FYI: More Cuts Coming

[Julylady]

We have hit the wall with Walt Disney World. I don't mind FP+ in Magic Kingdom, but I HATE the tiering in Epcot and Hollywood studios. To me it just shows that they don't have enough popular attractions in those parks. I also can't believe they plan to continue to charge a full admission at Hollywood studios after closing so many attractions. The prices they are charging for extras like Dessert parties, tours, Halloween parties are just excessive. The dirty bathrooms and untrained cast members really irritate me. Then it seems like each month they are cutting back on staff, character meet/greets, etc. All of those things coupled with record profits just makes me sick to my stomach.

We were avid Disney World fans with over 35 trips in the last 20 years. We have been DVC members since 2000. We have two more trips in the planning stages (Spring break trip in April, and then F/W festival one last time(with my Mom) in November). I have already told the kids that after our April trip we are for sure not going back to Disney World for at least 3 years. At first they were sad, but I hinted that Disneyland or Aulani were not off the table. I also promised a Universal only trip in two years. I am planning to rent out my DVC points to pay for some of other trips. The funny thing was that when I told them why we going to stop going to Disney World they seemed to totally understand. They also see the changes!

 

[sharadoc]

I think that this confirms what we've been saying about Disney caring about the first time/only time visitor rather than repeat. The first timers won't count on a discount and won't know what's missing since they were never there before. For them, the experience will still be magical.

In marketing, a primary exercise is to create your typical customer "persona" and develop marketing programs specifically aimed at the persona. I'm sure that first timer persona is clearly the most profitable, so the marketing folks are concentrating on them for the highest return. We Disboarders, double digit trips and 20 year trip history are probably the lowest return and therefore the decisions they make and effect on us are not consequential to the bottom line.

We've been going since the days of 3 hotels, 2 parks and Disney Village. The expansion and changes are almost overwhelming when we compare to the old experiences. But our best memories are the CMs, the characters, the shows, the little things. All of that is being taken away in favor of big entertainment to the largest possible crowds - castle shows, fireworks, parades. Our kids don't know the "old" days, so they are still okay.

In our world, we like spending as much time at the resort, mini golf, shopping, restaurants - as we do in the theme parks, so we're still okay. But the more cuts that happen, the more I expect it will change our overall experience. Definitely makes me sad.

 

[keaster]

We are DVC owners as well. We are going next month for March break but that's it for this year and in 2017 we plan to use our points for Aulani. 2018 we may try either Hilton Head or Vero for something different.

We would not consider selling as we would probably still use DVC as a "home base" per say and explore other options outside the parks. However with the Canadian exchange rate as bad as it is, we could come out ahead if we were to sell!

 

[OrangeCountyCommuter]

The only place where there is real value in using the points is to stay on property. Using your points at a non-Disney resort, Disney Cruise, etc is a total waste.
To go elsewhere, there is the added expense of a rental and gas. True you would need a hotel or rent house if you visit another place in FL, but most people who purchase DVC purchased because they love the parks not because they wanted a place in Florida. We pay annual dues as well. I can understand why people would not want to pay dues on a DVC resort if they are going to be spending their days elsewhere in the area. At that point it is pretty much just a place to shower and sleep. You can do that at a Value for much less. When most of us bought in there were more perks and there was great value in being a member. Over the past 5 - 7 years Disney has begun pulling it away along with the in-park cutbacks, crazy price hikes for everything and raising entry prices while pulling so much away and the number of closures.

It is a total waste? According to who?

I use mine at other places and have no problem with that.

And in the future I will be using a lot more of them just as a place to sleep when I visit family in the Orlando area. No need to pay Disney for a subpar park experience when there are better options out there close by.

 

[PrincessWithABlaster]

Disney is a business. Efficiency, without thinking of individuals is the right thing to do. Shareholders come first.

I've done some reading on this and the mantra to "maximize shareholder value" is a fairly recent phenomenon in the business world (last 25 ish years). And there's some debate on whether its a good thing for the economy or not. Focusing on shareholder is by its nature a short term proposition. They are always going to want maximum profits right now. That's not how you build a business though. And I think there are some big examples of companies that ignore the maximize part. Amazon, Apple, and Disney (at least it used to be). Apple would not be where it is without prioritizing the customer experience. They have legions of loyal fans who will pay more for asthetically designed products with an apple logo (I'm typing this on an iPhone so don't get mad) when they could buy other products with the same or better technology for less. How long did Amazon go before turning a profit? And Disney Magic is all predicated on having great customer experiences. They pioneered hiding the lines back in the day. I think the minute companies decide that shareholder value ranks higher than customers and employees is the day they start losing the ability to maximize it.

That said, no one has seen fit to put me in charge of any company.

 

[hiroMYhero]

The load and unload dock reduction could compromise safety.

It appears to be referring to FP loader CMs for attractions where FP isn't a necessity. So far, there are reports of Wishes, BatB, and Flights of Wonder not having FP availability beginning mid-April.

 

[sgtdisney]

Here is my .02 cents. Disney has a premium product and charges premium prices. Once they stop providing premium services, they may start losing business. It may take some time, as Disney is famous for high levels of service. However, this has been going on for a while in very small increments.

As DVC members since 1992, and many multiple visits years before then, I can say things have changed, a lot, in the ensuing decades. The current pricing structure is crazy, but as many have suggested if people are willing to pay it, they will charge it. That is a simple concept of ECON 101 - supply and demand.

What may hit Disney at some point is this. They have a lot of foreign business. That is all well and good, and I've been told numerous times from cast members and others, for many people in other nations, it's cheaper for them to vacation at Disney that at home due to exchange rates. When the exchange rates change, and hopefully they will at some point, they may lose that foreign business and have to re-capture some of the US business they so handily discarded along the way. In other words, some of their demand may drop. Certainly as they lose some long time customers they will gain newer customers who've never been before and have no idea of how it "used to be". However how many of us long time customers have changed their tune lately when people ask them about Disney World. I know I have. I used to sing the praises of my favorite place to vacation. People often ask me for my opinions and advice on planning a WDW vacation. Lately, I am sad to say, the first things coming out of my mouth is how expensive it is, things are different etc. Now, I know I am only one person and what I tell the few people I talk to will have no perceivable impact, but when there are a lot of long time visitors saying the same thing, it could have some impact.

I fully understand Disney is a business and has to run the company in the best interest of the shareholder. It's just hard to justify large cuts, which could tarnish the Disney brand due to cost overruns in some place half way around the world.. Especially when right now, the division is making money hand over fist and the upper management are pulling in huge numbers. Case in point, in my opinion as someone working in IT, what they did with their IT department the last year or so was scary and sad. If they were losing money, I can understand devastating cuts. But they aren't.

Do I still love visiting, yes, for now. But it's getting harder to maintain that rabid excitement I had years ago, maybe it's age, or maybe it's because I have a long amount of perspective to compare to what's happening now. It's just hard to accept these kinds of cuts, and still feel excited about it as I used to.

I know Disney must make a profit to survive, and as a stockholder, I am glad they do. However at what cost, and to what levels?

Stepping down off my soapbox. I guess Disgust and Anger got the better of me..

 

[EricInPA]

Apple would not be where it is without prioritizing the customer experience. They have legions of loyal fans who will pay more for asthetically designed products with an apple logo (I'm typing this on an iPhone so don't get mad) when they could buy other products with the same or better technology for less.

Apple and Disney are similar in a lot of ways when it comes to their perception from the general public, fans, former fans, etc.

They made the best product, and became a giant, hugely profitable company. Now their continued success is attributed to loyal customers, aesthetics, and unknowing first time users. They've taken hits for their treatment of workers despite other companies doing the same, and every product change, cut, or price increase is heralded as "is this the end?" Why do people keep paying extra for this when a competing product is just as good? (rhetorical)

ETA: Posted as a repeat customer of both companies (and their competitors). The reality may be that both companies are still the best at what they do, and even their smallest decisions are amplified.

 

[mom2rtk]

It appears to be referring to FP loader CMs for attractions where FP isn't a necessity. So far, there are reports of Wishes, BatB, and Flights of Wonder not having FP availability beginning mid-April.

That's an interesting theory, and quite plausible.

 

[oceanmarina]

If only they had some other "offset" to compensate for their staggering corporate losses.

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I feel badly for the employees and this bothers me more than other issues because having enough employees is crucial to the trip being magical or not. Long wait at checkin, not magical. Trashcans full, not magical. And so on. The best moments I've had at Disney were always because of a CM.

Seriously. They must think we're all stupid.

Yep and amen to all of the above!!! Hmmm, park ticket prices up and yet reductions in staffing and service..... just wrong.

 

[mshanson3121]

What confuses me about all this is that Disney World is not the only game in town anymore. Universal Studios has been gaining popularity more and more every year with all the upgrades and additions they've been doing. The thing that has separated Disney from all other competitors over the years is their perceived customer service in making their destinations The Happiest Place on Earth. Reading through other threads about the decline in CM "Magic" and now this, the perceived magic appears to be heading in the wrong direction that potentially could drive loyal and would-be-first-time Disney park goers to other vacation destinations. The US brass have to be smiling from ear to ear (pun intended).

And I can't see all these cuts they're making helping the "Cranky CM" issue, either. Service is only going to continue going south when the employees who get paid pittance anyways, are having their hours cut, and are being overworked due to lay offs.

 

[mshanson3121]

I'm not so sure that the cuts at WDW are because of cost overruns in China. I suspect a lot of the cuts are being made because after doing a cost-benefit analysis, in many cases the hours and/or positions were unnecessary or redundant. The iPad greeters and the concierge and front desk CMs really come to mind. If the Magic Bands and MDE are working properly, the front desk personnel become largely obsolete, and most guests won't notice if there are CMs working at the desk or not. In most cases now, it is completely unnecessary for any guest to visit the check-in desk for their entire trip. Guest experiences won't be diminished because it was a service guests aren't using anyway.

Unfortunately, you're greatly underestimating just how often the MBs don't work. When we were there, almost every time we entered the park 1 or 2 of our party had to use those "iPad greeters" because their MBs weren't working. We also visited front desk CMs 2 or 3x on our trip for various reasons. I'm just one person. There are many, many more out there like me. In fact I know there are - saw them every day on our trip. So, I really don't think you could even begin to say that these are services that weren't being used.

 

[Nancyg56]

I don't understand the stance on selling DVC if Disney takes to a different type of ticketing. DVC is a place to stay - doesn't mean when you go down and stay at a DVC you are forced to go into a Disney park. There is a whole state outside your door and plenty to do in the Orlando area. Did I miss something?

DVC ownership is a commitment to and an investment WDW vacations. The cost is kind of expensive, IMO, but if you vacation in Disney the investment pays off. Once you stop going into the parks, you have lost some value, IMO. There are less expensive ways to visit Orland attractions than using your DVC property.

 

[EricInPA]

There are many, many more out there like me. In fact I know there are - saw them every day on our trip. So, I really don't think you could even begin to say that these are services that weren't being used.

If you had to seek out customer service to deal with magic band issues, it would make sense that you would see others as well. Disney (reportedly) tripled their customer service staff when they rolled out MyMagic+, so it would also make sense to roll back some of those hires if the system is more stable.

 

[mshanson3121]

If you had to seek out customer service to deal with magic band issues, it would make sense that you would see others as well. Disney (reportedly) tripled their customer service staff when they rolled out MyMagic+, so it would also make sense to roll back some of those hires if the system is more stable.

I was just there this summer. And I was not there for MB issues. Nor would I presume that everyone else was there for MB issues. There are other issues that arise at WDW that require CS.

 

[EricInPA]

I was just there this summer. And I was not there for MB issues. Nor would I presume that everyone else was there for MB issues. There are other issues that arise at WDW that require CS.

Well...

Unfortunately, you're greatly underestimating just how often the MBs don't work. When we were there, almost every time we entered the park 1 or 2 of our party had to use those "iPad greeters" because their MBs weren't working.

Regardless, it doesn't matter why they (guests) were there (at a customer service location). If you go to customer service, you will see other people that need customer service issues resolved. That doesn't mean issues don't exist, but it also doesn't indicate suggest whether or not CS is over-staffed.

 

[mshanson3121]

Well...


Regardless, it doesn't matter why they (guests) were there (at a customer service location). If you go to customer service, you will see other people that need customer service issues resolved. That doesn't mean issues don't exist, but it also doesn't indicate suggest whether or not CS is over-staffed.

No it doesn't mean they aren't overstaffed. But, I would still argue that when you're there, and you can see that every single CS member that is working, is busy serving people and you have to wait in line... it certainly doesn't suggest they they are overstaffed, either.

My point - I highly doubt these cutbacks are due to over-staffing.

 

[MJ6987]

Digital ticket books might make us sell off our DVC.

The old non-digital ticket books are way before my time but don't people seem to reminisce favourably about those?

 

[mom2rtk]

The old non-digital ticket books are way before my time but don't people seem to reminisce favourably about those?

Maybe? But they didn't pay all access pricing PLUS the price of a ticket book.

 

[mshanson3121]

So if they were to try this ridiculous scheme, how would it likely be? You can do any 12 attractions you want, when you want? You can only ride something 1x? Would you still book your FP+ for 3 of the rides?