Guess who has the best selling jersey in the NFL as of today

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Nobody is being forced to do anything. Those players were not marched out their locker room and made to stand.
Players who took knees on the field were not physically lifted and forced to stand.
People in the stand were not acousted by security if they weren't holding their hands over their hearts.

Maybe someone could explain what is actually being forced.
 
Here's the deal for the NFL. They have been placed in a difficult situation. By allowing the kneelers, they are losing a large fan base. This means less $$$, and they are a business. They caved out of PC. It will cost them dearly. That is exactly why as the employer, they have the right to censor their employees (players and coaches) which they have done in many instances in the past.
By the way, hasn't a boycott already been called for by black leaders trying to get a team to cave and sign Kaepernick?

Hmmm...I don't know. "ESPN sports business reporter Darren Rovell wrote, “Preliminary ratings for NFL games on CBS yesterday were UP 4% vs Week 3 of last year. Its pregame show had highest viewership in 7 YEARS.”
 
Nobody is being forced to do anything. Those players were not marched out their locker room and made to stand.
Players who took knees on the field were not physically lifted and forced to stand.
People in the stand were not acousted by security if they weren't holding their hands over their hearts.

Maybe someone could explain what is actually being forced.

Well, a person who shall remain unnamed seems to think that the NFL should fire the ...
 


Sorry, wearing a shirt with a flag on it is not in my or many others opinions equitable to kneeling for the anthem.

Not a discussion. A lecture.

I assume the answer is yes. If that’s what you want to do, that’s totally up to you but it is breaking the official flag code. That’s actually disrespecting the flag...
 
Well, this 97 year old WWII Veteran disagrees with you. I'm sure he is not the only one.

"I want to show support for those kids," Middlemas told his grandson Brennan Gilmore during a chat they shared on Saturday. "They have every right to protest."

View attachment 272729


I love this guy! He looks wonderful for 97. If I took a knee on my bad knee, it would be a 12/step process to get back up,lol.
 
This is what gets me. I keep hearing Harrison Ford and Sean Connery's voices in my head, "Only the penitent man will pass. A penitent man is humble before God. A penitent man kneels before God." In all they times people kneel: in Church, in service of their King, to ask for a woman's hand in marriage when has it been a sign of disrespect and not the ultimate sign of respect and devotion? IMHO, it's a very powerful action to take because as someone mentioned, "the flag is supposed to be a symbol of liberty and justice for all." The protesters believe that is not practiced in reality. So instead of turning their backs, flipping the bird, mooning the flag...they go the opposite way. I sort of interpret in the same vein as, "why hast thou forsaken me?" "What have we (the larger issue, not any specific individual) done to make us deserving of unequal justice, unequal liberty. How have we (again, as a people) failed you (in this case, the flag or this country)?

In this country, it seems like it has been proven again and again that there is no one right way to do something, no one right way to act, no one right way to feel, no one right way to honor... so to see the drum being pounded so hard and so vehemently about how awful and disrespectful they are being. Especially, after seeing reactions about other recent hot button events. It hurts, and I find myself asking the same questions, and more. But it's a lot easier to dismiss, diminish and ignore the "disrespectful."

I will admit I'm conflicted. It goes against everything in me to not stand for the Anthem, so I have a hard time w/ other Americans who don't. But I'm not trying to force my brand of patriotism on anyone, & I don't want anyone to move to North Korea.

It just makes me feel sad, &, yes, I admit there's a part of me that gets my feathers ruffled. A lot of good men & women have served our country.

My dad fought in Vietnam. He doesn't talk much about it. I remember, after the first Gulf War when the military started returning to the United States, one of the only things my dad has ever said about Vietnam - "I hope we don't treat these soldiers the way we were treated when we came back." I will never ever forget his comment, &, even now, I'm teary remembering.

And I know, I know, that people will say kneeling while the Anthem is being played has nothing to do w/ our military. But, if just one veteran is made to feel defeated or disrespected, or like my dad felt years ago, when he/she sees people kneeling in protest, then it *does* affect our military - and I can't be in support of it.

We are fortunate to live in a country where we have liberties & where we're free to protest - rights that people in other countries do not share. But our freedom & our liberties came at a great price, & so I stand out of respect and honor for the sacrifices made.

But your first paragraph really spoke to me & humbled me, & I acknowledge that.

And I also acknowledge that kneeling is probably the most respectful & reverent way to protest. However, I also can see how, while it's not, it could feel like a slap in the face or a middle finger to many of our veterans. (And I know there are some veterans who support the NFL players kneeling - because they fought to give them that right.)

Again, I respect a person's right to protest. I'm grateful we live in a country where we're not forced to stand for the Anthem.

I hate that a certain person has fanned the flames, & we're here - I think, now, because of recent comments, the "kneeling in protest" has gone far beyond what was initially behind it. Now, there are a lot of ugly politics & rhetoric coming from both sides.

Grace, compassion, respect, and kindness are good things we need more of.
 
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I assume the answer is yes. If that’s what you want to do, that’s totally up to you but it is breaking the official flag code. That’s actually disrespecting the flag...


You get it and you aren't even an American.


Now I am having flashbacks of Will Ferrell on SNL rght after 9.11/wearing a flag thong, lol.
 
I can't answer for either of the other posters, but I will answer for myself.

I wear red, white, & blue around patriotic holidays, but our family does not wear clothes made to look like the flag. (For example, I may wear cropped blue jeans w/ a white tank top & a red sleeveless button-up top over the white tank top.) I admit that we have worn the Old Navy flag t-shirts on 4th of July; however, in my mind, the flag in its entirety being printed on a t-shirt is different than wearing clothes that look they are made from the flag, if that makes sense. I don't have an American flag bikini. LOL! We don't own any throw American flag pillows or blankets. However, in July, I decorate our fireplace mantel w/ some red & white striped material & candle holders that are blue w/ star cutouts. I hang a wooden flag on our front door during the month of July as well. We have used napkins w/ flags printed on them during 4th of July celebrations. I can't remember ever using a plate w/ an American flag on it, but I won't say that I haven't.

We also have an American flag flying on our front porch, which, at night, is lit by our porch light. We dispose of used/worn flags correctly.

I know you're trying to make the point that using an American-themed napkin during a 4th of July celebration is just as much of a disrespect to the flag as not standing during the National Anthem, but I will respectfully disagree with you. I think one needs to look at context in both instances. Suggesting that the two things are the same is, at best, a bit disingenuous, &, at worst, rather smug & condescending.


It really doesn’t matter to me one way or another if you (general you) wear flag clothing from head to toe. It’s not my flag so I have no say.

I’m not trying to be condescending or anything, I’m just pointing out the plain fact that doing any of those things is actually written in the flag code as things not to do. It does not mention kneeing during the anthem or when the flag is shown. That’s the only point I’m trying to make.
 
It really doesn’t matter to me one way or another if you (general you) wear flag clothing from head to toe. It’s not my flag so I have no say.

I’m not trying to be condescending or anything, I’m just pointing out the plain fact that doing any of those things is actually written in the flag code as things not to do. It does not mention kneeing during the anthem or when the flag is shown. That’s the only point I’m trying to make.

The US Flag Code is basically an etiquette guide. It does about as much as a Congressional declaration of "National Hamburger Week". Even the parts that deal with mutilation of the flag are unenforceable under the First Amendment.
 
The US Flag Code is basically an etiquette guide. It does about as much as a Congressional declaration of "National Hamburger Week". Even the parts that deal with mutilation of the flag are unenforceable under the First Amendment.


I get that it’s not a law or enforceable or anything..just like there’s no law about kneeling.

That’s the only point I’m trying to make.
 
Well, a person who shall remain unnamed seems to think that the NFL should fire the ...

LOL, well believe me when I say that he does not speak for everyone who is opposed to the act of kneeling.
I believe it is disrespectful, and I believe in the natural consequences of those actions.
I don't feel that they should be fired, but I don't have any issue if the NFL decides that losing half their fans and all that money means something has to change.
If that change is no longer playing the anthem, then so be it. If that means that from here on out players agree to stand when they sign their contracts, then so be it.
 
Here's the deal for the NFL. They have been placed in a difficult situation. By allowing the kneelers, they are losing a large fan base. This means less $$$, and they are a business. They caved out of PC. It will cost them dearly. That is exactly why as the employer, they have the right to censor their employees (players and coaches) which they have done in many instances in the past.
By the way, hasn't a boycott already been called for by black leaders trying to get a team to cave and sign Kaepernick?
What are you basing the bolded on? I believe I heard ratings were up this past weekend. Are some people "giving up" on the NFL because of this? I'm sure. A "large" number? Doubtful.
 
Do you think that the volunteer Chief of the Fire department shouldn't have been forced to apologize? From your post I believe not. You are forcing him to apologize for a belief you hold and he doesn't. Patriotism is a belief and maybe your brand of patriotism is something he doesn't believe.

Of course he shouldn't have been forced to apologize.
 
LOL, well believe me when I say that he does not speak for everyone who is opposed to the act of kneeling.
I believe it is disrespectful, and I believe in the natural consequences of those actions.
I don't feel that they should be fired, but I don't have any issue if the NFL decides that losing half their fans and all that money means something has to change.
If that change is no longer playing the anthem, then so be it. If that means that from here on out players agree to stand when they sign their contracts, then so be it.

I don't really know that the NFL is hurting for fans because of this. People keep throwing that out there but haven't it seems more like a feeling than anything else. Of course maybe that's because I'm in an area where football is worshipped.
I think the idea of the natural consequences of the actions is an important one. This kneeling started happening last season and the NFL decided it was ok. Some fans may have had a problem with it but overall not enough for the NFL to make any changes. Kaepernick wasn't picked up by a team.
What's happening now is a government official trying to use his position to force consequences. That is something everyone should have a problem with.
 
I will admit I'm conflicted. It goes against everything in me to not stand for the Anthem, so I have a hard time w/ other Americans who don't. But I'm not trying to force my brand of patriotism on anyone, & I don't want anyone to move to North Korea.

It just makes me feel sad, &, yes, I admit there's a part of me that gets my feathers ruffled. A lot of good men & women have served our country.

My dad fought in Vietnam. He doesn't talk much about it. I remember, after the first Gulf War when the military started returning to the United States, one of the only things my dad has ever said about Vietnam - "I hope we don't treat these soldiers the way we were treated when we came back." I will never ever forget his comment, &, even now, I'm teary remembering.

And I know, I know, that people will say kneeling while the Anthem is being played has nothing to do w/ our military. But, if just one veteran is made to feel defeated or disrespected, or like my dad felt years ago, when he/she sees people kneeling in protest, then it *does* affect our military - and I can't be in support of it.

We are fortunate to live in a country where we have liberties & where we're free to protest - rights that people in other countries do not share. But our freedom & our liberties came at a great price, & so I stand out of respect and honor for the sacrifices made.

But your first paragraph really spoke to me & humbled me, & I acknowledge that.

And I also acknowledge that kneeling is probably the most respectful & reverent way to protest. However, I also can see how, while it's not, it could feel like a slap in the face or a middle finger to many of our veterans. (And I know there are some veterans who support the NFL players kneeling - because they fought to give them that right.)

Again, I respect a person's right to protest. I'm grateful we live in a country where we're not forced to stand for the Anthem.

I hate that a certain person has fanned the flames, & we're here - I think, now, because of recent comments, the "kneeling in protest" has gone far beyond what was initially behind it. Now, there are a lot of ugly politics & rhetoric coming from both sides.

Grace, compassion, respect, and kindness are good things we need more of.
What a lovely, thoughtful response.
 
I don't really know that the NFL is hurting for fans because of this. People keep throwing that out there but haven't it seems more like a feeling than anything else. Of course maybe that's because I'm in an area where football is worshipped.
I think the idea of the natural consequences of the actions is an important one. This kneeling started happening last season and the NFL decided it was ok. Some fans may have had a problem with it but overall not enough for the NFL to make any changes. Kaepernick wasn't picked up by a team.
What's happening now is a government official trying to use his position to force consequences. That is something everyone should have a problem with.

All government officials try to use their position to force consequences on things they disagree with and support. Name anyone anywhere and you will find it.
 
LOL, well believe me when I say that he does not speak for everyone who is opposed to the act of kneeling.
I believe it is disrespectful, and I believe in the natural consequences of those actions.
I don't feel that they should be fired, but I don't have any issue if the NFL decides that losing half their fans and all that money means something has to change.
If that change is no longer playing the anthem, then so be it. If that means that from here on out players agree to stand when they sign their contracts, then so be it.

The NFL is not going to lose half their fans. It won't happen.
 
What are you basing the bolded on? I believe I heard ratings were up this past weekend. Are some people "giving up" on the NFL because of this? I'm sure. A "large" number? Doubtful.
Actually ratings were down for a lot of channels during the games this Sunday. Only one channel had a slight increase.
 
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