I need some help in understanding points allocation

[bobrex]

I have an issue with points allocation and I need some input - warning, the following is convoluted and I may not be explaining it well:

Here's the story: Last May I banked my points allocation for the year (new member, burning off developer points, use year of October,...). In August I reserved a split stay (SSR and AKL) studio for 12/19 - 12/26. Then in October I reserved a week at AKL for 9/24/01 - 10/1/01. I was expecting to use my banked points for both of these trips. On 12/18 I called MS and asked if it was possible to reserve a room for that night, starting my stay a day earlier to avoid the possible travel problems related to the predicted 12/19 snow storm (which turned out to be prescient - the storm hit and closed almost every airport in the Northeast.) I came back from the Christmas trip and everything was hunky dory - or so I thought. On Jan 10th I called MS to change my September trip from a 1BR to a studio (thereby reducing the points needed.) No problem doing this, but when I asked MS for a points tally, the cast member told me that I had 71 points left over from the banked pool and 279 (out of 300) left in my current use year. Confused, I asked how I had used current use year points (both trips above would have used less than my banked allocation), and was told that the points locked for my original September reservation meant that the 12/18 reservation dipped into the current use year. I then asked the CM if we could adjust the point allocation to not use current use year points, but rather take from the remaining banked points. I explained that I wanted to use all 300 points for an Adventures trip in 2011. The CM checked and told me that that would be impossible, since the current use year points were already used to cover the 12/18 stay. I then called down to MS and made the same request of my sales rep (Jeff Jarosz). Jeff claims he checked with the "exceptions committee" and they denied the request.

Now I'm just a little cynical; is there such a committee? Or did Jeff just use that as an excuse? Am I wrong in thinking that points are points and that adjusting this, even after points are "exercised" should be allowed?

If I can't get this adjustment I'll lose 71 points (yeah, I know I could rent them, but that's not the point ). Does this make any sense to anybody but my DW and me?

 

[MAO]

I don't know anything about the exceptions committee, but I do think that points are NOT points -- banked points are, and should be, different than current year points. Otherwise, you could end up banking points from 2009 into 2010, making reservations and canceling/changing them, then banking them into 2011, etc., etc.

It sounds like you had everything set up using the banked points and that additional day had to be taken from current year. Then you reduced (by changing from the 1br to studio) the total number of points needed for your upcoming trip and, thus, dropped banked points back into your banked points "bucket." But, yeah, you've already used 21 of your current year points with that December 2009 night so it can't be gotten back.

Maybe you can find someone who will "swap" current year points for banked points? (Though I don't know if you can transfer banked points, so that may not work.)

I guess my answer is, yes, it does make sense and I do understand both your frustration and MS being unable to help you. But I don't think that there's anything that can be done about it. You've already used the current year points. I'd suggest trying to go back to your original 1br reservation, or renting the banked points out and then seeing if you can get those 21 current year points from someone else. If your yearly allocation is 300 points, don't forget that you can't have more than 900 points available for use at one time, so be careful about how many points you want to get from someone else. Good luck.

 

[Sandisw]

I do understand that it might not be possible to re-allocate the banked points for the current UY points that were used for the Dec. 2009 reservation. That trip is done and you can't go backwards.

However, I don't understand why they can't make sure that the entire September reservation is using banked points. It should have been done that way to begin with when you booked.

MS typically will use banked first. Now, if your entire Sept reservation is already booked with banked points, then I do think you may be out of luck.

When I called MS to book a trip, I knew what should be left over in my 2010 UY, after using up the banked points. Once she told me, I quickly (while still on the phone), went to my account online to verify that I indeed had used the banked points first.

Give MS a call and ask to speak to a supervisor and tell them that you expected the Sept 2010 reservation to be done with banked points and that you were told that banked would always be used before current.

Let us know what happens. Good luck!

ETA: I just re-read your post. When you called on 12/18 to book that night, it sounds like you had already used all the banked points for the original December and September reservations. Unless you specifically told MS during this call that you wanted to re-allocate banked points from September to cover 12/18, they would take from current UY points. I think that is what she means by locked into the September reservation. They would not automatically re-allocate if the banked points were already tied up in a reservation.

 

[disneynutz]

MS using the incorrect points has happened to us a couple of times. MS will tell you that it can't happen, but that is not true.

Call MS and ask to speak to a TEAM LEAD. If the Adviser refuses, keep pushing for the TEAM LEAD. They are Senior Advisers who have access to systems and records that the normal Advisers don't.

If you are not successful, contact The Member Satisfaction Team.

Your Guide is blowing smoke, Guides are sales people, not friends of fixers. Don't waste their time or yours calling them with problems after the sale. That's like calling your car salesman two years after you bought a car because your gas peddle sticks.

Bill

 

[dcfromva]

Bobrex,
Could you help with filling in the points used in the time line below?
I am assuming in May 2009 you bought 300 AKV points with an OCT UY and 2008 points were included in the contract:

May 2009-banked 300 2008 OCTUY points into OCT 2009-SEPT 2010.
AUG 2009- booked AKV/SSR 12/19/09-12/26/09 studio stay using XX banked points.
OCT 2009- Booked 9/24/10 - 10/1/10 1BR AKV stay using XX banked points. (Did you book value--at 144 points, std view at 169 points or savanah view at 206 points?)

DEC 18 2009--added 12/18/2009 using XX points.

Jan 10 2010-- changed the 9/24/10 - 10/1/10 AKV booking to studio using XX banked points.

I suspect that all your banked points were already tied up between your two reservations when you added on the additional night so member services would have had no choice but to take the points from the current UY. The point change made on Jan 10th for the Sept reservation would have only released banked points back to you (if you only used banked points to make the reservation originally).

Were there some developer points you used in the Dec ressie? If you could fill in the points that you used to make a reservation it might make it easier to understand.

 

[Dean]

I have an issue with points allocation and I need some input - warning, the following is convoluted and I may not be explaining it well:

Here's the story: Last May I banked my points allocation for the year (new member, burning off developer points, use year of October,...). In August I reserved a split stay (SSR and AKL) studio for 12/19 - 12/26. Then in October I reserved a week at AKL for 9/24/01 - 10/1/01. I was expecting to use my banked points for both of these trips. On 12/18 I called MS and asked if it was possible to reserve a room for that night, starting my stay a day earlier to avoid the possible travel problems related to the predicted 12/19 snow storm (which turned out to be prescient - the storm hit and closed almost every airport in the Northeast.) I came back from the Christmas trip and everything was hunky dory - or so I thought. On Jan 10th I called MS to change my September trip from a 1BR to a studio (thereby reducing the points needed.) No problem doing this, but when I asked MS for a points tally, the cast member told me that I had 71 points left over from the banked pool and 279 (out of 300) left in my current use year. Confused, I asked how I had used current use year points (both trips above would have used less than my banked allocation), and was told that the points locked for my original September reservation meant that the 12/18 reservation dipped into the current use year. I then asked the CM if we could adjust the point allocation to not use current use year points, but rather take from the remaining banked points. I explained that I wanted to use all 300 points for an Adventures trip in 2011. The CM checked and told me that that would be impossible, since the current use year points were already used to cover the 12/18 stay. I then called down to MS and made the same request of my sales rep (Jeff Jarosz). Jeff claims he checked with the "exceptions committee" and they denied the request.

Now I'm just a little cynical; is there such a committee? Or did Jeff just use that as an excuse? Am I wrong in thinking that points are points and that adjusting this, even after points are "exercised" should be allowed?

If I can't get this adjustment I'll lose 71 points (yeah, I know I could rent them, but that's not the point ). Does this make any sense to anybody but my DW and me?

They should have used all applicable banked points for Dec if they were under a single contract. Assuming the banked points were in your account at the time, that your UY is Sept, Oct or Dec, you only have one home resort and 1 Use Year, they should have used the banked points first. I would talk to member satisfaction and make the case they should have used the correct points first and did not. However, if my assumptions are not accurate, it would alter my thoughts significantly. What likely happened is your extra night in December used up current year points because all of the banked points were already tied to a reservation, if this is the case, MS is correct and should not allow you to swap them out. What you could have done at the time was have them swap them around so that the points you used were banked and the points tied up in Sept were current UY points.

 

[dmoore22]

They should have used all applicable banked points for Dec if they were under a single contract. Assuming the banked points were in your account at the time, that your UY is Sept, Oct or Dec, you only have one home resort and 1 Use Year, they should have used the banked points first. I would talk to member satisfaction and make the case they should have used the correct points first and did not. However, if my assumptions are not accurate, it would alter my thoughts significantly. What likely happened is your extra night in December used up current year points because all of the banked points were already tied to a reservation, if this is the case, MS is correct and should not allow you to swap them out. What you could have done at the time was have them swap them around so that the points you used were banked and the points tied up in Sept were current UY points.

I couldn't express it any better. Unfortunately you do have to be vigilant because some of the CMs are not as knowledgeable about the manipulation of banked points in conjunction with current use year as others. We had a similar situation with the manipulation of our banked points in which the CM stated an understanding but, when all was said and done, when we checked our points allocation on the dvcmember website we found we were going to lose banked points. We promptly called member services, spoke with another CM that was obviously more knowledgeable and were able to correct the situation. Good Luck!!!

 

[bobrex]

Thanks everybody for your help. I called MS and spoke to team lead Heather. As I expected, there is nothing they can do. The problem comes from my changing the September reservation from a 1br to a studio. The original 1br reservation did use up the remainder of my banked points, so when I made the 12/18 reservation, MS had no choice but to pull from my current use year. According to Heather, DVC will not go back and re-post / re-credit prior used points.

So I guess this gets chalked up to inexperience and I'll just blame my dw for changing her mind.

 

[Dean]

Thanks everybody for your help. I called MS and spoke to team lead Heather. As I expected, there is nothing they can do. The problem comes from my changing the September reservation from a 1br to a studio. The original 1br reservation did use up the remainder of my banked points, so when I made the 12/18 reservation, MS had no choice but to pull from my current use year. According to Heather, DVC will not go back and re-post / re-credit prior used points.

So I guess this gets chalked up to inexperience and I'll just blame my dw for changing her mind.

That was the answer I expected based on the info you provided. I previously posted the way to avoid this issue going forward.