Hey...Teacher...leave those projects at school!!!

[Lilacs4Me]

Our players get oranges at halftime. They spend 30 minutes running up and down a full field in sometimes 90 degree weather. Nobody goes back and sits with mom and dad, the kids grab an orange, take a knee and listen to the coaches. Its not really a big deal.

30 FULL minutes? 90 degree weather? With shorts and a tshirt on?

How in the world do all those little football and lacrosse players play a 2 hour game in 90 degree heat with all those pads on without oranges at halftime??!! The poor little things.

but since it's not a big deal like you say, maybe it really is true that kids can get through a game without a snack. Hmmmmm

Now back to the original issue this trainwreck of a thread is about....

 

[cjbcam]

I personally think some teachers expect way too much. I'm sorry but there is now way I'm going to cook a meal for 30 kids. Even though I could afford it, why should I have to.
Here I was complaining about sending 48 pencils with my one daughter. Why are 48 pencils needed?

 

[mummabear]

You sound so bitter, you aren't really venting because you keep coming back trying to prove your point and then you try to add more drama (about the science project) so you can get more people on your side. You put yourself in this situation, no one else did. The school does not need to bend to how you feel things should be run, if you want to be in charge of school projects and dictate how things are run go get a teaching credential and become a teacher.

So you don't think anything should change ever? That the education boards shouldn't take on feedback from kids and parents? That they shouldn't make changes to policies and courses based on new information?
We should all carry on learning as we did in 1900?

Teachers assign group projects so students learn to work together and take on different roles. There is more to it than completing the project assigned, it teaches responsibility, getting along with others you might not normally work with, etc

But why can this group work not be completed during class time?

Kids do so much these days with school and outside activities etc. Parents need to put the focus back on education, because like it or not most of our kids aren't going to be professional athletes or play college level sports

There is a lot of learning involved in extra curricular activity, as important as the education they receive at school, and that learning/experiences have nothing to do with a desire to go pro.
Enough of their awake time is spent at school, and research has found no improvement through homework beyond 20 minutes of reading time. Research has in fact found positive family time, play and physical activity all more beneficial than homework.

The DD in question didn't have to. She chose to do this by not joining a group.

Again I ask why was each person not assigned one dish? If they had 3 dishes for 3 people why should 1 person have to do 3. And I'm looking for a better explanation than because she didn't join a group.

The teacher is in charge at school

That's right, in charge at school-not at my house...where apparently this project had to be done.

I personally think some teachers expect way too much. I'm sorry but there is now way I'm going to cook a meal for 30 kids. Even though I could afford it, why should I have to.
Here I was complaining about sending 48 pencils with my one daughter. Why are 48 pencils needed?

Yeah I'm busy complaining to DH that DD5 who starts in term 4 has the same stationary list as DD7 who obviously has started at the beginning of the year? Since all pencils, glue etc goes into a communal pot, it's not like we can just use the unused ones next year but how can they need as many glue sticks for 3 months of school as the whole year?

 

[Hikergirl]

30 FULL minutes? 90 degree weather? With shorts and a tshirt on?

How in the world do all those little football and lacrosse players play a 2 hour game in 90 degree heat with all those pads on without oranges at halftime??!! The poor little things.

but since it's not a big deal like you say, maybe it really is true that kids can get through a game without a snack. Hmmmmm

Now back to the original issue this trainwreck of a thread is about....

Just so you know we are talking about older kids here, and since its the coaches that provide the team a quick boost of energy, a half of an orange during half time it isn't a big deal. Its not about a snack, since its encouraged not to eat right before or during a game.
FTR, I could care less what other teams in other sports do, all I know is what my ds's team does. Is it necessary, probably not but its no different than them grabbing a gatorade instead of water. Maybe you are the type who thinks that kids play sports need to prove how tough they are and that is why you seem to think its hilarious. That's cool, if you are on some macho power trip. I know moms and dads like that. You can pick out ther kids on the field a mile away, and its not in a good way.
I guess our coaches are just regular guys who think the kids could benefit from a little sugar pick me up at half time. Must work, we do pretty well in that second half

 

[scoutie]

I assigned a project in my class right now, so this thread is timely. The kids are designing their own Utopian societies (they just read the book THE GIVER). They had the option to work alone, or with a group. They were told that absolutely nothing needed to be purchased. We've had work days in class, computer lab days, etc. Guess how many kids excitedly greeted me at the door today telling me either how they got together over the weekend to work on the project, that they went to the store to get X, Y, and Z for the project (which was in no way required at all), and how much time they spent on their own doing it? A few kids used google docs, which enabled them to not have to get together, but still collaborate (an option for those complaining about not being able to meet together). Out of my 120 kids......at least 20 did more than was required. These are honors kids--high achieving perfectionists. Just wanted to give another perspective. They all have the rubric, they all know the expectations, none of this extra was required....yet.....I'm sure I have a few parents who were upset that they had to run to the store.

 

[Missy1961]

I assigned a project in my class right now, so this thread is timely. The kids are designing their own Utopian societies (they just read the book THE GIVER). They had the option to work alone, or with a group. They were told that absolutely nothing needed to be purchased. We've had work days in class, computer lab days, etc. Guess how many kids excitedly greeted me at the door today telling me either how they got together over the weekend to work on the project, that they went to the store to get X, Y, and Z for the project (which was in no way required at all), and how much time they spent on their own doing it? A few kids used google docs, which enabled them to not have to get together, but still collaborate (an option for those complaining about not being able to meet together). Out of my 120 kids......at least 20 did more than was required. These are honors kids--high achieving perfectionists. Just wanted to give another perspective. They all have the rubric, they all know the expectations, none of this extra was required....yet.....I'm sure I have a few parents who were upset that they had to run to the store.

That sounds like a cool project!

I may be old (55) but I remember doing outside projects, even group projects. And my mom didn't drive, so we had to make arrangements for me to be driven places if need be. And somehow, we got them done. I'm sure it sucks when you have so many different things to do, but I doubt outside projects are going away.

 

[cjbcam]

I assigned a project in my class right now, so this thread is timely. The kids are designing their own Utopian societies (they just read the book THE GIVER). They had the option to work alone, or with a group. They were told that absolutely nothing needed to be purchased. We've had work days in class, computer lab days, etc. Guess how many kids excitedly greeted me at the door today telling me either how they got together over the weekend to work on the project, that they went to the store to get X, Y, and Z for the project (which was in no way required at all), and how much time they spent on their own doing it? A few kids used google docs, which enabled them to not have to get together, but still collaborate (an option for those complaining about not being able to meet together). Out of my 120 kids......at least 20 did more than was required. These are honors kids--high achieving perfectionists. Just wanted to give another perspective. They all have the rubric, they all know the expectations, none of this extra was required....yet.....I'm sure I have a few parents who were upset that they had to run to the store.

I think this assignment is totally different than cooking for 30 kids. This is an assignment the kids could/should do completely on their own. I have no problem running to the store if the kids need something for a project like this and the cost isn't even comparable.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

I shouldn't jump in, but I can't help myself.

Just a couple of points.

It is crazy that one student had to cook a three course meal for 30 classmates. I would have put my foot down and told the teacher "no." And if it harmed my child's grade, I would have taken to a higher authority. And I would have continued taking it to a higher authority until I had satisfaction. The time and the amount of supplies I would have needed to complete that project is unreasonable. The teacher either needed to assign groups or meal components. No one child should have to feed everyone.

Outside projects are a way of life in school. They happen. Deal with it. Keeping that in mind, projects need to be reasonable. There have always been teachers like the OP's child and there always will be. Parents need to push back then they encounter one.

When I vent about something, I don't expect everyone to agree with me. But I also don't have to agree with my detractors. Everyone has different opinions, different life experiences.

Repeatedly using the wrong word/spelling after being told the correct way, is passive aggressive. And annoying. And many people here do it.

 

[gwynne]

I shouldn't jump in, but I can't help myself.

Just a couple of points.

It is crazy that one student had to cook a three course meal for 30 classmates. I would have put my foot down and told the teacher "no." And if it harmed my child's grade, I would have taken to a higher authority. And I would have continued taking it to a higher authority until I had satisfaction. The time and the amount of supplies I would have needed to complete that project is unreasonable. The teacher either needed to assign groups or meal components. No one child should have to feed everyone.

Outside projects are a way of life in school. They happen. Deal with it. Keeping that in mind, projects need to be reasonable. There have always been teachers like the OP's child and there always will be. Parents need to push back then they encounter one.

When I vent about something, I don't expect everyone to agree with me. But I also don't have to agree with my detractors. Everyone has different opinions, different life experiences.

Repeatedly using the wrong word/spelling after being told the correct way, is passive aggressive. And annoying. And many people here do it.

But the student didn't have to cook a three course meal. She chose to.
That's a consequence of opting to not join a group. Following all of the assignment steps would have saved both time and money.

It is a parental choice if they want to make an issue of this or not.
Me? I'd work with my student to make sure they understood that they don't get to pick and choose what parts of an assignment they wish to do. Paying attention and following directions is often part of the assignment process. I wouldn't blame the teacher or admin for a choice my student made.

 

[mom2rtk]

But the student didn't have to cook a three course meal. She chose to.
That's a consequence of opting to not join a group. Following all of the assignment steps would have saved both time and money.

It is a parental choice if they want to make an issue of this or not.
Me? I'd work with my student to make sure they understood that they don't get to pick and choose what parts of an assignment they wish to do. Paying attention and following directions is often part of the assignment process. I wouldn't blame the teacher or admin for a choice my student made.

It's interesting that some posters here have such an aversion to "snowflake" kids. But I think showing this much disdain for a project and choosing not to be part of a group sort of pushes a kid toward snowflake status.

 

[mummabear]

But the student didn't have to cook a three course meal. She chose to.
That's a consequence of opting to not join a group.

Again beyond punishment, what reason was there for the single students to do all 3 courses when the grouped students would have only had to do 1 each.

It's interesting that some posters here have such an aversion to "snowflake" kids. But I think showing this much disdain for a project and choosing not to be part of a group sort of pushes a kid toward snowflake status.

Out of curiosity, what would have happened if she wanted to be part of a group but none of the other remaining classmates wanted to? Would the teacher have made a group of 4? forced 2 others into a group?nor said tough luck you are on your own?

I think there are several posters that call anothers child a snowflake as an insult anytime they don't agree with their opinions. Apparently on the DIS if your child isn't completely self sufficient, does any after school activities, you provide any help, or disagree with their school about anything they are a snowflake. Personally I think its what posters resort to when they can't make their argument.

 

[roseaster]

Again, in the hypothetical, because I don't believe this is all true there are a few strategies that could have been employed.

The student could have worked in a group. She chose not to.

The student could have chosen a less expensive, complicated meal plan.

The parent could have, other than talking the child to get the needed supplies, chose not to be so involved in this student's project. High school students shpuld be able to complete projects on their own.

The student could have chosen to do only the portion of the project she felt was fair and let the chips fall where they may grade-wise.

Before the project was done the parent could have contacted the school with her concerns regarding the project being too difficult or too expensive.


As I frequently say when people argue about whether schools should allow you to take your kids out for vacation. When you enroll your child in a school, whether it's public o private, you agree to abide by the policies of that school. You may not like them, but your enrollment indicated that you would follow these rules or accept the consequences for not following them.

Home school, cyber schools, private and charter schools are all an option, as is not doing the project or only doing part of the project and accepting the corresponding grade.

This is such an old project I did it in high school. It was, also, such a non issue that I can't even remember what I made and I am certain that I walked to school carrying my project because our town didn't have buses and both my parents worked and left before I did.

 

[gwynne]

Again beyond punishment, what reason was there for the single students to do all 3 courses when the grouped students would have only had to do 1 each.


Out of curiosity, what would have happened if she wanted to be part of a group but none of the other remaining classmates wanted to? Would the teacher have made a group of 4? forced 2 others into a group?nor said tough luck you are on your own?

I think there are several posters that call anothers child a snowflake as an insult anytime they don't agree with their opinions. Apparently on the DIS if your child isn't completely self sufficient, does any after school activities, you provide any help, or disagree with their school about anything they are a snowflake. Personally I think its what posters resort to when they can't make their argument.

I'm not sure what the purpose of an imaginary scenario is, there is already a real one.
I would never assume a teacher would be insensitive or cruel. I don't believe there is any evidence of that in the real situation.

JMO, I think learning how to follow instructions is important. It really doesn't matter if a student is heading to college or vocational school. They all are going to expect that their students listen, follow instructions and complete tasks.

I don't think the student in question was "punished". She made a choice. Hopefully she now knows she doesn't get to pick and choose what parts of the assignment she will complete. Lesson learned, move on.

 

[jevs]

 

[Snap Crackle Pop]

So true, I know that if I were in a group project I would hate to be in a group where people didn't prioritize school over their sport and refused to learn how to manage their time.

 

[jevs]

So true, I know that if I were in a group project I would hate to be in a group where people didn't prioritize school over their sport and refused to learn how to manage their time.

I've done group work at uni, it doesn't get any better because there's always that one person LOL.

 

[Snap Crackle Pop]

I've done group work at uni, it doesn't get any better because there's always that one person LOL.

Yeah I know , luckily I have no problem emailing the teacher that a particular student did not participate or help out. I've also had no problem not putting their name down on the project so they get a zero. (I mean serious business when it comes to group projects, put in your work or don't get a grade.)

 

[mummabear]

I'm not sure what the purpose of an imaginary scenario is, there is already a real one.
I would never assume a teacher would be insensitive or cruel. I don't believe there is any evidence of that in the real situation.

JMO, I think learning how to follow instructions is important. It really doesn't matter if a student is heading to college or vocational school. They all are going to expect that their students listen, follow instructions and complete tasks.

I don't think the student in question was "punished". She made a choice. Hopefully she now knows she doesn't get to pick and choose what parts of the assignment she will complete. Lesson learned, move on.

I think the teacher either needs to decide that being in a group is part of the project or not-is working as a group was part of the learning objective then it should have been set and assessed as such.
But again we are back to the only reason for an individual being required to do all 3 is because the teacher said so. But you don't seem capable of discussing why the teacher decided this and if it was a reasonable decision.

 

[Snap Crackle Pop]

I think the teacher either needs to decide that being in a group is part of the project or not-is working as a group was part of the learning objective then it should have been set and assessed as such.
But again we are back to the only reason for an individual being required to do all 3 is because the teacher said so. But you don't seem capable of discussing why the teacher decided this and if it was a reasonable decision.

I know you love to argue the opposite of the majority, but I'll reply anyway.

She chose to not be in a group it wasn't like no one wanted her in the group, and most teachers would have forced them to accept her in the group. I would not be surprised if she talked to this student and told her that if she was going to do this alone she had to do all three entrees, and made sure that it was what she wanted to do and she said yes. Once again, her choice. She is old enough to know that cooking three meals is no easy task, or she could have picked three SIMPLE recipes because there are options that aren't a lot of work.

 

[mummabear]

I know you love to argue the opposite of the majority, but I'll reply anyway.

She chose to not be in a group it wasn't like no one wanted her in the group, and most teachers would have forced them to accept her in the group. I would not be surprised if she talked to this student and told her that if she was going to do this alone she had to do all three entrees, and made sure that it was what she wanted to do and she said yes. Once again, her choice. She is old enough to know that cooking three meals is no easy task, or she could have picked three SIMPLE recipes because there are options that aren't a lot of work.

I don't argue against the majority for fu - it just seems that I have a different viewpoint in many topics from some on here.

But again you aren't getting to the root of why the teacher has decided that those not part of a group should have to do all 3 in the first place.
When they teacher was planning her lesson-what reasoning did she have behind deciding the requirement for all 3 course for an individual vs 3 course for 3 people in a group.
Are the groups required to cook all 3 together? Or can each group member make 1 course each?