GM to lay off 30,000 people

[cardaway]

Thank god for unions or most of working America would still be working in the sweatshops 12 hours a day.

That hasn't been true for decades. There are thousands of non-union companies paying compitive wages and benefits because they have to compete with each other for the best workers. Do they get as much as the union places? No, but they have a better chance of being around longer than the places with unions that will move or close because they no longer want to support the overhead.

 

[S. C.]

No one forced GM or any other company to offer "great benefits" - to jerk them (pension or other promised benefits) out from under people after years of service amounts to nothing more than stealing. Actuaries and accounts are responsible for making accurate projections on future cost, so don't try to tell me that these companies didn't see the "financial strain" coming.


Thank god for unions or most of working America would still be working in the sweatshops 12 hours a day.

ITA

Also I don't hear anyone complaining when the workers of the big three BUY services and merchandise from the companies that they work for which is helping to keep them in their JOBS.


Everyone is so down on the workers making a decent living.
What about the CEO's does everyone really believe they are worth millions in pay a year? plus they drive company cars for free and take lots of company paid trips. Not to mention the millions in bonus money that they get.

 

[S. C.]

I worked for four years in an unheated, unairconditioned auto parts warehouse, making maybe $1 an hour above minimum. It was horribly hot in the summer, freezing cold in the winter. It was hard, heavy labor intensive work. Anne

Did you forget your experience in the auto parts warehouse when you called us GM assembly line workers overpaid button pushers?

To supplement my income I worked two p/t jobs, one as a waittress, and the other in retail. For a good half of my adult life I've held at least two jobs. I earned it all. I worked for it. And I'm proud of that fact. And I NEVER had a union get any of it for me. Anne

HMMMMM....Nobody who worked union jobs bought anything from the places you worked for to help keep you working? Including the AUTO PARTS WAREHOUSE?

 

[ducklite]

Did you forget your experience in the auto parts warehouse when you called us GM assembly line workers overpaid button pushers?

HMMMMM....Nobody who worked union jobs bought anything from the places you worked for to help keep you working? Including the AUTO PARTS WAREHOUSE?

Nope. You are missing the point. Those parts would have been there whether made by a union worker or not. They were bought by union and non-union workers. If you think otherwise you are fooling no one but yourself. And how do you expect me to have sympathy? I made about half of what those union people are making, with no benefits, and instead of spending my life in a pity party blaming everyone but myself, I realized that there was a better way to live my life and worked my way up and out.

I didn't depend on a union in a long collapsing industry to bail me out, I figured it out on my own before it was too late and did something about it.

Anne

 

[mickeyfan2]

No one forced GM or any other company to offer "great benefits"

Really? So the union strikes were not there to force GM to give benefits they told the union they could not pay?

 

[mickman1962]

My BIL works for Metro North (union) and he told me the starting pay for the people that sweep out the trains each day (not even remotely close to skilled labor) start at over $19.00/hr + full benefits. As soon as any of you pro-union people can give a LOGICAL explanation of that, then I will change my mind about unions. Until then I firmly believe that unions have out lived their usefulness and are actually detrimental to both business and the employee in the long run.

 

[bimshire]

You're so right mickeysgal, it will indeed affect EVERYONE, regardless if you have a plant in town or not.

What has to change? More people need to BUY AMERICAN. Too many are buying foreign cars. Back in the day american cars were not as good. But for quite awhile now they have been rated as good, if not better.

But even if they were NOT better, think of the big picture ~we live in America. These buying trends are happening across the board in all kinds of consumer goods; whatever seems cheaper is what people buy, without thinking of the big picture, the long term consequences. There are cut-backs being made in every industry. Makes one wonder where it will all end.....

Sorry, but I don't believe in that type of charity. Build quality and people will consider to switching back to American. We have two Honda and are quite satified.
It was kind of ironic after 9/11 that the Chinese or Koreans(can't remember which) were featured on Nightline working around the clock to supply us with US flags.

 

[ducklite]

My BIL works for Metro North (union) and he told me the starting pay for the people that sweep out the trains each day (not even remotely close to skilled labor) start at over $19.00/hr + full benefits. As soon as any of you pro-union people can give a LOGICAL explanation of that, then I will change my mind about unions. Until then I firmly believe that unions have out lived their usefulness and are actually detrimental to both business and the employee in the long run.

And even first thing in the morning those trains are STILL filthy, so see what those high paid union workers are giving you for your money?

Anne

 

[tandrjohn]

My BIL works for Metro North (union) and he told me the starting pay for the people that sweep out the trains each day (not even remotely close to skilled labor) start at over $19.00/hr + full benefits. As soon as any of you pro-union people can give a LOGICAL explanation of that, then I will change my mind about unions. Until then I firmly believe that unions have out lived their usefulness and are actually detrimental to both business and the employee in the long run.

Not pro-union but your BIL's numbers are off. Here is a link to the job description of a coach cleaner for Metro North:

http://as0.mta.info/mnr/html/employ...er=3820700126450602400000&title=Coach Cleaner

As you can see the starting wage of a coach cleaner is $14.08 (70% of $20.11). The full wage of $20.11 is achieved after 10 years I believe.

Is $29,268 a year fair for this type of work in the NYC area? I have no idea.

COACH CLEANER

MTA Metro-North Railroad, an organization with a vital role in the economy of New York State and Connecticut, is a subsidiary agency of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority (MTA), the largest such authority in the United States. Metro-North is a dynamic organization with a strong focus on customer service, safety, new technologies, and service expansion. With a staff of approximately 5,500 people, Metro-North serves more than one million customers per week over 384 miles of rail that link historic Grand Central Terminal (GCT) in New York City and 120 stations in New York State and Connecticut. Metro-North rewards employee resourcefulness, encourages innovation and offers excellent job opportunities in a challenging and diverse environment.

RESPONSIBILITIES

Coach Cleaners are responsible for cleaning the interior and exterior portions of our passenger rail cars. Specific duties include: sweeping; mopping; picking up trash and newspapers; cleaning seats, windows and lavatories; and, fumigating car interiors.

QUALIFICATIONS

Applicants must demonstrate experience in commercial cleaning or where manual labor was involved in a commercial activity.

SENIORITY

New employees will establish seniority in the Transport Workers Union (TWU), the union representing Coach Cleaners, in accordance with the union's current collective bargaining agreement.

ASSIGNMENTS

Assignments can be to any location on the company's lines, plus the days and hours you work can change frequently.

RATE OF PAY

The wage progression scale is as follows: 70>75>80>85>90>100%. The full rate of pay is $20.11/hour.

OTHER COMMENTS

This is a safety sensitive position and subject to toxicological testing.

SELECTION CRITERIA

The selection method is based on the applicant meeting the minimum requirements in the job posting, an interview, and an evaluation of an applicant's ability to perform the responsibilities of the position. Not all qualified applicants are guaranteed an interview due to the competitive selection process. All selected candidates will be subject to a full background investigation.

HOW TO APPLY

Select "Apply for a Position" to go to the "Applicant Home" where you will click on the "View Job Postings/Apply for Job" link. Under the "Job Categories" section on that page, select "Craft/Union," "Professional," or both, and click on the "Search" button to see all applicable job postings. Under the "Job Basket" column, check all the positions you wish to apply for, and then click on the "Apply for Jobs in Basket" button at the bottom of the screen. This will take you to the "Apply for Job" screen where you can begin the online application process.

If you are a current user, enter your email address and password; if you are a new user, select the "Are you a new applicant?" link to register. Please remember to select the "Paste Resume Text" option. We may not be able to process your application without your resume.

MTA Metro-North Railroad is An Equal Opportunity Employer

 

[S. C.]

Nope. You are missing the point. Those parts would have been there whether made by a union worker or not. They were bought by union and non-union workers. If you think otherwise you are fooling no one but yourself. And how do you expect me to have sympathy? I made about half of what those union people are making, with no benefits, and instead of spending my life in a pity party blaming everyone but myself, I realized that there was a better way to live my life and worked my way up and out.

I didn't depend on a union in a long collapsing industry to bail me out, I figured it out on my own before it was too late and did something about it.

Anne

I never said that the parts were not bought by non union workers.

You said that unions did not help you with your income. I was pointing out that yes they did. Union people buy things from retail and go to restaurants to eat. buying these services with money they made from their union jobs.

I never asked you to have sympathy. But in a way is that not saying that all of us should not have sympathy if a hurricane blows your house down since you knew you were building it in a hurricane state? <----I pray that it never happens to you or anyone else again just using this as an example.

 

[ducklite]

I never asked you to have sympathy. But in a way is that not saying that all of us should not have sympathy if a hurricane blows your house down since you knew you were building it in a hurricane state? <----I pray that it never happens to you or anyone else again just using this as an example.

That's why I did two things. One, had my house built by a top notch builder with top notch materials in a manner which exceeds code. Two carry home owners with a company with good financials and a good history of paying claims.

It's called personal responsibility. If I worked in a trade that for years has seen massive layoffs, I would have long ago learned skills in a field like medicine or paraprofessional so that I could step gracefully away as the place collapsed around me.

BTW--Even if the unions didn't exist, those same people would have bought those same parts--to think otherwise is a fools game.

Anne

 

[mickman1962]

Not pro-union but your BIL's numbers are off. Here is a link to the job description of a coach cleaner for Metro North:

http://as0.mta.info/mnr/html/employ...er=3820700126450602400000&title=Coach Cleaner

As you can see the starting wage of a coach cleaner is $14.08 (70% of $20.11). The full wage of $20.11 is achieved after 10 years I believe.

Is $29,268 a year fair for this type of work in the NYC area? I have no idea.

COACH CLEANER

MTA Metro-North Railroad, an organization with a vital role in the economy of New York State and Connecticut, is a subsidiary agency of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority (MTA), the largest such authority in the United States. Metro-North is a dynamic organization with a strong focus on customer service, safety, new technologies, and service expansion. With a staff of approximately 5,500 people, Metro-North serves more than one million customers per week over 384 miles of rail that link historic Grand Central Terminal (GCT) in New York City and 120 stations in New York State and Connecticut. Metro-North rewards employee resourcefulness, encourages innovation and offers excellent job opportunities in a challenging and diverse environment.

RESPONSIBILITIES

Coach Cleaners are responsible for cleaning the interior and exterior portions of our passenger rail cars. Specific duties include: sweeping; mopping; picking up trash and newspapers; cleaning seats, windows and lavatories; and, fumigating car interiors.

QUALIFICATIONS

Applicants must demonstrate experience in commercial cleaning or where manual labor was involved in a commercial activity.

SENIORITY

New employees will establish seniority in the Transport Workers Union (TWU), the union representing Coach Cleaners, in accordance with the union's current collective bargaining agreement.

ASSIGNMENTS

Assignments can be to any location on the company's lines, plus the days and hours you work can change frequently.

RATE OF PAY

The wage progression scale is as follows: 70>75>80>85>90>100%. The full rate of pay is $20.11/hour.

OTHER COMMENTS

This is a safety sensitive position and subject to toxicological testing.

SELECTION CRITERIA

The selection method is based on the applicant meeting the minimum requirements in the job posting, an interview, and an evaluation of an applicant's ability to perform the responsibilities of the position. Not all qualified applicants are guaranteed an interview due to the competitive selection process. All selected candidates will be subject to a full background investigation.

HOW TO APPLY

Select "Apply for a Position" to go to the "Applicant Home" where you will click on the "View Job Postings/Apply for Job" link. Under the "Job Categories" section on that page, select "Craft/Union," "Professional," or both, and click on the "Search" button to see all applicable job postings. Under the "Job Basket" column, check all the positions you wish to apply for, and then click on the "Apply for Jobs in Basket" button at the bottom of the screen. This will take you to the "Apply for Job" screen where you can begin the online application process.

If you are a current user, enter your email address and password; if you are a new user, select the "Are you a new applicant?" link to register. Please remember to select the "Paste Resume Text" option. We may not be able to process your application without your resume.

MTA Metro-North Railroad is An Equal Opportunity Employer

OK numbers may be off slightly but with shift differential it's over $16 an hour to start and don't forget full benefits which I'm sure would easily bring the total compensation to well over $20 an hour. And yes ducklite the trains are filthy in the morning as it's nearly impossible to get fired from a union. My point again is non skilled (pushing a broom is about as non skilled as you can get) should not warrant these type of wages no matter where they are being done. Union labor costs have killed the US manufacturing/service industry. You can choose to believe it or not, but time will prove me correct.

 

[ducklite]

OK numbers may be off slightly but with shift differential it's over $16 an hour to start and don't forget full benefits which I'm sure would easily the total compensation to well over $20 an hour. And yes ducklite the trains are filthy in the morning as it's nearly impossible to get fired from a union. My point again is non skilled (pushing a broom is about as non skilled as you can get) should not warrant these type of wages no matter where they are being done. Union labor costs have killed the US manufacturing/service industry. You can choose to believe it or not, but time will prove me correct.

Um...I've been expressing that same senitment all along...

Anne

 

[Puffy2]

What about the CEO's does everyone really believe they are worth millions in pay a year? plus they drive company cars for free and take lots of company paid trips. Not to mention the millions in bonus money that they get.

Now your are on to something! The real problem with these mega corporations - they hire "CEO's" at huge salaries (hundreds of thousands) with multiple perks (private jet, car, vacations, homes) - they CEO stays around for a few years, making decisions for the company that are only good for the short haul (because he/she has absolutlely no intention of sticking around longer than a few years) so the company suffers in the long run - some even go bankrupt, but not without paying the HUGE severace package to the CEO first. Two examples SciTrek Atlanta and Mirant - both CEOs made off like bandits while running the companies into the ground. Shameful.

The problem with these corporations is at the top - not at the bottom.