Grand Californian Trip Report

[LIFERBABE]

Have fun!!!

If you have the standard room category booked (non theme park view), request something in the courtyard. The monorail runs right thru that courtyard all day long. We were seeing the new red monorail, too, but I don't think we ever got a photo of it.

Make sure you get to DCA right at opening for Toy Story Mania. Like I said, 10-15 minutes after opening the line was huge, but people were leaving big gaps so the size was deceptive. They did do a good job of putting up cover so you should be in the shade most of the time.

Be sure to try the Monster's Inc ride at DCA. Disney doesn't make many new dark rides these days, and I think it's one of the better ones in all of the parks.

The DL versions of PotC, Buzz and Space Mountain are better than WDW. Haunted Mansion is a toss-up now that the WDW version got plussed a couple years ago. As for Big Thunder, I liked the theming better at DL but the ride itself is better at WDW. And Splash Mnt is definitely better at WDW.

Make sure you get FastPasses for Indy, but take your time walking thru the queue because it's a lot of fun.

And don't forget your DVC ID card because we got discounts everywhere including Blue Bayou (DL), Storyteller's Cafe (GC), White Water Cafe (GC) and Goofy's Kitchen (DLH).

Oh, and try to take a few minutes to check out the Villa model rooms. The sales center is right across the street from the Grand Californian, so it's about a 5 minute walk. Just walk out the main entrance...up the drive...straight across the street and then keep walking about 200 feet. The sales center is a small building pretty much straight ahead and to the left of the Disneyland Hotel.

Thank you Tim for all the great tips!! I am printing this out

I can't believe we will be there tomorrow night!!

I will request courtyard. I tried to book concierge, but they were sold out so I just went with standard.

 

[tjkraz]

I wonder what the annual dues for the dvc gcv would be. With only 50 units, I hope the dues won't be as high as the ones in florida. It should probably be 1/4 of what the current dvc dues are. After all, it seems that dvc gcv is sharing the space with the hotel rather than the other way around. Any speculative ideas?

Since dues are expressed on a per-point basis, I wouldn't expect the small size of the Villa component to have any positive effect on the dues. There's no distinction made as to who is sharing with whom--the entire resort operating budget is calculated and owners will pay dues based upon the size of their presence in the resort.

Let's say that the DVC villas end up being 10% of the resort. The resort will issue budget projects for all the typical items: front desk, housekeeping, recreation (pool), landscaping, and so on. Whatever the budgeted figures are in those areas, the DVC owners would collectively pay 10%.

The point charts will play a large role in this. If the per-night costs for a single room are higher than what we've seen before, there will be more points in circulation. More points means that each point pays a smaller portion of the dues.

Example:

If you have an operating budget of $500k and 100k points in circulation, the dues will be $5 per point.

But if you have a budget of $500k and 150k points, each point only pays $3.33 in dues. Of course, under this second option it would cost more to spend a single night at the resort so members really aren't saving anything.

If anything I would expect dues to be higher than FL since the California cost-of-living is greater. Property taxes could also be an issue.

 

[ACDSNY]

I expect dues will be around the same as SSR as GC will not have any transportation costs to budget for.

 

[tjkraz]

I expect dues will be around the same as SSR as GC will not have any transportation costs to budget for.

Unless you have some insider information, I still think we need to wait for the point charts to make any educated guesses.

While the operating costs may (or may not) be similar to a resort like SSR, the number of points over which those costs will be spread is completely unknown. The points chart will play a large role in determining how much weight each point will bear.

Property taxes will also play a role, and my understanding is that CA tends to be noticeably higher than FL.

 

[toocherie]

Unless you have some insider information, I still think we need to wait for the point charts to make any educated guesses.

While the operating costs may (or may not) be similar to a resort like SSR, the number of points over which those costs will be spread is completely unknown. The points chart will play a large role in determining how much weight each point will bear.

Property taxes will also play a role, and my understanding is that CA tends to be noticeably higher than FL.

actually, unless the property ownership was transferred recently, property taxes should not be bad--Calif. has Prop. 13 which limits tax increases to 2% every year unless there is a change in ownership or other trigger (rather than many states which re-assess based on value every year). Since the law was enacted many years ago hopefully Disney structured any transfer that might have taken place to take advantage of exceptions which would have kept the taxes stable (and at rates dating back to 1978).

 

[tjkraz]

actually, unless the property ownership was transferred recently, property taxes should not be bad--Calif. has Prop. 13 which limits tax increases to 2% every year unless there is a change in ownership or other trigger (rather than many states which re-assess based on value every year). Since the law was enacted many years ago hopefully Disney structured any transfer that might have taken place to take advantage of exceptions which would have kept the taxes stable (and at rates dating back to 1978).

Did not know that. Thanks for the info!

 

[dwelty]

actually, unless the property ownership was transferred recently, property taxes should not be bad--Calif. has Prop. 13 which limits tax increases to 2% every year unless there is a change in ownership or other trigger (rather than many states which re-assess based on value every year). Since the law was enacted many years ago hopefully Disney structured any transfer that might have taken place to take advantage of exceptions which would have kept the taxes stable (and at rates dating back to 1978).

Not exacty right. You are right about how prop 13 works in relation to increasing taxes, however, the assesed value of a structure is determined when construction is finished. And is based on land and structure value.The Grand would have been assesed at it's year 2000 value, and that is when the 2% a year rule kicks in.
The law does not mean that every tax rate is set to 1978 values, it says after initial valuation, tax rates can increase no more than 2% a year)


The value of the Grand will be re-assesed when the addition is finished, but the value will only be increased in an amount equal to the cost of new construction, not a new assesed market value.

I know all of this because I live in California and recently did an addition to my house.

Suprisingly, the tax rate is actually lower in California than in Florida. What makes property taxes generally higher in California than in Florida is the fact that both rates are based on property valuation, and California has generally higher property values than Florida, Especially comparing Orange County California to Orange County Florida.

An interesting side note, the Democratic wing of the California ledgislature has been trying to overturn prop 13 for years because it limits the amount they can raise taxes, however, the law requires a 2/3 vote to be overturned, so they have not been successful.

 

[stopher1]

First off - thanks Tim for the great report. I loved reading it. We were just out there last month staying at the DLH on points. It was terrific, and we had a wonderful time. DW, 1st DS and I are all CA natives, and I worked at DL in the '80's in hs and college - so I have a natural affinity for my favorite Disney park... and am so very excited about adding on at the GC when able. I got to see those beautiful models too, and was sure to take tons of pictures. I read your updates on your website the past couple of days too - and really enjoyed them. Thanks!!

When they did the last construction changes and hotel rehab, they took out as many of the older structures as they could - the towers and convention center were effectively untouched. The old monorail station and restaurant was destroyed, along with the Bungalows, the Japanese Garden Villas, the huge gift shops, the old Goofy's Kitchen, etc. The pool area previously extended almost to the waterfalls and that was restructured to add the waterslides Remember the paddleboat lagoon? Then, there is the abandoned "Dancing Waters" in the back by the Waterfalls. Over half the time, the lower levels of the waterfalls are blocked access, for safety reasons. One year it was always open, the next, ropes were up and the paths were blocked. I can see where they wouldn't want to touch the pools and plumbing structures that interconnect all of those features. What a nightmare!

I remember all of these things! It was a sad day when the bungalows came down, and sad when the monorail no longer actually took you to the hotel complex... oh well - overall I like DTD - but those changes sure made the DLH a different place. I love the waterfalls, but it was really sad to walk by the old "Dancing Waters" area last month and remember that kitschy show. DW and I spent our 1st anniversary at the hotel and many times would go for dinner at the park and wander over to the hotel to enjoy the grounds.

I also agree that a water park wouldn't be successful for them here. It doesn't get hot enough for long enough to warrant it. Because it cools down at night, the water would require heating units all year - an expensive proposition. Look at all the folks on the boards here who complain that they can't swim in the DLH pool because it isn't heated. Even Raging Waters in San Dimas is only open from select May weekends through select September weekends. Public pools here close by then end of August, too. Different climate!

Yeah, growing up in So. Cal, the few water parks we had back then were definitely seasonal. The few that are there today are seasonal. That water park story has circulated for years, but while I would personally LOVE to have a Disney quality water park in So Cal - I don't believe it would work very well.

 

[toocherie]

Not exacty right. You are right about how prop 13 works in relation to increasing taxes, however, the assesed value of a structure is determined when construction is finished. And is based on land and structure value.The Grand would have been assesed at it's year 2000 value, and that is when the 2% a year rule kicks in.
The law does not mean that every tax rate is set to 1978 values, it says after initial valuation, tax rates can increase no more than 2% a year)


The value of the Grand will be re-assesed when the addition is finished, but the value will only be increased in an amount equal to the cost of new construction, not a new assesed market value.

I know all of this because I live in California and recently did an addition to my house.

Suprisingly, the tax rate is actually lower in California than in Florida. What makes property taxes generally higher in California than in Florida is the fact that both rates are based on property valuation, and California has generally higher property values than Florida, Especially comparing Orange County California to Orange County Florida.

An interesting side note, the Democratic wing of the California ledgislature has been trying to overturn prop 13 for years because it limits the amount they can raise taxes, however, the law requires a 2/3 vote to be overturned, so they have not been successful.

Yes, you're right that the STRUCTURE will be re-assessed, but I don't believe the land component gets re-assessed. There are two different categories of assessments on California tax bills--land and improvements. Presuming (which I don't know for sure) that Disney has owned the land under the Grand since 1978 the land value (which in my opinion would be the largest component of value) should not have increased more than 2% per year since then . . . . unless Disney transferred the ownership to a subsidiary in a way that did not come under the exceptions for re-assessment.

 

[toocherie]

also, it's interesting to note that there have been not only attempts at overturning Prop. 13 in its entirety, but also attempts to create a "split roll" scenario, where residential properties would continue to be protected by the Prop. 13 provisions, but commercial properties would be re-assessed on an annual basis to market value--that would certainly have an effect on Disney and DVC costs if that happened--but given the strong business lobby in Calif. I don't see that coming to fruition.

 

[dwelty]

Yes, you're right that the STRUCTURE will be re-assessed, but I don't believe the land component gets re-assessed. There are two different categories of assessments on California tax bills--land and improvements. Presuming (which I don't know for sure) that Disney has owned the land under the Grand since 1978 the land value (which in my opinion would be the largest component of value) should not have increased more than 2% per year since then . . . . unless Disney transferred the ownership to a subsidiary in a way that did not come under the exceptions for re-assessment.

You are right. Since that land has been owned by Disney since 1954 only the structure should have been re-assesed in 2000. I stand corrected. I do think the tax component will be the second highest piece of the Maintenance fees after payroll. Payroll Will probably be much higer than other DVC resorts since the cost of living is so high here (at least until Hawaii opens). Transportation remains to be seen. There are no buses here, and the monorail is really not a necessary mode of transportation, and moreover, does not stop at the Grand. Utilities are really high here, especially electricity.

 

[Longhairbear]

... There are no buses here.....

Slightly off topic, but if, or once the second DVC is built on, or off property, shuttle vans might be used to get guests to DTD to walk to the Esplanade, or take the monorail into Tomorrowland. Buses would be overkill, as everything is so close to each other.

 

[Laneychris]

So after DVC is open we will be limited to DVC and no hotel rooms. I hadn't thought of that. We are going next year and staying at the CG.

 

[Lexxiefern]

Thanks for the great info Tim! We stayed at the GC last year and loved it. I am going next weekend and trying out the DLH this time (on points). I figured I would save a few points and try out a new hotel. Do you know if we get a DVC discount at the restaurants in all the hotels as well? I seem to remember from last year, that between my DVC card, AAA and the disney visa, I got a discount at every restaurant we ate at.

About not being able to book GC regular hotel rooms after GCV is done, do we know this for certain? It seems to me like there aren't that many villas right? Aren't only some for points and some will be cash? I wonder if GC will be like Vero beach in the sense that we can book villas or regular hotel rooms?