House needs work, what to do?

[HHSTigerFan]

List of what we need to repair/replace on our 1960 house:

Siding
Windows
Waterproof the basement
Redo kitchen

The first 3 are needs, not wants.. the last is mostly a want, but kitchen also has some major problems like a 50 year old oven thats on its last leg, exhaust fan thats broke and a stove that is also 50 year old..

Had 2 people out, Pella gave us an estimate of $20K to replace all windows, basement company $7K to get our basement dry.. I am guessing $12K to replace the siding.. And then somewhere approaching $20K to redo the kitchen..

With rates still low, at what point do we just refinance the house and roll the improvements into the mortgage rather than saving up and doing one project at a time? We just spent about $14K last year gutting the bathrooms, so our savings is limited to an EF and thats it.. Also have CC debt of around $14K, but doing a nice job of getting that dwindled down by about $500/month..

 

[leadfootlevi]

Our state has a housing finance agency that offers low interest "Fix-up Funds." http://www.mnhousing.gov/ Check to see if your state offers something similar?

Also, our CU offers something similar. The closing costs on these types of loans is usually much less than a normal mortgage.

 

[HHSTigerFan]

Our state has a housing finance agency that offers low interest "Fix-up Funds." http://www.mnhousing.gov/ Check to see if your state offers something similar?

Also, our CU offers something similar. The closing costs on these types of loans is usually much less than a normal mortgage.

FHA also has a rehab program we have looked at, let you base the loan on the value of the house AFTER improvements..

 

[HHSTigerFan]

I looked around, seems like all programs are for low income people...

Which is fine, end up with a mortgage of around $180K and with a household income of around $100K well within our budget.. would prefer to do these as we save for them, but worried the improvements need to be done now.. plus, our current mortgage is still at 6.125% so we need to refi anyway..

 

[Darcy03231]

List of what we need to repair/replace on our 1960 house:

Siding
Windows
Waterproof the basement
Redo kitchen

The first 3 are needs, not wants.. the last is mostly a want, but kitchen also has some major problems like a 50 year old oven thats on its last leg, exhaust fan thats broke and a stove that is also 50 year old..

Had 2 people out, Pella gave us an estimate of $20K to replace all windows, basement company $7K to get our basement dry.. I am guessing $12K to replace the siding.. And then somewhere approaching $20K to redo the kitchen..

With rates still low, at what point do we just refinance the house and roll the improvements into the mortgage rather than saving up and doing one project at a time? We just spent about $14K last year gutting the bathrooms, so our savings is limited to an EF and thats it.. Also have CC debt of around $14K, but doing a nice job of getting that dwindled down by about $500/month..

I'd get some more quotes. I just had windows, siding, roof and a new deck put on my house last summer. We have a 2,200 s.f. garrison with a two car attached garage. We replaced 13 windows and put in 2 new windows and a french door in the family room (got rid of the one big plate glass window). Total cost was about $35k. We went with the Harvey windows and have been very happy with them. I live in the NE and my house has been much warmer and there are no drafts coming through the windows anymore!

 

[HHSTigerFan]

I'd get some more quotes. I just had windows, siding, roof and a new deck put on my house last summer. We have a 2,200 s.f. garrison with a two car attached garage. We replaced 13 windows and put in 2 new windows and a french door in the family room (got rid of the one big plate glass window). Total cost was about $35k. We went with the Harvey windows and have been very happy with them. I live in the NE and my house has been much warmer and there are no drafts coming through the windows anymore!

What kind of windows??? This price is for wood new construction, 13 holes with 23 separate windows.. 1 picture window and 3 6'x6' windows... Priced out windows about 2 years ago, bids came in around $20K then with no installation, we were actually happy with that quote..

 

[disneysteve]

List of what we need to repair/replace on our 1960 house:

Siding
Windows
Waterproof the basement
Redo kitchen

The first 3 are needs, not wants.

I understand why #3 is a need but what about #1 and #2. Is the siding damaged to a point where the underlying structure is exposed to the elements and getting damaged or water is getting in? Are the windows leaking? If so, then I'd agree those should be done as soon as possible. If not, the need isn't so immediate.

If it can wait a bit, you don't have to do all of the windows at one time. I know people who have done as few as one at a time as they had the money. Personally, we did the second floor one year and the first floor the following year.

Siding is a little tougher but I do also know people who didn't do all 4 sides of their house at the same time.

Definitely get at least 3 estimates for each job that you need done. Costs can vary dramatically between contractors for the exact same job.

 

[clutter]

It's not the amount of the mortgage, it's where it'll appraise. I refi-ed last year to do some improvements, and it's considered a 'cash-out' refi. My loan to value stayed under 65%, so it was easy. Anything higher than that has different requirements. You could maybe do a equity line, which they'll do to 90%, then refi after the work is done. I'd check with banks about your options.

Everything depends on how long you're staying. If you're leaving within 5-10 years, you may not need Pella windows. I put in replacement, quality, vinyl for half of that. But I'm in this house for 6-10 years. As for the kitchen, I think you're a bit low, unless you're doing the work yourself. I'd think 25k for a basic small kitchen. So that doesn't match the Pella windows. Cause for the kitchen, you would be getting the lowest level of cabinets, etc. I'd do a basic kitchen and less expensive windows, or the Pellas and add 5 to 10k for a kitchen and get what you want. On resale, the kitchen is probably worth more than having Pellas. (fyi - my kitchen is totally stripped down as I type, so I've been doing a lot of research, lol. Also, my kitchen is 40 years old, and my contractor is having to replace some pipes and electrical simply because of age.)

 

[HHSTigerFan]

It's not the amount of the mortgage, it's where it'll appraise. I refi-ed last year to do some improvements, and it's considered a 'cash-out' refi. My loan to value stayed under 65%, so it was easy. Anything higher than that has different requirements. You could maybe do a equity line, which they'll do to 90%, then refi after the work is done. I'd check with banks about your options.

Everything depends on how long you're staying. If you're leaving within 5-10 years, you may not need Pella windows. I put in replacement, quality, vinyl for half of that. But I'm in this house for 6-10 years. As for the kitchen, I think you're a bit low, unless you're doing the work yourself. I'd think 25k for a basic small kitchen. So that doesn't match the Pella windows. Cause for the kitchen, you would be getting the lowest level of cabinets, etc. I'd do a basic kitchen and less expensive windows, or the Pellas and add 5 to 10k for a kitchen and get what you want. On resale, the kitchen is probably worth more than having Pellas. (fyi - my kitchen is totally stripped down as I type, so I've been doing a lot of research, lol. Also, my kitchen is 40 years old, and my contractor is having to replace some pipes and electrical simply because of age.)

1. This is why we are looking at 203K, LTV is based on the improved value of the home..

2. We have been told that our windows are shot, replacements would cause us problems down the road... and then lies the problem, we have no intentions of moving soon, so don't want to but cheaper windows in and then live here for 40 years, if we go quality windows now will be set as long as we live here..

3. Totally guessed on the kitchen.. Bid we had for cabinets/solid counter thru Lowes was for around $10K, new floor was $4K installed.. $6K seemed fair for labor to install cabinets, remove a small wall and closet, little drywall work and buy a dishwasher, oven and microwave.. We have a fairly new fridge that will last us until we can buy a new one... and then have a few buddies that will do some electrical and plumbing on the side as favors..

 

[HHSTigerFan]

I understand why #3 is a need but what about #1 and #2. Is the siding damaged to a point where the underlying structure is exposed to the elements and getting damaged or water is getting in? Are the windows leaking? If so, then I'd agree those should be done as soon as possible. If not, the need isn't so immediate.

If it can wait a bit, you don't have to do all of the windows at one time. I know people who have done as few as one at a time as they had the money. Personally, we did the second floor one year and the first floor the following year.

Siding is a little tougher but I do also know people who didn't do all 4 sides of their house at the same time.

Definitely get at least 3 estimates for each job that you need done. Costs can vary dramatically between contractors for the exact same job.

The siding is bad, the old pressed wood variety, starting to rot at the bottom in a few spots and found a little mold in a closet wall.. contractor buddy says its going to be hard to replace a few windows at a time, the siding is so bad that its going to be impossible to keep it water proofed around the window until we get the new siding installed.. Could do siding first, but then will be more costly to install the windows because of more labor..

So while I hate to pay the extra interest, am I really saving anything if material costs increase close to what current mortgage rates are? And then add in the decreased energy costs I would expect to see, closes the gap even more..

 

[Darcy03231]

What kind of windows??? This price is for wood new construction, 13 holes with 23 separate windows.. 1 picture window and 3 6'x6' windows... Priced out windows about 2 years ago, bids came in around $20K then with no installation, we were actually happy with that quote..

Windows are Harvey, double hung, new construction, vinyl clad. We went with the new construction because our old window were so bad and some of the sill had started to rot. We didn't want to be bothered with replacement windows. The contractor also replaced all the interior wood trim and stained it to match the existing trim.

 

[Brer Shay]

Your window estimate seams high to me. Last year we replaced all of the windows in the house (32) with double pain lowE glass windows with full screens - at cost the windows were $4,800. Installation is generally twice the cost. I don't recall the name on the windows at the moment, but its a well known manufacturer. Just seems sensible to get a few estimates when you're looking at spending that much money.

 

[HHSTigerFan]

2 years ago I got pricing on Pella windows from Lowes and Andersen from Home Depot, they were at $14K not including the 3 big windows in the back of our house and not including installation..

 

[Darcy03231]

2 years ago I got pricing on Pella windows from Lowes and Andersen from Home Depot, they were at $14K not including the 3 big windows in the back of our house and not including installation..

I would go with a small independent local contractor. That's what we did. We got quotes from Lowes, Home Depot and Sears and they were about twice as much as what we paid. Our next door neighbor had his roof done by Lowes and his house is smaller than ours. He paid more than double what we did and he didn't get as good shingles. Also, keep in mind that Lowes, Home Depot and Sears contract out their work to independent subs. You could get a really good one, and you could get someone really bad (I've heard a lot of horror stories over the years with everything from carpet, to windows to roofs - my DH is in construction).

We found a younger contractor whose family had been in business for a long time who was branching out on his own (he's been in business on his own for about 5 years). His wasn't the lowest quote (it was somewhere in the middle), but when we asked questions about things he knew the answers, and had some great ideas we hadn't thought of. He and his crew did a wonderful job. We also got the benefit of his family's experience because he had his dad and uncle over working with him part of the time (due to the economy they didn't have any projects going on while our was.)

 

[disneyfan2kids]

What kind of windows??? This price is for wood new construction, 13 holes with 23 separate windows.. 1 picture window and 3 6'x6' windows... Priced out windows about 2 years ago, bids came in around $20K then with no installation, we were actually happy with that quote..

Holy COW!!

I'm glad my DH is a carpenter...I can't BELIEVE the quotes you guys are getting. Replacing a new window costs us about $150 (the cost of the window itself)! WOW.... 35K?! My entire kitchen redo costs us about 13K, and that included appliances, cabinets, and granite! I never realized how much labor must cost to get someone to do it.

 

[Darcy03231]

Holy COW!!

I'm glad my DH is a carpenter...I can't BELIEVE the quotes you guys are getting. Replacing a new window costs us about $150 (the cost of the window itself)! WOW.... 35K?! My entire kitchen redo costs us about 13K, and that included appliances, cabinets, and granite! I never realized how much labor must cost to get someone to do it.

The $35k included windows (13), siding, wrapping all of the exterior trim, seamless gutters, roof and deck (14' x 28'). It also included taking out an old big plate glass window and installing french doors and two new windows (which required rerouting some plumbing due to baseboard hot water heat). Our house is a 2,200 s.f. garrison with a 2 car attached garage and a farmer's porch on the front. I thought the $35k was a great price (and so did DH and he's in the construction business). The cost to replace the 13 windows with new construction ones with full screens was about $7k of the total.

 

[punkin]

OP is looking at Pella windows. Those do not come cheap. I replaced our windows in two batches (we used a local company - not "brand name" windows) because I did not feel I could afford to do it all at once. We still have one old window in the house (and basement windows, which I am not planning to change) because I want to do a break out on that wall and build a deck with a door. I am saving up for that.

We also should replace siding, but we will wait on that because it really is a "want" for us, not a "need" yet.

We could refi our house (or get a HEL/HELOC) and do everything we want at once (that would include driveway, deck, partial kitchen remodel, one powder room remodel). If we take about $80K of equity out of our house, we will still have an 80% LTV, even given the drop in prices, but in this economic climate with real estate prices still falling, I feel much better saving up and doing things one project (or half a project) at a time. Good luck OP.

 

[HHSTigerFan]

I would go with a small independent local contractor. That's what we did. We got quotes from Lowes, Home Depot and Sears and they were about twice as much as what we paid. Our next door neighbor had his roof done by Lowes and his house is smaller than ours. He paid more than double what we did and he didn't get as good shingles. Also, keep in mind that Lowes, Home Depot and Sears contract out their work to independent subs. You could get a really good one, and you could get someone really bad (I've heard a lot of horror stories over the years with everything from carpet, to windows to roofs - my DH is in construction).

We found a younger contractor whose family had been in business for a long time who was branching out on his own (he's been in business on his own for about 5 years). His wasn't the lowest quote (it was somewhere in the middle), but when we asked questions about things he knew the answers, and had some great ideas we hadn't thought of. He and his crew did a wonderful job. We also got the benefit of his family's experience because he had his dad and uncle over working with him part of the time (due to the economy they didn't have any projects going on while our was.)

I would never have one of the big box stores handle the labor, they just gave me a quote on the windows..

We talked to a guy last year, he priced out windows, siding and gutters.. total $36K..

 

[Gigi22]

OP, does your state government offer any rebates for improving the energy efficiency of your house? We recently replaced, and upgraded, our old gas furnace and our a/c, as well as adding some insulation to our basement, and we are getting about $2K in grants and incentives combined from the govt. and the furnace company.

In a similar position to yours, I would put the kitchen renovation on the back burner for a while, unless you can find a good contractor who is willing to work with you on a multi-year renovation plan. In my experience of getting renovations done, you have to concentrate on fixing any structural issues first. Also, how firm is the $7K estimate for your basement? If the work on your foundation has to be done from the exterior, the estimate can be off by a significant amount, depending on the cause of the dampness--we just got a foundation crack fixed at a cost of about half of the original low-end estimate--it could equally have been double the amount, had there been issues with the weeping tile.

 

[southern_redhead]

I would go with a small independent local contractor.

This! We just had both water heaters go out AND a pipe burst under the house. Lowes was going to sell us a $399 HWH and charge us $290 to put it in (then multiply that by two because we had to do both of them ) That didn't even include the burst pipe (that we didn't know about.) We had a local plumber come and he got us HWHs at local hardware stores for $330 and $350 (they were maybe $350 and $370 but he passed his discount on to us.) He installed both HWHs and fixed the pipe and charged us $300 labor. We ended up paying $1200 for the whole thing but could have paid more than that on the HWHs alone and still had to call someone out about the pipe, if they even found it...the plumber found it because after installing the HWH he could still hear water running!

Holy COW!!

......My entire kitchen redo costs us about 13K, and that included appliances, cabinets, and granite! I never realized how much labor must cost to get someone to do it.

Yeah, I was about those quotes too. We had DH's cousin custom build us new cabinets for our kitchen when we moved 7 years ago. Total cost for the cabinets, counters, and all new appliances (DW, Glass Top stove, Fridge) was just under $10,000. He also built us 4 floor to ceiling bookcases over the years - we paid $750 for the one in our family room that holds our TV and books/movies and less than $1000 for the 3 that are in our den that just hold books. It must pay to know the laborer