Gas Stations & Credit Cards - Is this true?

I get most of my gas from Costco these days. It not only has some of the best prices, but they now guarantee that all their gas stations include a high detergent level that meets the Top Tier Gasoline standard.

ARCO is usually the exact same price as COSTCO.
The advantage with COSTO.....I hear.....is they take credit cards. The disadvantage is you normally will have to wait in line. Top Tier Gasoline is the only gasoline that meets California laws, so all gas sold here is top tier.
I work 2 blocks from a fuel depot in Sacramento and when I walk past their on my lunch break, I watch tank trucks FROM Shell, 76, ARCO, Flyers, Chevron and brands I have never of filling up from the same source.
Gas, sadly, is gas.
 
Was it an AGO gas station?

DH had a favorite station near us, when it was BP, as they were typically 10-15 cents cheaper than anywhere else. Now they've changed and it's an AGO station. We stopped the other day and he had to go inside and see the attendant, and he was told the same thing the OP was. He said "no thanks" and would take his business elsewhere, and we did. The AGO station is the only station that does that, hopefully the others don't follow suit. We prefer to "pay at the pump" and it's very annoying when you have to go inside to talk to the attendant.

If you pay at the pump there's going to be a pre-authorization hold. In fact, if you use a credit card at the cashier there may be a hold on your account even if the attendant doesn't tell you. They're not going to let you pump more gas than you can pay for with your available credit limit. So they request a $100 hold, check with the processor that you've got at least that much available credit, and allow you to pump up to $100 of gas. When you return to the cashier, they finalize the amount and most of the time that settles the transaction. Sometimes it doesn't get settled for a few days.

http://blog.gasbuddy.com/posts/Buyi...available-credit-by-151/1715-516950-1417.aspx

Long have we heard complaints from some of our users that some gas stations have been putting significant holds on customers who choose to use credit cards. While I had never personally seen such a thing happen to me, I was "lucky" enough to have it happen to me last weekend.

I pulled into a travel stop in Burns Harbor, Indiana, on a motorcycle, with a measly 4.5 gallon tank. I only needed to top off, so I bought just a couple gallons of gasoline, left, and didn't think much of my $12 purchase.

After looking at my credit card transactions online later that afternoon I learned that the travel center in question put a massive $151 hold on my credit card- all for $12 in gasoline. In past situations, I'd notice a $1 pre-authorization that drops, but this time, the pre-authorization was a whopping $151. Curious what policy had changed, I e-mailed the travel center's customer service to see why they placed such a large hold on my credit card, leaving me with a big chunk of credit that was unusable as the charge waited to clear.

Karen, a customer service representative at Pilot Travel Centers e-mailed me back, saying "at the end of February, we rolled out a pump upgrade on Visa transactions that will allow for clearing of the transaction in real time, as opposed to the regular 2-3 business days. This is being done in response to consumer credit card legislation being passed that states that all banks must move to "Real Time" systems."

Karen also goes on to say,
In a real time system the hold of $151 will only be on your card for a few hours or less. Many banks are equipped to handle these types of transactions. Smaller, community banks and credit unions, even a few of the larger banks, may not be set up to handle these types of transactions yet.

In these situations, the $151.00 hold will remain on the account as it otherwise wouldn't until the transaction clears. Per Visa, we raised the hold amount from $75 to $151.00. We raised the amount of fuel that can be pumped at one time to $150.00 before the pump shuts off and this is why we raise the preauthorization amount as much as we did.

Using a debit card and typing in your pin number will keep the $150 hold from going on your account. You can also go into the store and prepay a smaller amount, and then the only amount held will be the preauthorized amount.

So apparently there are different ways to do it. However, I'm not sure if they would necessarily charge and then refund, or if the amount requested is just entered as a per-authorization hold.
 
ARCO is usually the exact same price as COSTCO.
The advantage with COSTO.....I hear.....is they take credit cards. The disadvantage is you normally will have to wait in line. Top Tier Gasoline is the only gasoline that meets California laws, so all gas sold here is top tier.
I work 2 blocks from a fuel depot in Sacramento and when I walk past their on my lunch break, I watch tank trucks FROM Shell, 76, ARCO, Flyers, Chevron and brands I have never of filling up from the same source.
Gas, sadly, is gas.

I'm kind of a fuels and lubricants geek (among other things), so here goes.....

Costco doesn't take most credit cards. About the only one they take is Amex. They've got some sort of special deal with them.

As for the fuel depot, yeah it's likely the same base fuel, but among all that piping you see there is a metering system that drops in specific detergent additive packages. If it's for a Chevron station, they will deposit the additive developed by Chevron.

Also - there's no requirement for the "Top Tier" standard to be applied to gasoline sold in California. California RFG3 has a specific standard for deposit formation in the combustion chamber and intake valves of a standard test engine.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/fuels/gasoline/100912CaRFG_regs.pdf

(c) Certification Requirements.

(1)(A) No gasoline formulation shall be certified under this subsection (c) unless the applicant for certification demonstrates each of the following to the executive officer's satisfaction:

(i) The gasoline formulation meets a maximum of 50 milligrams averaged over all intake valves when tested in accordance with ASTM D 5500-98, which is
incorporated herein by reference. As an alternative, intake valve deposits may be tested in accordance with subsection (c)(1)(A)(iii).

(ii) The gasoline formulation does not result in a flow loss of more than five percent for any fuel injector when tested in accordance with AST
M D 5598-95a, which is incorporated herein by reference.

(iii) The gasoline formulation meeting the requirements of (c)(1)(A)(i), does not result in more than 1300 milligrams total deposit weight, averaged over all four combustion chambers, or, does not result in more than 140 percent total deposit weight from all four combustion chambers, relative to the gasoline formulation containing no additive, when tested in accordance with the Stationary Source Division's Test Method for Evaluating Intake Valve and
Combustion Chamber Deposits in Vehicle Engines, dated March 12, 1999, which is incorporated herein by reference.

The "Top Tier" consortium has tougher standards than this. A lot of fuel brands in California doesn't meet the Top Tier standard, including Arco, Valero, Flyers, and probably most independents. The Top Tier standard includes requirements for valve sticking as well as requirements to show that the base fuel used in testing creates actual deposit formation without the additive. Additionally, the additive maker is supposed to run the tests and submit the test results to the Top Tier consortium. With California RFG3 it's a nebulous definition that they have to "demonstrate" that it meets the requirement.

The Top Tier testing requirements include demonstrating that the base fuel used for testing actually leaves deposits and contains ethanol/certain hydrocarbons that tend to leave deposits. It's really a stress test of the additive and not the complete fuel. Base fuel varies to some degree, and they want to ensure that the additive will perform up to snuff even in a worst case scenario. Often the fuel seller has little control over the quality of the base fuel, but they do over the quality of the additive.
 
ARCO is usually the exact same price as COSTCO.
The advantage with COSTO.....I hear.....is they take credit cards. The disadvantage is you normally will have to wait in line. Top Tier Gasoline is the only gasoline that meets California laws, so all gas sold here is top tier.
I work 2 blocks from a fuel depot in Sacramento and when I walk past their on my lunch break, I watch tank trucks FROM Shell, 76, ARCO, Flyers, Chevron and brands I have never of filling up from the same source.
Gas, sadly, is gas.

I did not realize any states had laws requiring top tier.

All of those trucks can use the same base gasoline the the brand specific additive packages are added when the truck is filling up.
 

As for the fuel depot, yeah it's likely the same base fuel, but among all that piping you see there is a metering system that drops in specific detergent additive packages. If it's for a Chevron station, they will deposit the additive developed by Chevron.

I used to work for a major oil company. That is the way it is done. Gas, unless being picked up at a refinery, is transported by pipeline. All the refineries along the route feed into it. Gas is gas when it goes into the pipeline. It all blends together,

What happens the additives for each brand is blended into the tanker as it is being filled up.
 
Yesterday: my car, my credit card, gas station #1 - Ran the card at the pump and it said it didn't process and I needed to see the attendant inside. Not sure why it didn't work, but now that I was inside I had to tell him the dollar amount of gas I wanted. Kind of inconvenient since I didn't know the exact amount I'd need. He tells me I can charge any amount I want (he suggested $70 :scared1:), sign for that amount, but if I pump less it will only really charge me for that amount. I thought to myself, "do I look like I was born yesterday? I don't think so." I charged $35 and put in $35.

Today: mom's car, mom's credit card, totally different gas station. Exact same thing happened. Went inside and was given the same story. Again, charged $35 and put in $35.

So now I'm wondering if this is really true or if there is some kind of scam taking place? In both cases, I signed the slip saying the credit card approved $35. If I would have signed for $70 and only put in $35, what proof would I have?

Coming from the UK and using a rental car we are increasingly encountering this - using a credit card means you have to enter a US zip code which we don't have - its difficult to estimate how much gas a rental car will take (in a foreign country) so have had to sign for a random amount, but have always been billed for the amount we've actually pumped.
 
I did not realize any states had laws requiring top tier.

All of those trucks can use the same base gasoline the the brand specific additive packages are added when the truck is filling up.

There isn't. Top Tier is a private licensing program established by several automakers. There's no way that California would force a fuel seller to be part of a private licensing program. However, they do have some deposit control requirements that on their face seem similar to those of Top Tier. However, they don't require submission of test results and with the variability of base fuel it's hard to tell. The Top Tier standard will meet California's RFG3 deposit control requirement..
 
I used to work for a major oil company. That is the way it is done. Gas, unless being picked up at a refinery, is transported by pipeline. All the refineries along the route feed into it. Gas is gas when it goes into the pipeline. It all blends together,

What happens the additives for each brand is blended into the tanker as it is being filled up.

I know there are some exceptions, but they're specialized. Stuff like 93/94 octane unleaded and 100 octane unleaded racing fuel. I've seen 100 octane racing fuel sold in 5 gallon cans. There are also a few gas stations around here that have 100 octane at specific pumps. Some of it is dyed blue and nicknamed "Smurf gas". Tosco used to make it, but I think now it's either VP Racing or Sunoco.

247618_10151927022970476_584843879_n.jpg


And Costco is different. They set up a system where they accept fuel without detergent additives. They've got their own additive tanks on site along with equipment to meter it for the amount of fuel in each delivery. They also recently got Top Tier certification once they had this system installed at all of their locations that sell gas.
 
About half the time, the 7-Eleven where I get gas cannot accept a debit card at the pump. Not sure why. I go inside and tell them to give me $20 on pump whatever. My car doesn't take $20 worth unless I am totally on empty. I fill up. Whatever amount I end up putting in my car is what is charged to my card. I've never had a problem with this. I think it is standard practice.
 
About half the time, the 7-Eleven where I get gas cannot accept a debit card at the pump. Not sure why. I go inside and tell them to give me $20 on pump whatever. My car doesn't take $20 worth unless I am totally on empty. I fill up. Whatever amount I end up putting in my car is what is charged to my card. I've never had a problem with this. I think it is standard practice.

It could be declined if the standard pre-authorization hold amount for pay at the pump is more than available funds. Sometimes it just doesn't properly read the strip.

Pre-authorization holds don't show up on statements, but they can show up as transactions with recent transaction inquiries online or over the phone.
 
It could be declined if the standard pre-authorization hold amount for pay at the pump is more than available funds. Sometimes it just doesn't properly read the strip.

Pre-authorization holds don't show up on statements, but they can show up as transactions with recent transaction inquiries online or over the phone.

In my case, the funds available are huge and I never come anywhere close to what is available. My assumption was that it just couldn't read the strip, but it was able to read the strip inside. While it seems common for some, I've simply never encountered this (fill up every single week) and to happen two days in a row, different cards, different stations, was odd. I hope this was a fluke. What's the point of the pay at the pump option if I have to go in?
 
I'm kind of a fuels and lubricants geek (among other things), so here goes.....

Costco doesn't take most credit cards. About the only one they take is Amex. They've got some sort of special deal with them.

As for the fuel depot, yeah it's likely the same base fuel, but among all that piping you see there is a metering system that drops in specific detergent additive packages. If it's for a Chevron station, they will deposit the additive developed by Chevron.

Also - there's no requirement for the "Top Tier" standard to be applied to gasoline sold in California. California RFG3 has a specific standard for deposit formation in the combustion chamber and intake valves of a standard test engine.



The "Top Tier" consortium has tougher standards than this. A lot of fuel brands in California doesn't meet the Top Tier standard, including Arco, Valero, Flyers, and probably most independents. The Top Tier standard includes requirements for valve sticking as well as requirements to show that the base fuel used in testing creates actual deposit formation without the additive. Additionally, the additive maker is supposed to run the tests and submit the test results to the Top Tier consortium. With California RFG3 it's a nebulous definition that they have to "demonstrate" that it meets the requirement.

The Top Tier testing requirements include demonstrating that the base fuel used for testing actually leaves deposits and contains ethanol/certain hydrocarbons that tend to leave deposits. It's really a stress test of the additive and not the complete fuel. Base fuel varies to some degree, and they want to ensure that the additive will perform up to snuff even in a worst case scenario. Often the fuel seller has little control over the quality of the base fuel, but they do over the quality of the additive.

Okay, ARCO pumps say they are BP and BP is a top tier fuel, so I just assumed that applied to ARCO as a BP subsidiary. I just know I have run my Suburban with a fuel injected 454 for 27 years on ARCO, changing the fuel filter every 30,000 miles as the owners manual says, and haven't had any engine issues yet. Transmission issues, yes, engine no.
 
Okay, ARCO pumps say they are BP and BP is a top tier fuel, so I just assumed that applied to ARCO as a BP subsidiary. I just know I have run my Suburban with a fuel injected 454 for 27 years on ARCO, changing the fuel filter every 30,000 miles as the owners manual says, and haven't had any engine issues yet. Transmission issues, yes, engine no.

It's a little more complicated than I remember. Here's the latest ARCO FAQ that describes who owns the trademarks and who licenses them. I would point out that BP sold ARCO, several fuel terminals, and their huge Carson, CA refinery to Tesoro but kept ownership of the am/pm trademark. Then apparently BP licensed the ARCO trademark back, but only for specific markets. And Tesoro licensed the am/pm trademark for the ARCO stations in the markets they controlled. Confused yet?

http://arco.com/straight-up-gas/faqs/

How is ARCO affiliated with Tesoro Corporation?

As of June 1st 2013, Tesoro Refining & Marketing Company LLC (a subsidiary of Tesoro Corporation) acquired all of rights, title and interest in the ARCO trademark.

How is ARCO affiliated with BP?

As of June 1st 2013, Tesoro Refining & Marketing Company LLC has licensed the ARCO trademark to BP for BP to market motor fuel in Northern California, Oregon and Washington.

How is ampm affiliated with BP?

BP is the owner of the ampm trademark and is the franchisor of ampm mini markets.

How is ampm affiliated with Tesoro Corporation?

As of June 1st 2013, Treasure Franchise Company LLC (a subsidiary of Tesoro Refining & Marketing Company LLC), became a subfranchisor for ampm mini market franchises in Arizona, Nevada and the following counties in California: Fresno, Imperial, Inyo, Kern, Kings, Los Angeles, Madera, Orange, Riverside, San Bernardino, San Diego, San Luis Obispo, Santa Barbara, Tulare, and Venrura.

However, ARCO isn't listed as being licensed by the Top Tier consortium. There's no particular reason why BP would have to use their additive and/or the same level of their additive even though they control the ARCO stations in Northern California or a few other states. It's easy enough for them to meter lower amounts of detergent or a cheaper detergent additive at fuel terminals. The license is for the retail brand name and not the parent company. ConocoPhillips controls 76, Conoco, and Phillips 66 stations, and all three are licensed by Top Tier.

http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.html

TOP TIER Gasoline Retailers:

USA
76 Stations
Aloha Petroleum
BP
Chevron
Conoco
Costco
CountryMark
Entec Stations
Exxon
Hawaii Fueling Network (HFN)
Holiday Stationstores
Kwik Trip / Kwik Star
MFA Oil Co.
Mobil
Ohana Fuels
Phillips 66
Quik Trip
Road Ranger
Scheirl Oil
Shell
SuperAmerica
Texaco
Tri-Par Oil Co.
U.S. Oil

Canada
Chevron Canada
Esso
Petro-Canada
Shell Canada

Puerto Rico
Puma Energy Caribe, LLC
 
In my case, the funds available are huge and I never come anywhere close to what is available. My assumption was that it just couldn't read the strip, but it was able to read the strip inside. While it seems common for some, I've simply never encountered this (fill up every single week) and to happen two days in a row, different cards, different stations, was odd. I hope this was a fluke. What's the point of the pay at the pump option if I have to go in?

Some magnetic strip readers are finicky. I know of two side by side Amtrak terminals at a station I use. They take credit cards, but also other magnetic strip cards that can be used to retrieve a reservation. One of these machines never properly reads a particular card, while the other one works almost every time.
 














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