Is Disney at fault for disappointment?

[WillAustin]

It's the bubble. People accept less because it's in the "World". I'm not sure anything other than MK would truly stand on its own and draw any more than a local park.

100% this.

 

[Hudson Hornet]

It's the bubble. People accept less because it's in the "World". I'm not sure anything other than MK would truly stand on its own and draw any more than a local park.

I think AK would do better than that. It is unique enough I think it would draw like Six Flags. So, it would be a regional draw, probably not globally or even from across the whole country.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Imagine they priced each ticket separately, no more multi-day discounts.

Let's say $100 a day for MK and $60 a day for the other three parks and you had to buy each day's ticket separately. Oh and no more park hoppers.

Would less people go to the other three parks then (minus the Epcot festival traffic)? Of course.

 

[DougEMG]

Imagine they priced each ticket separately, no more multi-day discounts.

Let's say $100 a day for MK and $60 a day for the other three parks and you had to buy each day's ticket separately. Oh and no more park hoppers.

Would less people go to the other three parks then (minus the Epcot festival traffic)? Of course.

If they eliminated multi-day discounts, including the annual pass, then I would probably not bother going at all. Since we normally spend at least 3-4 weeks at WDW, buying day tickets would make the trip way too expensive.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

Imagine they priced each ticket separately, no more multi-day discounts.

Let's say $100 a day for MK and $60 a day for the other three parks and you had to buy each day's ticket separately. Oh and no more park hoppers.

Would less people go to the other three parks then (minus the Epcot festival traffic)? Of course.

I might pay $60 for AK if we were already in Orlando. I wouldn't drive 7 hours just for that though.

 

[ArwenMarie]

I might pay $60 for AK if we were already in Orlando. I wouldn't drive 7 hours just for that though.

I would too (I happen to like DAK a lot) but I think a lot of people would think more about it. Ditto for DHS right now. And I guess Epcot too. Heck if they bundled SeaWorld into the multi-day Disney pass attendance would skyrocket.

 

[DoingDisney]

I didn't miss the point, actually. I know that it will be the new most sought after FP+. You're missing the point that the other poster and I were trying ot make.

Your point - that it's adding capacity of rides people want - only works if Maelstrom's capacity was never used. Maelstrom wasn't deserted. It had lines, its capacity was used. I remember waiting in quite a long line for it myself. Frozen's FP+ will be more coveted, yes, but the actual number of riders the attraction takes through in a day is not going to be significantly different than Maelstrom was. There will be some increase, yes, as I did say before (coming from potential more efficient ride system with newer technology, and the ride running at full capacity more often than Maelstrom did). But it isn't going to be an increase in actual # of bodies moved through the ride to the huge extent it's being made out to be.

Yup, that's exactly the problem, people have fleshed this out quite a bit but this really hits it on the head.

The focus has been on squeezing more out of guests and out of existing footprint rides, not on adding more actual capacity. I get the business sense of this, but the quality of experience for the guest, not good.

I don't see why people can't just agree on this, no one who is critical of the investments in FP+ and MM+ denies that Disney is -now-, finally, adding things, adding capacity, the expansions at HS will add some and the Avatar expansion will as well, as will keeping AK open later.

Why can't people just admit that the focus of Disney over the last few years has been increasing the squeeze on guests, squeezing more out of the same offerings, increasing prices etc. Disney itself admits this, they highlight in their quarterly report that their profits are up on increased prices, and on decreased staffing/expenditures.

I just don't get why some people have to try and spin spin spin to make every Disney does magical, instead of just admitting where they have done wrong and where they are doing right.

 

[BroganMc]

I just don't get why some people have to try and spin spin spin to make every Disney does magical, instead of just admitting where they have done wrong and where they are doing right.

Because doing so would be admitting to oneself that the happy magical Disney is just like every other corporation that values profit above all else. Many still want to hold onto the "Walt's dream" sentiment that created Disney (and WDW). If some have a fun time there, then that's enough to believe the place is and always will be run like that mythical Saturday afternoon playground for families Walt imagined. It's difficult to admit that the company is just as adept at marketing and optimizing all laws and business practices to bring in a good report for the stockholders. That's nothing new for the company. Roy Disney was a businessman, after all. While Walt was busy dreaming up adventures for his little mouse, Roy was working out a toy line to sell.

The conflict arises when people debate if Disney Corp. has crossed the line from a well-run family business into a poorly managed corporate monstrosity.

I've loved Disney most of my life. I've vacationed at WDW for 15 years straight. I invested a lot of time, affection and money into the place. Yet I've been very troubled by certain things done in the last 5 years.

That's the rub of being a company with such loyal fans. They are the harshest critics when you appear to stray from your original message.

 

[GrandAdmiralStrife]

One report on read on here made a good point,
- NO where on the site does it says "book your cinderella table ADR for 8 now, cause when you get to to the parks it will almost impossible to get a table"

I had to laugh at that one, because I'd really would love to see the restaurant that can get 8 people seated without a reservation outside of Disney let alone inside of Disney.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I had to laugh at that one, because I'd really would love to see the restaurant that can get 8 people seated without a reservation outside of Disney let alone inside of Disney.

When our extended family us together, we are a party of 9. Believe it or not, we have gone out to family restaurants without having reservations, and didn't wait more than 15 mind for a table

 

[GPC0321]

When our extended family us together, we are a party of 9. Believe it or not, we have gone out to family restaurants without having reservations, and didn't wait more than 15 mind for a table

And I've had to wait for 45-60 minutes for a party of two for lunch at the Cheesecake Factory in the mall on Black Friday.
I think popular mall dining on a major shopping day like that is more comparable to trying to eat at WDW at any time of the year.

 

[rwdavis2]

Because doing so would be admitting to oneself that the happy magical Disney is just like every other corporation that values profit above all else. Many still want to hold onto the "Walt's dream" sentiment that created Disney (and WDW). ....

People have a tough time letting that go. One of Walt's "dreams" was to make money. I would recommend that Disney fans take a look at the (PBS?) documentary on Walt. It's a pretty eye opening and seems fairly even handed. They did not gloss over anything. His treatment of the the striking animators in the late 30's and how bad their pay was shows that Walt was pretty much like most other corporate CEOs at the time. The man was a genius, but human as well.

 

[Laz]

People have a tough time letting that go. One of Walt's "dreams" was to make money. I would recommend that Disney fans take a look at the (PBS?) documentary on Walt. It's a pretty eye opening and seems fairly even handed. They did not gloss over anything. His treatment of the the striking animators in the late 30's and how bad their pay was shows that Walt was pretty much like most other corporate CEOs at the time. The man was a genius, but human as well.

Agreed! Any corporation and its employees want to make money and increase shareholder wealth.; A consumer of vacations spend their money where they get the best value for them. If it is still at a Disney park, great! If not, they should spend their money some where else. If enough people spend their vacation dollars elsewhere, then Disney will change because of a loss of profit and shareholder value.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

People have a tough time letting that go. One of Walt's "dreams" was to make money. I would recommend that Disney fans take a look at the (PBS?) documentary on Walt. It's a pretty eye opening and seems fairly even handed. They did not gloss over anything. His treatment of the the striking animators in the late 30's and how bad their pay was shows that Walt was pretty much like most other corporate CEOs at the time. The man was a genius, but human as well.

I don't think anyone begrudges the company turning a profit. To me it's more of an issue with the lack of reinvestment back into the company that's troubling. Walt put a lot of money into maintenance and development and now a lot of money is being put in reserve to boost stock and conversely the bonuses of those on top.

I know they've announced a lot of new stuff for the future and the drawings look great but I'm going to be cynical until it's actually completed. They've had grand visions from the Imagineers before only to have budgets slashed and we end up with a shell of what was proposed. Of course Japan has greatly benefited from this since their ownership partners really want to reinvest in the parks and they allow the visions to be expanded on.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

I've loved Disney most of my life. I've vacationed at WDW for 15 years straight. I invested a lot of time, affection and money into the place. Yet I've been very troubled by certain things done in the last 5 years.

That's the rub of being a company with such loyal fans. They are the harshest critics when you appear to stray from your original message.

My feeling exactly. They've added so many more resort rooms without the increased capacity on attractions.

Does anyone else remember years ago, going to morning EMH and the MK being almost empty? That was a wonderful benefit to staying on property. Now we avoid the park days with any EMH because they are more crowded than non-EMH days. My park experience has diminished greatly in the last 5 years. I'm not sure how that is my (the customer's) fault.

Yes, the parks are more crowded. Everyone knows that INCLUDING Disney so what are they doing about it? What did they expect to happen?

 

[3DisneyFanz]

My feeling exactly. They've added so many more resort rooms without the increased capacity on attractions.

Does anyone else remember years ago, going to morning EMH and the MK being almost empty? That was a wonderful benefit to staying on property. Now we avoid the park days with any EMH because they are more crowded than non-EMH days. My park experience has diminished greatly in the last 5 years. I'm not sure how that is my (the customer's) fault.

Yes, the parks are more crowded. Everyone knows that INCLUDING Disney so what are they doing about it? What did they expect to happen?

They gave you a rubber bracelet and a recommendation to check out Laugh Floor what more do you want?

They decided they had enough capacity if people would just stop skipping stuff so rather than making those things more interesting they tried to figure out how to push people to those things.

 

[lugnut33]

If you took DHS and plopped it near St. Louis the park would have gone into bankruptcy long ago.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

They gave you a rubber bracelet and a recommendation to check out Laugh Floor what more do you want?

They decided they had enough capacity if people would just stop skipping stuff so rather than making those things more interesting they tried to figure out how to push people to those things.

Yep, that's what they did. The ride redistribution system called FP+. This change has been especially hard because Epcot is my favorite park by far but I'm forced to choose between Soarin' and TT which I never had to do before. I've had to accept less than what I had did before which was Soarin', FP Soarin, TT single rider, FP TT then onto an afternoon of Entertainment at WS. Again, why should that be my (the customer') fault that I now enjoy less than before?

 

[3DisneyFanz]

Yep, that's what they did. The ride redistribution system called FP+. This change has been especially hard because Epcot is my favorite park by far but I'm forced to choose between Soarin' and TT which I never had to do before. I've had to accept less than what I had did before which was Soarin', FP Soarin, TT single rider, FP TT then onto an afternoon of Entertainment at WS. Again, why should that be my (the customer') fault that I now enjoy less than before?

It's your fault that you're not happy with it. Disney is a for profit business after all. Why do you expect them to potentially reduce profit for your expectations. Iger isn't getting a solid gold Cadillac by giving you more for your money.

 

[Angel Ariel]

And I've had to wait for 45-60 minutes for a party of two for lunch at the Cheesecake Factory in the mall on Black Friday.
I think popular mall dining on a major shopping day like that is more comparable to trying to eat at WDW at any time of the year.

The person I was quoting was expressing disbelief that a party of 8 could go to any restaurant outside of Disney without a reservation. The person did not qualify that they were talking about a day like black Friday, which I would equate to check Christmas at wdw, not any day of the year. I merely responded to that with my experience under the conditions the poster provided.