I was not allowed to use rocking chairs at Baby Care Center

[Indiana Rose Lee]

Breast is best = fact?

My bottle fed 4 year old has never been sick ~ `can read, do math, is artistic, started talking at 5 months old... etc, etc, etc.

What was she deprived of by eating formula?

You need to let go of your defensiveness about this subject. Breast milk is best for babies because there is no way to duplicate it, fully. Can someone thrive without that, of course. Most people from my generation were bottle fed. your child has thrived. Good for her. You don't have anything you need to prove.

 

[okeydokey]

makes no sense, you can breastfeed on a bench in WDW but not bottle feed in private? ridiculous. If they are going to enforce no bottle feeding moms in there...then they need to restrict the bf to there only.

That would be illegal.

 

[badblackpug]

NO ONE would have been hurt. But the reason she was denied access to the NURSING mothers room is that she DOES NOT HAVE A NEED for a private space, because she is not doing something that requires removing a breast to feed her baby. If Disney let all moms who use bottles use the NURSING mothers room, there would be no guaranteed PRIVATE space for NURSING mothers, who, like it or not, may require PRIVACY due to the fact that they use their breasts to feed their babies. This is not the big discriminatory issue that people are making it out to be. If bottle-feeding moms want a quiet room with rocking chairs, CONTACT DISNEY, but don't try to take it away from the moms who truly need it or make it sound like nursing moms are being favored here. Meeting a need does not equal favoritism.

I get that there can be discrimination about bottle-feeding, but honestly, can you find half as many threads here on the DIS about people who had their meals ruined by a mom taking out a bottle and feeding her child? Or about how some little snowflake had their day ruined because they witnessed a mom feeding her baby with a bottle? Or how someone's husband witnessed the shocking, appalling, and vulgar act of someone feeding a baby with a bottle? Give me a break. It's one little area where a nursing mom can sit and NOT have to worry that her "vulgar" act is offending someone. And if that space is filled with bottle-feeding moms, the nursing moms will have nowhere private to go.

The OP was not denied use of the babycare facility. It's open to her. She was denied use of an area within that facility because it is designated for nursing moms and she wasn't going in there to nurse.

I agree that it's hard to hear "breast is best" on those commercials when you aren't nursing your child. My son weaned very early and I remember hearing the commercials. What I don't agree with is the idea that hearing "breast is best" is a form of abuse. It's just a statement on a commercial. Unless she's being verbally attacked for her choices, the abuse a woman feels from that statement comes from within.

I also don't agree that any woman on this thread has had to explain why she bottle feeds. The women who explained made the decision to explain, nobody needed to know why and nobody asked. I could have explained why my DS weaned so early but doing so would have felt "defensive" to me and I don't have anything I need to defend. Neither do they.

I was pointing out that there are options for pumping and space, here again, is limited to that one thing. It is not my fault if your sensitivities colored your reading of my post.

I guess I am not sensitive because I have no issue with women breast feeding in public. I am sure some women want some privacy, the Op, too, felt she needed a quiet, private space. For whatever reasons her child needs that type of environment to eat, I think that it is a shame that in a "family friendly" environment (sponsored by a formula company, no less!) she was treated like this. I did not mean to say that I thought any "breast is best" commercials were abusive, but there is a segment of breast feeding advocates out there who are very "dedicated" to their cause. I was not speaking of the commercial at all, I was speaking of those people who feel it is okay to question a mother about her choices in feeding her child, and sometimes berate her about those choices, whether it be breast feeding or formula feeding. I have had 2 friends who bottle fed, for different reasons, who had people, sometimes strangers, sometimes friends repeatedly tell them that they were no doing "the best" for their children. One actually had the lactation consultant from the hospital call her repeatedly at home and nag her about not breast feeding.

...and about the last quote, my "sensitivities" did not color my reading of your post, I personally, have never been harassed about bottle feeding. You did not simply offer info about where to pump, you added a snarky comment at the end. As I have explained before, I used the baby center once in I don't know how many trips, and that was only to change a diaper, and that was only because we were in the area of the center. My kids are good feeders and will eat anywhere, so I truly don't care whether the baby centers even exist, I will say again that I think that it is wrong that instead of embracing and supporting one another, mothers continue to judge and exclude.

 

[kidshop]

You need to let go of your defensiveness about this subject. Breast milk is best for babies because there is no way to duplicate it, fully. Can someone thrive without that, of course. Most people from my generation were bottle fed. your child has thrived. Good for her. You don't have anything you need to prove.

Thank you! yes, it is not meant as an insult. I think that is the crux of our whole problem here. Absolutely babies thrive on formula. This is really not the issue, so I hope we can get past that.

Did you do lot of public nursing? I did some, but I could give a flying fig what others think of me so I also never had any negative looks or comments, b/c i didn't look up much.

 

[Colinsmom]

Before the breastfeeding moms start flaming me... as has been my experience in the past... I couldn't breast feed because I was doing chemotherapy and that is passed through breast milk. No one asks ~ they assume you choose not to BF.

Did you actually read the thread? BF'ing moms haven't been flaming bottle-feeding moms in this thread for their decision to bottle feed. However, I have also noticed that many bottle-feeding moms have felt the need to offer an explanation for their choice (no one asked for this info).

I agree that rather than fighting the nursing room, why not write letters asking Disney to set aside a large quiet, dark space with comfy chairs (rocking or otherwise) for families (moms, dads, grandparents) to feed their babies in any way that they choose. But keep a small, private nursing room for nursing moms who want/need that private space. That meets all babies' needs for quiet, dark space while feeding, but also affords a little bit of privacy for nursing moms, who have the unique situation where they must expose a part of their anatomy to feed their baby that may make some people uncomfortable.

People can be very cruel to mothers feeding their babies, for baring a breast or for bearing a bottle. That is never right. Never.

 

[ccgirl]

Obviously, this is a very hot topic. I think that if you explained to the CM why you needed a private space, and there was one available, you should have been let in. However, if a bf mom came in and there were no rockers left, you should let them have yours. This is coming from someone who bf one child and bottle fed another so I don't really care one way or the other.

 

[littlbugmom]

>>If no one is using that rocking chair who cares you sits in it? You don't mind other BF moms seeing you breastfeed but have a problem with someone who isn't? Sure if someone poked in and needed the spot I would have given it up.>>

It's not about a bottle feeding mom seeing you bf at all. Omg, is that what it seems like? That a bfing mom wouldn't want a mom who bottle feeds to see her nursing? It's about having that room available for bfing moms. Bfing in a room with other women is very different than sitting on a bench with hundreds of men, women, teens and children walking by. Walk by me while I was nursing and you would see my nipple and a good portion of my breast. My DD was a little bit discreet but my DS was a chore and wouldn't stand to be covered up.

I would like to say that if the room is available then a mom who bottle feeds should be allowed to use it but eventually the room is going to fill up and then you put a bfing mom in the position of saying "I need that seat so she needs to move" and you put the mom who is bottle feeding in the position of having to get up and move because a bfing mom walked in.

>>While bottle feeding my DD2 (never ran into this with my older DD ~ times are changing I guess) ~ I was treated like a horrible mother by BF moms and pretty much immediately excluded from conversations and literally had one mom turn her back to me when I said I bottle fed. Without even knowing anything about WHY I didn't BF>>

That's horrible. I never experienced anything like that while bottle feeding my DS5.

>>Also if BF is such a normal natural thing that it is okay to do while dining or standing in line or whatever (and yes I would bottle feed my baby in any of those places) WHY do you have more of a need for a nice dark quiet room with rocking chairs more than a bottle feeding mom?>>

Bfing is normal and natural and is ok to do while dining and standing in line and hopefully, some day it will actually be regarded as such by the majority of people. That's not the case right now and Disney is no doubt trying to lessen the number of complaints they receive about women "doing that" in public.

I don't think a bfing mom NEEDS a dark quiet room with rocking chairs, that's just how Disney chose to make that particular room. Maybe they took a survey and that's what they got from responses. They didn't set out to make a room "better" for the nursing moms but if bottle feeding moms want the other room to have rocking chairs and be darker or less noisy then they need to tell Disney that.


>>Everyone wants to be able to do all the same things at bottle feeding moms ~ but also want the special treatment too.>>

That's an unfair assumption and you seem to be basing it on nursing moms on this board wanting to keep the one small area they have to nurse away from the general population who do stare and point and give dirty looks and say negative things.

>>Before the breastfeeding moms start flaming me... as has been my experience in the past... I couldn't breast feed because I was doing chemotherapy and that is passed through breast milk. No one asks ~ they assume you choose not to BF>>

I don't think the reason you bottle fed has anything to do with this discussion. My reason for bottle feeding my DS isn't important in this conversation either. The discussion is about that small room that Disney offers to women who nurse....it's about women who don't nurse wanting to use it and the reasons it should or shouldn't be allowed.


I will say it again, if you don't like the room they offer to moms who bottle feed, take it up with Disney. Ask them to make the room quieter and darker and put rocking chairs in there. I really don't understand why they didn't make the rooms the same in the first place.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

Thank you! yes, it is not meant as an insult. I think that is the crux of our whole problem here. Absolutely babies thrive on formula. This is really not the issue, so I hope we can get past that.

Did you do lot of public nursing? I did some, but I could give a flying fig what others think of me so I also never had any negative looks or comments, b/c i didn't look up much.

When they were wee, yes. once they felt the need to strip me, not so
much! Lol. This doesn't have to be an us against them topic.

 

[NotUrsula]

Breast is best = fact?

My bottle fed 4 year old has never been sick ~ `can read, do math, is artistic, started talking at 5 months old... etc, etc, etc.

What was she deprived of by eating formula?

Sigh. It doesn't work like that. Human milk is nutritionally superior to formula, because it is more calorie-dense, more easily digested, and does not produce as much waste product. Basic biochemistry. However, none of that means that formula is nutritionally insufficient. Formula is perfectly adequate from a nutritional standpoint, but human milk happens to be a premium product for the purpose.

To give you a one basic example: 4 oz. of human milk is nutritionally equivalent to approximately 8 oz. of formula. You need to feed twice as much to get the same caloric benefit and fat content, and a lot more of the components of formula will pass out of the body undigested. (This is the reason for the famous difference in the quantity and odor of the poop.)

Again, folks, the matter at hand is about available quiet space and how Disney chooses to manage the capacity of that space. It is to their PR advantage to encourage nursing mothers to use the space, because even if some idiot is rude enough to make a comment about bottlefeeding to your face, they are NOT going to go and complain to Guest Services about being offended by your doing it in their sight. However, people complain about witnessing NIP every single day. Disney makes a strong effort to minimize guest complaints, and this obviously works for them as a partial solution to THAT business problem.

 

[LuLuO]

Again, folks, the matter at hand is about available quiet space and how Disney chooses to manage the capacity of that space. It is to their PR advantage to encourage nursing mothers to use the space, because even if some idiot is rude enough to make a comment about bottlefeeding to your face, they are NOT going to go and complain to Guest Services about being offended by your doing it in their sight. However, people complain about witnessing NIP every single day. Disney makes a strong effort to minimize guest complaints, and this obviously works for them as a partial solution to THAT business problem.

ITA. Again, if Disney and other places, weren't catching heck for mothers NIP then they wouldn't go through the expense of having nursing stations. ETA: So I don't think it is an issue of Disney looking out for nursing mothers more than bottle feeding mothers. It's not a bottle vs breast issue. It is a business issue.

 

[NemoMOm]

You nailed it. But notice that no one addresses this in the thread despite several attempts to explain this. Instead this has become a bottle fed vs. breast fed thread. Which is a shame because moms should be more supportive each other. Again, if moms that NIP recieved more support we would not need a private room.

Again, folks, the matter at hand is about available quiet space and how Disney chooses to manage the capacity of that space. It is to their PR advantage to encourage nursing mothers to use the space, because even if some idiot is rude enough to make a comment about bottlefeeding to your face, they are NOT going to go and complain to Guest Services about being offended by your doing it in their sight. However, people complain about witnessing NIP every single day. Disney makes a strong effort to minimize guest complaints, and this obviously works for them as a partial solution to THAT business problem.

 

[littlbugmom]

>>I was not speaking of the commercial at all, I was speaking of those people who feel it is okay to question a mother about her choices in feeding her child, and sometimes berate her about those choices, whether it be breast feeding or formula feeding. I have had 2 friends who bottle fed, for different reasons, who had people, sometimes strangers, sometimes friends repeatedly tell them that they were no doing "the best" for their children. One actually had the lactation consultant from the hospital call her repeatedly at home and nag her about not breast feeding>>


I thought you were referring to the commercials because you used the term "breast is best" and that's the only place I've ever heard that term used. I've heard people discussing the subject but I've only heard that phrase on commercials. What you're friends experienced was a "verbal attack", imo. I did say that unless someone is verbally attacking a woman for her choices, it's not abuse.

I can't believe that people say things like that to perfect strangers. I guess I shouldn't be surprised because I've had strangers say mean things to me while bfing. My DD bfed until she was 2yrs old and I got crap from coworkers and family about THAT.

Speaking of coworkers....I also got grief at work from coworkers who thought it unfair that moms who needed to pump could do so in a private room. It's similar to the babycare center situation. They thought it was unfair that pumping moms could take their breaks and lunches in a room that others couldn't use. In this case, it was just a room....no better, just private. In the case of the babycare center, I can see why mom would want the main room to have ammenities that the nursing room has. That's why I think the right thing to do would be to contact Disney and telling them.

 

[LuLuO]

You nailed it. But notice that no one addresses this in the thread despite several attempts to explain this. Instead this has become a bottle fed vs. breast fed thread. Which is a shame because moms should be more supportive each other. Again, if moms that NIP recieved more support we would not need a private room.

This is what I said a few pages back.

It is no one's business but my own how I feed my kids and I'm sure the big wigs at Disney don't care one way or another. They just want to keep as many people content as possible and they think that providing a private nursing area will do this.

 

[designermv]

Speaking of coworkers....I also got grief at work from coworkers who thought it unfair that moms who needed to pump could do so in a private room. It's similar to the babycare center situation. They thought it was unfair that pumping moms could take their breaks and lunches in a room that others couldn't use. In this case, it was just a room....no better, just private. In the case of the babycare center, I can see why mom would want the main room to have ammenities that the nursing room has. That's why I think the right thing to do would be to contact Disney and telling them.

That is just wrong. I'd have those moms come sit and witness the glamour that is having your breasts noisily pulled through a large plastic horn while milk comes out, and see if they still want the pumping moms to do it out in the regular lunch room. I don't even like watching MYSELF pump.

 

[littlbugmom]

That is just wrong. I'd have those moms come sit and witness the glamour that is having your breasts noisily pulled through a large plastic horn while milk comes out, and see if they still want the pumping moms to do it out in the regular lunch room. I don't even like watching MYSELF pump.

They didn't like that pumping was taking over the other break room. At one point I tried using a different room but it housed a copier so, other people didn't like not being able to use it. They wanted the pumping moms to walk over to a different building but it left no time to pump!

And please....you don't NOT want to see me double pumping!

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I have read through this thread with interest. I can see both sides of the issue. To me though it is crystal clear. The nursing room is meant to be a private ladies only room. That is obvious since men can't nurse. If it becomes a "feeding" room then Dad, Grandpa, Uncle Bob, Brother Joe etc. can go in and feed. They cannot stop someone from feeding their child and not every kid is on vacation with just Mommy. Disney can't designate an area like that as only one gender without having a lawsuit. So they designated it nursing only because that automatically cuts out the other half.
If you want a special room for feeding then you need to contact Disney. I do agree that it can be hard to feed a baby in the big room of the BCC at MK and there should be a quiet area as well. I do however understand that a baby latching and unlatching because of distraction could be embarrassing to some if there are other people around where as a baby pulling off their bottle wouldn't have that same issue.
As for breast/bottle- who cares? As long as your kid is being fed I personally don't care what you chose. FTR- I nursed all of my kids and I heard "well meaning" comments from others as well but I didn't really care. Everyone makes their own choices and they are none of my business.

 

[geishagirl81]

Before the breastfeeding moms start flaming me... as has been my experience in the past... I couldn't breast feed because I was doing chemotherapy and that is passed through breast milk. No one asks ~ they assume you choose not to BF.

You don't need to justify it to anyone. EVER. I bottle fed both my babies. i tried with my first and couldn't, and i felt like I had to justify the fact that I couldn't b'feed to everyone. With my second, I knew that my health was at a state where I COULD b'feed. I chose not to though. Bottlefeeding made the best sense to my family. I will NEVER justify me reasons to anyone now. It is what works best for baby and family. With a bottle, daddy could bond with our kisd in a way he never could if I was the only food source. Moms have to stop judging each other. No one is a failure if they don't or can't b'feed. No one is a saint if they do or can. If baby is happy and healthy, it shouldn't matter. And my kids are VERY healthy and very happy.

As I said in previous post, the room should be for moms and babies. Period. No judgement on how baby is being fed. If I am in there with a bottle, i don't care if you are b'feeding. B'feeders should NOT care if I am in there either. Motherhood is hard enough, why do we have to draw lines and judge eachother? (not that I am saying anyone here is doing that, but in society in general)

 

[melancholywings]

While bottle feeding my DD2 (never ran into this with my older DD ~ times are changing I guess) ~ I was treated like a horrible mother by BF moms and pretty much immediately excluded from conversations and literally had one mom turn her back to me when I said I bottle fed. Without even knowing anything about WHY I didn't BF.

This elitism is really bad over in our area. And I think it's why there are so many posts on here from bottle feeders who explain why they chose bottle feeding. Because there are some BFers who are rutheless with the 'breast is best' motto with out showing compassion or understanding for bottle feeders. In one community I visited (as a new mom) there was a woman who declared she wouldn't let her son play with any bottle fed babies because they were 'unclean' and 'unhealthy'. Once you encounter women like that it makes you defensive. My own dear friend had to switch to the bottle and now hates to go shopping with her baby because of these vocally judgmental women she runs into. It's really not that different than wanting a private place to feed with out showing nip to a stranger.

 

[lillygator]

That would be illegal.

I know, I was just trying to show how ridiculous they are being.

 

[NotUrsula]

This elitism is really bad over in our area. And I think it's why there are so many posts on here from bottle feeders who explain why they chose bottle feeding. Because there are some BFers who are rutheless with the 'breast is best' motto with out showing compassion or understanding for bottle feeders. In one community I visited (as a new mom) there was a woman who declared she wouldn't let her son play with any bottle fed babies because they were 'unclean' and 'unhealthy'. Once you encounter women like that it makes you defensive. My own dear friend had to switch to the bottle and now hates to go shopping with her baby because of these vocally judgmental women she runs into. It's really not that different than wanting a private place to feed with out showing nip to a stranger.

Look, I'm sorry you have to deal with "nursing nazis" but loonies like that are NOT normal breastfeeding moms, any more than my SIL who likes to go around exclaiming that she can "smell meat" on people in public places is a normal vegetarian. The large majority of us do use bottles, too; we just don't feed formula in most cases. WDW isn't a playgroup, so how would a total stranger truly know what you had in the bottle?

Rudeness like that deserves a public verbal smackdown; that is the only way that idiots like that will learn to mind their own business.