually go ahead with the lawsuit..

The only thing I'm sure of is that I am going to be very, very upset if Jon "caves" out of court and agrees to let the filming of his children resume..

I'm saying the joint bank account which both J&K have access to and the one that was at the centre of all of the troubles is a bank account owned by the corporation -- the one where TLC deposits their pay, the one that Kate says is used for household bills (although I can't imagine why this one and not a personal account) And yes, $55,000 is a lot of money to spend in 1 month.

You may very well be right. I just don't know how much he is being talked into and how much is what he has wanted for awhile, and he just thought he found someone who could help him get it.

ITA with this part of your post. Apparently the lawyer that Jon had previously to Mark Heller was also working on stopping the filming, but got nowhere with it.

 

[redrosesix]

Michael Lohan helps contribute to the madness, and he's the first to start blabbing.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ohan-testify-against-jon-gosselin-tlc-lawsuit

Can somebody remind me why Michael Lohan is famous, aside from his daughter?

 

[DMRick]

Apparently the lawyer that Jon had previously to Mark Heller was also working on stopping the filming, but got nowhere with it.

I don't understand the above. Didn't the stopping of the filming of the kids come about because Jon said, release me to let me do other things, or I'll not let you film the kids (or somethign like that)? Did the earlier lawyer try to get TLC to stop filming the kids (without Jon wanting something out of it, if he did) or do you mean the earlier lawyer tried to get Jon out of filming? Did Jon want to get out of filming (and out of being paid), or did Jon want to be free to also persue other things, if that was the case?

I think a soap opera is easier to follow, even not having watched one in years LOL!

 

[JennaTX]

Oh wonderful. Geez, it's like Jon has a manual of 'who not to trust'! Let's see...

Trashy babysitter Stephanie who sells her story to tabloids, check!
Crazy tabloid reporter Kate2 who sells her story on tv, check!
Trashy young Gf Hailey who berates you on tv, check!
Slimy lawyer Mark Heller who's been previously suspended from practicing law, check!
Deadbeat dad Lohan, check!
Paparazzi turned bodyguard, check!

Jon, Jon, Jon, where is your discernment? I can't believe Lohan is talking like this about his supposed friend Jon. Boy, I have a feeling he's going to sing like a canary when he's deposed.

I love your check list. It is like Jon does not have a clue.

I think if I was Kate and watching all of this I would take my children and run until Jon gets his head on straight. He isn't even middle-aged and yet is having the male meltdown.

 

[MAKmom]

Michael Lohan helps contribute to the madness, and he's the first to start blabbing.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ohan-testify-against-jon-gosselin-tlc-lawsuit

OMG...If Jon accepted cash or chips he is going to have an IRS problem. Does anyone know if Kate is responsible for this debt after she filed?

 

[madge]

OMG...If Jon accepted cash or chips he is going to have an IRS problem. Does anyone know if Kate is responsible for this debt after she filed?

what is the (or is there a?) difference between accepting cash/chips in Vegas or cash only for pictures at a speaking engagement like Jon and Kate did in the past? It should all be reported, right?

PS. I'm not trying to cast Kate in a bad light with this question, because it's a good question about what happens after she files -- I am just curious if there's a tax difference. Especially, if there is no difference, then Jon may (for as stupid as this seems/is) not have realized the implications OR he figures he got away with accepting cash for something once, it would be ok to do it again.

 

[daughtersrus]

OMG...If Jon accepted cash or chips he is going to have an IRS problem.

Why? Just because you accept cash doesn't mean that you're not claiming the money as income. Waitresses do it all of the time.