Help in dealing with school please

[grlpwrd]

Does you state have mandated class size limits? Find out what they are before complaining. If they are over the limit, start with the principal, then move to the superintendent, and up to the State Board of Education.

I really don't think it would behoove you to go back and forth with the teacher. You really need to go up the chain of command.

GL! My 15yo dd takes French, too, and I help her because I speak it, too. I also have her supplement her studies with French CDs and such.

 

[punkin]

You know, I find myself in the unfamilliar place of having to defend my child's teacher. It's interesting.

Look, this woman has 5 classes with almost 40 kids each. That's 200 students. Since this is a foreign language, she gives homework and grades it every day. She is very responsive with feedback to the kids. There are also weekly quizzes so she can assess where the kids are since they came from different schools and teaching levels (some of them are also native speakers). If I was doing that job, I'd be overwhelmed and worried that I was shortchanging the kids. I agree with her frustration completely and am, frankly, shocked at some of the responses criticising the teacher.

 

[noodleknitter]

You know, I find myself in the unfamilliar place of having to defend my child's teacher. It's interesting.

Isn't it funny how the world works? I find myself arguing against myself half the time because some dingdong makes a stupid radical remark! And I feel the need to bring back rationality!

Hope it works out for you!

 

[grlpwrd]

You know, I find myself in the unfamilliar place of having to defend my child's teacher. It's interesting.

Look, this woman has 5 classes with almost 40 kids each. That's 200 students. Since this is a foreign language, she gives homework and grades it every day. She is very responsive with feedback to the kids. There are also weekly quizzes so she can assess where the kids are since they came from different schools and teaching levels (some of them are also native speakers). If I was doing that job, I'd be overwhelmed and worried that I was shortchanging the kids. I agree with her frustration completely and am, frankly, shocked at some of the responses criticising the teacher.

I totally understand.

I really think that it is beyond her control and that administration should hire a teacher's aide or similar to help the teacher and class or do something.

Please let us know what happens...

 

[TinkInPink]

I am currently in french three. i started french in 5th grade we had about 20 in our class, even at that level (french one) we had a lot of lecturing and note taking. currently in french 3 i have over 30 kids in my class. we havent had any one on one work with the teacher for about 3 years.

 

[punkin]

Well, I asked for a meeting with the AP. I really doubt we can get anything accomplished for this semester, but maybe is we start nagging now, they could hire someone for next semester. Will let you know how everything goes.

 

[Mickey1122]

They will probably be reluctant to split classes now because it will mean changing a lot of schedules. How long has school been going on?

 

[ElizaB39]

My daughter is 12 and in 7th grade. She has 9! kids in her french class. In all of her major subjects (math, reading, writing, science, ancient history) she has 20.

Frankly, I am amazed at the larger class sizes that are posted on this thread. I guess she is lucky.

 

[JVL1018]

Well, if the limit is 35 and there are 38 students in the class, why doesn't the teacher complain to the union. I know that's what would happen in my town!

When my daughter was in Kindergarten, the class was just at the limit. Many parents went before the School Committee and complained and they hired another teacher. That was quite awhile ago, and with so many budget restrictions today, I'm not sure that would happen again. But, like I said above, if it were even 1 child above the limit, the union wouldn't allow it.

It happened here last year.
We had 48 kids going into Kindergarten. At 50 they would split them up into 3 classes. I'm not sure if they got to over 50, but I know enough parents called(though not me) and sure enough there were 3 K classes. Less than 20 kids per class. DD had 14 children in her class.
38 kids in a class, is unacceptable IMO. They need to split it into two classes.

I have never heard of a public school around here having more than 25 kids in any class.You learn something new every day!

 

[pigletz]

I'm a teacher who has large class sizes. This year all six of my classes are around 35 but I have had years where they have been well above 40. It can be overwhelming especially if you want to give timely feedback to the kids. I have never let on to the students that I was overwhelmed however I have had kids complain that the class sizes were too big. I do tell them to tell their parents to call the board. The union has been trying to lower class sizes for years and the principal has asked for more teachers every year but the board doesn't listen. The only way anything gets changed in our district is if a parent calls and complains. Unfortunatly, we don't have a lot of parents who will complain.

 

[taximomfor4]

My dh started the school year this year (public high school teacher) with 38 kids in a class. By day 2, he had 39. By day 4, a parent was trying to get her kid stuckl into that same class, as the 40th student. DH only had 34 desks in the room...he "borrowed" one from another room and just squeezed it in, but could NOT fit 5 more. So if a student was absent, their seat was taken by one of the added-in kids. Kids complained LOUDLY. Dh explained that his job is to teach the kids assigned to him as effectively as he could. That if they truly had a problem with the class size, that was a battle for them and/or their parents to take up elsewhere. It took about 3 more days before 5 kids were re-scheduled by the guidance office to other class periods...the kids still has my dh as a teacher since he teaches EVERY SINGLE senior, they just had him at a different class period.

As for the OP's situation, that teacher may have said similar to what my dh did. OP didn't necessarily state that the teacher was having a b*tch session. Perhaps she was replying to the kids' complaints. I wasn't there in the room, so don't really know how things were said, or even WHAT was trulyl said.

Perhaps if the OP starts her campaign now, they can arrange better for next year's students. It might be hard to change this year, because they might not be able to find a French teacher who can work such a part-time schedule.

Good luck OP...I, too, feel for your dd's teacher. Are all of her classes so big? If not, the school might learn to distribute the students between class periods better, like they ended up doing with my dh's students.

 

[monsterkitty]

French is considered an elective class. Most states exempt elective classes from their mandated class sizes.

Our foreign language classes are not all lecture and note taking. They are very interactive and hands-on. A class this size would be impossible to teach.

When a teacher asks the parents to complain, I can guarantee you it is because he or she has already done everything in his or her power to get something changed.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

I'll have to ask my boys (8th and 11th grades) how many kids are in their Spanish classes. I doubt that many are in my older sons Spanish class at this point since he's in level 5 and a lot of kids have dropped out by now, but I'm sure the classes were fairly large a couple years ago. And that was the year that he has a lousy teacher half of the year who wouldn't have been able to handle a big class.

Seems that they should assign an aide to your DD's teacher. Would give her an extra set of hands and ears and someone to help grade papers, give tests, etc. Might be enough to help without actually splitting the classes. Don't know that the county would actually do that or even have an aide who would be able to do that since they would need to be fluent in French.

 

[hydster]

In my dd's middle school she'd be lucky if she didn't have almost 40 kids a class every class. That being said they go to only 4 periods a day and have almost 2 hours per class period each day. That way the teacher is able to teach for a longer amount of time with a greater # of students and it works out "ok". Would I rather have smaller class sizes yes but there isn't a whole lot I can do about it.

It's one of those issues that for *ME* wouldn't be a huge issue. True it's a foreign language that is harder to learn but by 9th grade most kids should be able to adapt to a larger class size. The older I got in school the more kids I had in each class until when I finally got to college I had almost 200 people in one of my classes.

I'd get a tutor for your dd and let the teacher do what she needs to do in order to get more help. I was/am a teacher so I get it but she really needs to go through the teaching "channels" and not begging the kids and the parents to fight her fight. JMHO

 

[Luv'sTink]

What if the OP can't afford a tutor?

 

[barkley]

unless the op's daughter is willing/able to work at a much more excellerated pace with less hands on attention the jc may not be a good option. most jc classes take each level of language on in a single class-so depending on if the college does quarters, trimesters or semesters-the student may have to be able/willing to do more work in a shorter period of time. also i would imagine the student would have to take the classes at night-and at least around here the language classes are few and far between and only meet at most 2x per week (so less classroom time vs high school in addition to a faster pace). and honestly, most college classes are not more hands on (as far as teacher giving student individualized attention)-students are given assigments in advance of the class, in class it's reviewed and they are prepped to move on to the next assignment.

in jr/sr high our foreign language classes had as much as 40 or more, and the teachers did a great job of engaging all of us in learning.

 

[hydster]

I just had a few other thoughts:

Ask at your dd's school if they have any after hours tutoring in foreign languages. At my dd's school they have previous students on hand to help the kids for an hour after school each day M-Th and it's free.

Call your local community college and see if they have any students who are doing cheap tutoring. There are college kids that will tutor for anywhere between $5 - $15 a session or some do it monthly charges at least around here.

There are tapes you can get for her or you can usually download the lessons onto an MP3 or an Ipod once you buy them. You can get SOME free French help at http://www.frenchtutorial.com/ or you can do a google search for learning french. There are a multitude of websites that have free lessons and help. Some you can subscribe to for a fee and others you can buy. Do some internet research and see if any of those websites can help.

My dh and I are in the middle of using a program in Spanish so we can refresh when we go back to Mexico in February. It helps a lot and we are getting more and more fluent but then we're old and your dd is not.

And if none of these options work and your dd truly needs to be pulled out then pull her out of French.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

What if the OP can't afford a tutor?

That is true they are very expensive! My dd has a math tutor.

However in her PreAP Chemistry class they have started up a study group.

 

[kwdietrich1]

High School Spanish teacher here! This will be long, sorry! I have to say, teaching a language has come along way since some of you have been in school. Teaching a World Language, is not and can NOT be in a lecture format. It is all about communicating in the target language in multiple ways. We must assess their proficiency in Writing, Speaking/oral, Listening, Reading, and Aural skills. National standards are quite clear, that one CANNOT learn to communicate by being lectured. Everyday, I must determine if my students are meeting the lesson's objectives by individually assessing their speaking and writing skills. I collect written work everyday, and I also make sure I get around to EVERY student during the Block by calling on each student.

National standards for a World language class at the secondary level states that a class size should be no more than 25 students with the ideal goal of no more than 18 students. When I was in highschool, the standards were quite different. There wasn't a push for oral proficiency like today.

I could never imagine having a class that large. We have a language lab in our building. It seats only 26 students, therefore we cannot have more than 26 students in a class.

It is sad that a school principal cannot see how unproductive this situation is. I wouldn't be worried about managing the students' behavior in a large class, rather to adequately teach my students the approved curriculum. It is inevitable that she will not get through all the curriculum, and the students will not be prepared for the next level.

A majority of universitiesin my state require applicants to have successfully completed 3 years of a world language in the same language. If any of these students want to pursue college, this might be a rough start and perhaps turn them off from what otherwise would have been a positive experience.

Go directly to the Superintendant. There has to be some compromise. If they really care about student success, they can and will find a reasonable solution!

I appologize for any possible typos. The arthritis in my hands is acting up!