Injustice at Test Track

[skier_pete]

You did the right thing...you tried to report the guy...the CMs decided to do nothing.

I have to say this is a new one on me. Obviously there are always people that are going to try and "cheat" the system. What's odd is the guy must've *HAD* valid FP, and then swapped them out for the old expired ones...if he was doing this, I would think it meant he was intending to ride over and over. I suppose maybe from his point of view, he's not really "stealing" anything...he is not taking FP slots away from others, only getting his seat on the ride faster.

But i agree with the OP, I hate seeing people that think the rules don't count for them. And sometimes, in the name of "keep the customer happy" Disney condones this behavior. Last year when we were in line first thing in the AM for Toy Story Mania...we had three people cut through the line to "catch up with their party". These were people that had waited in line for a FP while the rest of their party went into the stand-by line, the third person even said the CM had sent them through. I had decided that if one more person came by, I would simply not let them through. Fortunately (or unfortunately) no-one else did this after I made the decision.

I have become very bold in my old (middle) age...if I had been there and thought of it, I might have snatched the bag of FPs out of his hand. What is he going to do, report you to a CM for stealing his bag of illegal FP? That would've gotten him, huh?

On the other hand, why let a few jerks ruin your vacation...I certainly would not let that happen either.

SkierPete

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

...The second thing people should keep in mind is that sometimes it's possible to be WRONG. Check out how many times people comment that someone has been rude to them for going to the left side of the check-out person at a QS when noone was there and several people were waiting on the other side. Someone's ignorance turned into rudeness.

Happened to me at the bag check, where there are lines on both sides of the table. Everyone was lined up on one side of a table and I just walked up to the other side and went through as the next bag checked. A man who was waiting on the other side got very angry. He got even more angry when he saw me stop after passing through the bag check to wait for a few friends. For some reason, the fact that I "cut" in line when I was not in a hurry made my "offense" worse. I cracked up. He was still talking to himself as he walked out of sight.

And then there was the time, many trips ago, when my friend and I got in line for Star Tours, walking past a group of about 7 or 8 people who were standing at the entrance discussing whether or not they wanted to wait in the line. They followed us in, and then several of them started loudly complaining about people who cut in line. It was embarrassing - but rather than argue the point, we asked if they wanted to go ahead of us. They did - the whole big group ahead of the two of us. And then they CONTINUED to complain about us all the way through the line, and how "some selfish people" ruin things for everyone else.

At some point, just let it go...

Similar story here. I was separated from my 9 year old son in MK a few days ago. He was supposed to go into the pre-show area for Philharmagic and see if my wife was inside, then come back out. He didn't come back out, so I became concerned (even though he is very smart and knows WDW very well). At one point, I decided to go into the pre-show area and look for him. I large man decided that I was "cutting" in line and tried to stop me. This man was willing to come to blows over me "cutting" line until the guy behind him told him what I had explained to them as I asked to be allowed through - then he felt like an idiot and let me pass (but no apology). When I found my son, I gathered him and we went to the back of the line. Many people in WDW just assume the worst in others...

 

[Princess Disney Mom]

I've seen a CM find offenders in the Test Track line and take away the forged passes. Another CM must have alerted them. They did get to ride so probably Disney does not make more of a scene then they have to.

I stay away from these people because if they are so ruthless to use fake /old passes they will think nothing to hit you or whatever if you say some comment to them in line. I leave this up to Disney.

 

[KellyNY]

I wonder if he let them in simply b/c he thought that the first CM had granted permission by looking at their tickets. It was for a different year, but I've seen CMs allow people in with fastpasses that were obviously from a different trip.

CMs willingly letting people use old FP, that is new, so what we should all take our old FP and take a chance, weird, plain weird.

The only time I was able to use my FP before time was at Universal, you have a choise of 2 or 3 time frames for FP(or at least it was couple of years ago), so I got a later time for Terminator and it hit me we will have to leave to our bus before that time, so I went to CMs next to FP machine and entrance and asked if I can exchange those FP for earlier time(it was available) due to our bus schedule. They kindly just let us in without any FP at all. It was exception and I never saw anything like that again, well I never tried it again anyway.

 

[Withacy]

: I have become very bold in my old (middle) age...if I had been there and thought of it, I might have snatched the bag of FPs out of his hand. What is he going to do, report you to a CM for stealing his bag of illegal FP?
SkierPete

Or punched you in the face? Started a physical fight with you? Was keeping someone from using illegal fastpasses worth all those children in that line seeing two men beating on each other...and who knows what to the people who couldn't get out of the way fast enough?

There are unstable people out there, and someone with no sense of civil boundaries (and basic right & wrong) would be a likely candidate. I just read about 2 people getting killed over a parking space.

People who deal with the public have to be trained how to deal with them. At a certain point you have to call security (away from whatever else they're dealing with) or let it go. I'm sure Disney has rules for that. A rider gets in the wrong car & refuses to move. Do you hold up the entire line for 10-20 minutes (provoking who knows how many other people) while you argue with them or call security? Do you try to physically remove them - but only if they're smaller than you (and risk a law suit for touching someone in any way?)

Yes, they're a jerk. Karma, God, the universe - whatever you believe in - will hopefully pay them back for it some day. But at some point you're just upsetting yourself and whoever's with you, and you need to let it go.

 

[DaParkers]

Ohh. Why can't ppl mind there own business?!? I thought tattle tales stayed in elementary school. I can't imagine something like this getting me that upset!

Exactly! Mind your own business! That's how people get into fights and different things like that. If you want to enforce WDW's rules, then join their security team. I could understand if he was putting someone in danger or committing a crime, but he wasn't. LET IT GO! I'm sure the OP doesn't follow every rule. Have they ever gone over the speed limit or done anything that was against the rules? YES! That is not how you handle it. If you must tell, then pull a CM to the side and tell exactly what you saw and that it is not fair to the rest of the guests.
There is a lot of hypocrisy in this thread. I don't know any of you, but would bet my life that MOST(if not all) of you break some sort of rule in your everyday lives. There's just not someone there to tell on you.

 

[DaParkers]

Or punched you in the face? Started a physical fight with you? Was keeping someone from using illegal fastpasses worth all those children in that line seeing two men beating on each other...and who knows what to the people who couldn't get out of the way fast enough?

There are unstable people out there, and someone with no sense of civil boundaries (and basic right & wrong) would be a likely candidate. I just read about 2 people getting killed over a parking space.

People who deal with the public have to be trained how to deal with them. At a certain point you have to call security (away from whatever else they're dealing with) or let it go. I'm sure Disney has rules for that. A rider gets in the wrong car & refuses to move. Do you hold up the entire line for 10-20 minutes (provoking who knows how many other people) while you argue with them or call security? Do you try to physically remove them - but only if they're smaller than you (and risk a law suit for touching someone in any way?)

Yes, they're a jerk. Karma, God, the universe - whatever you believe in - will hopefully pay them back for it some day. But at some point you're just upsetting yourself and whoever's with you, and you need to let it go.

Excellent Post!

 

[mickeyluv'r]

I dunno. I've seen lots of folks do similar things at WDW over my trips. I don't think I'd let it get to me so much. I suppose we all have our pet peeves. Perhaps some things that bother me wouldn't phase you.

This guy did have valid fastpasses. The fact that he switched them out probably gave him a little kick, but likely he ended up sticking them in his baggie and not using them. Even if the CM had said something - he could easily just have said, "Oops," and produced valid fastpasses. There's no way Disney is going to hassle anybody beyond that.

The end result is not likely to be any real change for him, but more inconvenience for all the rest of us. Think about it.

ALL of us honest folks will essentially be punished, over one guy that can't be punished.

I also don't really begrudge the guy for walking past the outer CM when there were folks whose fastpasses weren't up - who were clearly blocking the way. Some of those folks take FOREVER to get it that they are BLOCKING everyone's path. I'm pretty good about waiting for them to clear - but many times I've been very tempted to cut past them and just flash my pass for the cm. I generally figure the line ahead is going to be the same either way. As others have said, WDW is full of folks who block pathways for no good reason, have you never walked past any cluless path blockers who happened to be consulting their park map while standing in front of an entrance to a ride, eatery, etc? WDW is full of them.

 

[KellyNY]

Exactly! Mind your own business! That's how people get into fights and different things like that. If you want to enforce WDW's rules, then join their security team. I could understand if he was putting someone in danger or committing a crime, but he wasn't. LET IT GO! I'm sure the OP doesn't follow every rule. Have they ever gone over the speed limit or done anything that was against the rules? YES! That is not how you handle it. If you must tell, then pull a CM to the side and tell exactly what you saw and that it is not fair to the rest of the guests.
There is a lot of hypocrisy in this thread. I don't know any of you, but would bet my life that MOST(if not all) of you break some sort of rule in your everyday lives. There's just not someone there to tell on you.

I disagree with your post. There is a difference between speeding (i'm sure all of us went 10m/h more then they should at least once in a life time) and carefully plotted plan. This man brought his old FP, then showed one set to get in and another to be thrown away, isn't a plan, it is not even cutting in line, it is planned in advance. How can it be possible compared. OP did well to let them know about new cheating scheme and you do not need to be a security to report some wrong actions.
Mind your own business? OK, lets all print our FT home and cheat the system or even better lets print $100 bills and hope everyone will mind their own business.

 

[Withacy]

I disagree with your post. There is a difference between speeding (i'm sure all of us went 10m/h more then they should at least once in a life time) and carefully plotted plan. This man brought his old FP, then showed one set to get in and another to be thrown away, isn't a plan, it is not even cutting in line, it is planned in advance. How can it be possible compared. OP did well to let them know about new cheating scheme and you do not need to be a security to report some wrong actions.
Mind your own business? OK, lets all print our FT home and cheat the system or even better lets print $100 bills and hope everyone will mind their own business.

Well, first off, I work in downtown Atlanta & live in the suburbs. Trust me, I plan on speeding tomorrow morning on the highway. As long as I don't do it in the carpool lane. and keep it within 20 or 30 miles of the speedlimit & don't weave in and out of traffic, the cops don't generally have a problem with it. (And I'm not joking - as people from Atlanta can tell you.)

Seriously, the difference between speeding and cheating with a fastpass is MUCH SMALLER than between cheating with a FP and counterfitting MONEY. Are you kidding me? Actually, the speeding and the counterfitting are, you know, ILLEGAL. I doubt the FP counterfitting is more than a violation of copywrite (a civil case at most).

I would seriously advise you to let it go - or quietly tell a CM, then LET IT GO. I can't speak for your loved ones, but personally, being in line with someone (or near someone) throwing a fit over something like that would piss me off (and HAS pissed me off) far more than the original transgression. I can't tell you how many times I've wanted to tell someone in line who is complaining (about some who cut, about a wait time, about the waitress, about their child's behavior - whatever) to just SHUT UP! I'm sorry you're rightfully indignit - but can you be indignit to yourself? (And I'm not referring to here - this is the appropriate place, and if I don't like it, I can go to another page or thread - I'm talking about people in line).

 

[DaParkers]

I disagree with your post. There is a difference between speeding (i'm sure all of us went 10m/h more then they should at least once in a life time) and carefully plotted plan. This man brought his old FP, then showed one set to get in and another to be thrown away, isn't a plan, it is not even cutting in line, it is planned in advance. How can it be possible compared. OP did well to let them know about new cheating scheme and you do not need to be a security to report some wrong actions.
Mind your own business? OK, lets all print our FT home and cheat the system or even better lets print $100 bills and hope everyone will mind their own business.

You're right! They are different. One is dangerous and can contribute to someone's death and the other isn't. Just like a previous poster said, he DID HAVE VALID FP's. So, even if he is called back, he still would've been able to board the ride at that time. HE WAS WRONG! I agree with that, just not the outrage behind it. The OP became upset enough to go home and still be upset while the man just went on with his vacation. We have to stop letting SOME idiots control our emotions. Why give him that much power?

 

[KellyNY]

Well, first off, I work in downtown Atlanta & live in the suburbs. Trust me, I plan on speeding tomorrow morning on the highway. As long as I don't do it in the carpool lane. and keep it within 20 or 30 miles of the speedlimit & don't weave in and out of traffic, the cops don't generally have a problem with it. (And I'm not joking - as people from Atlanta can tell you.)

What can I say, Atlanta probably does not need money if cops close their eyes on that. Here in NY we have hidden cops on highways and radars as well as cameras. There are areas where left turn is not allowed and there is a sign but since that rule in that areas is so weird people simply do not pay attention to sign and there are several cop cars them cutting them right away and giving tickets with points non less. I was cought once and now I know and every time I drive there those cops are waiting for new victims. Our city does need money I guess.

 

[soupy11]

Originally Posted by babyfacebabe86 View Post
Ohh. Why can't ppl mind there own business?!? I thought tattle tales stayed in elementary school. I can't imagine something like this getting me that upset!

??????? Really are you serious...Cheating is cheating, plain and simple. Maybe that's just the police officer coming out in me.

It is that attitude that makes me shake my head. No wonder bullying is so rampant. Teach our kids that tattling is a greater sin then the offense.

 

[marciemi]

You're right! They are different. One is dangerous and can contribute to someone's death and the other isn't. Just like a previous poster said, he DID HAVE VALID FP's.

Yes, he had valid FP's - THAT HE WASN'T USING! To me that's comparable to going to an event (concert, show, whatever) that's general admission and going in with your tickets. Then heading back out (telling them you're using the restroom or whatever) and handing them to someone else to use! Many events around here (especially at the high school level) have tickets that cost $5 or so and they don't collect them - you just show them when you walk in. Hey, next time I can save $10 for my family to go and only buy 2 tickets instead of 4! And if someone doesn't get in then (because they only sell a certain number of tickets) - that's not my problem! Just like this guy is making others wait longer, but that's okay, especially if people with your philosophy allow him to or say "it's no big deal". Where do you draw the line?

Would it ruin my vacation? No. Would I make a big deal about it? Probably not even as much as the OP did (although I respect them for it). Does it bother me far more to read this thread and see the number of people condoning the behavior (tattling? ) - Yep, you betcha!

 

[Withacy]

What can I say, Atlanta probably does not need money if cops close their eyes on that. Here in NY we have hidden cops on highways and radars as well as cameras. There are areas where left turn is not allowed and there is a sign but since that rule in that areas is so weird people simply do not pay attention to sign and there are several cop cars them cutting them right away and giving tickets with points non less. I was cought once and now I know and every time I drive there those cops are waiting for new victims. Our city does need money I guess.

There is a big difference here. Not to get too off topic. In a neighborhood, especially near a school, you better believe they'll pull you over! In a heart beat. And they DO need the money.

But Atlanta highways are unbelievable at rush hour. Even the presence of a cop on the road can slow down traffic to the point of creating a traffic back up for miles - so unless they're needed for an accident, they stay off (though near by) the highway all together during rush hour! They actually have special safty vehicles who just do tickets for the car pool lane (and only that) to try to stop people from slowing down. (Why do people feel they need to go 45 when they see a police car?) The most important thing is to keep traffic moving! (Unless someone is being reckless.)

But to draw it back to Disney - you have to pick your battles. Disney wants to keep people moving, and keep people from being held up or upset as much as possible. From a cost-benefit perspective, despite how upset YOU many be, having security called to wrestle someone with expired fastpasses to the ground and kicked out of the park is possibly a waste of resources and unneeded overkill.

 

[metime]

I just want to point out that the " Do unto others" philosophy is : "do unto others as you would have done unto you"

Not: "do unto others as they have done unto you"

I believe what goes around comes around and personaly I am quick to anger as well but it serves no purpose to walk around miffed at someone who probably couldn't care less.

While there are a lot of people out there who absolutely make my blood boil (I think they are breeding to annoy me even more) I wouldn't bother wasting my energy being angry or throwing dirty looks at them or I would just be miserable all day. WDW is the mecca of bad parenting, rudeness, discontent, and very bratty children but I put on my blinders as much as I possibly can so that I may enjoy myself.

I just think to myself that I am very glad that I am not one of "those" people and move on. I truely believe, even though I might not be the catalist or even a witness, that they will get what is coming to them one way or another.

If I walk around annoyed for too long all I seem to notice is the nastiness and that is not how I want my trip to go down.

Good thing it was your last day so it didn't color your whole vacation. I try not to let the actions of a dumb*** determine how I feel. It isn;t always possible but really the best revenge is that they have to walk around being themselves all the time.

 

[KellyNY]

You're right! They are different. One is dangerous and can contribute to someone's death and the other isn't. Just like a previous poster said, he DID HAVE VALID FP's. So, even if he is called back, he still would've been able to board the ride at that time. HE WAS WRONG! I agree with that, just not the outrage behind it. The OP became upset enough to go home and still be upset while the man just went on with his vacation. We have to stop letting SOME idiots control our emotions. Why give him that much power?

I compared it only in a way someone decides to do it, speeding is a crime on a spot, which all of us did before even so yes it is dangerous, it is common, OP story is a plot, planned before, and even so executing this plan was not dangerous to others it was clearly something most people will not do. That is the difference between two. My point was not to compare everyday mistakes we all do with schemes, some people use.
Yes it is better to let it go and not to let anyone ruin your vacation, but I am glad OP shared the story, made me think how low some people are if instead of doing their touring plans they spend time ploting the schemes, printing and forging FP and so on, just amazing.

 

[Rip]

As far as using old fastpasses, its wrong I agree. I do think that sometimes well meaning people buy them not knowing they are not allowed. (Might not be the case here though). On your other point, when I pictured the situation in my mind, as this has happened many times, he might have thought that you were with the group in front of you and that you guys were waiting for you fp window to open. Just throwing out another point of view.

In which case he was probably thinking how rude it is to block the FP lane when you don't have valid passes.

It's funny, but if not for him going around people blocking the lane the OP would probably not have ever paid him any mind.

While I do agree with the issue of the expired passes, I can't count the number of times I've politely gone through/around a group of people standing in front of the FP lane waiting for their time to open and blocking everyone else from going in.

 

[KellyNY]

There is a big difference here. Not to get too off topic. In a neighborhood, especially near a school, you better believe they'll pull you over! In a heart beat. And they DO need the money.

But Atlanta highways are unbelievable at rush hour. Even the presence of a cop on the road can slow down traffic to the point of creating a traffic back up for miles - so unless they're needed for an accident, they stay off (though near by) the highway all together during rush hour! They actually have special safty vehicles who just do tickets for the car pool lane (and only that) to try to stop people from slowing down. (Why do people feel they need to go 45 when they see a police car?) The most important thing is to keep traffic moving! (Unless someone is being reckless.)

But to draw it back to Disney - you have to pick your battles. Disney wants to keep people moving, and keep people from being held up or upset as much as possible. From a cost-benefit perspective, despite how upset YOU many be, having security called to wrestle someone with expired fastpasses to the ground and kicked out of the park is possibly a waste of resources and unneeded overkill.

WOW it is fun to drive in Atlanta. Here they do not care about slowing highways, I saw them hiding behing a regular cars and following someone whose speed was higher then allowed, maybe this is why we have so much traffic on highways
Back to Disney, you are right, getting upset is something I try to avoid on vacations but letting them know about new trend can be useful for their training programs and so. Personally I would not get into that, but again I try to keep my mood up, but I totally respect OP view and search for the truth.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

of doing their touring plans they spend time ploting the schemes, printing and forging FP and so on, just amazing.

I'm not op, but I didn't read that this guy actually forged his fp's. I read it more likely that this guy simply saved them from prior trips. If he was actually forging fp's - why wouldn't he print one with the current date?

So that right there puts a serious limit on this guy's ability to do what he's doing. You can only collect so many fastpasses in a day, and you are only likely to ride Test Track so may times ina given day. Even witha fastpass, it still takes a fair amount of time to get through the attraction.

Not exonerating his activity - just putting it in perspective. It's a very limited operation. Every time he uses an old fastpass, that's one less old fastpass in his collection. He's only got so many. I mean in all our trips, we have had leftover fastpasses sure, but really, not that many. He can only collect so many - and when he's collecting them - he missing an opportunity to use them when they are valid - thereby making the fastpass line shorter.

What I'm saying is that if you look at the big picture- it sort of evens out. It's not at all like reusing a theater ticket, or speeding on a highway. It's more like reusing a 'wait-in-line' number at the local bakery/deli - assuming the bakery guy collects your ticket each time. He'd have drive all the way to the bakery to get a ticket in the first place, and then not use it. As long as all the other patrons arrive before the bakery closes - they will still get served. Meanwhile this guy wasted all his gas multiple times to collect his tickets that may or may not work. His system of cheating is of VERY limited value. And even the bakery analogy is not equal - the bakery may run out of raisin bread. The only thing that MAY happen at TT, is that it MIGHT happen to breakdown just as this guy is exiting the ride.