Is a fetus considered a human being

[charlie,nj]

…if so why can’t it be counted as a passenger?

(she is one quick thinking lady)


Judge: Baby on board is no excuse

Pregnant woman claimed she was driving for two

PHOENIX, Arizona (AP) -- Fetuses do not count as passengers when it comes to determining who may drive in the carpool lane, a judge has ruled.

Candace Dickinson was fined $367 for improper use of a carpool lane.

But Dickinson, pregnant when she received the ticket, contended her unborn child qualified to use the lane.

cnn.com story


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[TheOtherVillainess]

OMG...some people will do ANYTHING to get in the HOV lane.

TOV

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I saw that story and liked the judges take on it. Passengers must occupy there own seat. .

So no lap babies in the HOV lane either.

 

[KarenAylwood]

 

[Kimberly815]

 

[Tinkerbell_Girl]

 

[golfgal]

I saw this too and thought "we spent TAX money on this?" This is one of the STUPIDEST things I have heard in a long time!!!

 

[disneymom3]

Well, geez and here I always worry if my kids count for those HOV lanes! There are three of them and they are always in their own seats, but really what else are they gonna do? Drive themselves? I always figure I am not technically saving any #s of cars on the road.

 

[golfgal]

Well, geez and here I always worry if my kids count for those HOV lanes! There are three of them and they are always in their own seats, but really what else are they gonna do? Drive themselves? I always figure I am not technically saving any #s of cars on the road.

Heck, the first time DH and I drove where there was a carpool lane we wouldn't even drive in it because we weren't going to work . Then we thought about it again and wondered how would they know that?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I saw this too and thought "we spent TAX money on this?" This is one of the STUPIDEST things I have heard in a long time!!!

I thought when you contest a ticket and lose--that you pay court fees as part of the fine.

Never been there--so have no idea.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Heck, the first time DH and I drove where there was a carpool lane we wouldn't even drive in it because we weren't going to work . Then we thought about it again and wondered how would they know that?

 

[eclectics]

What if you have multiple personalities? Hey, you could end up with a full car!

 

[bekkiz]

To be fair, and not to start anything, I wondered if she did this as, I don't know, almost a challenge to other laws involving a fetus.

For example, if a 5 month old fetus is enough of a person to count against a murderer as a second victim, I can see why she could make the point it should also count as much as a person for the carpool lane.

Or, if she could prove in a lower court that a five month old fetus (or however far along she was) is not, in fact, an actually human being, then that provides more ammo/precident for people trying to protect a woman's right to choose an abortion.

Anyway, it didn't seem that stupid to me--though, it doesn't mean she thought of it this way, just that there are greater implications...

 

[Charade]

To be fair, and not to start anything, I wondered if she did this as, I don't know, almost a challenge to other laws involving a fetus.

For example, if a 5 month old fetus is enough of a person to count against a murderer as a second victim, I can see why she could make the point it should also count as much as a person for the carpool lane.

Or, if she could prove in a lower court that a five month old fetus (or however far along she was) is not, in fact, an actually human being, then that provides more ammo/precedent for people trying to protect a woman's right to choose an abortion.

Anyway, it didn't seem that stupid to me--though, it doesn't mean she thought of it this way, just that there are greater implications...

I don't think either is the reason. I think she just wanted to use the HOV lane.

But you do bring up a good point. If a law (like in CA/Peterson) says a fetus has protected status AND the HOV law is not specific that multiple seats must be occupied, then she should get a pass and then the HOV law amended for the next time a pregnant Mom gets pulled over for being the only occupant in the HOV lane.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I did not gather that from how they showed the news story. I think she was just contesting a ticket. Happened to be in the HOV and thought she could get away with it kind of thing. The fact the judge said that passengers must occupy a seat to qualify kept him from having to declare the "humanness" of her baby, while at the same time saying "Nice try--but no". He was able to succeed without declaring anything.

JMHO based on the snippet I saw on the news and how she made her statement to the reporter (keeping in mind that it is possible what else she had to say was snipped for television).

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But fetus protected status means that someone cannot harm the baby (outside of her personal right to choose the outcome of her pregnancy at 5 months gestation).

There is no harm to baby by not utilizing the HOV lane.

As the cop said--"will they have to start carrying around pregnancy tests and administering that on-site if the claim is pregnancy".

I'm all for fetal rights--but it's a stretch to say that they should serve as a pass to expedite your travel. It's a "Baby" not a "get out of jail free card"

 

[disneymom3]

Heck, the first time DH and I drove where there was a carpool lane we wouldn't even drive in it because we weren't going to work . Then we thought about it again and wondered how would they know that?

Too funny. I don't think going to work is a requirement.

 

[AMcaptured]

I wonder if this pregnant woman would be charged for two movie tickets if she went to see a show or for two airline seats if she was to fly. I am guessing that she would not be willing to pay double for those things so IMO she should just pay her ticket and shut up....

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But lap children and screaming babies are free .

 

[Charade]

But fetus protected status means that someone cannot harm the baby (outside of her personal right to choose the outcome of her pregnancy at 5 months gestation).

There is no harm to baby by not utilizing the HOV lane.

As the cop said--"will they have to start carrying around pregnancy tests and administering that on-site if the claim is pregnancy".

I'm all for fetal rights--but it's a stretch to say that they should serve as a pass to expedite your travel. It's a "Baby" not a "get out of jail free card"

I disagree with your assessment of the protected status of a fetus. If it's enough of a person to be protected from harm, it should be considered just like another child and laws affecting children equally applied.

But I think the judge was right but I'd have to see the wording of the HOV law to see what it says. If it doesn't say that a 2nd seating area in the vehicle must be occupied by a person, then it should. After that there's no ambiguity.