How money changes people

[Lilo&Stitch]

I don't like to share things on a message board, i'm laid back and pretty care free, but all of a sudden i find myself feeling sick over a family situation.
My oldest brother is well off, im talking his DD was given a BMW for her birthday type well off and his home is worth a cpl million.
Anyway, a few years back he told my parents they should retire and he would help them out with the bills so they could be comfortable, so they did ! well fast forward to this week when he saw my folks will, simply put, he is going to cut them off unless the will states that their home be signed over to him, they also had a few personal things willed to my other brother and myself, which he wants changed too.

I am just sick over this, and honestly it's not about the money or anything, it's the fact that they feel like they have no other options if they want to keep their house ( and yes they paid for the house themselves ) they can't afford to stay there without that extra they get from him monthly, we have offered to let them move in with us and tried tossing other ideas around, but they just love their home, they're healthy and active and don't want or need to leave. I just don't get why he wants to do that to my parents, or to us for that matter, my parents are so upset that he wants my other brother and I cut out of the will and yet they just don't know what to do ?? and the best part !!! my parents are not supposed to tell my brother and I about this revised will, so we have to pretend not to know anything and of course i'm sure you know what I want to say to him

Well, thanks for listening, sometimes it just feels better to type it out

 

[BubMunkeyBles]

I don't see why the house should be signed over now, but I guess if he's paying that much of their expenses I could see giving him the house when they died since he's helping them out so much. My parents would probably do the same if one of us was paying most their bills and the others weren't.

The personal stuff makes no sense to me though. Heirlooms don't really have a monetary value in my opinion. I hope your parents figure something out.

 

[Styx Fan]

I don't know if money really changes a person, or if having it just allows a persons lesser character traits come to the forefront.

Too bad your brother didn't make this a deal with your parents before they retired. It doesn't seem fair to throw it at them now. They should have a choice.

As far as the items of more sentimental value....that's just a jerk on his part.

Could your parents make a new will they he wants, then revise it and just not tell him?

 

[Handbag Lady]

Can they get a reverse mortgage so that they won't need his help any longer?

 

[eliza61]

One of the problems is money + family is a lot of times a deadly combination. For many money equals power, determines worth and in our society it definitely divides.

Often with multi-generational families it's really hard to separate financial issues from emotions. Siblings squabble over who is helping more. Could this be the issue? He may feel that since he is footing a large part of their care he is entitled to the house?
What concerns me most is that he wants this done behind your back. I don't like sneakiness so sorry I would definitely call him on it.
I also don't like threats. as much as I love my house I'd burn the sucker down to the ground before I'd let one of my children dictate to me what to do with my will. So I definitely agree with handbag lady, it's time to get them professional financial advice without your brother. Ask them about the options.

 

[*pixie*dust*]

OP, since they can't affort to stay there, the sensible thing would be for your parents to sell the house. I know they love their home but if they can't afford it they can't afford it. Then they would have the ability to move to a smaller more manageable place and not have to rely on your brother, especially since they are active and healthy. This would eleviate the problem all together.

I can understand your brother's position to a degree(not the personal items but the house)--if he is footing a large part of their retirement, I can see why he might think that that they should leave him the home--especially if you and your brother aren't helping financially.

Your parents should not have shared all of this with you and then want you to not let on that you know. Your parents are making this more difficult and divisive. I don't think this is an issue about money changing people-- I think its just about perception and unfortunately, about your parents wanting someone to pay for their retirement but not wanting there to be any expectations on them. As much as you love them, I think the fault here is more with your parents than with your brother.

 

[crisi]

I understand the brother as well, he's investing in a comfortable retirement for your parents, but he isn't providing for his siblings at his parents death, he'd like to get some of his money back. It actually seems rather fair to me - but then, I was just the "your brother" in a situation and I sunk a ton of money into a relative. If your parents did not want strings, they shouldn't have taken the money. And yeah, I know there probably weren't strings on the original deal - not stated strings - but apparently, there were.

Its possible that your brother is not as well off as his lifestyle implies. My uncle had that issue - when his mother died he NEEDED the money...turns out two kids in college is expensive if you spend their college funds buying them BMWs.

And its certain that your parents can't afford their home without your brother's help. Its time for your parents to downsize if they don't want the obligations that come with the help. Or, if its important to them to continue to live like they are, accept the terms of your brothers deal - it isn't generosity, its a deal he's cutting them. In which case, your brother and you have to understand that their priorities are comfort now at the expense of the ability to will their possessions where they want.

Your brother sounds like kind of a jerk, but your parents have the power to sell the house and refuse all future help. That's their decision.

 

[Swan4Me]

Can they get a reverse mortgage so that they won't need his help any longer?

You usually can get about 60% back-BUT this is only a good option if they are elderly-like in their 80's

If the son is giving them a sizable chuck every month-you siblings need to see it as HE is the bank doing a reverse mortgage-and deserves the house. My cousin did this for an elderly Aunt-but had the papers drawn up.

 

[beckybowler]

If they retired early and are both healthy and active can't they find jobs to support their expenses that your brother is currently covering and get him out of the position of holding that over their heads?

 

[eliza61]

Also Op, remember you parents have to shoulder some of the responsibility for this mess. They retired knowing that they could not afford to. so they accepted the fact that they would be dependant on some one else for their care.

 

[Marionnette]

I don't like to share things on a message board, i'm laid back and pretty care free, but all of a sudden i find myself feeling sick over a family situation.
My oldest brother is well off, im talking his DD was given a BMW for her birthday type well off and his home is worth a cpl million.
Anyway, a few years back he told my parents they should retire and he would help them out with the bills so they could be comfortable, so they did ! well fast forward to this week when he saw my folks will, simply put, he is going to cut them off unless the will states that their home be signed over to him, they also had a few personal things willed to my other brother and myself, which he wants changed too.

I am just sick over this, and honestly it's not about the money or anything, it's the fact that they feel like they have no other options if they want to keep their house ( and yes they paid for the house themselves ) they can't afford to stay there without that extra they get from him monthly, we have offered to let them move in with us and tried tossing other ideas around, but they just love their home, they're healthy and active and don't want or need to leave. I just don't get why he wants to do that to my parents, or to us for that matter, my parents are so upset that he wants my other brother and I cut out of the will and yet they just don't know what to do ?? and the best part !!! my parents are not supposed to tell my brother and I about this revised will, so we have to pretend not to know anything and of course i'm sure you know what I want to say to him

Well, thanks for listening, sometimes it just feels better to type it out

Your parents put themselves in a situation where they are dependent on this brother for their livelihood. They don't have to will the house to him and they don't need to even show them their wills. But he doesn't have to continue paying their bills either.

This is between your parents and your brother. Your parents should handle this themselves. I don't see a good ending to anything that would include you and brother #2 getting involved. It will only drive a wedge between you and your sibling. But since your parents have dragged you into this, the loving thing to do would be to tell them that you have no interest in laying claim to their assets and that if they want to leave the house to your brother, they can do so with your blessing. This takes the emotional burden off of your parents since I'm sure that they are upset that they will have less to leave to you and your other brother.

 

[lizabu]

I think it depends how much money he gives them. Like you said it's an amount they can't manage without so it sounds like a lot. He probably should get the house seeing as he's paying their bills. Like someone else said if they had a reverse mortgage the bank would expect something in return for the money they gave your parents. The sentimental items is just petty. If it was me I'd just give the items to whoever I wanted to have them now while I was still alive unless of course if it was something I need for the moment.

 

[mom to minnie&mickey]

I don't like to share things on a message board, i'm laid back and pretty care free, but all of a sudden i find myself feeling sick over a family situation.
My oldest brother is well off, im talking his DD was given a BMW for her birthday type well off and his home is worth a cpl million.
Anyway, a few years back he told my parents they should retire and he would help them out with the bills so they could be comfortable, so they did ! well fast forward to this week when he saw my folks will, simply put, he is going to cut them off unless the will states that their home be signed over to him, they also had a few personal things willed to my other brother and myself, which he wants changed too.

I am just sick over this, and honestly it's not about the money or anything, it's the fact that they feel like they have no other options if they want to keep their house ( and yes they paid for the house themselves ) they can't afford to stay there without that extra they get from him monthly, we have offered to let them move in with us and tried tossing other ideas around, but they just love their home, they're healthy and active and don't want or need to leave. I just don't get why he wants to do that to my parents, or to us for that matter, my parents are so upset that he wants my other brother and I cut out of the will and yet they just don't know what to do ?? and the best part !!! my parents are not supposed to tell my brother and I about this revised will, so we have to pretend not to know anything and of course i'm sure you know what I want to say to him

Well, thanks for listening, sometimes it just feels better to type it out

Well, how much is their "monthly allowance"? Is your brother giving them enough to justify a small mortgage payment? If so, I can see his reason as your parents may live for many, many more years and if he continues then he is basically buying this house only to have it be given to his siblings upon their passing. Seems to me all three of you feel some sort of entitlement to your parents' assets but only one is footing the bill.

Your parents have become accustomed to a lifestyle that they cannot afford so they either make the hard choice to sell , re-negotiate the deal with your brother or you and your other brother carry the burden of supporting your parents as well. You cannot have it both ways. Good luck to your family as these things are never easy.

 

[Poohbug]

Sounds like your parents have some decisions to make.

Your brother does not have the right to ask his parents to change their will. He offer money to pay their bills. This was not an investment, I don't see what rights your brother thinks he has other than to stop paying the bills. Were there strings attached to this money when it was first offered?

That being said, there are a lot of options open to your parents. They could get jobs and/or move to a smaller house or condo. As mentioned before, they could distribute the personal items now to whomever they want. They could change their will, give your rich brother a copy, and promptly change it back. They could create a trust, put all their assets into it, and really mess with your brother.

I am a firm believer in NOT loaning money to family and friends, if I can help them out, I will do so with no strings or repayment expected.

 

[danceintherain]

I don't think it has anything to do with money either. I've known people with money who are great and people who aren't. It has to do with your brother. Chances are if you were the ones with the money, and he wasn't he would probably still be trying to convince your parents that he "deserved" the house. Money always has strings attached. I learned that at a fairly young age. It's sad that it took your parents this long to figure it out.

The only idea I have for your parents to put their house up for sale (or rent) and move into a smaller place. I know it's sad to move out of a house with a lot of memories, but if they can't afford it, they can't afford it. If your brother wants it that badly, he can buy it from them. Chances are, since he already has a house, he probably is just planning on selling it eventually anyways, unless he really does have the money to accommodate a house as an heirloom.
Either way, at that point they'll be able to do whatever they want with their money.

The situation does suck for them, but I do understand where your brother is coming from to a point as well. It would have been nice if he had made them aware of those terms at the beginning, when they still had a choice, but nothing can be done about that now.

 

[luvmy3]

If the house is paid for, how is what he is giving them helping them to stay in it? If they need money for other expenses then what he gives them allows them those, if the house is paid for then its theirs.
Also, you state "how money changes someone" but that applies to your parents here too. They couldn't afford to retire, and your brother offers them money so they can, and they agreed.
I do understand your brother, if he is essentially supporting your parents, then there is nothing wrong with him wanting the house after they are gone. I think he should have went about it another way, but I don't really fault him for wanting a "return" on what he has given through the years. Your parents need to decide what is important to them, staying in their house now and having their retirement funded by your brother, or selling their house and living off what they get for it (which probably isn't going to support their retirement unless they are living in a home worth a cpl. million).

 

[boltfan]

I completely understand. My father moved in with my family in 1997 because of illness, even though I'm the youngest and very much the poorest of the 3 siblings. Doctors said he'd die if no one helped and my brother and sister refused outright. I was happy to take him in, even buying a house where he wouldn't have to use stairs. He had very little money when he passed in 2009, but the second my sister and her husband walked into the house after, my brother-in-law grabbed my father's checkbook to check the balance. My sister and her husband make at least a million a year, but when the money cleared the bank, they took their $1500 share immediately. They never came to see my Dad except on his birthday/Father's Day (same week) and Christmas. Same with my brother, though he doesn't make quite as much money. I was upset to say the least after caring for our Dad for 12 years that they would take the money they didn't need that we desperately needed to keep our heat and electric going (ended up using a credit card to cover). My husband works two jobs and I am full time also, but we can barely pay our bills each month. It just really burned me when they never cared about him enough when he was alive, yet felt they had the right to his things and his money.

 

[Lilo&Stitch]

Thanks for the replies, don't know why i feel the need to clarify, but, my other brother and I DID give our blessing to my parents to do whatever they feel is necessary and we are both fine with the house being willed to the other brother, the problem is that my parents aren't comfortable with it, they're also afraid that even if they did do it, that he can just stop giving them money and their house is still his, and believe it or not, he could possibly do that ! he has made them wait for the money several times.
Also, this brother never comes over to visit & we aren't ever invited there, we see him maybe once a year (he lives no more than 30 mins away)
My parents decided my other brother and I should know because we are all close and they didn't think it was right to "surprise" us in the end.
We did discuss the reverse mortgage and it's definitely something my parents are thinking of doing, as for how much money they get, um seriously it's really not that much.
The thing that is really bothering us is that he wants this done behind our backs and I feel like he's giving my parents no other options.

 

[luvmy3]

I completely understand. My father moved in with my family in 1997 because of illness, even though I'm the youngest and very much the poorest of the 3 siblings. Doctors said he'd die if no one helped and my brother and sister refused outright. I was happy to take him in, even buying a house where he wouldn't have to use stairs. He had very little money when he passed in 2009, but the second my sister and her husband walked into the house after, my brother-in-law grabbed my father's checkbook to check the balance. My sister and her husband make at least a million a year, but when the money cleared the bank, they took their $1500 share immediately. They never came to see my Dad except on his birthday/Father's Day (same week) and Christmas. Same with my brother, though he doesn't make quite as much money. I was upset to say the least after caring for our Dad for 12 years that they would take the money they didn't need that we desperately needed to keep our heat and electric going (ended up using a credit card to cover). My husband works two jobs and I am full time also, but we can barely pay our bills each month. It just really burned me when they never cared about him enough when he was alive, yet felt they had the right to his things and his money.

If it was their share, as in your father split his money between the three of you, then they absolutely had the right to take it. It doesn't matter what you feel is right in that situation (and I would agree that maybe your siblings could have given up their share to you for what you did for your dad), it is what is in the will that matters.

 

[taylor3297]

How about if your parents deed the house to your brother that they draw up a contract where your parents have lifetiime rights? This way, the brother can not do anything to the house until both of your parents are gone.

My stepdad did this for my mom.