Is DVCM's current stance on COVID-19 related canceled points fair?

[gdrj]

Do you mean not take the fee they are allowed? I doubt it because they are nothing more than a company, we, as owners, hire to manage our timeshare system,

What I meant was would their attempt to make it be fair to members come at any expense to DVC (aka Disney money) or would it be all on the backs of members. Many companies Are making adjustments for their customers and are absorbing the costs. If they try to compensate owners who lose points be it park ticket discounts or adjusting the point cost for hotel (not villa stays) or use points some other way. DVC should be willing to feel some of the pain as well.

 

[Sandisw]

What I meant was would their attempt to make it be fair to members come at any expense to DVC (aka Disney money) or would it be all on the backs of members. Many companies Are making adjustments for their customers and are absorbing the costs. If they try to compensate owners who lose points be it park ticket discounts or adjusting the point cost for hotel (not villa stays) or use points some other way. DVC should be willing to feel some of the pain as well.

DVCM isn’t Disney, so any ways for them to make it fair or comepensate members without involving another division of Disney, including parks and resorts, would indeed fall to members to compensate,

From what I have read, there is not a legal basis for compensating owners foe loss of points through tickets, etc. It has to fall within the guidelines of this being a real estate issue,

Now, that is not to say DVCM can’t negotiate with parks and resorts foe a different program for the Disney Collection, which is something we have in our program. But, if it comes with a cost, that cost has to be built into the program in some way...at least the way I understand it all.

What DVCM has to do and has a responsibility to do is find a way to absorb lost points...or not...in such a way that keeps the system balanced as a whole and meets the guidelines of timeshare law,

For example. it’s possible, if the law allows, that they could give people the number of lost points over the next few years. For example, give them free OTU points at 7 months for the next X amount of years, equivalent to the lost points I don’t see that decision needing any other divisions agreement,

That is why I think they have said they can’t make those types of decisions until we have a resort open date. If we can get them open by June 1st, the likelihood of solution for those lost points seems possible. If they don’t open until August first, then I think solutions will be less favorable for owners and the points.

I do believe they probably have been working on a whole set of plans on how to handle so that once it’s known, they can let members now quickly. I would b

 

[KingRichard]

DVCM is Disney! Does DVC sell at a loss or does the profits go to Disney? Where does the money go to for managing the property? Disney! Where does the money for transportation go? Disney! Who leased the land? Disney!

You can create all the sub companies you want, but is it still Disney!

 

[Sandisw]

DVCM is Disney! Does DVC sell at a loss or does the profits go to Disney? Where does the money go to for managing the property? Disney! Where does the money for transportation go? Disney! Who leased the land? Disney!

You can create all the sub companies you want, but is it still Disney!

However, for this situation at hand and who is responsible and who is not, it is important to understand the legal separation and distinction between the two,

 

[graychef]

I do not think it's been appropriate to ignore the rule for one set of points (borrowed) and hold to them for others especially given the fact that 2 UY's did not have enough warning to make a decision. At the very least they should have been allowed to bank past their banking deadlines.

For what to do - they've already made exceptions (returning borrowed points) so I think the fairest is to work out something that allows other affected point to be used somehow and not where RCI is the solution unless that's the choice of the owner.

The last part irks me the most. They waived one set of rules (return borrowed points) and not the other (late banking).

 

[gdrj]

DVCM isn’t Disney, so any ways for them to make it fair or compensate members without involving another division of Disney, including parks and resorts, would indeed fall to members to compensate,

From what I have read, there is not a legal basis for compensating owners foe loss of points through tickets, etc. It has to fall within the guidelines of this being a real estate issue,


I do believe they probably have been working on a whole set of plans on how to handle so that once it’s known, they can let members now quickly. I would b

I do understand DVC is a separate entity than the parks (and I agree with you that any financial adjustment needs to come from somewhere) but it does fall under the Disney company, just like ESPN, ABC, Movie Studio etc. Disney Vacation Club does create revenue for the company (they are far from being a non-profit or revenue neutral division). My only point is that DVC/Disney does have the ability to absorb some of the cost.

Being real estate, and timeshare I have no idea what is allowed or not. But before owners are hit with any costs/ loss of future use (due to availability IF they were to allow banking of the loss points) I would hope that DVC/Disney would absorb some the cost.

Just like with DVC AP discounts (this does not come at the expense of owners, or I dont believe it does).

 

[Sandisw]

I do understand DVC is a separate entity than the parks (and I agree with you that any financial adjustment needs to come from somewhere) but it does fall under the Disney company, just like ESPN, ABC, Movie Studio etc. Disney Vacation Club does create revenue for the company (they are far from being a non-profit or revenue neutral division). My only point is that DVC/Disney does have the ability to absorb some of the cost.

Being real estate, and timeshare I have no idea what is allowed or not. But before owners are hit with any costs/ loss of future use (due to availability IF they were to allow banking of the loss points) I would hope that DVC/Disney would absorb some the cost.

Just like with DVC AP discounts (this does not come at the expense of owners, or I dont believe it does).

The AP discount is a deal negotiated with Parks and Resorts, That is why it’s a perk because that division can decide at any time to not offer it to DVC members,

I agree that other divisions of Disney could decide to absorb some costs, but they do not have to. DVCM is only a managing entity so in itself does not profit from running the system, other than the fee paid to them for being that entity. All timeshares must have a managing entity to run it,

So, if there are things done by DVCM without involving other divisions, like reimbursement of dues,..again, I don’t know if thst is legal or not,,but that type of fee would be absorbed by membership.

Right now, the cost of trades to Disney hotels is paid for by the membership in the sense that we agree to give up a DVC villa to be rented for cash to pay for the trade. If DVCM works a deal with Disney to offer more hotel rooms, without sending the DVC villa, the cost agreed upon would need to come from somewhere, unless Disney can and would give DVC rooms for free,

DVCM will only have so much power to do things on their own, without involving divisions of Disney.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

I think everyone that voices an opinion on this thread should have to start with: I am an owner that will be directly affected by this (or not be affected by this) and state the number of points. Directly means you will lose points - not some theoretical imagined loss of your choice of room in a potential future booking.
I think it helps to undestand others' thoughts on the subject. Don't you?

 

[Phatscott25]

^ I agree. I'm a June use year set to lose 87 points. They are current use year points that currently cannot be banked. I voted for option 3 and that is not because I'm affected. Honestly, I know to better to (and couldn't anyway because I own a tax business) travel in the no-no period of my use year. The only reason I have the points is due to a canceled rental. I say that I would've voted option 3 anyway because I agree with @KAT4DISNEY that they should be consistent with allowing un-borrowing and banking. I don't agree that points should be allowed to be "double banked" though and still wouldn't even if I had double banked points in this circumstance. Allowing double banked, in my opinion, definitely pushes it too far. And if I lose my 87 points (which it looks like I will), I'm OK with that too. But it would be a nice bonus to get them back, and that's how I'd view it if it happens.

 

[DougEMG]

I think everyone that voices an opinion on this thread should have to start with: I am an owner that will be directly affected by this (or not be affected by this) and state the number of points. Directly means you will lose points - not some theoretical imagined loss of your choice of room in a potential future booking.
I think it helps to undestand others' thoughts on the subject. Don't you?

I think everyone that voices an opinion on this thread should have to start with: I am an owner that will be directly affected by this (or not be affected by this) and state the number of points. Directly means you will lose points - not some theoretical imagined loss of your choice of room in a potential future booking.
I think it helps to undestand others' thoughts on the subject. Don't you?

I am not effected by the current process. I am a large point holder (2500+), so anything applied to the entire membership will definitely have a large effect/cost on me.

 

[tjm236]

Fair or not, my question is whether DVCM is really doing what's best for the members. We can all speculate the impact of unborrowing or allowing late banking will have, but we have no numbers to support this. DVCM made the decision to allow unborrowing but not late banking. Do they have to justify what they're doing or are we supposed to just accept it and assume they're doing what's best for the members?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Fair or not, my question is whether DVCM is really doing what's best for the members. We can all speculate the impact of unborrowing or allowing late banking will have, but we have no numbers to support this. DVCM made the decision to allow unborrowing but not late banking. Do they have to justify what they're doing or are we supposed to just accept it and assume they're doing what's best for the members?

Their fiduciary responsibility could perhaps be questioned legally.

 

[anomamatt]

While what they did benefits me (I had pre- and post- cruise nights booked using points borrowed from Aug UY 2020 and they are now back into my UY2020), it doesn't make a lot of sense why they allow this but not late banking.

I know whatever they do (if anything else) will cause a problem for all of us down the road in terms of making it hard to book. I'd rather have them enact "shared pain" across all DVC members and let everyone bank points late, rather than penalize just the select people who booked using current UY points that will expire if not able to be banked. Since they are currently allowing points to be unborrowed, they should allow late banking.

 

[Sandisw]

Fair or not, my question is whether DVCM is really doing what's best for the members. We can all speculate the impact of unborrowing or allowing late banking will have, but we have no numbers to support this. DVCM made the decision to allow unborrowing but not late banking. Do they have to justify what they're doing or are we supposed to just accept it and assume they're doing what's best for the members?

They are good at answering emails,,,They answered my questions regarding the legality of the closing, If you have concerns as to the decision, email them to see what response they give as to why the decision was made the way it was.

 

[tjm236]

Did you just email them through the website?

 

[Sandisw]

Did you just email them through the website?

I emailed membership satisfaction and asked them to please forward to the correct department. It took about a week or so to get a response.

 

[Lumpy1106]

Other and here's why; The current situation favors those who are borrowing points FROM NEXT YEAR but let's get real - you are borrowing those points from someone who is banking points to be used NEXT YEAR, when they banked them a year ago. In other words, there would be no borrowing, if not for banking. How can you say that the people who banked the points should be the ones who are taking the biggest loss?

What's the fix? No idea. Well, I have some ideas, but it's not my call to make. I'm glad I'm not the person to make this decision - there is no way everyone will be happy with it NMW.

 

[marcyleecorgan]

Doesnt need to be fair... it only needs to be legal by FL timeshare laws.

 

[disneymagicRN]

I think it would be nice if they could do something with points that will expire due to covid19. Maybe put them in a special account for each member, to use like one time use points at a later date (kind of like how you can buy one time points to use). I know availability may be tough for the next few years, but they could say starting at this date in the future, you can use x number of your special covid points towards a future trip. Then at least members won't completely lose out on those points, but it could respect the restraints ofcollective system.

 

[keishashadow]

For all reservations cancelled because of the closure:

1. borrowed points should be returned to their original UY
2. current and banked points should be able to be banked

Agree. Was thinking that many of us who stretch their points via studios might just elect to book one or two BR units. They typically seem to be available far longer to book at my resorts BWV, WLV & AKV. Might help to free up studios at the 11 month mark too