I'm curious - percentage of students with IEP/504/etc

[Magic Mom]

Didn't I say it was no one's fault??? If anyone I would blame those who continue to cut school bugets to the point that we cannot do what we need to do for our kids.

You are unfairly getting a beating on this thread and you have handled yourself very maturely. Good for you for not attacking back.

 

[ReneeA]

If you don't mind me asking, how much time do they get in school where you are for speech therapy. Here they don't get nearly enough time and the speech therapists are split between schools. The little bit of time they get with the therapist seems like a drop in the bucket for what they really need.

He gets 1/2 hour twice a week. It was not enough at first, and I was having to do tons of work on our own at home (his original therapist was great at training me). Now he's almost 10, and he still needs work with multisylabbic words, recall, and facial movements (sticking out the tongue, wiggling eyebrows, etc). He's far enough along now that you'd never know that he has trouble with speaking...in fact, drives me crazy with the talking at times.

 

[princessmom29]

Well obviously you are not stupid, you are a teacher. I never called you stupid. I said I think you need to learn better time management skills, because this is what is involved with teaching. You will never have a perfect class of all average children. You will have the upper few, lower few, some in the middle and some with IEPs. My worry for you is that if it is overwhelming for you to teach ALL these students with their varying levels of abilities, maybe YOU need to be having a talk with your administrator. Or talk to some teachers who have been working with SpedEd longer and find out how they do it. See what everyone needs to understand is that the IEP shouldn't interfere with the educational process of the class and if it is, then there is a break down in the way the accommodations are being administered. That could be with the teacher, or with the admin., but should be addressed if you are seeing a disruption to the learning of the other students.
I also want to stress that the IEP/504 probably isn't the problem here, but an overall problem with either policy in the school, or a teachers inability to effectively integrate. Please do not read this as me saying "YOUR" fault, I'm saying it in a broad manner.

Agian, I am not stupid. I did actually go to college andtake education classes. I don't need to be told "this is teaching". I get that there will always be different kids with different needs. I don't see where said there wouldn't be. Of course there are. The problem comes in when I am asked to deal with more students than I should, and to do things that sohuld be supported by an aide. It isn't time managment, it isn't I can't deal with SPD, because I do know what I am doing. It is the fact that ther should be an aide helping with some of this, and it just isn't happening becuase the money isn't there. There is nothing my admisitration can do about that. We simply don't have enough resources to do what is required by the IEP's so it falls to the classroom teacher to pick up the slack. This is the relaity in all but the most affulent school systems in much of te country. Teachers are spread too thin and asked to do too much. There are schools in my system with 50 kids in a classroom and one teacher, no aide. I don't se how time managment could possibly fix that. No teacher can manage her time that well.

 

[princessmom29]

You are unfairly getting a beating on this thread and you have handled yourself very maturely. Good for you for not attacking back.

thanks!

 

[Magic Mom]

He gets 1/2 hour twice a week. It was not enough at first, and I was having to do tons of work on our own at home (his original therapist was great at training me). Now he's almost 10, and he still needs work with multisylabbic words, recall, and facial movements (sticking out the tongue, wiggling eyebrows, etc). He's far enough along now that you'd never know that he has trouble with speaking...in fact, drives me crazy with the talking at times.

Is that one-on-one time or with a group? I'm sorry I'm being nosey.LOL I am applying to grad school this year to get my speech pathology degree and it's interesting to hear how they run things in different districts.

 

[DizBelle]

What about Advanced kids? Aren't they also a drain on the teacher? The teacher needs special, advanced courses for them, needs time to make their tests, needs time to talk with their parents, needs to cater to what they need.

But this isn't considered a problem??? Only the kids who need extra help because they are behind are a problem, not the ones who need extras because they are ahead???

Yes, they are also a drain on the teacher. Who said they weren't?

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

I hardly think attacking someone trying to do their job plus is helpful. One teacher should not be trying to address the needs of all those kids. Any class that has students needing extra help needs two teachers. For them to foist it all upon one teacher is ridiculous.

People who have this kind of arrangement need to speak up and start harassing their school board and call in the state. Children are entitled to an "Appropriate Education". It's mandated, across the board, across the country. Someone is getting away with murder there.

 

[princessmom29]

Yes, they are also a drain on the teacher. Who said they weren't?

yes they are, and ours are actually housed under the special education umbrella, although they rarely actually get any services unless a parent really pushes for them. The mentality is that they are already ahead of the pack, so they don't need extra anything. Sad

 

[ReneeA]

Is that one-on-one time or with a group? I'm sorry I'm being nosey.LOL I am applying to grad school this year to get my speech pathology degree and it's interesting to hear how they run things in different districts.

Hmmm...I think that k-3rd was individual and last year was mostly group work. There were normally 2-5 boys in the group, total...all boys from 4th and 5th grades.

You're making me fire up some brain cells this afternoon.

 

[DizBelle]

So what is your solution? Kids that need IEP's should not be sent to school at all so the resources can be focused only on kids that meet a certain standard?

That's extreme. No one suggested that. But, perhaps, some (SOME, not ALL) of the resources going to the few could be redirected to the many so that EVERYONE benefits.

Again, if 10 students get 100% of what they need and the other 15 only get 50%, that is a significant inbalance. Maybe resources could be re-distributed so that everyone gets 90% of what they need instead. That seems much more fair and beneficial to everyone.

 

[Magic Mom]

I hardly think attacking someone trying to do their job plus is helpful. One teacher should not be trying to address the needs of all those kids. Any class that has students needing extra help needs two teachers. For them to foist it all upon one teacher is ridiculous.

People who have this kind of arrangement need to speak up and start harassing their school board and call in the state. Children are entitled to an "Appropriate Education". It's mandated, across the board, across the country. Someone is getting away with murder there.

Districts and principals don't look kindly on teachers who speak out. So that leaves the parents to speak out, but if the IEP families are getting their needs met, why would they speak out...and if the non-iep families speak out they are told IEP issues aren't their business and treated like monsters for even mentioning it.

 

[DizBelle]

My son needed speech therapy, and we couldn't get it until I got an IEP in place for him. That's all he needs - 1 hour of speech per week. He's not a drain on resources, he's not a distraction in the classroom, he's no more work than anyone else's little snowflake.

He was diagnosed with apraxia at 20 months (never made any sound at all up to that point - no crying, grunting, nothing.). We put him in an intensive speech therapy at 22 months, a special preschool at 3, and he finally made noise at just-shy of 4. Lots of time spent and lots and lots of $$$ spent out of my pocket. The program I had him in was fantastic, but the hours are M-Th 9-3. He's in school at that time, and I'm not willing to pull him out a couple hours a week in order to get him the therapy that he NEEDS (besides the school probably being against him missing that much).

He's a good kid, and I know for a fact that there are other kids in his school that have IEPs that aren't a drain on the teacher as well.

Certainly, there are some IEPs that are easy to deal with and not much of a drain at all. There are also some that are a significant drain. Multiply that by the number of students in the class that have that kind of accomodation and it will significantly impact the teacher and the class as a whole. Then, who loses? EVERYONE does.

 

[princessmom29]

I hardly think attacking someone trying to do their job plus is helpful. One teacher should not be trying to address the needs of all those kids. Any class that has students needing extra help needs two teachers. For them to foist it all upon one teacher is ridiculous.

People who have this kind of arrangement need to speak up and start harassing their school board and call in the state. Children are entitled to an "Appropriate Education". It's mandated, across the board, across the country. Someone is getting away with murder there.

Sadly, the problem is that many simply don't value education and are not willing to vote to fund it. Every year, education bugets in many states take the brunt of buget cuts made. We are sacrificing our children's future by doing so. Combine that with the fact that there are insane restrictions on the use of much of the money school systems get from the feds, and you start to get the full picture.

 

[princessmom29]

Districts and principals don't look kindly on teachers who speak out. So that leaves the parents to speak out, but if the IEP families are getting their needs met, why would they speak out...and if the non-iep families speak out they are told IEP issues aren't their business and treated like monsters for even mentioning it.

this is a factor as well. I speak up and I convinently find myself teaching in the worst school in the district or suddenly my evals are bad. If a another parent speaks out, they are jealous or crazy.

 

[DizBelle]

Sadly, the problem is that many simply don't value education and are not willing to vote to fund it. Every year, education bugets in many states take the brunt of buget cuts made. We are sacrificing our children's future by doing so. Combine that with the fact that there are insane restrictions on the use of much of the money school systems get from the feds, and you start to get the full picture.

Unfortunately, I think the bigger problem is how they spend the money they do get rather than the amount of money they get. I would hazard to guess that people (taxpayers) would be less likely to vote to give more money until they feel that the money they arleady give is spent responsibly.

School districts don't need to be spending $1.5 million on a new press box for the football field when they are cutting teachers or unable to buy textbooks.

 

[ReneeA]

Certainly, there are some IEPs that are easy to deal with and not much of a drain at all. There are also some that are a significant drain. Multiply that by the number of students in the class that have that kind of accomodation and it will significantly impact the teacher and the class as a whole. The, who loses? EVERYONE does.

So, what's your thoughts towards a solution? I can guarantee that every child that needs services is not getting them, I can guarantee that every child that gets services is not getting 100% of their needs met, and I can certainly guarantee that every middle of the road child is only getting 50% of their needs met. If you talk to most parents, most believe that their children are getting what they need from their school...at least all of the people I've talked to in our district. My DH is the cubmaster for our school, so I have the pleasure of having LOTS of discussions re. the school and it's performance.

I have one child with an IEP (and he's certainly a low-needs child when you look at the SPED range) and one middle to upper performing child. I don't feel as if my "normal" child is getting the shaft at all. From what I've seen in the schools is that due to budget cuts, our teachers are under much more stress than they ever have been, partially due to demands by the SPED programs, but mostly due to budget restraints that ups the size of their classroom and cuts the amount of resources available to them.

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Districts and principals don't look kindly on teachers who speak out. So that leaves the parents to speak out, but if the IEP families are getting their needs met, why would they speak out...and if the non-iep families speak out they are told IEP issues aren't their business and treated like monsters for even mentioning it.

In that type of setting, I would hazard to guess that NONE of the children are getting their needs met.

 

[kissesbykim]

I hardly think attacking someone trying to do their job plus is helpful. One teacher should not be trying to address the needs of all those kids. Any class that has students needing extra help needs two teachers. For them to foist it all upon one teacher is ridiculous.

People who have this kind of arrangement need to speak up and start harassing their school board and call in the state. Children are entitled to an "Appropriate Education". It's mandated, across the board, across the country. Someone is getting away with murder there.

 

[SaraJayne]

I hardly think attacking someone trying to do their job plus is helpful. One teacher should not be trying to address the needs of all those kids. Any class that has students needing extra help needs two teachers. For them to foist it all upon one teacher is ridiculous.

People who have this kind of arrangement need to speak up and start harassing their school board and call in the state. Children are entitled to an "Appropriate Education". It's mandated, across the board, across the country. Someone is getting away with murder there.

The "states" don't have any money to hire more teachers/aides, etc. There is no more money for textbooks and other resources that enrich learning. Thank to our governor, our education system has been gutted.

So what happens now?

 

[Magic Mom]

Hmmm...I think that k-3rd was individual and last year was mostly group work. There were normally 2-5 boys in the group, total...all boys from 4th and 5th grades.

You're making me fire up some brain cells this afternoon.

Sorry. That's pretty much how it's done here as well.