Gator grabs 2 year old at Grand Floridian?

[mshanson3121]

Disney doesn't have to hold their hands they are people who can think, Disney actively prevented the problem the best they could for 45 years without an incident. As I already said this situation has occurred 1 times in over a BILLION guests who have visited Disney since it opened. If that's to big of a risk for you then go live in your bubble and never come out because it won't be safe anywhere you do.

Actually there was an attack in the 80s. The child survived. Someone else in the board mentioned being chased by one. Sightings in the parks are getting more common. This was not a first encounter. Also you have to remember gator population has exploded in recent years - the risk then was not at all what it is now. Still small numbers yes. But the warning signs, albeit subtle, were there.

 

[Delgado]

My "guess"? People would be blaming the parent for ignoring the warning signs.
Either way - it's a horrible tragedy, that Disney needs to take reasonable steps for preventing further incidents.

But there werent signs. Signs stating gators in the area not just the water. Disney has an obligation to educate people on their surroundings at THEIR property. Disney has an obligation not to encourage recreation on the beach areas. Again, disney caters to children and its not okay for the resorts to be open to the water with sand. Children playing in the sand, relaxing on hammocks, whatever the case maybe. I am so sick of this blaming the parents "what kind of idiots let their child in the water at dark" ..what kind of company shows a movie on that same beach in the dark. I am not sure one person has said kill all the alligators, elephants, bees, and whatever. Most people are saying people shouldn't be on the beaches/ in the water. And idk who said it but yes disney ignored it til it was a problem. And apparently they knew people were feeding gators so why wasn't that fixed? Yes they ignored it because pepper don't want to see an alligator warning sign feet away from them, disney wants to sell those beaches and happily take their money. I'm not saying disney doesn't feel horrible about what happened but they knew it was a possibility but because of that iy will never happen attitude a child was taken from this earth. That's not fair to say one in a million. And its just an accident. That's crap. Disney is held to a much higher standard. As one person put it very falsely so. And he's right. This is an eye opener.

I addressed that part of your post because it showed the tone of the rest. Do you honestly believe that Disney knew the danger and chose not to address it due to money concerns? Please take the tinfoil hat off. Considering that there has not been a single case of alligator attack in Disney since they opened the gates before this? Is it POSSIBLE that the threat was was so negligible that there was thought to be no need for additional signage? Maybe Disney had more faith in human intelligence than was warranted. Nah, Disney is the EVIL EMPIRE that wants to take all your money and has 0 concern for your safety. Please disregard all the seat belts, height restrictions, roped off areas, etc, those are just for aesthetics. You run the risk of getting struck by a meteor as well. Maybe they should put up signs warning of that as well. THAT is how ridiculous your suggestion is.

A meteor, really that's the argument.

 

[poison ivy]

There's been far less intelligent commentary in this discussion here, than this. I'm trying to put some of those comments into perspective. If a snapping turtle had bit off a childs toes, would we be expecting Disney to go after every snapping turtle on property? Would we want signage up warning guests of the dangers of snapping turtles?

You may want to put comparing a snapping turtle who bit off a toe to a gator that killed a child in with the far less intelligent commentary.

 

[Disco]

Gator population has increased exponentially since then.

Why has the gator population increased so much?!

 

[dlavender]

I honestly don't get the stance that a sign stating the dangers of alligators is not warranted after this situation. This thread has proved the need for their existence.

 

[XXRAINMANX]

So looking at that sign, you would assume it meant something good?

I'll take the chance that there are 4 people in the entire world that would look at that sign and think it meant "free candy" so that the other 99.999999% of the world would get the gist and better understand the risks of getting close to the water.

Not sure why you would be against putting that sign up versus the other gentile "no swimming" sign.

I'm by no means against putting up said sign, I'm just saying that regardless of what sign is put up or what happens situations like this can still occur regardless. Your sign is more blunt, but for those who don't know what symbols mean won't understand the signage anymore than the current sign.

Yes the current sign does not convey that danger could exist in the water for X,Y,Z reasons, but it does convey that the water could be dangerous for an unknown reason. Similarly the signs outside rides suggest that certain individuals with medical conditions shouldn't ride the ride, but it doesn't give the end result reasoning for why they shouldn't ride. If Disney told everyone the risks of every tiny thing that might happen on property if they were to do this or that or one thing or another then everyone would question Disney's safety on anything.

At the end of it all it's still just a bad situation for anyone to be in.

 

[mshanson3121]

But there werent signs. Signs stating gators in the area not just the water. Disney has an obligation to educate people on their surroundings at THEIR property. Disney has an obligation not to encourage recreation on the beach areas. Again, disney caters to children and its not okay for the resorts to be open to the water with sand. Children playing in the sand, relaxing on hammocks, whatever the case maybe. I am so sick of this blaming the parents "what kind of idiots let their child in the water at dark" ..what kind of company shows a movie on that same beach in the dark. I am not sure one person has said kill all the alligators, elephants, bees, and whatever. Most people are saying people shouldn't be on the beaches/ in the water. And idk who said it but yes disney ignored it til it was a problem. And apparently they knew people were feeding gators so why wasn't that fixed? Yes they ignored it because pepper don't want to see an alligator warning sign feet away from them, disney wants to sell those beaches and happily take their money. I'm not saying disney doesn't feel horrible about what happened but they knew it was a possibility but because of that iy will never happen attitude a child was taken from this earth. That's not fair to say one in a million. And its just an accident. That's crap. Disney is held to a much higher standard. As one person put it very falsely so. And he's right. This is an eye opener.

A meteor, really that's the argument.

If you read what i was replying to, you would see i was replying to a hypothetical question of what the response would be if there HAD been signs. Im well aware there are none. Im one of the ones saying there should be.

 

[ELSA711]

I honestly don't get the stance that a sign stating the dangers of alligators is not warranted after this situation. This thread has proved the need for their existence.

They definitely need signs that show a vivid picture of an alligator and the word DANGER!. No swimming doesn't cut it but I don't blame Disney 100% but they do need to fix this. I can't believe this happened, still I'm sitting here and thinking of the horror that father must have felt.

 

[Belle83]

We simply don't know enough facts to know whether Disney was negligent. I am inclined to think that Disney wasn't negligent, but you never know. Those poor parents, it is simply unimaginable and my heart breaks for them and their family.

 

[Disco]

But there werent signs. Signs stating gators in the area not just the water. Disney has an obligation to educate people on their surroundings at THEIR property. Disney has an obligation not to encourage recreation on the beach areas. Again, disney caters to children and its not okay for the resorts to be open to the water with sand. Children playing in the sand, relaxing on hammocks, whatever the case maybe. I am so sick of this blaming the parents "what kind of idiots let their child in the water at dark" ..what kind of company shows a movie on that same beach in the dark. I am not sure one person has said kill all the alligators, elephants, bees, and whatever. Most people are saying people shouldn't be on the beaches/ in the water. And idk who said it but yes disney ignored it til it was a problem. And apparently they knew people were feeding gators so why wasn't that fixed? Yes they ignored it because pepper don't want to see an alligator warning sign feet away from them, disney wants to sell those beaches and happily take their money. I'm not saying disney doesn't feel horrible about what happened but they knew it was a possibility but because of that iy will never happen attitude a child was taken from this earth. That's not fair to say one in a million. And its just an accident. That's crap. Disney is held to a much higher standard. As one person put it very falsely so. And he's right. This is an eye opener.

A meteor, really that's the argument.

Amoebas would be the better argument/example as they have killed at Disney and, I think, were the reason the beaches (swimming) were shut down in the first place.

 

[mshanson3121]

Why has the gator population increased so much?!

Oie. Google it. Short version back in the 70s i believe when land development was booming their numbers dropped. So the animal lovers put a big push on to save the alligators and there was a huge effort to bring the numbers back up, they were a protected animal etc... Unfortunately it worked too well and now their numbers are out of control. Well beyond anything that would have naturally been seen.

 

[rteetz]

Why has the gator population increased so much?!

Probably the same reason any population increases.

 

[MamaBelle4]

There's been far less intelligent commentary in this discussion here, than this. I'm trying to put some of those comments into perspective. If a snapping turtle had bit off a childs toes, would we be expecting Disney to go after every snapping turtle on property? Would we want signage up warning guests of the dangers of snapping turtles?

I understand your perspective. A simple "Keep out of the water" should be sufficient. In general, I don't think people should have to know why the rule is in place in order to follow it when they are guests somewhere.

But the fact remains that a child is gone. The dad probably didn't think he was breaking any rules and probably hadn't given gators a second thought. The only thing that family should be coming home with is a suitcase full of souvenirs and memories, not an empty car seat.

(This is not directed at you specifically, just humanity) We shouldn't become so callous and unfeeling that we spend hours disecting the what ifs and who is responsible and who was negligent and forget that we are talking about the loss of life.

There is a time and a place for sarcasm and jokes. This is most asuredly not it.

 

[dlavender]

Similarly the signs outside rides suggest that certain individuals with medical conditions shouldn't ride the ride, but it doesn't give the end result reasoning for why they shouldn't ride. If Disney told everyone the risks of every tiny thing that might happen on property if they were to do this or that or one thing or another then everyone would question Disney's safety on anything.

The signs outside of the rides do, in fact, give the reasons - speed, height, sudden drops, darkness..... Just like a no swimming sign should state - alligators, amoebas, boats.....

Calling a 7 foot alligator eating a child a "tiny thing" is a little ridiculous.

It's a giant thing and needs to be addressed moving forward. Signage is a good start.

 

[StirlingSilver83]

I can't get over the people who think that a sign that says "no swimming" means they could wade in the water.

Even if I had no clue that alligators were in that lake, if I saw a "no swimming" sign, I would assume that meant that I was not to put my body into that water. Not my feet, not my hands, not a wisp of hair. For all I know, that "no swimming" sign is up because the lake is highly polluted, why the heck would I want to go in it? Maybe it's because I'm from NJ (where unfortunately, many of our fresh water habitats are polluted) or because I'm a city girl and have never swam in a lake in my life, but wading and swimming are the same thing.

That being said, I feel incredibly bad for the poor child and his family. This is a complete nightmare, and I do hope Disney makes their signs a bit scarier so folks don't wade in the water.

But this is not Disney's fault. No swimming means no wading means keep your body parts out of the water.

I'm from NJ too and when we visited Disney we never even went on the beaches. I have 2 younger kids and my youngest likes to bolt and I was too afraid that he would run into the water...I never wanted my kid to step foot in that water, but not bc of gators, honestly gators never even crossed my mind. I am afraid of any type of lakes bc of all the brain eating amoeba that we hear about now a days. I also assumed the "no swimming" signs meant don't even go in the water...But I guess the signs are open to interpretation. Maybe Disney will put new signs up now or put rocks down to deter anyone from going into the water or close their beaches down altogether (which I hope is a last resort and not really an option, even though I don't go on the beaches I have heard many people on this board that love the beaches and love watching the fireworks and water parade from the beaches). Hopefully everyone will have some answers soon and the parents can get some closure.

Can you imagine actually staying at the resort right now? At the GF? It must be horrendous.

I can't even imagine and I have a feeling that those new bungalows at the Poly just lost a lot of peoples interest. I love the bungalows and it was always a dream of mine to stay in them 1 day, but now I don't think so...I will pass I don't want to stay in a condo on an alligator filled lake...I am not even sure I want to stay at any of the monorail resorts on our next stay...AKL has moved right up there into first place on which resort I want to stay at for our 2017 visit. Has anyone ever seen gators at AKL?

 

[2009CAN]

I'm sure (or at least hoping) Disney officials have already privately expressed their condolences. I'm probably in the minority, but I don't think social media is an appropriate platform for that sort of thing.

The Disney spokeswoman said last night they had people with the family and were doing all they could to support them at that time. I’m sure there is a lot going on behind the scenes. And I agree, Disney social media shouldn’t be a tool to attend to the family, but at some point, I’d like them to make a comment about it.

 

[closetmickey]

Uh, yeah, beaches do have signs like this along with signs about slippery rocks, large waves, strong currents - depending on which beach you're on. These warning signs can save lives, and no, not all people know these things..that's why there are signs.

View attachment 175654

This is reminding me of the warning signs on the beach at DCL's island Castaway Cay. Warns of all types of things in the water, including sea lice. Resorts should have done the same.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

Disney should have known? The last gator attack at Disney was 30 YEARS AGO! An 8 year old boy was bit when he wondered off to a small pond near Fort Wilderness. Since then a gator got into rivers of America in the early 2000's. There has never been anything remotely like this at Disney before. It is bizarre and unusual. Not swimming is usually thought to be enough. Even across Florida there are attacks every year, but rarely are they fatal. No one should come down so hard on Disney or the parents. I am sure everything will be examined, re-thought, and appropriate measures taken. Signage and direct warniings to all visitors staying on property are appropriate and should be sufficient.

 

[XXRAINMANX]

The signs outside of the rides do, in fact, give the reasons - speed, height, sudden drops, darkness..... Just like a no swimming sign should state - alligators, amoebas, boats......

http://www.****************/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/space-mountain-safety-warnings-tomorrowland-magic-kingdom-walt-disney-world.jpg

For reference since this is the type of sign we're referring to. The reason for not riding would include DEATH or SERIOUS BODILY INJURY, both of which have happened at Disney but neither are mentioned as potential results of not riding. When swimming a potential risk is drowning, when by a natural body of water in a semi wildlife area one would know wildlife regardless of type could be present.

 

[closetmickey]

Here is DCL's sign at Castaway Cay. Everyone reads. No magic lost.