How does your school district handle G&T education?

[jfranklyn]

Our school district is currently going through major budget cuts. One of the programs that they have cut is our gifted and talented program, which was, at least in part, a two year intensive program for one class each of 4th and 5th graders (pulled from 9 different schools in town to one common classroom). My daughter graduated from this program and went on to her regular middle school in all honors classes - a g&t "track" if you will, but reaches many more kids than the original program she was in.

We are being told by the district that they will be reevaulating the g&t program and coming up with something that meets the needs of more kids across the district. But I honestly think they are starting from scratch and have no idea at this point how they will be handling elementary g&t kids.

So I'm wondering how other districts handle this type of need?

 

[golfgal]

Quite honestly, most G&T programs are a joke and can easily be eliminated, especially since none of the kids in the program are really gifted-they are just above average students. In our elementary school they have a once/week pull out program and in the middle school the G&T teacher designs assignments that coordinates with the classroom teacher and the G/T are in the regular classroom, they just sit by each other and usually have different homework.

Most schools would be better off using a flexible tracking system and it would save a LOT of money. Kids can be tracked based on teacher recommendations, test scores, and grades. They could be in different tracks for different subjects too. Schools used to do this but too much parent outcry at their child not being in the "best" track-it is really sad actually.

 

[SC Minnie]

In the elementary schools each school as GT classes for Math and Science- I believe they have 1 or 2 classes for each subject per grade depending on the number of kids in the program. For each middle school they also have GT classes for Math, Science, Social Studies, and English that 'track' into Honors for high school.

I agree with golfgal. I don't like the term Gifted and Talented but that's what they call it. These students aren't gifted. They are a littel more 'advanced' that typical students. They learn at a slightly faster pace and can handle a little more of a challenge. But not gifted or talented.

 

[laurie31]

In the elementary schools each school as GT classes for Math and Science- I believe they have 1 or 2 classes for each subject per grade depending on the number of kids in the program. For each middle school they also have GT classes for Math, Science, Social Studies, and English that 'track' into Honors for high school.

I agree with golfgal. I don't like the term Gifted and Talented but that's what they call it. These students aren't gifted. They are a littel more 'advanced' that typical students. They learn at a slightly faster pace and can handle a little more of a challenge. But not gifted or talented.

That may be true for most of the children in the program, but truly gifted children (IQ > 140) are different. They learn *differently* not just faster. They need education tailored to their needs just like kids with learning disabilities do. In general, our schools fail miserably with these children.

 

[golfgal]

That may be true for most of the children in the program, but truly gifted children (IQ > 140) are different. They learn *differently* not just faster. They need education tailored to their needs just like kids with learning disabilities do. In general, our schools fail miserably with these children.

I understand that but most kids in the G/T programs around the country do not have IQ's that high which is the point.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

Quite honestly, most G&T programs are a joke and can easily be eliminated, especially since none of the kids in the program are really gifted-they are just above average students. In our elementary school they have a once/week pull out program and in the middle school the G&T teacher designs assignments that coordinates with the classroom teacher and the G/T are in the regular classroom, they just sit by each other and usually have different homework.

I agree with golfgal. I don't like the term Gifted and Talented but that's what they call it. These students aren't gifted. They are a littel more 'advanced' that typical students. They learn at a slightly faster pace and can handle a little more of a challenge. But not gifted or talented.

That may be true for most of the children in the program, but truly gifted children (IQ > 140) are different. They learn *differently* not just faster. They need education tailored to their needs just like kids with learning disabilities do. In general, our schools fail miserably with these children.

Several years ago the Department of Education was hosting a large conference about G&T and contacted Mensa to send a representative. One of our members, with a doctorate in Education, went as the representative.

After the conference was over, she reported back to both the local group as well as the National Office of Mensa that the conference was intended for teaching people with an IQ of about 120 to 140; her opinion was they totally ignored the Mensa-level students feeling that they could fend for themselves.

 

[laurie31]

That may be true for most of the children in the program, but truly gifted children (IQ > 140) are different. They learn *differently* not just faster. They need education tailored to their needs just like kids with learning disabilities do. In general, our schools fail miserably with these children.

I understand that but most kids in the G/T programs around the country do not have IQ's that high which is the point.

Yes, I said it was true for most kids in the program - most of them AREN'T truly gifted. I think they expand the criteria to bring in more kids, or ...well, actually, I don't know what they do. But I agree that most of them aren't truly gifted. That's why the schools are failing the ones who are. Even in the "gifted" classes, they aren't having their needs met very well.

 

[golfgal]

Yes, I said it was true for most kids in the program - most of them AREN'T truly gifted. I think they expand the criteria to bring in more kids, or ...well, actually, I don't know what they do. But I agree that most of them aren't truly gifted. That's why the schools are failing the ones who are. Even in the "gifted" classes, they aren't having their needs met very well.

The point you are missing is that the actual incidence of a 140+IQ is VERY RARE and even then they may not show signs of "gifteness". Yes, they are very bright but being gifted is more than just having a high IQ. I have to say that our schools do a pretty good job of selecting kids, it isn't based on test scores but it is based more on evaluations of learning styles but several people-the G/T instructor, classroom instructor and the special ed dept reps. Very few kids qualify--there were 4 in our twins' grade out of about 600 students.

DS17 has a classmate that is a prodigy in math-he is taking a specially designed math course-designed by some top math professors around the country--was personally invited to attend MIT by the president of the college-unbelievable math student-he didn't qualify for G/T in any other subject and the G/T program couldn't do anything for him in math either (he has been taking classes at the University since his freshman year).

These are the kinds of kids that should qualify for special ed, NOT most of the kids in the G/T program.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Sorry to hear you are having cuts.

Our gifted program is huge here so not sure what you are looking for as far as info. It is already district wide and they even have their own school building. They even cater to the super advanced gifted kids.

The district we choose has a "challenge program" for middle school. Basically if you score a certain percentage on the standarized testing you get into "challenge classes". This was a great fit for my dd.

The challenge classes have them above the reg. math track. The classes are more advanced than regular. The gifted kids are in these classes as well, except English however my dd says she is not missing anything. She is going to a University this summer to participate in an English course. She has to build her skills outside of school right now. She should be in the gifted English but it is all or nothing. However this school will allow her to do honors in HS in english without being in the gifted program. So we are not concerned about it.

So in HS she can walk into honors classes, along with the gifted kids. Now the gifted kids are going to be in a higher math, but that is not her gifted area anyway. However she will be in a higher math than the reg. track kids.

The HS does have a weighted english class. She will probably get into that to counter her GPA for missing the weighted math class that the gifted kids take. English is her area.

We moved here in 6th grade and picked this school because of how they are set up with their program. I don't know how the elementary is set up. However I am sure they have kids in there starting earlier than 4th grade.

She started off in reg. classes in 6th grade and then took the standarized tests and was moved into all challenge classes. The counselor wanted to test her for the gifted program but we declined. She did it twice already (2nd grade in MO & 3rd grade in TX) and did not make it on the the math.

All in all, it is a program that I absolutely think is great.

Did you follow all that?

 

[ADisneyQueen]

Both my kids are in the gifted program. They had to do testing with both the guidance counselor and the school psychologist to get in and had to have a certain IQ score. There are many kids that I know that are really good students that did not score high enough, so our program really is for gifted, not for the child that gets good grades.

In elementary school, they go to the program 1/2 day per week at another school. Kids from several other schools join them, and it is usually by grade or even two grades together. In middle school and high school, they go to a college campus 2 days per month and take programs there ( for kids in their grades, not with college students). They also open up this program to more than just the gifted kids. I think they have to apply and they look at their grades. In 12th grade they are allowed to take some college courses for credit.

 

[iwrbnd]

Recent studies show that kids develop in spurts rather than on a gradual curve. It said you can't label a child as gifted until middle school because until then you don't know if you've tested a child in a spurt (labeling him gifted) or in a pre-spurt (and missing an actual gifted child). With that in mind our district just went through budget cuts and kept the elementary gifted program and dropped the middle school program. That goes completely against research but nobody asked me!

My youngest son's IQ has consistantly been tested in the 130-140 range but isn't in the gifted program because he tests "normal" on the language part of one of the test...he's mildly on the autism spectrum. It bothers him but not me. I sub in the gifted program and he's not missing anything! I think the advanced classes are much better so hopefully your school has those!

 

[Tinkermommy]

Quite honestly, most G&T programs are a joke and can easily be eliminated, especially since none of the kids in the program are really gifted-they are just above average students. In our elementary school they have a once/week pull out program and in the middle school the G&T teacher designs assignments that coordinates with the classroom teacher and the G/T are in the regular classroom, they just sit by each other and usually have different homework.

Most schools would be better off using a flexible tracking system and it would save a LOT of money. Kids can be tracked based on teacher recommendations, test scores, and grades. They could be in different tracks for different subjects too. Schools used to do this but too much parent outcry at their child not being in the "best" track-it is really sad actually.

This sounds very similar to our schools. We do have different tracks (on-level, advanced and accelerated) for Reading and Math.

They keep testing my DD for G&T, but she never makes it. She seems to be missing one of the five pieces and it's usually not the hard test scores, but things like "creativity and motivation". These are very subjective and there is no way to even measure them in a consistent way especially for children.

I really don't want them to test her anymore! Her teacher this year really wanted us to let them test her so we did, but not next year. The G&T program seems to be really "light" at our school. Not sure what they even do. But a lot of the kids in there are teacher's kids . Just saying!

 

[mumom95]

Our school doesn't offer services for the gifted in grades 1-4. Starting in 5th grade they have a program for gifted kids that lasts 4 years (up through 8th grade). They take between 40-50 kids per grade level (our graduating classes are usually between 750-800 kids) and have a specialized program for them for the four years. (they are in regular classrooms for all the electives).

They require an IQ of 129 or above (that is what the state of Ohio considers gifted). And the student must have scored in the 95th percentile or above in math and reading on the IOWA Basic Achievement test. What I don't know is what they do if they don't have 40 students with an IQ of that high and the IOWA scores.

I hear the program is pretty intense. My son will be in it next year, but he will be a 5th grader so it will be his first experience. I have substitute taught in the classes before and the program seems to be very project oriented and puts a lot of responsibilities on the students.

After 8th grade there isn't a gifted program, but it's difficult to get into the honors level classes if you weren't in the gifted program. It's possible, but often times you have to double up on other stuff your freshman year to have the pre-requisites for the courses.

Honestly, I think our countries education system is doing a real disservice to our country by not puting more emphasis on our best and brightest education wise. But unfortunately money doesn't grow on trees, and with the fact that passing the standardized is the most important thing to our schools, most districts take the attitude that "the gifted kids will do fine".

 

[NY Disney fan]

That may be true for most of the children in the program, but truly gifted children (IQ > 140) are different. They learn *differently* not just faster. They need education tailored to their needs just like kids with learning disabilities do. In general, our schools fail miserably with these children.

This is very true. G&T children (the truly gifted) are just as vulnerable than someone who is in special ed. They could easily flunk out of school and become hermits. Schools need to recognize truly gifted kids and educate them appropriately.

 

[Crystal0608]

My dd is in AIG twice a week for 3 hours and loves it. I believe there are 9 students out of about 200+ kids in 4th grade. It is supplemental and she still has homework in her regular courses. She will also be in it in 5th grade.

I was also in the gifted program in 4th & 5th and was pulled out of class daily for English and Math with a total of 5 students. In middle school we had gifted classes daily with about 10 students (two elementary schools merged). I really enjoyed being in that program. I moved to a different district in 8th grade and there was not a gifted program there. I got into honors classes, but they moved A LOT slower that what I was used to and were boring compared to the gifted courses.

 

[luvmy3]

This sounds very similar to our schools. We do have different tracks (on-level, advanced and accelerated) for Reading and Math.

Thats how it is at my kid's school too, there is no real G&T program.

 

[Longsx3]

DD(13) has been in GT since 2nd grade, in DODDS it was simply a pull out program for enrichment and some classroom differentiation. When we returned from overseas for 7th grade we rented a house in Tampa, there the Middle School wrote her and EP (education plan) but simply put her in the Higher Level classes. There was not any additional resources for GT, DD was being teased for being smart in the higher level classes
We bought a house and moved prior to the 4th qtr of 7th grade, the house is in a different school district, it has been a wonderful year! Her school divides each grade level into teams, plus a GT team which has 6, 7, & 8 grades... 7 & 8 are in combined classes. Every student on her team has an EP for giftedness, some also have an IEP for other issues...she has a classmate in one class that regularlly stands during class. Not all of these kids are perfect, their are still underachievers and those with other behavior issues, but for the most part these kids are very accepting of each others quirks. Next year DD will begin HS and it is simply acclerated classes, I believe she will also have a mentor who helps the GT kids, DD will take 4 Honors Courses plus an AP Course.

 

[diznygirl]

The gifted program in our school district started out as a pull out once a week thing. This year they started something different. Each grade has a gifted class so they can be gifted all week long. Of course, it's only as good as the teacher, and we are struggling with ours.

I don't care what they call it - I just want the children to be challenged so they won't be bored.

 

[Magic Mom]

There's extra money to help special needs children reach their potential. There's extra money to help GT children reach their potential. Where is the extra money to help average kids reach their potential? My daughter is a bright girl. She is not a GT student. She works very hard and usually gets A's and B's. But she needs extra attention at school to get straight A's. There's no money for that. There are lots of kids like DD who could use that extra help and have their learning tailored to fit their needs as someone mentioned gifted kids need. Too bad for them, they won't get it. At least not provided by the district.

 

[pooh4evr]

You can be reccommended as young as 4 for a summer program ("Sparklers"), then again in K- (Firecrackers") once you turn 6 you can be tested for the "Spectra" program- if you pass you start in 1st - I think DD#2 goes 2 times a week for 1.5 hrs a time-- DD#1 in 3rd goes I think 5 hours a week -- if you do not pass in K you can retake the test in 1st but if you fail again you have to wait until 3rd grade to take it again -- we haven't been very impressed with the kind of work they are doing we hoped it woul;d be a more accelerated curriculumn- higher math, sciences...- oh well at least it is something----- So it is a pull out program in elem- then 6-12 it is an elective class - once you test in you are in until you decide to leave. -- They also have a super gifted program - can;t remember the name though- those kids go to their own building near the administration campus and can attend upper grade classes (6th grader in 8th grade and so on). I want to say that is for kids with IQ of 140 +.