Funeral Leave

[jen0610]

This is a touchy subject around here at work.

Per the employee handbook, there are no paid bereavement days. However, if you are salaried, which is every male in the company, you don't lose any of your pay. But if your hourly, which is every female in the company, you either take the time off without pay or you can use 1 of your 3 personal days or a day of your vacation time. And to clairify, NO the salaried men DO NOT lose to use any of their personal or vacation time to cover being off and getting their full salary.

So, do we have bereavement pay or not. It all depends on your gender.

Prior to working here, every other place I have worked, had some type of bereavement pay. It included grandparents, aunts, uncles, and 1st cousins, and it extending to those that were in-laws. Most were 3 days for spouce, kids, parents, sibs. 1 day off for the extended family.

Where DH worked, they got 3 paid days off for all family, including extended and in-laws. So, while I had to take a personal day off for my uncles funeral, DH got to take 3 days off with pay of it.

 

[focusondisney]

This is a touchy subject around here at work.

Per the employee handbook, there are no paid bereavement days. However, if you are salaried, which is every male in the company, you don't lose any of your pay. But if your hourly, which is every female in the company, you either take the time off without pay or you can use 1 of your 3 personal days or a day of your vacation time. And to clairify, NO the salaried men DO NOT lose to use any of their personal or vacation time to cover being off and getting their full salary.

So, do we have bereavement pay or not. It all depends on your gender.

Wow! Sounds like this must be a very frustrating place to work! I'd probably get fired for opening my mouth about the inequity!

As for me, I work in a hospital which is unionized. So all our benefits are pretty firm. We get 3 days for spouse/ legal partner, children, parents/ parents in law, siblings, foster parents or children, step parents, children or siblings & grandparents. For other in laws (sister, brother or grandparents) we get 1 paid day for funeral/ memorial. If you have to travel over 300 miles, it is 5 days paid. Any others, uncles, aunts, cousins etc, that is what you would use a personal day for (we get 2 personal days per year). If you need additional time off you could use PTO or take a personal, unpaid leave.

Edit: I forgot 3 days for grandchildren.

Sometimes it is funny to see how many times a coworkers "grandmother" dies! You don't have to provide proof to get the days, occasionally someone really takes advantage.

 

[FireDancer]

This is a touchy subject around here at work.

Per the employee handbook, there are no paid bereavement days. However, if you are salaried, which is every male in the company, you don't lose any of your pay. But if your hourly, which is every female in the company, you either take the time off without pay or you can use 1 of your 3 personal days or a day of your vacation time. And to clairify, NO the salaried men DO NOT lose to use any of their personal or vacation time to cover being off and getting their full salary.

So, do we have bereavement pay or not. It all depends on your gender.

Prior to working here, every other place I have worked, had some type of bereavement pay. It included grandparents, aunts, uncles, and 1st cousins, and it extending to those that were in-laws. Most were 3 days for spouce, kids, parents, sibs. 1 day off for the extended family.

Where DH worked, they got 3 paid days off for all family, including extended and in-laws. So, while I had to take a personal day off for my uncles funeral, DH got to take 3 days off with pay of it.

It's standard for salaried and hourly employees to have time off treated differently. If a woman were to get hired salary or a man hired hourly and the rules remained different it would be discrimination, as it is now it is comparing apples to oranges.

Are hourly employees paid overtime if they work over 40 hours? Are salaried employees?

 

[Golf4food]

We get up to five days for immediate family members, 1 day for more distant relations.

I've used both this year already.

 

[Gigi22]

I used to work for the federal govt. in another country, and all our leave was set by the various collective agreements--people covered by one agreement had certain amounts of leave, people covered by another agreement could have different leaves, or be entitled to different amounts of time. There was a lot of work done to standardize the leave entitlements. The collective agreements were very poorly written (IMHO) when it came to bereavement leave. As a result, many people expected more days of leave to be granted than they were "entitled to" by their collective agreement, and unexpectedly wound up taking days without pay -- or using vacation leave -- to cover requests for bereavement leave.
I think everyone should print out/copy their employer's bereavement leave policy document, or their collective agreement, take it home--and keep it in a safe place. It can save you a lot of confusion and heartache if you have it available at home. Sad, but true.

 

[need2cruise]

Here we get 5 paid days for immediate family (including the inlaws or stepchildren if they fall in this category)--spouse, parents, siblings, children.

3 days for non-immediate--grandparents and such

1 day for all others.

Last year--my ex lost 2 family members within days of each other. I was given one day for each of them even though they weren't my family and we weren't together, but they understood my child was related and would need me.

However--we do have some who try to abuse the system and think they deserve bereavement time when the great great uncle from their husbands side of the family has passed away.....and her or her husband have never met the guy before...and have nothing to do with that side of the family. I guess there will always be someone who tries to abuse it and ruin it for others.

 

[jen0610]

It standard for salaried and hourly employees to have time off treated differently. If a woman were to get hired salary or a man hired hourly and the rules remained different it would be discrimination, as it is now it is comparing apples to oranges.

Are hourly employees paid overtime if they work over 40 hours? Are salaried employees?

It is not apples to oranges.

If CLEARLY states in the HANDBOOK that there is NO BEREAVMENT PAY - Period!!! Time off can be taken without pay, or in order to receive pay for these days, you have to use a personal day or a vacation day. This is what the females do in order to get paid, as we are hourly employees and it's a big hit to our paychecks. The salaried employess, do not get any days deducted. There is NOTHING noted in the handbook, that this applies to hourly employees only. So, the burn is, while they get paid for being out, and they should be losing either a day of vacation or a day of personal time, THEY DON'T!!!!

And I know this because I am in PAYROLL and it's part of my job to keep track of when all of the employees use their personal and vacation time. Every time the sheets are given to the owners and manager to review the usage, WHEN we show haven taken a day away from one of the salaried employee's, it is noted on the sheets to put the day back into their pool, as the day off didn't require being covered by a personal or vacation day. Hello....everybody in the office knew why X was out for those 3 days.

Believe me, between the two of us in payroll, there is a huge file being kept on all of this. And as much as it sucks around here, we are all pretty darn happy to be getting a paycheck in these times. If that were to ever change, that file - along with all the other gender issues they have around here - will be given to the proper authorties.

 

[ICF]

This thread made me check, since thankfully it's not really been much of an issue with me (plus I've always had a cool boss!).

We (at a major Fortune 500 company) get PTO for parents, in-laws, kids (and their spouses) our grandparents and / or any grandchildren. Per Policy, it can be granted from time of death until the day of the funeral.

With manager approval, depending on your attendance records and other things going on you can also get additional time for the above people if needed or get paid funeral leave for spouses family or other people with whom you were close. That is up to manager descrition, but I was given the day of my wife's grandma funeral last spring without any question.

If your manager is being a PITA about giving the time off, we should generally be able to use vacation or personal choice days to go...assuming we would have some left when the situation comes around.

 

[Robinrs]

A grandparent isn't an immediate family member. That would be a spouse or a child. I've never heard of leave for a grandparent's funeral.

From my company's handbook:

In the event of a death in your immediate family, you will be granted a leave with pay for a period of up to five (5) days. (In the context of this section, your immediate family consists of your spouse, parents, children, siblings, grandparents, grandchildren, mother-in law and father-in-law.) You should notify your supervisor as soon as possible concerning the death in your family.

I guess you've heard now!!

 

[DebbieB]

I work in a small office. We get no paid time off. One person who has worked there for over 25 years lost her husband and they paid her zip. She had to take vacation. And she has let all her clients know that. Doesnt make the boss look too good.

That is a shame but I think it's also unprofessional to tell all her clients about it.

My company gives 3 days for immediate family, which I don't think extends to grandparents. All others are PTO.

 

[Darsa]

We do have to use sick, vacation or personal time for funeral leave. However I'm certainly not going to complain because the office I work for is VERY generous with their paid leave allowances!

 

[ski_mom]

I work for a relatively small company and we have a pretty liberal funeral policy.

We get 3 days off for parents, spouse, sibling, child, MIL, FIL, son or daughter in law. We get 1 day off for grandparent, nephew, niece, brother or sister in law, aunt, uncle, grandchild.

 

[MickeyCrazedMom]

DH works for a very large computer company and has been there for 11 years. I have no idea what the "official' stand is on PTO but his 41 year old brother got ill, went into hospice and passed away all within 6 weeks. This just happened last month. He was given "whatever he needed". There were days he had to spend at the hospital talking to doctors, because BIL's wife was in denial and wouldn't speak to the doctors. When we were told he had less than a week they told him not to come back to work and to spend as much time as he could with his brother. He passed on a Tues and the funeral was Thursday. He went back to work on Monday because he wanted the distraction, but his boss told him if he needed to leave early or needed more time to take it. I can't even count how much time he took off, but he was paid for all of it. I will say though, that DH busts his butt and is available 24/7 for them. So I guess it all works out in the end.

On a side note, his boss & a few of DH's employees drove 3 hours, attended the funeral, and 3 hours back for someone they had never meet. It was the first time I had seen DH smile in weeks knowing that they cared enough to do that.

 

[Arielle22]

It is not apples to oranges.

If CLEARLY states in the HANDBOOK that there is NO BEREAVMENT PAY - Period!!! Time off can be taken without pay, or in order to receive pay for these days, you have to use a personal day or a vacation day. This is what the females do in order to get paid, as we are hourly employees and it's a big hit to our paychecks. The salaried employess, do not get any days deducted. There is NOTHING noted in the handbook, that this applies to hourly employees only. So, the burn is, while they get paid for being out, and they should be losing either a day of vacation or a day of personal time, THEY DON'T!!!!

And I know this because I am in PAYROLL and it's part of my job to keep track of when all of the employees use their personal and vacation time. Every time the sheets are given to the owners and manager to review the usage, WHEN we show haven taken a day away from one of the salaried employee's, it is noted on the sheets to put the day back into their pool, as the day off didn't require being covered by a personal or vacation day. Hello....everybody in the office knew why X was out for those 3 days.

Believe me, between the two of us in payroll, there is a huge file being kept on all of this. And as much as it sucks around here, we are all pretty darn happy to be getting a paycheck in these times. If that were to ever change, that file - along with all the other gender issues they have around here - will be given to the proper authorties.

Jen, unless a female is hired as exempt (Salaried is merely a pay method) and not given the same benefits as the exempt males then it isn't discrimination. Or if a male is hired as non-exempt but given bereavement time that would be discrimination.

Many companies pay exempt their full salaries no matter what without docking. Some companies figure the employees work hard without OT and will let is slide and some don't want to try to figure out the laws under which an exempt employee is covered.

If you are a payroll professional you need to know the laws. If you feel so strongly that it is gender discrimination then file with the EEOC.

Finally handbooks most times do not rise to the level of a contract. This means the company is free to not follow it if they choose to do so.

 

[bettymae1121]

My company gives paid berevment leave, the closer the relation the longer you get (1 day for a cousin, 3 days for a grandparent or aunt/uncle, 5 days for a parent or child, that sort of thing). Once that is gone you are free to use vacation time, if you are out of vacation time you are free to take it unpaid. My company is pretty flexable, when my mother was dieing they said I could take as much of my paid sick time as I wanted (turned out I need a week) and once she passed I could still take the 5 days of paid bereavment, which I took. I was ready to come back after that, but I could have taken another week of sick leave (even though policy states it should have been vacation time) simply because my boss, her boss, and HR all felt so bad for me. I appreciated it but I was ready to go back to work.

On the other hand, my DH's company are a bunch of jerks. You get three days no matter what the situation is, and that's it, you're expected back at work. DH's co-worker just lost his infant son (8 weeks old, I can't even imagine! ) and they at first wanted him back in three days!!!! His wife can't even get out of bed so he made a request for FMLA to take care of her, so I think they are going to begrudgingly give him a bit more time. I know that company's can't just give unlimitted time off, regardless of the circumstance, but a little compassion goes a long way! This guy should not have to fight his company for a reasonable request at such a time.

ETA: I wanted to clarify, I'm not talking that they only wanted to give him 3 days paid and then he could take it unpaid or out of his vacation/sick time. I mean they wanted him back at work, period!!!

 

[lovesmurfs]

Three days here for Immediate Family. Defined as spouse, children, stepchildren, daughters-in-law, sons-in-law, parents, father-in-law, mother-in-law, brothers, sisters, and grandparents.

 

[barkley]

She did a pre-need and everything is already taken care of. My uncle is taking care of the legal stuff.

If my mom died I would be the one in charge and would need the extra time.

not wishing anything bad happens to your mom, but just as a heads up to you: plan on MUCH more time dealing with this than you anticipate it will take.


we had a family member pass a couple of months ago, and dh was the person who had/has to take care of everything. we thought the funeral would be the least time consuming BOY WERE WE WRONG.

"pre-need" is defined differently by different companies. we thought b/c the family member had done a "pre-need" with the mortuary and the cemetary it would be relativly simple. um, nope. in our case "pre-need" just involved the family member purchasing a plot, then telling the mortuary what their wishes were. their wishes were that dh choose the burial container and make all the arrangements between the mortuary and the cemetary, along with paying for the costs out of the estate.

when a mortuary is associated with a cemetary it's one thing-when it's 2 different entities it's a whole different ball of wax, and when the cememtary is owned by a government entity (which allot of older cemetaries in some regions are) you get stuck dealing with government red tape, and currently-government offices that are closed for furlough or so understaffed you can spend days trying to get the proper permits (yup, burial permit had to be gotten in person) and paying the fees (again-had to be done in person).

we are now into our second month of dealing with what is still technicly a "simple estate". the person used a lawyer so there's a will-but all a will does is say who gets what, it does'nt guarantee the person has set up their finances to make them accessable to pay for their funeral expenses and those that are on-going (if a renter, the portion for the notice that has to be given) let alone those that dribble in for months on end (first month or so it's the last cable, credit card and phone bills-but medical bills can take up to a year to wind their way through insurance companies esp. if it's a senior with medicare and supplementals).

i can't begin to count the number of hours dh and i have spent on the phone trying to cancel accounts. with a simple estate that's exempt from probate the person handling it (even if they are named "executor") does'nt get official court papers which some companies want to let a non customer cancel services. so then it's them faxing an affadavit to us, dh schlepping to a notary to get it witnessed, us mailing the affadavit along with certified death certificates....and don't even get me started on the issue of dealing with a deceased person's car. if noone else is listed on the title you can be looking at 45 days where the car has to remain insured and have up to date registration before anything can be done with it which does'nt sound tricky but if it's a state where a deceased person can't legaly have insurance, and another person can't insure a car that they don't own it's a freaking nightmare.


for anyone that will have to deal with this at somepoint, i'de greatly suggest taking the time NOW to get a nolo executor's guide along with one specific to the state the someday to be deceased person lives in. it will give you an vague idea of what you will have to deal with, and that way if the person is willing to discuss these matters-many things that a lawyer may not tell a person about (b/c they prefer that the estate pay them an arm and a leg to deal with it on their behalf) in setting up not only their estate but also the way they do their day to day person buisness dealings can be tweaked a bit so that your family members are not left with a nightmare to deal with, and actualy have an opportunity to greave the loss.

 

[MomRN]

Our bereavement leave is extensive. We get 3 days off for immediate (considered parents, spouse, children, grandparent, great-grandparent, in-laws, step-children, step-parents, and others I'm missing). We get 1 day for step-grandparents, grandparents in law, neices, nephews, and cousins.

 

[FireDancer]

It is not apples to oranges.

If CLEARLY states in the HANDBOOK that there is NO BEREAVMENT PAY - Period!!! Time off can be taken without pay, or in order to receive pay for these days, you have to use a personal day or a vacation day. This is what the females do in order to get paid, as we are hourly employees and it's a big hit to our paychecks. The salaried employess, do not get any days deducted. There is NOTHING noted in the handbook, that this applies to hourly employees only. So, the burn is, while they get paid for being out, and they should be losing either a day of vacation or a day of personal time, THEY DON'T!!!!

And I know this because I am in PAYROLL and it's part of my job to keep track of when all of the employees use their personal and vacation time. Every time the sheets are given to the owners and manager to review the usage, WHEN we show haven taken a day away from one of the salaried employee's, it is noted on the sheets to put the day back into their pool, as the day off didn't require being covered by a personal or vacation day. Hello....everybody in the office knew why X was out for those 3 days.

Believe me, between the two of us in payroll, there is a huge file being kept on all of this. And as much as it sucks around here, we are all pretty darn happy to be getting a paycheck in these times. If that were to ever change, that file - along with all the other gender issues they have around here - will be given to the proper authorties.

It sounds legit to me. Perhaps not nice but legal. As long as they treat all hourly employees the same regardless of sex and treat all salaried employees the same regardless of sex. As you have stated it the company treats hourly and salaried employees differently and that is ok, even if it is contrary to the handbook.

The fact that all hourly employees are female while all salaried are male is completely irrelevant, it is just a coincidence.

ETA: I just walked over to our payroll clerk and explained the situation. She said you are allowed to treat hourly and non-hourly employees differently and the situation you described would be legal, at least in Ohio. She said the male vs. female thing is irrelevant since the differing factor is not sex but exempt status. It is possible that in other states you can't treat hourly and salaried employees differently but here you can.

 

[BEloveDisney]

I get five days for parents/in laws or children...in theory (My son just died while I was still on maternity leave and rather than save me some sick days for later and use the bereavement days, but they didn't. I have five fewer sick days now) One day for siblings. No days for grandparents/aunts/cousins.