Is Your City One of The Meanest?

Tigger_Magic

I am opinionated, independent-minded, self-righteo
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Mar 18, 2005
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According to the National Coalition for the Homeless (http://www.nationalhomeless.org/publications/crimreport/index.html) these are the top 20 meanest cities. Do you live in a "mean" city?
While most cities throughout the country have either laws or practices that criminalize homeless persons, some city practices or laws have stood out as more egregious than others in their attempt to criminalize homelessness. The National Coalition for the Homeless and the National Law Center on Homelessness & Poverty have chosen the following top 20 meanest cities in 2005 based on one or more of the following criteria: the number of anti-homeless laws in the city, the enforcement of those laws and severities of penalties, the general political climate toward homeless people in the city, local advocate support for the meanest designation, the city’s history of criminalization measures, and the existence of pending or recently enacted criminalization legislation in the city. Although some of the report’s top 20 meanest cities have made some efforts to address homelessness in their communities, the punitive practices highlighted in the report impede true progress in solving the problem.

1. Sarasota, FL
2. Lawrence, KS
3. Little Rock, AR
4. Atlanta, GA
5. Las Vegas, NV
6. Dallas, TX
7. Houston, TX
8. San Juan, PR
9. Santa Monica, CA
10. Flagstaff, AZ
11. San Francisco, CA
12. Chicago, IL
13. San Antonio, TX
14. New York City, NY
15. Austin, TX
16. Anchorage, AK
17. Phoenix, AZ
18. Los Angeles, CA
19. St. Louis, MO
20. Pittsburgh, PA
 
It'd be a miracle if ANY city in my entire state made ANY of these city lists! :rotfl2:
 
RATS. Detroit didn't make the list! :mad:
 

Woo hoo for Pittsburgh being #20. :rolleyes: I wonder if it's because of the recently passed legislation restricting panhandling to certain areas and times?
 
lol....Atlanta is #4 and I can look out of my office right now and locate a half dozen homeless people. Sure they can't beg for money, but that doesn't stop them from taking up every park bench and living under every underpass.
 
I don't get the point. Should cities be allowing folks to sleep on the streets, use the sidewalks as toilets, beg folks for money, etc? I don't understand how it is mean to make laws banning this type of behavior and then actually enforcing those laws. :confused3
 
The #1 city, Sarasota, is within the listener area of the radio station I listen to, and they were talking about it this morning. Sarasota is the meanest city because they passed a law that said you can't sleep outdoors on public or private property without the owners permission. :confused3 That just seems like common sense to me. I would have assumed lots of places had that law.
 
I live in the #1 city!! Whoo hoooo....love the quote about "they continue to push homeless people out of the city".....



this was in our local paper...

Sarasota collects 'meanest city' title

Officials reject coalition's criticism of the way homeless people are treated

By MIKE SAEWITZ



mike.saewitz@heraldtribune.com

SARASOTA -- The only thing that would have kept Sarasota from being listed as the nation's meanest city was a promise to reconsider its ordinance aimed at keeping homeless people from sleeping outside.

But that didn't happen and now it's official: Sarasota is the meanest, according to a coalition of advocacy organizations for the homeless.

Fort Myers stayed off the list after it agreed to re-examine an ordinance prohibiting feeding the homeless in public parks. Gainesville, which was No. 5 last year, stayed out of the top 20 after police there backed off arresting the homeless.

"They (Sarasota) could have been taken off the mean list if they would have just done away with that ordinance," Michael Stoops, acting director of the National Coalition for the Homeless, said at a press conference Wednesday. "They continue to push and push and push, and push homeless people out of the city."

The city of Sarasota officially rejected the title. The ordinance, said Mayor Mary Anne Servian and other city officials, is a tool to safeguard the homeless and lead them to help.

"This is the best thing we can do for them," Servian said.

City Manager Michael McNees said he e-mailed Stoops to explain the city's position and the community's efforts to help the homeless, but he never received a response.

"It is clear that this designation is much more about generating publicity for the agenda of the coalition, whatever that may be, than it is about legitimate public policy discussion," McNees said.

The groups that compiled the report say that it's intended to generate publicity, and to get city leaders to take a second look at their ordinances. They also admitted that the report looks only at "criminalization" issues, and not at services in the community.

Out of more than 200 cities, the groups chose Sarasota as No. 1, up 10 spots from last year.

Sarasota finished first on a list that included much bigger places like Atlanta, Chicago and New York. The report on homelessness, called "A Dream Denied," was compiled with help from the National Law Center on Homelessness and Poverty.

Stoops said the groups came up with the "meanest cities" idea in 2002, putting the 12 meanest in a list called The Dirty Dozen.

He said that the groups had to do something to get local governments' attention, otherwise cities would just continue to create rules that put homeless people in jail.

"It puts pressure . . . pressure on cities to rethink their criminalization strategies," Stoops said. "No city should want to be labeled a mean city."

The Sarasota city commissioners have passed three similar ordinances that prohibit outdoor sleeping overnight on public or private properties. The first two attempts were declared unconstitutional, but the third was recently upheld by a local judge.

Complaints from some downtown residents and business owners prompted the city to pass its first no-camping rule in 2002, along with prohibitions on public urination and aggressive panhandling.

Stoops said he's been working on homeless issues for more than three decades, and Sarasota has been the most "persistent in trying to get an anti-homeless law adopted."

Bradenton was not included in the Top 20, even though it had been pre-ranked at No. 12. Stoops said he was provided with updated information that warranted removing the city from the list.

Sarasota -- which lobbied hard to stay off the list -- didn't get the same consideration. McNees and a police lieutenant have disputed the designation since learning that Sarasota might be named No. 1.

McNees has said that the report is unfair to the entire community, which has been generous in helping the homeless. Sarasota police Lt. Paul Sutton said that the city has more beds for transients than any city its size, and has one of the biggest Salvation Army shelters in Florida.

The new ordinance allows police to take offenders to the Salvation Army, instead of jail. Police came in contact with more than 4,500 transients last year and arrested 45 people under the city's no-lodging rule.

In the past, city police have arrested dozens of homeless people under the no-camping rule. In only five months in 2003, police arrested more than 120 people under the ordinance. During that same time, an additional 210 people were arrested for open container and curbside drinking.

Many homeless people are repeatedly booked at Sarasota's jail. A consultant said last year that the same 473 people -- many of them homeless and addicted to drugs or alcohol -- accounted for 9,343 arrests in six years. That's about 20 arrests per person.

Since then, the county has created a plan to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars finding treatment alternatives.

City commissioners insist they passed the no-lodging ordinance to take homeless people out of unsafe and unhealthy camps. The report is a "slap . . in the face" to everyone who's trying to help, said Commissioner Lou Ann Palmer.

"It's ludicrous," Palmer said. "Absolutely ludicrous."

Service providers also dispute the report, as a whole.

"It makes no sense," said Bryan Pope, general manager of the Salvation Army. "It's not based on fact. They are going to give a distorted report that paints the entire community with a set of accusations that has no bearing on what's really going on."

Stoops said he will likely visit Sarasota in February, when New College of Florida will host a forum to discuss homelessness. He hopes that the city will join the dialogue.

"We're going to try to twist some arms in a good way to get people to work with us," Stoops said. "We're not going to go away. That's not our style. We're going to continue to put pressure and focus on Sarasota, for sure." << Previous | 1 | 2 | 3
 
disneysteve said:
I don't get the point. Should cities be allowing folks to sleep on the streets, use the sidewalks as toilets, beg folks for money, etc? I don't understand how it is mean to make laws banning this type of behavior and then actually enforcing those laws. :confused3
The NCH considers housing a "basic economic and social entitlement. Their concept of housing is defined as "safe, decent, accessible, affordable and permanent."

Now as for responsiblity -- NCH has decided it is society's responsibility to provide such housing for "all people, including people experiencing homelessness, who are unable to secure such housing through their own means." They also believe that everyone requires "economic and social supports to enable them to" acquire such housing (decent, accessible, etc.). Note that there is no mention made of how this is to be sustained financially -- somehow it will all be magically paid for.

If you are experiencing homelessness, you "deserve access to safe, decent, accessible, affordable, and permanent housing through the same systems and programs available to people with housing." There are no conditions and there is no mention of personal responsibility.

Therefore, according to these principles, Sarasota is not just being mean, but also unjust because according to the NCH "universal access to safe, decent, accessible, affordable, and permanent housing is a measure of a truly just society."
 
It would seem according to the NCH -- everything for everyone. Socialism at it's finest.
 
Little Rock was number 3 on the list. They rousted a lot of homeless people who lived by the river to build the Clinton Presidential Library, and have been accused of being "mean" to the homeless because of it.

I will say this San Francisco has the MEANEST beggars. They get right in your face and if you don't give them money they start screaming the worst obcenities you've ever heard. They will follow you to your car, home or store while doing this. Some have even been known to spit on people.

Lots of my friends who lived in the city talked about having a "toll" to pass through a certain block. A beggar would harrass and block anyone who did not give them money.

This caused a lot of problems especially for stores in the tourist areas. I know it stopped me from making as many trips in the city as I would have liked. I've been gone for 4 years now. One mayor cracked down on this only for the next one to let it go again. I think San Francisco made the "meanest" list (#11) because they have taken some steps to stop this horrible behavior by beggars (not all of whom were homeless).
 
hucifer said:
RATS. Detroit didn't make the list! :mad:

When I read the title I was thinking Detroit would be number 1. Then I read why. I wasn't suprized.

Really when you considere the homeless popluation you really need to look at mental health services. The great majority of people who are homless for a long period of time are really in need of consistant mental health treatment. If they were receving this this then more then likley they would not be transistent and able to function better in soceity. It is very sad because medicaitons for many mental illnesses are very effective and can be provided long term (injections) that can help reduce this issue.

I don't think we should be "encourging" homelessness. I don't think that is what the article is about. It is about the cities managment of it. In my opinion the mental health services go hand and hand with that. Detroit does have a major problem with homelessness, and mental health treatment. (I should know I worked in the inner city for 6 years in a mental health treatment center, until it lost funding and was closed, making the care and treatment of menal illness much more difficult to find.)
 
Our city didn't make the list. However, DH contends that a portion of our city is one of the "meanest" 5 AM to 3 PM, Tuesday through Friday. :teeth:
 
We aren't on the meaneast list, rightly so. I always feel bad for the homeless people and try and give 'em a buck if I have any cash on me. Many homeless people DO have jobs. They are just unable to afford the outrageous housing prices in many places.

I think that cities should address the problem, but if they are going to kick them out of the parks it wont do anything, they'll just move. Why not build a shelter or build affordable housing?
 
Free4Life11 said:
We aren't on the meaneast list, rightly so. I always feel bad for the homeless people and try and give 'em a buck if I have any cash on me. Many homeless people DO have jobs. They are just unable to afford the outrageous housing prices in many places.

I think that cities should address the problem, but if they are going to kick them out of the parks it wont do anything, they'll just move. Why not build a shelter or build affordable housing?
Where exactly is the money for those shelters or "affordable" housing to come from? Most cities' budgets are already strapped as it is with every special interest group screaming for more money. I wonder who ends up getting less so more shelters can be built?
 
Increase revenues. Cut costs. Define priorities.

That is how any entity, person, household, business, should deal with a cash-flow problem.
 
Free4Life11 said:
Raise Revenue. Cut costs. Define priorities.
I am reminded of a quote by Calvin Coolidge: "Nothing is easier than the expenditure of public money. It doesn't appear to belong to anyone. The temptation is overwhelming to bestow it on something."

And so we do, most often with terrible results that, at best, impede solving the problem and at worst exacerbate and entrench the problem.

Sure, we can spend more on public housing, but how much of a tax rate are you willing to bear to help fund it? What programs should be cut to help pay for it? What priorities get moved down on the list so public housing gets moved up?

Homelessness is a terrible problem, but it won't be solved by cities giving away public resources, taxing taxpayers further, cutting essential programs and services or redefining their priorities. I don't know what the answer is, but in the 60+ years since the New Deal, I'm convinced that all these grandiose programs have resulted in nothing more than one failure after another.
 
Tigger_Magic said:
Homelessness is a terrible problem, but it won't be solved by cities giving away public resources, taxing taxpayers further, cutting essential programs and services or redefining their priorities. I don't know what the answer is, but in the 60+ years since the New Deal, I'm convinced that all these grandiose programs have resulted in nothing more than one failure after another.
I agree. We all have our causes that we donate time and money to. This is just another area where private donations of time and money can make a difference.

But I am also reminded of a phrase, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. For some of the homeless, it is their choice to live that way.
 


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