Is dvc membership a value at the proposed increased prices?

[Dean]

Funny, I think people who buy their cars can't afford to lease them

Look at the numbers both in terms of how much extra you pay early in the life plus the additional charges many people have to add in. Leasing is by far the most expensive way to own a vehicle but trading every 3-4 years is very expensive unto itself.

 

[luckyman_apd]

In realty "buying" a new car lease/or bought (financed) is horrendous either way. It loses value the second you drive it off the lot (much like a timeshare). One instance, you will spend less than the other, but your throwing money away either way. You can in reality take advantage of those leased cars by buying one from a used car dealer that sells for the banks. Get a 3 year old car for a substantial discount, with minimal miles on them, and they'll last you the same 8-10 years or more if cared for properly.

Of course, I'd never benefit from this if people didn't lease or buy in the first place. Just like resale. I don't see any value or savings in DVC at today's prices. Resale on the other hand actually did provide me with substantial value.

With the help of many of you, I bought it with eyes wide open, without the impulse. Over the last few years Disney trips have become a real source of enjoyment for us, and we were going to do them anyway. This provided us a way to continue that, for less or the same cost, with much better locations/accommodations.

Maybe the economy has rebounded enough, and the demand is up that disney is able to sell at the current prices, but once the prices jumped beyond $100 per point, they lost me as a direct purchaser.

 

[DisneyFansInLINY]

Look at the numbers both in terms of how much extra you pay early in the life plus the additional charges many people have to add in. Leasing is by far the most expensive way to own a vehicle but trading every 3-4 years is very expensive unto itself.

And look at how much your car costs due to maintenance. Leasing gets you the car for it's best years and then onto a brand new car. We own one car since DH needs a lot of miles. But my car is leased. We used to own 2 cars. However, after an accident totaled our Audi and we literally ended up with no car and very little insurance money, we bought another Audi. And then after a few years, that car was a money pit because it's good years were all used up and it kept needing new parts. So we dumped the car and started leasing a Nissan. That is the best way to go. I use the car up and then get a new car when I am done with it.

 

[Dean]

And look at how much your car costs due to maintenance. Leasing gets you the car for it's best years and then onto a brand new car. We own one car since DH needs a lot of miles. But my car is leased. We used to own 2 cars. However, after an accident totaled our Audi and we literally ended up with no car and very little insurance money, we bought another Audi. And then after a few years, that car was a money pit because it's good years were all used up and it kept needing new parts. So we dumped the car and started leasing a Nissan. That is the best way to go. I use the car up and then get a new car when I am done with it.

Those costs are the function of the car choice and not the system. Don't fool yourself into the idea that you're saving money on maintenance by getting a new car every few years, it's as far from the truth as one can get. In reality the very best years are likely starting at 2-3 years after purchase for about another 10 years depending on the vehicle of course. As I alluded to and as did the post above yours, trading cars every 3-4 years is a VERY expensive approach, likely more than the cost of one's home over time. For those that can afford to do so and chose to, that's their choice and I don't begrudge them that choice. Just don't try to justify it as a reasonable expense from a cost standpoint.

 

[spiceycat]

Maybe the economy has rebounded enough, and the demand is up that disney is able to sell at the current prices, but once the prices jumped beyond $100 per point, they lost me as a direct purchaser.

agree!

 

[luckyman_apd]

Those costs are the function of the car choice and not the system. Don't fool yourself into the idea that you're saving money on maintenance by getting a new car every few years, it's as far from the truth as one can get. In reality the very best years are likely starting at 2-3 years after purchase for about another 10 years depending on the vehicle of course. As I alluded to and as did the post above yours, trading cars every 3-4 years is a VERY expensive approach, likely more than the cost of one's home over time. For those that can afford to do so and chose to, that's their choice and I don't begrudge them that choice. Just don't try to justify it as a reasonable expense from a cost standpoint.

Exactly. I have a friend at work who was tired of driving "cars that broke down" all the time, so she leases not and never worries about maintenance. While true, the cars she was referring too were well past 10 years old, and as a mechanic of my own cars since the day I've gotten my license, the amount of "maintainance" you save by leasing will NEVER equal the extra you pay to swap cars every 3 years. In fact, two 3 year leases can easily surpass a 5 year loan on the same model at first lease, and after 6 years of ownership. AND at the end of the 6 years, the purchased cars still has SOME value, as the lease gets returned with 0 value.

Now I respect her choice, but to justify in any way as a cost savings is far from reality. There may be plenty of other reasons to lease vs buy, but cost savings is not one of them.

 

[Sandisw]

Look at the numbers both in terms of how much extra you pay early in the life plus the additional charges many people have to add in. Leasing is by far the most expensive way to own a vehicle but trading every 3-4 years is very expensive unto itself.

Have to laugh and agree at the same time...guilty as charged though...I love having new cars every 3 to 4 years and got tired of always being upside down so now I lease..
But, just as with my DVC, I go I with wide eyes open and don't try to pretend that there are not other options that from a strictly financial, dollars and sense standpoint would be better.

In terms of value of DVC, I am thrilled with it and don't regret a thing but its gotten very hard to recommend direct to anyone, given the vast price difference. When I began looking in 2008--when BLT was announced, AKV was offered to me at $92...resale prices at some of the others were in the 80's...so not a huge difference...now, there is just no way to justify the huge price gap between direct and resale.

 

[Dean]

Have to laugh and agree at the same time...guilty as charged though...I love having new cars every 3 to 4 years and got tired of always being upside down so now I lease..
But, just as with my DVC, I go I with wide eyes open and don't try to pretend that there are not other options that from a strictly financial, dollars and sense standpoint would be better.

In terms of value of DVC, I am thrilled with it and don't regret a thing but its gotten very hard to recommend direct to anyone, given the vast price difference. When I began looking in 2008--when BLT was announced, AKV was offered to me at $92...resale prices at some of the others were in the 80's...so not a huge difference...now, there is just no way to justify the huge price gap between direct and resale.

We all make choices and some are better than others. No doubt I wish I had some of mine back over the years to have a do over. As long as one knows what they're getting into and what the choices are, I think that's fine. About 25 years ago I moonlighted every other weekend for a year to pay our cars off and since that time I pay myself a car payment every month. That way I can go buy what I want when I want assuming I've saved enough money and I did just that in Nov. Then rather than trading or selling my 8.5 y/o prius, I let my daughter and SIL have it to drive. It worked out well for everyone.

 

[xbrentx]

It all comes down to value. For me, I'm 28, married, will have kids on the way in the next 2-5 years. Myself, my wife, my brother, and my parents all visit Disney at least once every 2 years, each. We are not a rich family, and we're not a poor family, but staying in a deluxe resort is not an option for us with cash. We can't justify spending $3500-$5000 a week. We ALWAYS stayed at value resorts like Pop Century, and we were happy doing it.

We asked ourselves how we could find new things to experience at Disney. We go so much, we've done it all, it seemed routine. BINGO! DVC!

The resale pricing for DVC allowed us to get 240 points at SSR. Sure, we will spend more money by the time the contract has ended than if we had just stayed at a value resort every time, but the VALUE to us as a family now being able to stay at a deluxe resort far exceeds the price difference.

Direct pricing is outrageous, I would never pay it, even if I was a millionaire I would buy resale.

We're very excited for our first trip as DVC members, scheduled in a 2 bedroom at SSR for new years!

 

[Dean]

It all comes down to value.

Direct pricing is outrageous, I would never pay it, even if I was a millionaire I would buy resale.

IMO value must have a financial component but it's one that will likely vary with the individual's past history and preferences though there is a relatively fixed $$$ component as well.

It's ALL relative. Even at retail prices DVC is still a good deal compared to one who goes and pays cash for a non DVC suite or even DVC through CRO. Compared to off property DVC is dramatically overpriced even at the best resale prices you can find.

 

[luckyman_apd]

IMO value must have a financial component but it's one that will likely vary with the individual's past history and preferences though there is a relatively fixed $$$ component as well.

It's ALL relative. Even at retail prices DVC is still a good deal compared to one who goes and pays cash for a non DVC suite or even DVC through CRO. Compared to off property DVC is dramatically overpriced even at the best resale prices you can find.

Very valid points. Value is financial mixed with personal. I stayed offsite as a kid as my parents NEVER stayed on site. I Hated it. LONG hours in the park, drive back to the Days inn for a break, drive back for the night. I swore when I had kids we would stay on property and soak it all in. DVC allows me to do that for the same cost with an even better location and the monorail that (I get it, I'm a monorail dork) I never thought I could afford staying at. I was even ok paying $100 per point at SSR direct when we first started looking into DVC. No way was I going to pay $145 for BLT at the time. Resale gave me the value I was looking for. Is that the same value to someone else? Probably not, but to others yes. To my parents? They would think I'm nuts ( when they were my age). They would tell me to stay offsite and save so much more money as that s where they see the value.

When it comes to Value, I don't think I can justify a direct price vs moderate resort cash prices. Regardless of any value components added that are not financial, the financial part is no longer there IMHO......as far as direct is concerned.

 

[Anal Annie]

There has to be a point break where you really have to ask yourself is this really worth it. Between interest, principle, and MF's, I pay over $6500 a year for my 320 BLT points. Current prices are more than double the introductory DVC prices at some resorts. When you boil it down, your points get you a hotel room for a couple a nights a year with no maid service. I don't think I would do it over at today's prices.

I think they're overpriced as it is, especially when you consider what has happened to the resale market. I can't believe they're raising prices like they are. It still irks me a little bit what we paid for our SSR points when we bought in 2006 ($86 per point) compared to what the resale market started running right after we bought. At the time we bought the gap was comparable - the bottom dropped out soon after tho. We love our DVC but I'm sure glad we bought before the prices got out of control.

 

[Sammie]

As TJ stated if you compare the rack rates of DVC villas versus the cost of owning then yes there is still value in it.

For me personally the true value of DVC is at least a one bedroom and actually the 2 bedroom is what made us buy.

At today's prices if I was always going to stay in a studio, it would not be worth it to me personally.

 

[dbs1228]

As TJ stated if you compare the rack rates of DVC villas versus the cost of owning then yes there is still value in it.

For me personally the true value of DVC is at least a one bedroom and actually the 2 bedroom is what made us buy.

At today's prices if I was always going to stay in a studio, it would not be worth it to me personally.

This is the exact reason we bought! DH and I both agree if we are going to take the plunge in DVC it is not to stretch our points for longer stays we will buy enough to do a yearly trip in a two bedroom if there are more then 3 of us and a 1 bedroom when its just the 2 of us.

 

[Dean]

Very valid points. Value is financial mixed with personal. I stayed offsite as a kid as my parents NEVER stayed on site. I Hated it. LONG hours in the park, drive back to the Days inn for a break, drive back for the night. I swore when I had kids we would stay on property and soak it all in. DVC allows me to do that for the same cost with an even better location and the monorail that (I get it, I'm a monorail dork) I never thought I could afford staying at. I was even ok paying $100 per point at SSR direct when we first started looking into DVC. No way was I going to pay $145 for BLT at the time. Resale gave me the value I was looking for. Is that the same value to someone else? Probably not, but to others yes. To my parents? They would think I'm nuts ( when they were my age). They would tell me to stay offsite and save so much more money as that s where they see the value.

When it comes to Value, I don't think I can justify a direct price vs moderate resort cash prices. Regardless of any value components added that are not financial, the financial part is no longer there IMHO......as far as direct is concerned.

I think that touches on a point I've made a couple of times lately. That many who look into and/or buy DVC make assumptions of off property based on limited info and experience. If off property motel 6 or sleep inn and 12 hours in the park is your point of reference, that is a very skewed comparison in 2013, IMO. There are a number of resorts that are at least as nice as DVC and that one can drive from to the parks as easily (generally speaking) as one can do the same from some of the DVC resorts (we drive in most situations). Of course nobody beats Disney for theming but looked at overall I think a number of the resorts are actually better than DVC resorts if you ignore location. I realize that you can't totally ignore location but I'd suggest that the "compromise" if it is one, is much smaller than many realize even if you end up renting a car consistently. Plus you often pick up other benefits that are far superior to the same using DVC, such as non Disney trips to other locations. We enjoy both and all else being equal, I'd rather stay on property at DVC, but all else isn't equal most of the time, esp when we can get the presidential suite at the Fountains for $79 a night.

 

[bman388]

We bought 160 Direct BLT points in December and couldn't be happier. BLT seems to be one of the main whoopin dogs in this thread so I thought I'd share my thought. When we bought we were offered BLT or AKV. We loved both and although BLT is more up front, you need to look at the MF's.. The contract itself was about $5000 more than AKV but over the life of the contract the MF's at AKV are about $9000 more (that # is using today's MF rates and I know they will change!) .. So BLT is cheaper than AKV in the end.. Is it expensive? Yep. Is it money well spent? Yep. The question of value I believe is one that each person must ask themselves. You can talk to me all day about how it's too much money but you could not change my opinion.. We love DVC and will for many, many, more years. Oh.. and we are on the look out and will be getting 160 to 200 RESALE points at SSR someime this year!

 

[Novakm]

Way back in 1993 I went to Poly, and was offered DVC. No way I could afford it then, much as I wanted to.

Now I am planning to go three times in the next three years. Each time will be with a different one of my daughters and their family. 6 people each trip.

Not many good options for six people without going DVC. I am looking at resale. Vs renting it will take 8 trips for me to break even. At full retail it would take twice that. Seems like it would take a lot of fast talking and arm twisting to convince anyone that its a good deal at 16 years payback.

But there is something you get by owning that you do not get by renting. It's intangible but real. I would never buy direct, but I'm considering resale.

 

[pinnocchiosdad]

DVC is an emotional purchase. You sell yourself on the idea of making memories with your kids that will last forever. You sell yourself on the idea of your kids one day staying in the same rooms that they did with you, but with their own children. For me, I would vacation at WDW withy family in the 70's. we would drive from NY in the station wagon and stay at small motels an hour away in Daytona. We would drive on the morning to the MK. I remember riding on the monorail as it passed through the Contemporary, and I couldn't even conceive the thought of family staying there. Today I have a deed in my strong box showing that I own part of that resort. I sit on my balcony and watch the monorail go by. It feels good. People by for many different reasons.

 

[CMOORE185]

DVC is an emotional purchase. You sell yourself on the idea of making memories with your kids that will last forever. You sell yourself on the idea of your kids one day staying in the same rooms that they did with you, but with their own children. For me, I would vacation at WDW withy family in the 70's. we would drive from NY in the station wagon and stay at small motels an hour away in Daytona. We would drive on the morning to the MK. I remember riding on the monorail as it passed through the Contemporary, and I couldn't even conceive the thought of family staying there. Today I have a deed in my strong box showing that I own part of that resort. I sit on my balcony and watch the monorail go by. It feels good. People by for many different reasons.

Great story. My parents never took us to Disney world, the first time I went was on my honeymoon and I loved it. We bought DVC 9 years later and I think some of my children's best memories are of Disney world and DVC. My children are 20 and 16 and still love the world. My daughter wants to get married at GF. I still love Disney and hope I always will.
I do not know if I would buy at today's prices but I sure am glad I did buy DVC when I did.

 

[luckyman_apd]

DVC is an emotional purchase. You sell yourself on the idea of making memories with your kids that will last forever. You sell yourself on the idea of your kids one day staying in the same rooms that they did with you, but with their own children. For me, I would vacation at WDW withy family in the 70's. we would drive from NY in the station wagon and stay at small motels an hour away in Daytona. We would drive on the morning to the MK. I remember riding on the monorail as it passed through the Contemporary, and I couldn't even conceive the thought of family staying there. Today I have a deed in my strong box showing that I own part of that resort. I sit on my balcony and watch the monorail go by. It feels good. People by for many different reasons.

Love this. My thoughts exactly (minus the driving from NY in a station wagon).
My first trip I was five. My parent were divorced, my mom was recently remarried. They had little money and my Grandparents took us all to WDW. We stayed at some top notch high rise hotel (not sure of the name, but it was sanctioned by disney and had character breakfasts there and a glass elevator on the outside of the building). I believe the contemporary was one of the only actual Disney resorts at the time. 1982. Epcot was being built and we could see spaceship earth from our balcony. We went again in 1988 and stayed in a days inn. Hated it, and wished my mom had us staying at the place my grandparents took us or a disney resort ( I know, I was a brat).

Well the first trip I took my daughter we stayed at Coronado, and I felt that it would be sooooo awesome to stay at the contemporary, but we couldn't afford that. Also made me remorseful for being a brat to my mother. But to think that now we can stay EVERY trip at that resort is a very gratifying experience to know I'm giving my kids the experience I always wanted, but still paying the same basic amount as if we continued at Coronado. To me that is the value.