Is the economy really that bad?

You can not blame this on the government for lack of regulation. When will Americans stand up and look at what they have done. Why is it always the governments fault?

Somebody please answer this. I'd sure like to know.
 
The reason why the financial crises is happening is because of government deregulation which allowed banks and financial institutions brave new ways to lend money to those who should never have received it.

.

Regardless of deregulation, no one held a gun to anyone's head to sign a bad mortgage deal. Again, where is the personal responsibility from the people that agreed to it? My cousin is one. I remember questioning him when he bought his house. I thought his arm was just a bad move and the house too much for his income, his answer to my concerns.."Well. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it". Guess what, he crossed it right into foreclosure.

You can not blame this on the government for lack of regulation. When will Americans stand up and look at what they have done. Why is it always the governments fault?

It's a questions that I have yet have seen an real answer to.
 
Greed is the problem. Period. Collective "we" weren't happy with normal growth, 'cause unrestrained capitalism is always good, ya know?
 

Let's see more millionares in the past eight years compared to the prior 10.

Bigger houses than our parents had and certainly our grandparents.

Nah, we are not wealthier as a nation than any time in history. It must all be smoke and mirrors.
 
You can not blame this on the government for lack of regulation. When will Americans stand up and look at what they have done. Why is it always the governments fault?
OK, so we (the collective we) are to blame for everything. So how do 'we' fix it?

You see I can accept responsibility as part of society but I don't have a clue what I can do to make things better. Blaming the people is handy because it's an exercise in futility.
 
Let's see more millionares in the past eight years compared to the prior 10.

Bigger houses than our parents had and certainly our grandparents.

Nah, we are not wealthier as a nation than any time in history. It must all be smoke and mirrors.

During the past 8 years anyone could finance anything which is why the nation is in a current fiscal meltdown. Everyone decided that they had to have the McMansion when the Split Level would have been more economically viable for them.

Bigger houses + more millionaires + larger gap between the haves and haves not does not equal a wealthier nation.
 
Regardless of deregulation, no one held a gun to anyone's head to sign a bad mortgage deal. Again, where is the personal responsibility from the people that agreed to it? My cousin is one. I remember questioning him when he bought his house. I thought his arm was just a bad move and the house too much for his income, his answer to my concerns.."Well. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it". Guess what, he crossed it right into foreclosure.



It's a questions that I have yet have seen an real answer to.

No, not regardless of deregulation. Regulations that had been put in place by FDR prevented things like this from happening. Those regulations were gutted by the Republicans and Phil Gramm as Banking chairman. Because of the gutting of those regulations, business does what business does. It went after the quick profit and hid the red ink.

So people can sit on their high horses and point fingers as if the American taxpayer isn't going get hosed because of it. Like or not, your cousin will cost us all money that we wouldn't have to spend if the Republicans hadn't gone on a deregulation spree.

And that is the bottom line.
 
OK, so we (the collective we) are to blame for everything. So how do 'we' fix it?

You see I can accept responsibility as part of society but I don't have a clue what I can do to make things better. Blaming the people is handy because it's an exercise in futility.

It's only an exercise in futility if no one accepts blame and is bailed out by someone else.

Do you think the government should bail out people who made bad choices when getting a mortgage they ultimately couldn't afford?
 
It's only an exercise in futility if no one accepts blame and is bailed out by someone else.

Do you think the government should bail out people who made bad choices when getting a mortgage they ultimately couldn't afford?
I'll answer that with another question. Do you think it will help the economy if people (and companies) are just cut loose to handle things on their own?
 
During the past 8 years anyone could finance anything which is why the nation is in a current fiscal meltdown. Everyone decided that they had to have the McMansion when the Split Level would have been more economically viable for them.

This is true. I can see two responsible parties for that. The consumer and the lender.
 
No, not regardless of deregulation. Regulations that had been put in place by FDR prevented things like this from happening. Those regulations were gutted by the Republicans and Phil Gramm as Banking chairman. Because of the gutting of those regulations, business does what business does. It went after the quick profit and hid the red ink.

So people can sit on their high horses and point fingers as if the American taxpayer isn't going get hosed because of it. Like or not, your cousin will cost us all money that we wouldn't have to spend if the Republicans hadn't gone on a deregulation spree.

And that is the bottom line.

I see you conveniently left out the other major player in this. The consumer.

Now unless they were hoodwinked and lied to, they made the final decision to take on a risky mortgage. No one held a gun to their head.
 
Like or not, your cousin will cost us all money that we wouldn't have to spend if the Republicans hadn't gone on a deregulation spree.

And that is the bottom line.
No, the bottom line was he KNEW what he was getting into and the responsibility is HIS. He wished to ignore the warning signs.

For that matter, lets blame the government for allowing cars to be built or imported or sold that go 100MPH. Heck careless speeding/driving can then be blamed on the government instead of the person driving the car.
 
And don't forget it was the Democrats that said it wasn't fair that some people had a home and others did not which led to the deregulation in the first place. The Democrats wanted everyone to own a home who wanted one regardless of their economic status and now the "economy" is "paying" for it.

Link please to where a Democrat ever said that. Just because you write it on a BB doesn't mean the rest of us have to believe it.

JimFitz said:
You can not blame this on the government for lack of regulation. When will Americans stand up and look at what they have done. Why is it always the governments fault?

No, I certainly can blame this on government deregulation. It is the government's job to look out for the general welfare and that includes oversight over financial institutions, and putting regulations in place to prevent creative loans and accounting.

But, we couldn't be more in agreement that Americans are to blame for this. Americans put the politicians in office who gutted the regulations FDR had put in place and deregulated the financial institutions that has led this crises.

Make no mistake about it. This is a financial crises. Millions of Americans have their savings, pensions and investments in the financial institutions that have failed or are failing. If Americans like what happening, they should keep doing it. As Harry Truman said, sooner or later people wake up and realize who's been kicking them in the head.

Btw, if you think you're not going to be affected by this, guess again. And if you get hit hard enough, you'll be screaming for reregulation. Just remember, McCain's economic advisor was Phil Gramm, Mr. Deregulation himself. Vote accordingly.

Charade said:
I see you conveniently left out the other major player in this. The consumer.

Now unless they were hoodwinked and lied to, they made the final decision to take on a risky mortgage. No one held a gun to their head.

As usual, you've missed the point. Government regulation would've prevented the financial institutions from the creativity" in lending and then hiding the red ink.

Btw, no matter where you point the finger, you will get bitten in the butt if you have an investment account or a 401K.

You may be estatic over pointing fingers. Good luck with that. Many are worried are their investments, their pensions and the future.
 
No, the bottom line was he KNEW what he was getting into and the responsibility is HIS. He wished to ignore the warning signs.

For that matter, lets blame the government for allowing cars to be built or imported or sold that go 100MPH. Heck careless speeding/driving can then be blamed on the government instead of the person driving the car.

And YOU will end up paying for your cousin and the failed financial insitutions. But you'll be standing tall pointing fingers while your pension, investments, and savings go down the crapper.

I salute you for standing tall. :thumbsup2
 
And YOU will end up paying for your cousin and the failed financial insitutions. But you'll be standing tall pointing fingers while your pension, investments, and savings go down the crapper.

I salute you for standing tall. :thumbsup2

You are absolutely right I will be paying for it and Im damn pi$$ed off about it, but I tend to blame consumers and lenders before I blame the government.

Like Ive said before, there is no single blame here but before you start pointing all the fingers at the government, you need to see the fault all around.
 
No, I certainly can blame this on government deregulation. It is the government's job to look out for the general welfare and that includes oversight over financial institutions, and putting regulations in place to prevent creative loans and accounting.

But, we couldn't be more in agreement that Americans are to blame for this. Americans put the politicians in office who gutted the regulations FDR had put in place and deregulated the financial institutions that has led this crises.

Make no mistake about it. This is a financial crises. Millions of Americans have their savings, pensions and investments in the financial institutions that have failed or are failing. If Americans like what happening, they should keep doing it. As Harry Truman said, sooner or later people wake up and realize who's been kicking them in the head.

Btw, if you think you're not going to be affected by this, guess again. And if you get hit hard enough, you'll be screaming for reregulation. Just remember, McCain's economic advisor was Phil Gramm, Mr. Deregulation himself. Vote accordingly.

As usual, you've missed the point. Government regulation would've prevented the financial institutions from the creativity" in lending and then hiding the red ink.

Btw, no matter where you point the finger, you will get bitten in the butt if you have an investment account or a 401K.

You may be estatic over pointing fingers. Good luck with that. Many are worried are their investments, their pensions and the future.

No, I didn't miss anything. As usual.

It's interesting though, in this post you blame people for putting in politicians that caused deregulation but stop short of assigning any responsibility to the same people for signing onto "creative" loans.

"I didn't know that eventually I couldn't afford a $500,000 note on a $50k income!!!" Well, unless you were lied to, or didn't do your homework, then it sucks to be you.
 
You are absolutely right I will be paying for it and Im damn pi$$ed off about it, but I tend to blame consumers and lenders before I blame the government.

Like Ive said before, there is no single blame here but before you start pointing all the fingers at the government, you need to see the fault all around.


Ah, but you assume I don't see the larger point. I actually do see the fault being all the way around.

My point is, with FDR's regulations still in place, we wouldn't even be having this discussion of "who's to blame" because it would never have got to this point.
 
No, I didn't miss anything. As usual.

It's interesting though, in this post you blame people for putting in politicians that caused deregulation but stop short of assigning any responsibility to the same people for signing onto "creative" loans.

"I didn't know that eventually I couldn't afford a $500,000 note on a $50k income!!!" Well, unless you were lied to, or didn't do your homework, then it sucks to be you.

The financial institutions should never have been able to offer these "creative loans" and then be able to hide the mounting red ink.

But if you're happy paying for the result of government deregulation, I'm hysterical. You assign all the responsibility you want. You will still end up paying for it.
 
For us personally, we are doing better now than we ever have been financially. DH has a good job that he loves and that pays him well. I have a job that I love as well, and though I don't make a large income, my income helps us pay our bills. We were able to buy our first house due to the decrease in home sales prices in our area. We purchased it with a conventional 30 year fixed rate mortgage since we saw what happened to so many folks who used interest only loans to purchase houses. We are blessed with excellent health insurance for a reasonable price. We are able to meet all our basic needs and many of our wants. We are very blessed.

However, a few short years ago things were not like this for us at all. I was downsized 2 months after getting married, and at that point I was the primary bread winner for our family. So while the economy is not as bad for us personally as the news media says it is, I think it's important for us all to remember that it can and does happen to many hardworking folks in our country. There but for the grace of God go I. Since we are doing well, we have made a point to give generously to charities.

As for why I think we're having a slower economy, I think that both of the main reasons brought up by posters here have truth to them. I DO think that many people bought homes they couldn't afford using "creative" mortgages. I DO think that many people use credit cards like they are going out of style and just hope they can pay the minimums. But I also think that many people have lots jobs to outsourcing and downsizing. I think that many people are being very hard hit when it comes to their retirement savings investments. I think it's imperative that those of us who are making it do what we can to help those that are not. I don't think it's the governments job to always bail people out. I think we need to take care of each other through charitable contributions.
 








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