Jon and Kate Plus 8, Official Thread--Part 7

[kidshop]

See that's the funny thing.

You'll excuse Jodi to go on "vacation" and "help" with the kids--

But Kate gets raked over the coals for what relates to her "job" when she travels for abandoning her kids.

Must be nice that Jodi's DH's job facilitates her travel to exotic locales, b/c it would be hypocritical to bless her having a "nanny" to care for her kids while she's off nannying for free for Kate's crew.

Anyway--I don't think it is all that big of a deal that Jodi went.

The irony that was pointed out though is priceless.

Jodi was gone for 1 day. She flew in b/c Beth left unexpectedly (and was never heard from again LOL).

Not the same as traveling weeks at a time, while spouting how great and selfless of a mother you are, home cooking dinner while others ones are talking to the press...while across the country talking to the press of course!

 

[kidshop]

i don't think jodi or kevin (or jon for that matter) have ever said the children's safety has been threatened, or have they alleged abuse. they've said that the filming is'nt in the best interest of the kids and is having a negative impact.

Yeah, do you call CPS and report that they don't have jobs and are living off money earned from filming the kids?!

I think the reality genre is much different than a child actor filming either a tv show or movie. First, they are playing a character not themselves edited for entertainment; and second, other shows don't film year round non-stop with no end in sight. There are regular periods of off time.

I feel the most damaging aspect is that everything about them is privy to the world without their consent. Kids do not belong on reality show especially where the focus is them and the show becomes their life.

 

[daughtersrus]

I haven't been able to keep up with this board so please forgive me if this has already been brought up.

Was anyone else really sad when Kate talked about Mady's response to the news that they were splitting? I feel so horrible for that little girl and no matter how much Kate says that she's doing everything for her children, I can't help but think how bad all of this is effecting Mady. Clearly, she has not been happy for a very long time. How many times did we see her put her hand in front of the camera and storm away. If Kate wants to do what's best for her children, she needs to step back and realize how everything is impacting them.

Sure, they will miss the trips, the freebies, playing with the camera crew, the fancy clothes...but they'll get over it. Getting over having their parents rip each other apart so publicly and have their lives available for all to see forever will be much more difficult for them.


If they really want to do what's best for their children, they need to get out of the spotlight, off of TV and work on the relationships within their family.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I feel the most damaging aspect is that everything about them is privy to the world without their consent. Kids do not belong on reality show especially where the focus is them and the show becomes their life.

Legally, noone under the age of 18 can provide consent for anything. That's where the parent comes in.

As much as you don't like that they provided consent, the "without consent" argument doesn't fly.

Some of the children did enjoy being on camera, but that is neither here nor there.

 

[kidshop]

Legally, noone under the age of 18 can provide consent for anything. That's where the parent comes in.

As much as you don't like that they provided consent, the "without consent" argument doesn't fly.

Some of the children did enjoy being on camera, but that is neither here nor there.

The filming was in their home, their bedrooms. I imagine if a child actor didn't want to work they would have to be dragged kicking and screaming to the set, and then refuse to learn the lines or participate. How do you do this when the set is your home and they just film your meltdown for entertainment? It is wrong on so many levels. Defend it all you want, I think there will be laws on filming children in their real life, in their own home for the profit of their parents. Personal privacy is not violated in a child actor playing a part.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

The filming was in their home, their bedrooms. I imagine if a child actor didn't want to work they would have to be dragged kicking and screaming to the set, and then refuse to learn the lines or participate. How do you do this when the set is your home and they just film your meltdown for entertainment? It is wrong on so many levels. Defend it all you want, I think there will be laws on filming children in their real life, in their own home for the profit of their parents. Personal privacy is not violated in a child actor playing a part.

That's where that little 1st amendment comes into play....

Unless they want to extend it to home video--it just won't fly. Sorry.

It's not a defense. It's the truth.


Sometimes the children appear on camera willingly---sometimes babies are filmed in movies for profit losing their diaper and showing their bum all without permission....

So it doesn't fly--sorry!

Again, not a defense--it's the truth.

ETA: Where did you read or see or witness that any of these children were "dragged kicking and screaming" to the set?

 

[daughtersrus]

The filming was in their home, their bedrooms. I imagine if a child actor didn't want to work they would have to be dragged kicking and screaming to the set, and then refuse to learn the lines or participate. How do you do this when the set is your home and they just film your meltdown for entertainment? It is wrong on so many levels. Defend it all you want, I think there will be laws on filming children in their real life, in their own home for the profit of their parents. Personal privacy is not violated in a child actor playing a part.

I believe that Kate herself has admitted that the children are working. In the interview, I believe that she said something along the lines of it's their money when asked about accounts for the children.

 

[kidshop]

That's where that little 1st amendment comes into play....

Unless they want to extend it to home video--it just won't fly. Sorry.

It's not a defense. It's the truth.


Sometimes the children appear on camera willingly---sometimes babies are filmed in movies for profit losing their diaper and showing their bum all without permission....

So it doesn't fly--sorry!

Again, not a defense--it's the truth.

ETA: Where did you read or see or witness that any of these children were "dragged kicking and screaming" to the set?

I meant a real child actor could not be forced to work...they would just refuse to do it or refuse to go to the set, but the Gosselin children didn't have that option. The cameras were in their home and any reaction made the show.

Do adults profit off of home videos? Other venues using children for profit are regulated and are not using the child's home and real life as the show and as the basis of income for the parents.

 

[Family Fun Mom]

That's where that little 1st amendment comes into play....

Unless they want to extend it to home video--it just won't fly. Sorry.

It's not a defense. It's the truth.


Sometimes the children appear on camera willingly---sometimes babies are filmed in movies for profit losing their diaper and showing their bum all without permission....

So it doesn't fly--sorry!

Again, not a defense--it's the truth.

ETA: Where did you read or see or witness that any of these children were "dragged kicking and screaming" to the set?

You absolutely cannot compare a child being video taped by their mom for home movies and a child being filmed for a television show by a crew. The difference is so vast including who doing the taping all the way to who is viewing it. Home videos are mostly harmless while reality TV shows starring kids seem to be mostly harmFUL. What Jon, Kate and TLC have subjected these children to is deplorable. And honestly, we're all part of it because we tuned in. Lesson learned. J&K+8 has completely turned me off to reality shows involving families. I won't watch them anymore. I'm not contributing to that.

I've seen most of the the Gosselin kids kicking and screaming, holding their hands up to shield their faces from the cameras, storming away, ect at one point or another. Maddy most of all. They can't be "dragged" to the set because they live on their set. There's no escape. These kids have no privacy and no peace.

Well, they do now. Thank goodness the taping has stopped.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I meant a real child actor could not be forced to work...they would just refuse to do it or refuse to go to the set, but the Gosselin children didn't have that option. The cameras were in their home and any reaction made the show.

Do adults profit off of home videos? Other venues using children for profit are regulated and are not using the child's home and real life as the show and as the basis of income for the parents.

America's Funniest Videos profits and those who win money profit.

But in your theory, the child cannot give consent, so it wouldn't really matter if profit is involved or not.

As it stands--with regulation, this program format won't end.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I've seen most of the the Gosselin kids kicking and screaming, holding their hands up to shield their faces from the cameras, storming away, ect at one point or another. Maddy most of all. They can't be "dragged" to the set because they live on their set. There's no escape. These kids have no privacy and no peace.

And there are countless times where the children have WELCOMED the cameras. Including Mady and Cara.

 

[3prettyprincesses]

And there are countless times where the children have WELCOMED the cameras. Including Mady and Cara.

Yes, but the point is that they have no choice. Their home is the set for the show, the cameras are there whether they like it or not. Good grief, this season alone was supposed to have over 40 episodes. That's a lot of camera time.

And if they throw a tantrum, it's filmed. I'll never forget Mady coming home from school on her b-day and kicking the balloons while storming out of the room. Nice. I'm sure she'll be thrilled to see that when she's older and know that her parents allowed it.

 

[3prettyprincesses]

You absolutely cannot compare a child being video taped by their mom for home movies and a child being filmed for a television show by a crew. The difference is so vast including who doing the taping all the way to who is viewing it. Home videos are mostly harmless while reality TV shows starring kids seem to be mostly harmFUL. What Jon, Kate and TLC have subjected these children to is deplorable. And honestly, we're all part of it because we tuned in. Lesson learned. J&K+8 has completely turned me off to reality shows involving families. I won't watch them anymore. I'm not contributing to that.

I've seen most of the the Gosselin kids kicking and screaming, holding their hands up to shield their faces from the cameras, storming away, ect at one point or another. Maddy most of all. They can't be "dragged" to the set because they live on their set. There's no escape. These kids have no privacy and no peace.

Well, they do now. Thank goodness the taping has stopped.

Fabulous post!

 

[C.Ann]

Oh baloney. It's a board for crying outloud..

Then why the agitation when others have different opinions and state them?

Jon must have PR people posting on here as well then. The truly harsh or hateful posts are mostly thrown in Kate's direction, IMO.

Could you point them out for the rest of us? Most everyone agrees the both of the Gosselin parents are acting inappropriately - in one manner or the other.. People have posted various thoughts on "why" Jon may be acting like he currently is, but no one (that I can remember) has said he was "right" or should cut him any slack for it..

You absolutely cannot compare a child being video taped by their mom for home movies and a child being filmed for a television show by a crew. The difference is so vast including who doing the taping all the way to who is viewing it. Home videos are mostly harmless while reality TV shows starring kids seem to be mostly harmFUL. What Jon, Kate and TLC have subjected these children to is deplorable. And honestly, we're all part of it because we tuned in. Lesson learned. J&K+8 has completely turned me off to reality shows involving families. I won't watch them anymore. I'm not contributing to that.

I've seen most of the the Gosselin kids kicking and screaming, holding their hands up to shield their faces from the cameras, storming away, ect at one point or another. Maddy most of all. They can't be "dragged" to the set because they live on their set. There's no escape. These kids have no privacy and no peace.

Well, they do now. Thank goodness the taping has stopped.

While none of us are perfect parents - and I'm sure we've "lost it" a time or two - the difference is exactly what you stated above.. We didn't choose to film every embarrassing moment - put it out there for millions of viewers to see - humilate our children by filming their private moments for a television show - or put those moments up for sale on DVD's.. That's a pretty significant difference in my book..

I too am glas that the filming has stopped and I'm curious as to why TLC hasn't been able to push through their lawsuit against Jon so they can start filming the kids again.. Could it be that TLC can't win that suit because one of the two parents is refusing to allow the children to be filmed?

I guess only time will tell..

 

[monkeybug]

I feel bad for this poor family. I can't think of one person I know who doesn't have some "issues" from childhood. Most of our parents messed up somewhere, some worse than others but still. I look at the fact that these kids have a beautiful home, nice clothes, healthy food, private schooling, and a million experiences I'd love for my kids to have. Is it really that awful for them to have cameras in their homes for a few hours a few days a week? Do young kids really care about privacy? (I mean my three year old tried to pee on a tree in the middle of a very busy park yesterday!)
I don't know. I cringe at the things people would say if they put my family under a microscope! They would say things like "she gave them dorito's for breakfast?, pulled them out of school to decorate a Christmas tree?, Ignored them and let them watch TV all day just so she could read Harry Potter. How selfish!!!" I mean Yikes! We may not know all the ways in which we are screwing up our kids each day, but rest assured we are!!!

 

[DMRick]

Then why the agitation when others have different opinions and state them?

I don't have a problem with opinions. No agitation here. We banter back and forth. But to say that Kate has PR people or wannabe's. Just not a nice comment and it's silly..it's a back handed way of getting personal, once again. I always think when people throw something like that out, (liken it to 'are you Kate'?) they are trying to get someone they don't agree with to not want to post.

 

[madge]

changing the conversation to something else ....

apparently today was a court day in the TLC case
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ell-witnesses-against-jon-gosselin-court-case

 

[3prettyprincesses]

changing the conversation to something else ....

apparently today was a court day in the TLC case
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ell-witnesses-against-jon-gosselin-court-case

Yikes. Wow, that law firm certainly isn't wasting any time. Is it true though, that if they depose Mark Heller he can't represent Jon in the case? I thought he couldn't anyway since the PA attorney withdrew his support? I'm actually a bit frightened for Jon, I think this law firm is going to chew him up and spit him out. I wonder how Kate feels about that.

 

[monkeybug]

Then why the agitation when others have different opinions and state them?



Could you point them out for the rest of us? Most everyone agrees the both of the Gosselin parents are acting inappropriately - in one manner or the other.. People have posted various thoughts on "why" Jon may be acting like he currently is, but no one (that I can remember) has said he was "right" or should cut him any slack for it..



While none of us are perfect parents - and I'm sure we've "lost it" a time or two - the difference is exactly what you stated above.. We didn't choose to film every embarrassing moment - put it out there for millions of viewers to see - humilate our children by filming their private moments for a television show - or put those moments up for sale on DVD's.. That's a pretty significant difference in my book..

I too am glas that the filming has stopped and I'm curious as to why TLC hasn't been able to push through their lawsuit against Jon so they can start filming the kids again.. Could it be that TLC can't win that suit because one of the two parents is refusing to allow the children to be filmed?

I guess only time will tell..

Well I was certainly humiliated by my parents plenty! And I don't know many teens who don't roll their eyes at how embarrassing and dorky mom and dad are. True for most of us the embarrassment might be more localized, but even in a bigger arena I would guess these kids will grow up and laugh about their antics just like the majority of us do. My mom has shown the video of me doing ballet on the soccer field to every one! I used to cringe, now I beg to see it again.
Last night my husband and I went to a dinner for newly initiated chiefs. They go through a humiliating initiation for weeks and weeks before they get to pin their anchors on. During the pinning a master chief told them "we do not put you through this humiliation to embarrass you, but to humble you, to show you that humiliation can not harm you and in fact will strengthen and make a better leader out of you. There will be a time when your best will not be enough and it will be humiliating. I only hope that you will look back at this time and remember that you had the strength of character to get through it today and you can do it again."
It was an interesting way to look at humiliation, and I think he's right! I think if you have loving supporting parents and mentors a little humiliation is probably a good thing!

 

[TanyaLovesPooh]

Could you point them out for the rest of us? Most everyone agrees the both of the Gosselin parents are acting inappropriately - in one manner or the other.. People have posted various thoughts on "why" Jon may be acting like he currently is, but no one (that I can remember) has said he was "right" or should cut him any slack for it..

I am not going to call out any particular poster, that would serve no purpose but to create problems. Point is, some folks side with Kate, some with Jon. Many think they are both lost and need to find their way. Again, in my opinion the truly harsh posts are usually at Kate.

I feel bad for this poor family. I can't think of one person I know who doesn't have some "issues" from childhood. Most of our parents messed up somewhere, some worse than others but still. I look at the fact that these kids have a beautiful home, nice clothes, healthy food, private schooling, and a million experiences I'd love for my kids to have. Is it really that awful for them to have cameras in their homes for a few hours a few days a week? Do young kids really care about privacy? (I mean my three year old tried to pee on a tree in the middle of a very busy park yesterday!)
I don't know. I cringe at the things people would say if they put my family under a microscope! They would say things like "she gave them dorito's for breakfast?, pulled them out of school to decorate a Christmas tree?, Ignored them and let them watch TV all day just so she could read Harry Potter. How selfish!!!" I mean Yikes! We may not know all the ways in which we are screwing up our kids each day, but rest assured we are!!!

Very good points