How can I contact the big boss at DVC?

[Doctor P]

Because doing so increases Member trade power.

For example, it is well known that Westgate treats exchangers poorly. Thus, even though their units and resorts are often quite nice, they tend to be the exchange option of last resort for many. Because this lowers demand for Westgate units, this in turn lowers the trade power available to Westgate owners who wish to exchange out.

So, if it doesn't cost anything to "be nice", it's worth doing. A CM at check in warmly welcoming an inbound exchanger costs nothing, and only helps the Members who wish to exchange out. Naturally, it also helps Disney's image, as inbounds may someday rent rooms conventionally, or even buy DVC.

If it does cost something to "be nice", then the management company and owners have to decide if the benefits are worth the costs. Increasingly, owners and their management companies are deciding that this is not so. However, this is a relatively recent phenomenon and DVC was among the first to go this route.


To some extent, this is not true. DVC chooses season, resort, and booking category, and tries to deposit the least-demanded inventory possible to satisfy a Member's exchange request. For example, it would be rare to see a Hospitality House unit at OKW available through II, because those are more in-demand by Members than the general resort. This is as it should be---there is no reason to deposit "more" than you need to to satisfy a Member request.


Not necessarily---it depends on what is deposited. For example, a Platinum season Marriott unit at many of their resorts costs roughly the same in terms of purchase price and annual fees as an equivalent DVC Membership.

As a good litigator would say---"non-responsive" and irrelevant.

 

[Tinkerbellcrafter]

By the way, I did not flaunt our points at the CM. I did tell her we've owned there for 16 years and in fact we opened one of the buildings. She was not only non-responsive she was downright rude. She smiled the whole time yet said rude things to us. LIKE "put your cards away, I don't need them. I got you an elevator building as you requested what else do you want me to do. I am a concierge and I only took you because I saw you were next in line. I am tired of doing this ETC.

Wow, this attitude is really bad. We do not own anything other than DVC and I do not know anything about exchanges, etc but an attitude like that is terrible! You are a paying guest whether using cash, points, etc and deserve to be treated with respect and the Disney Magical Smile and attitude!! Please keep us posted and let us know what comes of your letter!

 

[Dean]

Most of my stays the last few years have been exchanges in. I don't own as many points as I used to but I still own over 400 though I expect to end up at 75 or 100. I can see both sides of this situation and I guess it depends on how it was handled. No excuse to be rude. DVC does have the right to treat exchangers (even members that exchange in) different than owners. IMO, and I might say different than many TUG opinions, I feel that offering members discounts and minor perks that are not offered to exchangers is reasonable. A member who exchanges in however is an enigma to them. They really don't know how to handle it. Officially they treat them as non members and given that's the approach, the non member packet is appropriate. They have always provided a members packet when I asked, and I always ask. At times I have pushed to get the members rates on phone calls and the like, other trips I haven't worried about it. I think they have so few members trading in that they know about they simply haven't addressed the issue.

It is my opinion that members who trade in should get ALL the perks of a points stay. Even if you didn't use your points to do so, someone else's points were used. It is petty of DVC not to extend the courtesy, esp when they charge you the $95 fee for things you can always do without the fee as a member. Still, it's such a good deal that it's hard to get too upset over it. Of course you could do like I am, divest yourself of most points and still trade in smiling to yourself that you're costs are only 15-30% of what it would be if you were using your points for the stay.

The $95 resort services fee in general is an issue. IMO, it does significantly impact the II demand and thus the members trade power using DVC. And the truth is it doesn't add anything other than to put money in DVD's pocket for items already being paid for by members. I have voiced my opinion to DVC in the past that the fee is inappropriate, esp for members exchanging in.

Jim Lewis' email was posted on a thread recently. I guess the bottom line question is how do members want to be treated when they exchange out.

 

[icydog]

Previously requested "areas of improvement" ... just in case DVC suits are reading this ...

• The official low cost, high satisfaction, DVC perk idea thread, from May 2008
• IF the Big Cheese is reading, how would you improve DVC?, from March 2007
• New DVC Perks ... Your Opinions, from Feb 2007

I agree totally with all your posts. Thanks

 

[icydog]

Most of my stays the last few years have been exchanges in. I don't own as many points as I used to but I still own over 400 though I expect to end up at 75 or 100. I can see both sides of this situation and I guess it depends on how it was handled. No excuse to be rude. DVC does have the right to treat exchangers (even members that exchange in) different than owners. IMO, and I might say different than many TUG opinions, I feel that offering members discounts and minor perks that are not offered to exchangers is reasonable. A member who exchanges in however is an enigma to them. They really don't know how to handle it. Officially they treat them as non members and given that's the approach, the non member packet is appropriate. They have always provided a members packet when I asked, and I always ask. At times I have pushed to get the members rates on phone calls and the like, other trips I haven't worried about it. I think they have so few members trading in that they know about they simply haven't addressed the issue.

It is my opinion that members who trade in should get ALL the perks of a points stay. Even if you didn't use your points to do so, someone else's points were used. It is petty of DVC not to extend the courtesy, esp when they charge you the $95 fee for things you can always do without the fee as a member. Still, it's such a good deal that it's hard to get too upset over it. Of course you could do like I am, divest yourself of most points and still trade in smiling to yourself that you're costs are only 15-30% of what it would be if you were using your points for the stay.

The $95 resort services fee in general is an issue. IMO, it does significantly impact the II demand and thus the members trade power using DVC. And the truth is it doesn't add anything other than to put money in DVD's pocket for items already being paid for by members. I have voiced my opinion to DVC in the past that the fee is inappropriate, esp for members exchanging in.

Jim Lewis' email was posted on a thread recently. I guess the bottom line question is how do members want to be treated when they exchange out.

I agree, members trading in is a rarity and DVC doesn't know how to deal with it. But to treat even non members rudely is an issue. I would be sorely put to find a Marriott Rep who treated a non owner this way.

I also agree that my Marriott weeks cost a lot, very much like DVC. What I don't see as an exchanger into other Marriotts, or other timeshares, is the flip, better than thou, attitude I got from this CM. Most timeshares see exchangers as a gigantic pool from which to draw prospective owners. Showing an exchanger how wonderful DVC is would be a wonderful Marketing tool in my opinion (I was a sales director for many years) and a loss of opportunity if they don't tap that market.

Dean, could you point me to that Jim Lewis email please. I would be very interested in reading it. Thanks

Thanks again to all of you who have posted. Seeing all sides will help me prepare a better argument.

 

[Chuck S]

I don't think people trading in should get the same perks (those that require a points stay, like Pool Hopping and free Internet), even if they are DVC members.

Here's the thing. Someone can buy a small resale contract, then a really inexpensive non-DVC timeshare, and trade into DVC. Yes, the member trading out of DVC that made the room available used points for their trade...but they are not staying in the room, but those owners are physically using their points for other accommodations. Other non-II trades go to CRO for cash rentals, and those people, even paying a high per night fee do not get free internet or pool hopping, even if they are members. Just as DVCers that trade to non DVC WDW resorts don't get free internet or pool hopping.

The people trading into DVC, even if they are a DVC owner, are not using their personal points, and they are not non-compensated guests of the owner that traded out. The owner that traded out received compensation in the form of the II accommodations.

Unless all II locations agree to treat those DVC people that trade in as full owners at their resorts, then neither should DVC. IMO

 

[Dean]

I don't think people trading in should get the same perks (those that require a points stay, like Pool Hopping and free Internet), even if they are DVC members.

Here's the thing. Someone can buy a small resale contract, then a really inexpensive non-DVC timeshare, and trade into DVC. Yes, the member trading out of DVC that made the room available used points for their trade...but they are not staying in the room, but those owners are physically using their points for other accommodations. Other non-II trades go to CRO for cash rentals, and those people, even paying a high per night fee do not get free internet or pool hopping, even if they are members. Just as DVCers that trade to non DVC WDW resorts don't get free internet or pool hopping.

The people trading into DVC, even if they are a DVC owner, are not using their personal points, and they are not non-compensated guests of the owner that traded out. The owner that traded out received compensation in the form of the II accommodations.

Unless all II locations agree to treat those DVC people that trade in as full owners at their resorts, then neither should DVC. IMO

As a rule they treat them far better than DVC treats those who exchange in from my experience but that's not to say I've experienced rude behavior in this circumstance, I have not. And it does vary from one resort and system to another. But what I have experienced is simply lack of knowledge and training, unacceptable for a system such as DVC, IMO. I do understand your point and I guess my opinion is that there are perks that are reasonable to exclude, mainly PH and those that are not like internet, DVD's, phone charges. Of course some perks are member specific and not stay specific anyway. As I noted, it's not a big deal to me overall but it is petty.

 

[icydog]

As a rule they treat them far better than DVC treats those who exchange in from my experience but that's not to say I've experienced rude behavior in this circumstance, I have not. And it does vary from one resort and system to another. I do understand your point and I guess my opinion is that there are perks that are reasonable to exclude, mainly PH and those that are not like internet, DVD's, phone charges. Of course some perks are member specific and not stay specific anyway. As I noted, it's not a big deal to me overall but it is petty.

I have exchanged into other resorts A LOT and I have never been treated the way I was treated at DVC. That much I can guarantee. Most folks on the Dis have limited experience with timesharing and most only know DVC. I was in the same position a few years ago, but I learned a lot, especially from Dean. Now I know there is a world beyond DVC and Orlando (okay HH and VB too) and I think that the perks that will not cost the members anything like free internet should be included for all exchangers not just myself as an owner. It costs NOTHING and it goes a long way in the way of hospitality.


"But what I have experienced is simply lack of knowledge and training, unacceptable for a system such as DVC, IMO".

This sums it up in a nutshell. DVC is still operating the same way it did in 1992. It is time the big shots learned we, DVC owners and bosses, are small fishes in a very big pond.

 

[Deb & Bill]

It appears that DVC treats inbound exchangers the same way they treat DVC members who use their points to stay at a non-DVC WDW resort. They both pay $95 on top of the points. Neither get DVC Member perks at the resort. No pool hopping.

Any DVC member can use dining perks, valet parking perks wherever they stay. Those perks are not dependent upon a stay at at DVC resort on points.

For those posters who expressed concern about not treating a high point member with better respect. Not all high point owners use all their points for their own or their family vacations. Some do, but some use those points to make reservations for others. DVC does allow a member to rent reservations based on the POS.

 

[DebbieB]

I have exchanged into other resorts A LOT and I have never been treated the way I was treated at DVC. That much I can guarantee. Most folks on the Dis have limited experience with timesharing and most only know DVC. I was in the same position a few years ago, but I learned a lot, especially from Dean. Now I know there is a world beyond DVC and Orlando (okay HH and VB too) and I think that the perks that will not cost the members anything like free internet should be included for all exchangers not just myself as an owner. It costs NOTHING and it goes a long way in the way of hospitality.

"But what I have experienced is simply lack of knowledge and training, unacceptable for a system such as DVC, IMO".

This sums it up in a nutshell. DVC is still operating the same way it did in 1992. It is time the big shots learned we, DVC owners and bosses, are small fishes in a very big pond.

Do you know for a fact that the free internet costs DVC nothing? An outside company operates the internet service, are you sure that DVC does not have to reimburse that company for member use? I'm sure its nowhere near full price but I've wondered since it started if there is some reimbursement. No one does anything for free.

It bugs me more than members have to pay a $95 fee to stay at a non-DVC WDW resort on points and still have to pay for internet.

 

[Chuck S]

Do you know for a fact that the free internet costs DVC nothing? An outside company operates the internet service, are you sure that DVC does not have to reimburse that company for member use? I'm sure its nowhere near full price but I've wondered since it started if there is some reimbursement. No one does anything for free.

It bugs me more than members have to pay a $95 fee to stay at a non-DVC WDW resort on points and still have to pay for internet.

I would venture to guess that it does cost DVC a minimal negotiated price, whether it be a monthly fee, or a per user per day charge, that charge is likely included in the operational costs of the resort, thus in our dues.

 

[Dean]

Do you know for a fact that the free internet costs DVC nothing? An outside company operates the internet service, are you sure that DVC does not have to reimburse that company for member use? I'm sure its nowhere near full price but I've wondered since it started if there is some reimbursement. No one does anything for free.

It bugs me more than members have to pay a $95 fee to stay at a non-DVC WDW resort on points and still have to pay for internet.

There has to me some cost if simply internal, even if just personnel or time. But I think it's unlikely that the number of users has any cost or that a single user increases that cost. The likelihood for a member is that not giving it increases the cost simply due to the time spent dealing with the unhappy member at the front desk or on the phone. Realize the $95 fee in question is on top of a $139 exchange fee that II charges. This is money that goes straight to DVD.

 

[Brian Noble]

As a good litigator would say---"non-responsive" and irrelevant.

Which, when translated into English, loosely means "That's not the answer I was looking for, so let's try again." Of course, a really good litigator wouldn't have asked the question without first knowing the answer.

DVC does have the right to treat exchangers (even members that exchange in) different than owners. IMO, and I might say different than many TUG opinions, I feel that offering members discounts and minor perks that are not offered to exchangers is reasonable.

I agree with this. It is any resort's/system's right to set up the rules of exchange however they like, balancing the costs and benefits of exchange with the needs of internal owners. And, as time goes on, more and more resorts/systems are moving to a world that favors internal owners vs. exchange guests.

For example, in the past few years Wyndham switched to depositing only developer-chosen weeks, eliminating the option for owners to reserve and deposit specific weeks. Since then, Wyndham has very conciously deposited inventory with lower demand to RCI, keeping the better inventory for internal booking. There was a noticeable drop in trade power in RCI as a result, which made owners who regularly exchange unhappy. On the other hand, owners who don't typically exchange were happier. For Wyndham, I think it is perfectly reasonable to favor internal use, because there is already significant diversity in-system.

It is my opinion that members who trade in should get ALL the perks of a points stay. Even if you didn't use your points to do so, someone else's points were used.

But someone's points were used for every exchange guest, Member or not. That's not to say that DVC couldn't go this route. As I say, they have the right to set up the rules however they want, and I could see giving Member inbounds access to perks if they so chose, while not granting them to non-Member inbounds.

The $95 resort services fee in general is an issue. IMO, it does significantly impact the II demand and thus the members trade power using DVC.

But, realistically, DVC trade power is already pretty decent. The biggest problem is that DVC Members can't get ACs, and by rights probably should. I'm not aware of anything that DVC can't pull, except low-quality resorts in high-demand places. But, that's due to resort quality differential, not trade power, and increased trade power won't help.

Dean, could you point me to that Jim Lewis email please. I would be very interested in reading it.

I would be too.

 

[Brian Noble]

Regarding the cost of broadband: there absolutely is a cost to giving it to all exchange guests---namely, the lost revenue that you would have had had you charged for it. I don't know where that revenue goes, but I'm guessing Disney gets some of it, even though there is a third party providing the service.

 

[DisDaydreamer]

Whatever the issue is, I think a regular snail-mail letter -- appropriately written -- would be given much more credibility than an email. Especially if the email was a rant.

I agree with this completely. I also think it obligates at least a return letter that will cause the author to be more thorough in understanding the issue before responding.

 

[Laxmom]

I am reluctant because over here most of you are only DVC owners, and I am afraid to be judged by you all, but here goes.

I own over 1400 points with Disney. I am a founding member, since 1992. I have a gigantic maintenance fee to pay as well as the cost of all those points in the first place. I love DVC. I really love OKW and it has always been our home away from home.

Last week, since I own Marriotts as well as DVC, I traded into OKW using Interval International. I paid the $95 resort fee. I did everything right as far as I could tell. When I got to the front desk the cast member was openly hostile to me and my husband. We showed our blue member cards and she glanced at them and said "put them away" We told her we have been members for 16 years. We tried to make conversation. We tried laughter. We tried cajoling. We finally spoke with her supervisor. He was pleasant enough and we got a first floor room as we requested.

Then we looked at the packet she gave us. It didn't have a Perks book in it or any member information. It was as if she stripped the book of all member content--despite the fact that she knew we were members.

We went back to our villa. It was a one bedroom villa on the first floor in bldg 64. We were fine with it all. Then we found out that we didn't get free internet. No internet? Why, we asked? Because you traded in-- and you are like any other exchanger-- no free internet!!. We called the GM. He apologized profusely and gave us free internet and a member package. We can use all the member perks if we show our cards after all, so there was no need for her attitude. What the GM didn't tell us was that we would have to have the internet charges removed daily. When we went up to have them removed we got a supervisor who basically acted like the cast member and she started to deny credit to us. I told her that the GM gave us his blessing and only reluctantely did she give it to us. She too wouldn't grace us with any conversation despite the fact that we have been staying there several times a year on our points. I was disheartened at our treatment since we have only stayed this way, on an exchange, this one time. BUT, I want this policy to be revisited. I may wish to exchange in again, or another member may want to stay on an II trade as well. I have enough points to stay whenever I please---BUT that is not the issue.

I did not take anyone's points. DVC deposited them into II. I did not use the club without paying dues. We have been paying dues for 12 years. I never quit my membership. I only availed myself a way to stay for the weekend without using 140 points to do it. I gave up a valuable platinum week in the Marriott system to stay in DVC.

I am a still a member and I really don't want this type of thing to happen to someone else. That's why I want to send the letter to Mr. Lewis.

Okay, now I guess I will get slam blasted for taking this on over here on the Dis (I post non-DVC issues on TUG). I know that most of you will not get my angst- but look at it this way---I am still a DVC member-- and I hope to be always treated like one-- whether using my points or not.

Marylyn
Member since '92

Marilyn, I am so sorry to hear this. We exchanged in using one of our Marriott's to OKW in July and had the opposite experience to yours. We got our members folder, free internet -which was reversed each day but we didn't have to repeatedly ask-and were treated like owners.

DVC is going to have to change this mind set. As the program grows and more people trade out of DVC and into the general timeshare market, there are going to be more exchangers staying at DVC properties. I would not expect a DVC owner to be treated differently at either of my Marriott properties so it shouldn't happen visa versa!

 

[Brian Noble]

We exchanged in using one of our Marriott's to OKW in July and...were treated like owners.

That could be because your reservation was coded incorrectly. I have had them coded both ways---sometimes as a Member, sometimes not. As I gather it, the policy is "not".

 

[Laxmom]

Our KTTW cards did not say member on that trip.

 

[Doctor P]

I would not expect a DVC owner to be treated differently at either of my Marriott properties so it shouldn't happen visa versa!

BUT THEY ARE...that is my point. Marriott is NOTORIOUS for treating outside exchangers way different than owners both in terms of access to normal perks, access to villas, and fees. They also treat those who are owners but bought resale (from somebody besides Marriott) differently.

 

[musical2]

BUT THEY ARE...that is my point. Marriott is NOTORIOUS for treating outside exchangers way different than owners both in terms of access to normal perks, access to villas, and fees. They also treat those who are owners but bought resale (from somebody besides Marriott) differently.

I'd have to agree with this. Although I own at Marriott Manor Club in Williamsburg, I have have also exhanged into Manor Club using my Aruba Renaissance twice. I didn't expect, nor did I receive, my six free rounds of golf like I would if I just went on my normal Manor Club reservation. I was lucky enough though to get good villas each time I exchanged in. The point is I wouldn't expect to have the same perks if I exchanged in to DVC from outside either. There has to be something special about going in as an owner on points or as a Marriott owner.