Is Disney Losing It????

[Cree629]

I completely understand Disney's need to cut back, and I totally don't mind if they can only run certain shows and parades a couple of days a week. However, it does really stink that I am within my 90 day window, able to make ADRs, and the official hours and show scedules have still not been released. Is it really too much to ask for them to please release the schedule in time for people in their 90-day window to be able to make their ADRs?

 

[SoonipiLady]

I know of no other business that posts its operating hours months in advance. Disney has always done this for the convenience of its guests, but they have no obligation to do so.

Most post them for entire season already at least here in the northeast.

http://www.canobie.com/hours.php

http://www.sixflags.com/greatescape/info/parkInfo.aspx

http://www.hersheypark.com/hours/index.php

No, Disney doesn't have an obligation to do so, but in stopping this practice, many people have developed a uneasy feeling about their upcoming vacation. Is that Disney's fault? Maybe, maybe not. That doesn't mean that the folks that are feeling "slighted" by Disney aren't totally valid in their thinking. Does it bother me that the hours weren't up for may vacation until a few weeks ago? Sure. Did it stress me out...not really. But I can understand that it may for some people. Times are tough, and getting tougher. When stress levels are high, a lot of people like to do the farmiliar. When the "familiar" isn't, it just adds to the stress level. Tought times isn't a good time for change for most folks. For many families, Disney is a MAJOR investment. If I'm investing 1/10 of my year's salary in a vacation, I'd like to know what I'm buying. If the changes were small one or two, that's one thing. Disney is changing many small and two absolutely huge...the ADR process and the park hours.

 

[Glencora]

I think the thing that upsets me most is that Disney created the whole 90 problem when they introduced the dining plan. Don't get me wrong - I know that for many families the dining plan is a great thing. But because of it, everybody else now has to make their ADRs early - whether they're on the plan or not. So it seems to me they could go the extra mile to ensure that that process runs smoothly. I mean, if you're going to force us to plan, then at least give us the tools to do so. Just sayin'.

 

[swald91]

We just came back-I can't say that they are losing their magic, but I do miss YOAMD....they are training many new college students now. I encountered one at a gift shop & he was getting a bit frustrated b/c he didn't give me my change fast enough-I think he was just nervous & felt like another CM was looking over his shoulder. And yet when my daughter bought something at the same store-the CM didn't charge enough & she told her what she bought-she thanked my daughter for her honesty & gave her a pin. I think that the whole fireworks/parade issues are just b/c the economy isn't what it was. My opinion is after just returning (to be a slow time) it doesn't seem to me that Disney is hurting. I'm sure it may not look it to the public...I think if things pick up the schedule will change & they will offer more as they see fit.

 

[Disney1976]

Forgive me if this has already been stated, I didn't read through the whole thread.

I completely understand the need for cutbacks. Disney is a business and must answer ultimately to its shareholders. Thus, in a weaker economy, to protect the bottom line, certain cutbacks may be necessary. Certainly the few days you or I might spend in a park looking at crowds is not indicative of, nor a good measure of, attendance figures. Indeed, Disney has already annouced there has been a decline in bookings for the first part of 2009. Even a 2 percent drop in attendance can result in double-digit loses-just ask Universal, who annouced this last week.

At the same time, my fear is that (and I hope I'm wrong) when the economy does improve, the programs and special things that were cut in order to save money (reduction in shows, 4 for a $, etc.) won't return, because Disney will just say "Well, we're getting along fine without it, and people really aren't complaining...let's leave it alone." Honestly, Disney gets so many new visitors annually and visitors who visit very infrequently they probably wouldn't know the way things were, just as they are in that moment.

 

[selina4disney]

I think the thing that upsets me most is that Disney created the whole 90 problem when they introduced the dining plan. Don't get me wrong - I know that for many families the dining plan is a great thing. But because of it, everybody else now has to make their ADRs early - whether they're on the plan or not. So it seems to me they could go the extra mile to ensure that that process runs smoothly. I mean, if you're going to force us to plan, then at least give us the tools to do so. Just sayin'.

WELL SAID!

 

[WDSearcher]

At the same time, my fear is that (and I hope I'm wrong) when the economy does improve, the programs and special things that were cut in order to save money (reduction in shows, 4 for a $, etc.) won't return, because Disney will just say "Well, we're getting along fine without it, and people really aren't complaining...let's leave it alone." Honestly, Disney gets so many new visitors annually and visitors who visit very infrequently they probably wouldn't know the way things were, just as they are in that moment.

If it makes you feel better, the past times that this has happened -- cutbacks due to the economy -- Disney did fully add back what had been cut out, and then some. Not exactly, of course. It's not like Four for $ will automatically be brought back. But new entertainment will be added, fireworks schedules will be bumped back up, new parades added, etc. Because the thing is ... Disney HATES having to make these cuts. They hate shortening days and schedules, they hate having to let performers go, they hate shuttering shows. They hate it all. Because the parks exist to entertain and delight and provide relaxation and fun. And as soon as they can, they'll be chomping at the bit to get that stuff back in the parks.

 

[JPN4265]

This kind of comment always kind of confuses me. I understand that none of us want line-jumpers, rude people, etc., but the thing that makes me scratch my head is "We don't want to fight ... we don't want to get mad ..." If we don't want to do these things, then ... well ... we shouldn't. I am the only one who controls whether a tour group makes me angry. I'm the only one who can decide if I'm going to fight with someone about a parade spot. That's my call, not Disney's.

Frankly, in all my days in the parks, I seldom see someone smoking in a non-smoking area. Maybe I've just been lucky. But I've seen many a CM reminding people that where they're smoking is NOT a smoking area. The guest does not always comply, but the CMs are doing their best.

As for people pushing in front of us at a parade .... the onus is on us to complain. If there's a CM nearby, flag them down, point to the people and say, "Those folks pushed in front of me." And then be prepared for a battle of sorts, because those pushy people will certainly deny it. And so then you have a CM who didn't see it happen having to make a value call as to whether you are right or the other folks are right. And even then, CMs are limited to what they can do. If they side with you and tell the pushy people they will need to move back ... let's say the pushy people move back. The CM is not going to stand there for the entire parade and make sure the pushy people behave themselves. They have other things to deal with ... other pushy people or lost kids or whatever. So then, the pushy people come back and push through again. So, you find another CM and it starts over. It's not like Disney can inject a chip in a pushy person's head that instantly makes them polite. Nor can they really eject someone from the park for one incident. Sure, those people may have been pushy all day long. But if you were the only one to report it, all the CM knows is that they were pushy once.

Same with the tour groups. I know it's surprising to imagine, but there are actual tour operators that Disney will not allow on their property any more because of how those tour groups behaved. So they have and will deny access to touring prices and deals and such to groups who do not follow the rules. But short of assigning a batch of CMs to monitor each tour group, it's hard to police these groups all day long. Most guests who are bothered by a tour group never report it anywhere but someplace like the DIS. And at that point, it can't be fixed. They don't call over a CM, they don't go to guest relations, they don't complain in the moment. They complain afterwards ... when they (and the tour group) are gone.

People do have a belief that all CMs are all-seeing and all-powerful, but most are not. They're college kids or seniors or people trying to get by on a minimum wage job, and they didn't take any classes in group mentality or chaos theory or psychology or negotiation. Imagine yourself in their position. You're 20 years old, first job. It's hot, crowded, and you see someone not "sliding all the way to the left" at a venue. You walk up there and say to them, "I'm sorry, but I need you to slide all the way over." They refuse. You ask nicely again. They refuse and yell at you that they paid their money to be here and they can sit wherever they darn please. Now ... how long are you going to stand there trying to move this unmovable object? How willing are you to fall on a sword for that?

Disney can only do so much. But if I don't want to spend my vacation angry at people for jumping a line, then it's me who needs to decide that. And I also have to decide to help police the place too, just like I keep track of my purse at the grocery store or my kids on the playground. If I'm not willing to take the time and energy to find a CM, make a complaint or make Disney (not the DIS, but actually writing to Disney) aware of a problem, then I'm kind of asking for the impossible!

JMHO

Talk about being confused? First you say we are the only ones that can control the situation, if we don't want to fight with someone for being a jerk, then you say go get a CM, but be ready for battle. All I say is that if the CM's would just enforce the rules, then the problem would handle itself. I've seen to many fights over just the items I mentioned because someone has had enough, and decided to take matters into their own hands. I've also seen CM's walk right past the people breaking the rules and say nothing. Can a CM see it all? No. But when they refuse to enforce the rules, that's when trouble breaks out. You wanting us to become the Disney unpaid police officers just doesn't work for me. I don't think that Disney would agree with your idea of getting involved in enforcing the rules either. Do I expect all of the problems to be solved by the CM's? No, but even a small amount would help.

 

[mom2taylorandemily]

I think the thing that upsets me most is that Disney created the whole 90 problem when they introduced the dining plan. Don't get me wrong - I know that for many families the dining plan is a great thing. But because of it, everybody else now has to make their ADRs early - whether they're on the plan or not. So it seems to me they could go the extra mile to ensure that that process runs smoothly. I mean, if you're going to force us to plan, then at least give us the tools to do so. Just sayin'.

WELL SAID!

Now I don't agree with these statements at all FOR MY FAMILY! We do not get a rental car when we come down, to us its just another expense so we do not get groceries, nor do we travel off-site to other restaurants. Disney makes their dining plan very desireable. I don't stay in DVC I stay in Resorts with no cooking ability. The dining plan is affordable and it enables my family the ability to eat in some great restaurants that we might never have even ever thought about eating at. There are a great many families who travel to Disney with kids and this plan makes it very easy and affordable, they don't have to budget $$ for every day for meals, its already paid for the day you arrive. Then you do get to eat at some fabulous places. I don't think the plan is forced on you, if you don't want to use it then don't. But I'll sing its praises to anyone who'll listen, it makes my trip easy and its one less thing I have to worry about when I get there. I am one of those making changes to my touring schedule up until the day I get there, so the 90 window is ideal for me, as the Disney hours are more likely to be accurate at that time than the 180 day mark. I've see them change hours for Dec. for the last 3 years from the 180 day mark to the 90 day mark and then change them again the week before we arrive.

So, pull some historical hours and try to make a tentative plan from there, and adjust as necessary, but please stop slamming the DDP, it is not the reason for all of these changes at Disney. It is purely driven by the economy, bottem line.

Ok, I'm off my soap box.

 

[selina4disney]

Now I don't agree with these statements at all FOR MY FAMILY! We do not get a rental car when we come down, to us its just another expense so we do not get groceries, nor do we travel off-site to other restaurants. Disney makes their dining plan very desireable. I don't stay in DVC I stay in Resorts with no cooking ability. The dining plan is affordable and it enables my family the ability to eat in some great restaurants that we might never have even ever thought about eating at. There are a great many families who travel to Disney with kids and this plan makes it very easy and affordable, they don't have to budget $$ for every day for meals, its already paid for the day you arrive. Then you do get to eat at some fabulous places. I don't think the plan is forced on you, if you don't want to use it then don't. But I'll sing its praises to anyone who'll listen, it makes my trip easy and its one less thing I have to worry about when I get there. I am one of those making changes to my touring schedule up until the day I get there, so the 90 window is ideal for me, as the Disney hours are more likely to be accurate at that time than the 180 day mark. I've see them change hours for Dec. for the last 3 years from the 180 day mark to the 90 day mark and then change them again the week before we arrive.

So, pull some historical hours and try to make a tentative plan from there, and adjust as necessary, but please stop slamming the DDP, it is not the reason for all of these changes at Disney. It is purely driven by the economy, bottem line.

Ok, I'm off my soap box.

You got on your soap box for nothing here because I don't think you quite got what I was saying, nor what the other poster you quoted was saying either. I am NOT slamming the DDP. I am slamming Disney for, with the DDP, having made it so we HAVE to plan so far ahead...and then not posting park hours and parade and fireworks schedules far enough ahead so we CAN plan.

We have used the DDP many times. We go 4 or 5 times a year. We are AP holders and even before AP holders could get the dining plan, we bought packages with one day base tickets so we COULD buy the dining plan. We stay onsite. We do not rent a car....we haven't since our first trip in 2002. We are not DVC. We do not buy groceries, and I sure as heck am not cooking when I am at Disney even if I was in a resort with that capability. I'm on vacation, and trust me, I hate to cook when I am home, and any vacation that makes me cook is NOT a vacation. We loved the dining plan because we could try a lot of new restaurants.

HOWEVER....when they tell us we can make ADRs 90 + 10 (90 days out plus the first 10 days of your stay) and they don't post the hours...I CAN'T make ADRs. I don't know what park we will be in, and I do not want to be tied down to ADRs at one park when once the hours are finally posted we might see we want to be somewhere else, and I have to cancel and try to get the ADR's elsewhere.

So stop worrying. Not slamming your DDP. I just want the blasted park hours so I CAN PLAN. We are down to 82 days for our anniversary trip and I still have only one ADR at California Grill for our anniversary. I'll happily go with 90 days instead of 180..but POST THE HOURS early enough so we can plan! THAT'S all I was saying.

And now...I have to go finish my RideMax plans because I leave in 36 hours for my next trip!

 

[WDSearcher]

Talk about being confused? First you say we are the only ones that can control the situation, if we don't want to fight with someone for being a jerk, then you say go get a CM, but be ready for battle. All I say is that if the CM's would just enforce the rules, then the problem would handle itself. I've seen to many fights over just the items I mentioned because someone has had enough, and decided to take matters into their own hands. I've also seen CM's walk right past the people breaking the rules and say nothing. Can a CM see it all? No. But when they refuse to enforce the rules, that's when trouble breaks out. You wanting us to become the Disney unpaid police officers just doesn't work for me. I don't think that Disney would agree with your idea of getting involved in enforcing the rules either. Do I expect all of the problems to be solved by the CM's? No, but even a small amount would help.

Have you ever taken a problem to a CM and had them say, "I'm sorry, but I refuse to enforce the rules" or "I'm sorry, that's not my job"? If that has happened to you, then I hope you reported that CM because that is truly unacceptable behavior. I'm also wondering how many times per vacation you see this happening. Is it that rampant? I've seen guests breaking rules (smoking in a non-smoking area, climbing a fence for a better view, etc), but never when a CM is nearby. But then, I'm not always aware of what's going on with my own group, much less what other people are up to!

I'm not asking you be a "Disney unpaid police officer." I'm saying that if there's a fight going on and you see a CM walking by and they don't seem to notice the fight, flag them down and yell, "Call Security! There's a fight over here!" If people are line jumping and the CM doesn't seem to be acting on it, flag them down and yell, "There are line jumpers here! The guy in the orange shirt is line jumping! Stop him!" You'd be surprised how quickly that works. But if there's a fight going on and a CM walks by and they don't seem to notice and you also do nothing, then you're expecting the CM to be all-knowing and all-seeing. And, even though CMs are charged with maintaining the "magic" of WDW, they are humans as well, and they sometimes default to non-confrontational mode. If it looks like the line-jumper is long gone or that the fight is more hot air than it is life-threatening, they are likely to let it go rather than climb into the middle of it and make it worse.

But if every time you saw a CM not acting on someone who you felt was breaking the rules and reported them, then Disney would get a feel for how often this is happening and change their training accordingly.

 

[redrosesix]

To all of you who are fine with the 90 day rule and are planning your trips for May or November, or sometime off in the distant future:

FYI, the park hours for Feb. have apparently changed twice in the last month, nobody seems to know for sure what the park hours or EMHs are for next week, and the CMs at reservations don't always have the correct information on when Fantasmic, etc. will be for next month. I have not been able to use the "build my itinerary" part of the website for most of this month, and the ADRs are unavailable for most of the park restaurants in Feb. -- God forbid you need to change one to fit the new schedule that they "might" be having.

And we are trying to make plans to work around reservations, shows, etc. with other people outside "the world", none of which have changed their schedules.

The OP is right -- this does affect the magic.

 

[MattM]

Ah, the ole "IS Disney losing it" thread. The short answer is no, and it is ridiculous to think any different. First and foremost, above all other things, Disney is a business. They are in business to make a profit, so that they may stay in business. If your "magic" is shortchanged a bit in an economic slowdown, then THANK Disney. They are taking the steps necessary to ensure that when the economy recovers and you return to Disney, they will have been smart enough during the slowdown to have enough money to bring all the "magic" back that you've come to expect.

 

[mom2taylorandemily]

You got on your soap box for nothing here because I don't think you quite got what I was saying, nor what the other poster you quoted was saying either. I am NOT slamming the DDP. I am slamming Disney for, with the DDP, having made it so we HAVE to plan so far ahead...and then not posting park hours and parade and fireworks schedules far enough ahead so we CAN plan.

We have used the DDP many times. We go 4 or 5 times a year. We are AP holders and even before AP holders could get the dining plan, we bought packages with one day base tickets so we COULD buy the dining plan. We stay onsite. We do not rent a car....we haven't since our first trip in 2002. We are not DVC. We do not buy groceries, and I sure as heck am not cooking when I am at Disney even if I was in a resort with that capability. I'm on vacation, and trust me, I hate to cook when I am home, and any vacation that makes me cook is NOT a vacation. We loved the dining plan because we could try a lot of new restaurants.

HOWEVER....when they tell us we can make ADRs 90 + 10 (90 days out plus the first 10 days of your stay) and they don't post the hours...I CAN'T make ADRs. I don't know what park we will be in, and I do not want to be tied down to ADRs at one park when once the hours are finally posted we might see we want to be somewhere else, and I have to cancel and try to get the ADR's elsewhere.

So stop worrying. Not slamming your DDP. I just want the blasted park hours so I CAN PLAN. We are down to 82 days for our anniversary trip and I still have only one ADR at California Grill for our anniversary. I'll happily go with 90 days instead of 180..but POST THE HOURS early enough so we can plan! THAT'S all I was saying.

And now...I have to go finish my RideMax plans because I leave in 36 hours for my next trip!

Sorry, I stand corrected and apologize for misquoting you and other poster.

 

[Whisky In A VAse]

Wishes on every night in May

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