Frustrated with DD's teacher

[kt_mom]

MAKE HER PUT IT IN HER BOOK BAG.....IT IS HER RESPONSIBILITY NOT YOURS!

I'm sorry, I guess I don't get the sarcastic eye roll about this. DD bring her book bag in. She gets her notebook out and put its on the counter. She gets her homework out and goes to the table to do her homework. When its complete she puts it back in her folder. In the meantime I pull out the papers that are sent home for the parents and sign the things that I am supposed sign, or read or whatever it is that's in there. If I finish first I leave it on the counter and she puts it in her bookbag when she's done with her homework. If she finishes first, then I turn around and stick it in her bag when I'm done with my part. I'm not going to ask her to stand around and wait on me when she has other chores and things she needs to be doing and a limited amount of time to do them in. It doesn't hurt me or her for me to pick up the notebook and stick it in her bookbag when I'm done.

 

[kt_mom]

Thought #1: a person who goes through life looking for a fight always finds one.

Thought #2: children learn what they live. If they see that their parents are hyper-critical, they will be hyper-critical too. This may come back to bite the parent when the child becomes a teen.

I don't see how this has anything to do with the discussion. DD does not know about the emails between the teacher and myself or the late notice on the program.

And again, I don't feel that its hyper-critical to expect things that aren't late to not be counted as late. I can see if I was trying to turn in a month of logs and expecting the teacher to give full credit, but I'm not.

 

[kt_mom]

Sometimes you have to stay one step ahead of the teacher by being proactive. My 7th grader is more than capable of keeping track of his own work, but I still check his assignments and grades, and question him about what he needs to do. In his English class, there is a set of regular assignments that are given each week, but his teacher tends to forget things or hand them out late. On the drive home each day, I ask him to run through his homework for the night. I make sure to ask about his English assignments if he doesn't list any. "Do you have a spelling packet? Grammar packet? Reading log?" If the teacher isn't assigning a reading log that week, she will usually specifically tell them. Sometimes she just forgets to hand it out until the next day. Seventh grade reading logs involve reading for 30 minutes each night, listing page numbers, and writing a long paragraph about what they read. If he misses one night, it's double the work the next night.

When the teacher seems to have forgotten, my son prints out a log from the teacher's website and does the first night's work. If she assigns it the next day, he's right on track. If she doesn't and he finds out there won't be a log due that week, he saves his work for the following week. Sometimes it takes second guessing the teacher and trying to stay on top of things, even if she forgot. It's not necessarily the optimal situation, but it's what my son and I have decided he needs to do to stay on top of things when the teacher might not be doing so.

Thanks. I know now that I am going to have to keep notes on when and what is turned in from now on. I have had a couple of weeks where its been wednesday and the teacher has not given the log back yet from the previous week and I've had to tell DD that she needs to make sure and ask her teacher for it back the next day because its due by friday.

My niece is in 4th grade and they have the same kind of weekly log that DD has last year. So thankfully next year we'll be back to that system which is much more straightforward.

 

[kt_mom]

My mom was the worst helicopter parent in the world and reading both your original and subsequent posts made me feel a little sick. I opened this thread expecting to read about some crazy, irrational thing the teacher did, but the irrational one is not the teacher. Your special snowflake will not benefit from this level of involvement. It is one point. Chill.

You can keep your nasty comments to yourself. I understand constructive criticism and that's fine. But just being nasty is not called for. And the stupid helicopter and snowflake terms are overused and annoying at best.

I said I was frustrated with DD's teacher. Again, not that I was irrate or going to storm the school and demand justice. Simply frustrated over two incidents that happened on the same day. And as a parent who gives a crap about my kids, I don't think its unreasonable to track her grades and question when something doesn't seem right. I didn't go yelling into the classroom and slam the papers down on the desk and tell the teacher she was horrible for grading the paper wrong. I simply sent an email to the teacher, which she said we could do anytime we had a question, and asked if she could check the grade becuase I thought there had been some confusion because of the week that SHE didn't hand out the logs on time and asked the parents to write the time in the kids notebook.

 

[andymattmom]

You came here saying how frustrated you were. You don't like what you hear and then go off on another rant. You stated you put things in here backpack. Put it in a spot on the counter and if she leaves and home...oh well! It is not your job to put in her backpack. We need to cut the cord at some point!

Your OP's were very one sided. They made it sound like your DD is the only child in class and teacher isn't doing HER job by emailing you immediately or remembering you both work.

From your post it appears you believe your DD is special and is the only one in the class because you aren't happy with the way the teacher is slow to email. You are not taking any responsibility for turning in the log early. Teachers set days, rules, etc and KIDS AND PARENTS should respect those rules. You and your daughter aren't exempt from following them. She wants it turned in on Friday so turn it in on Friday...how hard a rule is that to follow. So you didn't get an email on Monday because teacher had other things...is that the end of the world. You went on about that.

Comparing her to the other teachers from previous years IS JUST AS BAD AS TEACHERS COMPARING BROTHERS AND SISTERS TO EACH OTHER! It is not fair or right....EVERYONE IS THEIR OWN PERSON, HAS OWN CLASS RULES, ETC.

I am a parent who "gives a crap" about her kids too but I knew when to cut the cord or apron strings. There is a point when you can become too involved over the tiniest details. If there is a log issue have your DD talk to teacher about. The email doesn't even require anything...that is a stupid, petty issue. You need to step back, let DD talk to teacher and follow the rules teacher set for parents...turn it in on correct date. Maybe realize DD might not be bringing things home, etc. Let her unload backpack. Kids need to learn mommy and daddy won't always be there to get them out of situations. Being a parent who calls, goes in or whines about every tiny thing impacts your child. AND teachers do talk to previous years teachers....YOUR REPUTATION AND OVER INVOLVEMENT will follow YOUR DD.

If you don't like what you hear don't whine....don't come back and tear apart every post you don't agree with.

The rolling eyes were because from the wording of the post in was my opinion you baby your daughter....that is my opinion though from what I read in your posts. If you don't like OH WELL! The teacher is the one I feel for!

No, you didn't say DD was only one in class but your words implied it!

 

[kt_mom]

You came here saying how frustrated you were. You don't like what you hear and then go off on another rant. You stated you put things in here backpack. Put it in a spot on the counter and if she leaves and home...oh well! It is not your job to put in her backpack. We need to cut the cord at some point!

Your OP's were very one sided. They made it sound like your DD is the only child in class and teacher isn't doing HER job by emailing you immediately or remembering you both work.

From your post it appears you believe your DD is special and is the only one in the class because you aren't happy with the way the teacher is slow to email. You are not taking any responsibility for turning in the log early. Teachers set days, rules, etc and KIDS AND PARENTS should respect those rules. You and your daughter aren't exempt from following them. She wants it turned in on Friday so turn it in on Friday...how hard a rule is that to follow. So you didn't get an email on Monday because teacher had other things...is that the end of the world. You went on about that.

Comparing her to the other teachers from previous years IS JUST AS BAD AS TEACHERS COMPARING BROTHERS AND SISTERS TO EACH OTHER! It is not fair or right....EVERYONE IS THEIR OWN PERSON, HAS OWN CLASS RULES, ETC.

I am a parent who "gives a crap" about her kids too but I knew when to cut the cord or apron strings. There is a point when you can become too involved over the tiniest details. If there is a log issue have your DD talk to teacher about. The email doesn't even require anything...that is a stupid, petty issue. You need to step back, let DD talk to teacher and follow the rules teacher set for parents...turn it in on correct date. Maybe realize DD might not be bringing things home, etc. Let her unload backpack. Kids need to learn mommy and daddy won't always be there to get them out of situations. Being a parent who calls, goes in or whines about every tiny thing impacts your child. AND teachers do talk to previous years teachers....YOUR REPUTATION AND OVER INVOLVEMENT will follow YOUR DD.

If you don't like what you hear don't whine....don't come back and tear apart every post you don't agree with.

The rolling eyes were because from the wording of the post in was my opinion you baby your daughter....that is my opinion though from what I read in your posts. If you don't like OH WELL! The teacher is the one I feel for!

No, you didn't say DD was only one in class but your words implied it!

Are you a teacher? becasue you seem to be taking this rather personally.

I stated in one of my posts that their notebooks are the place they are supposed to store these type of things. According to the teacher anyway. I choose to fill the log out as we go. If the teacher chooses to take it up early because she sees that DD has met the required reading early, that's her choice. I am not "breaking the rules". And as I've stated before the directions say to "turn in BY friday" not "turn in ON friday" Their math contract specifically says "turn in ON friday".

DD does unload her backpack. I said that a few posts ago. She does her part and I do mine. Whoever finishes last sticks the notebook back in the bookbag. I don't think that's babying. I think its just practical. If she finishes last and forgets to put it in her backpack then that would be her fault. She has plenty of things she is required to be responsible for both at home and at school. The act of physcially sticking the notebook back in her bookbag is just not something I see as an issue. If I did leave it on the counter which has happened before then she gets it in the morning when she gets the toaster out.

I have a great relationship with all of the teachers that DD has had. I have rarely ever have to contact them at all or them me. But I'm not going to feel bad for using the method of communication that the teacher said to use to ask her about DD's grades when I notice something is off. If you choose to ignore incorrect grades I guess that's your choice.

I do not believe my DD is "special". What I do believe is that the teacher has a responsiblity to accurately grade the kids work and not count things as late that aren't. I believe that as a parent if I see a mistake its my job to ask the teacher to either correct it or explain it to me. She has corrected part of it and I'm going to leave it at that. Although DD is still missing a point for something as late that WAS NOT late.

But, for the teacher to then try to say that it stems from something that it clearly doesn't really frustrates me. The teacher messed up the logs and counted something late that wasn't. Then she wants to say that she has been counting them late all along, when I can clearly see from the grades that she hasn't. I haven't seen any but these two come home marked as late. The only ones that are showing up as late are the two in question and have absolutely nothing to do with a trip taken several weeks before, but actually have to do with the fact that SHE did not send the logs home on time and requested that the information be turned in in a different manner. I did what she asked and wrote it in the notebook. SHE chose to cut the page out of the notebook the next day. Personally I think she probably misplaced it. If she had just said this and corrected the grades then I would not be irritated.

But now I know that I will have to keep records of when and what I turn in and not rely on the teacher to do her part accurately.

And I'm sorry, I missed the sticky that stated we weren't allowed to respond to the responses on our threads. What is the point of a discussion board if there is not discussion?

 

[CAFarmerGirl]

I would have been annoyed at the late points, too. Also, I don't think annoyed necessarily = helicopter/hypercritical parent.

Finally, (sorry I skimmed the posts) was there something about a week delayed email? That is unacceptable (in my book) for *any* profession. I was also an engineer before obtaining my teaching credential, and my boss would have had my hide if I didn't respond to a client within 24 hours. When I taught (I am currently not working by choice), I treated my parents as my clients.

Nicole (credentialed special ed teacher, married to a teacher)

 

[kt_mom]

I would have been annoyed at the late points, too. Also, I don't think annoyed necessarily = helicopter/hypercritical parent.

Finally, (sorry I skimmed the posts) was there something about a week delayed email? That is unacceptable (in my book) for *any* profession. I was also an engineer before obtaining my teaching credential, and my boss would have had my hide if I didn't respond to a client within 24 hours. When I taught (I am currently not working by choice), I treated my parents as my clients.

Nicole (credentialed special ed teacher, married to a teacher)

It wasn't a week, at least I don't think so. DD had a paper that was chosen to be read in chapel with her on stage yesterday. The teacher emailed us Tuesday night at 5pm when she responded to the email I sent about the points on Monday night. DH takes DD to school every day and simply asked the teacher about it when he dropped off DD on Wednesday morning. The teacher said she didn't find out until Monday.

My thought was that I wish she would have jotted a quick note or email to us or told DD so she could tell us on Monday so that we could try to attend. I was able to work it out but DH was not on such short notice. I'm not angry with the teacher, just frustrated. Which I feel I have every right to be. I think it only becomes wrong depending on how you deal with it. I chose to vent a little on a message board, not go in and tell the teacher off that would be wrong. My main frustration was over the late points, this was just one of those things that happened at the same time that irritated me. It might not have irritated me so badly if it hadn't all happened in one email.

 

[pacrosby]

My goodness.

I'll jump in because I feel you've gotten a bit too much flack for a 'feeling' that really wasn't all that unreasonable. Your child is 8 years old for crying out loud....NOT a middle schooler. My eight year old is in second grade. He is NOT and should not be expected to take full control the way many of these posters are suggesting an 8 yr old should. Cut the cord? For an eight year old? How ridiculous is that? While I understand that some DISser's kids ride public transportation alone at night and read the Iliad, most other 8 yr olds play with toys, sleep with stuffed animals and cry when they fall down and hurt themselves. It is most definately appropriate to help them keep organized with their schoolwork. And there aren't too many teachers out there who would suggest otherwise (except here on the Dis perhaps)

fwiw personally, I think you have a legitimate concern about the manner in which the teacher has handled all of this (if the way I am reading your complaint is an accurate reflection of how it all went down). And although I wouldn't be all up in arms about it, I'd be careful from here on in. Perhaps a conference is appropriate. Not to 'blast' her but to present your concerns and gain some clarification regarding her expectations. You're not even 1/2 way into the year. Straighten it out now.

What I can't quite wrap my head around however is your concern about the loss of 1 single point. And that may have been where you lost the sympathy of many of the posters here. I hate to hear when parents are so wrapped up in their kids' grades that they start to lose perspective. Just maybe something to think about

 

[kt_mom]

My goodness.

I'll jump in because I feel you've gotten a bit too much flack for a 'feeling' that really wasn't all that unreasonable. Your child is 8 years old for crying out loud....NOT a middle schooler. My eight year old is in second grade. He is NOT and should not be expected to take full control the way many of these posters are suggesting an 8 yr old should. Cut the cord? For an eight year old? How ridiculous is that? While I understand that some DISser's kids ride public transportation alone at night and read the Iliad, most other 8 yr olds play with dolls/cars, sleep with stuffed animals and cry when they fall down and hurt themselves. It is most definately appropriate to help them keep organized with their schoolwork. And there aren't too many teachers out there who would suggest otherwise (except here on the Dis perhaps)

fwiw personally, I think you have a legitimate concern about the manner in which the teacher has handled all of this (if the way I am reading your complaint is an accurate reflection of how it all went down). And although I wouldn't be all up in arms about it, I'd be careful from here on in. Perhaps a conference is appropriate. Not to 'blast' her but to present your concerns and gain some clarification regarding her expectations. You're not even 1/2 way into the year. Straighten it out now.

What I can't quite wrap my head around however is your concern about the loss of 1 single point. And that may have been where you lost the sympathy of many of the posters here. I hate to hear when parents are so wrapped up in their kids' grades that they start to lose perspective. Just maybe something to think about

Thanks

I'll clarify the point issue. They don't get very many reading grades and reading comprehension is not her best subject. To keep her reading grade an A she needs the full points on her reading logs as there aren't many other grades other than the comprehension tests. It was actually more than one point in question. It was a 2.5 out of 5 one week and a 4 out of 5 for the second week in question. A 2.5 out of 5 is a 50%. a 4 out of 5 is an 80%. This can really affect the grade for the quarter.

She has worked hard to get invited into the enrichment program in her school and its very competitve. You have to be in the top % in your classroom and continue to do so to continue to be allowed to be in it as well as to be invited back the next semester. This is a program that she loves so she is working hard to keep her grades up to stay in it. She was really worried because she got a B in English last quarter. And there's nothing wrong with a B at all but she worries that it could cost her the spot in enrichment. If she is working hard and doing her part to keep her grades up to be in this program, then its important to me that her grades reflect her work. And missing points through no fault of her own is something that I feel needs to be addressed.

My email to the teacher was very nice and simply asked her if she could relook at it because I thought there was some confusion because of the week that she didn't send the logs home. Her response is to blame it on something entirely different that had no affect on it but then say that she would give DD the points anyway. As if she is doing it just to appease me rather than to correct her own mistake. Like I said, I think she lost the paper she cut out of DD's notepad the week she requested that they be written in there.

 

[pacrosby]

Thanks

I'll clarify the point issue. They don't get very many reading grades and reading comprehension is not her best subject. To keep her reading grade an A she needs the full points on her reading logs as there aren't many other grades other than the comprehension tests. It was actually more than one point in question. It was a 2.5 out of 5 one week and a 4 out of 5 for the second week in question. A 2.5 out of 5 is a 50%. a 4 out of 5 is an 80%. This can really affect the grade for the quarter.

She has worked hard to get invited into the enrichment program in her school and its very competitve. You have to be in the top % in your classroom and continue to do so to continue to be allowed to be in it as well as to be invited back the next semester. This is a program that she loves so she is working hard to keep her grades up to stay in it. She was really worried because she got a B in English last quarter. And there's nothing wrong with a B at all but she worries that it could cost her the spot in enrichment. If she is working hard and doing her part to keep her grades up to be in this program, then its important to me that her grades reflect her work. And missing points through no fault of her own is something that I feel needs to be addressed.

My email to the teacher was very nice and simply asked her if she could relook at it because I thought there was some confusion because of the week that she didn't send the logs home. Her response is to blame it on something entirely different that had no affect on it but then say that she would give DD the points anyway. As if she is doing it just to appease me rather than to correct her own mistake. Like I said, I think she lost the paper she cut out of DD's notepad the week she requested that they be written in there.

If that is the case (although to be honest it concerns me that a school puts a program into place that cause grade anxiety in an elementary school student) than I think you most definately should meet with the teacher and explain to her what you have just explained to me. It's a legitimate concern. Clear it up now

Good luck!

 

[kt_mom]

If that is the case (although to be honest it concerns me that a school puts a program into place that cause grade anxiety in an elementary school student) than I think you most definately should meet with the teacher and explain to her what you have just explained to me. It's a legitimate concern. Clear it up now

Good luck!

Its actually a really neat program. DD was really bummed that she didn't get invited last year. But she worked hard and was invited this year and is really enjoying it.

They pull them out of class for an hour or so two days a week and they get to learn about all kinds of neat things usually science or history related. Then they also have a field trip about once a month that goes along with what they are learning. They are also required to keep up with anything they miss in class while they are out. They are allowed to do this during their reading time on those days. Last month they were studying germs and some history about how we've learned to deal with them. The field trip was to the old city cemetary and their pest house museum. (I think that's what it was called) I got to go on that one and it was actually pretty interesting.

They are required to keep an A/B average during the semester to stay in the program. To get invited though you would have to have all A's to be in the top percentage of the class. Its not the end of the world if she wasn't invited back, but she would be really disappointed. I don't mind something that encourages her to work hard and also to manage her time wisely in class to keep up with the work. If it started to affect her grades or she became overly stressed about it then we would not continue doing it.

 

[pacrosby]

Its actually a really neat program. DD was really bummed that she didn't get invited last year. But she worked hard and was invited this year and is really enjoying it.

They pull them out of class for an hour or so two days a week and they get to learn about all kinds of neat things usually science or history related. Then they also have a field trip about once a month that goes along with what they are learning. They are also required to keep up with anything they miss in class while they are out. They are allowed to do this during their reading time on those days. Last month they were studying germs and some history about how we've learned to deal with them. The field trip was to the old city cemetary and their pest house museum. (I think that's what it was called) I got to go on that one and it was actually pretty interesting.

They are required to keep an A/B average during the semester to stay in the program. To get invited though you would have to have all A's to be in the top percentage of the class. Its not the end of the world if she wasn't invited back, but she would be really disappointed. I don't mind something that encourages her to work hard and also to manage her time wisely in class to keep up with the work. If it started to affect her grades or she became overly stressed about it then we would not continue doing it.

No need to feel like you have to justify her involvement...sorry if I made you feel like you did.

I'm sure it is a wonderful program, I just don't personally agree with that kind of focus on grades at such an early age. It's a different climate now in the schools and not one that I necessarily agree with it.....but I suppose that's another thread

 

[kt_mom]

No need to feel like you have to justify her involvement...sorry if I made you feel like you did.

I'm sure it is a wonderful program, I just don't personally agree with that kind of focus on grades at such an early age. It's a different climate now in the schools and not one that I necessarily agree with it.....but I suppose that's another thread

No problem. I understand what you are saying too. And its important for us to help DD keep it all in perspective. Getting a B in english in 3rd grade is not the end of the world.

 

[EKW]

I don't see how this has anything to do with the discussion. DD does not know about the emails between the teacher and myself or the late notice on the program.

And again, I don't feel that its hyper-critical to expect things that aren't late to not be counted as late. I can see if I was trying to turn in a month of logs and expecting the teacher to give full credit, but I'm not.

The answer to the problem might be to spend some time why you don't see how my comments apply to this situation. It doesn't surprise me that they befuddle you. When you figure out how they apply you'll be half way there!

 

[jessica52877]

If my kid should have been given full credit and wasn't you bet I would email the teacher and ask why. Why should he be penalized if he didn't do wrong?

 

[kt_mom]

The answer to the problem might be to spend some time why you don't see how my comments apply to this situation. It doesn't surprise me that they befuddle you. When you figure out how they apply you'll be half way there!

Befuddle, really? You're comments do not "befuddle" me. Make me laugh, yes. Befuddle me, no. I stand by what I originally said. You're comments do not apply.

 

[kt_mom]

If my kid should have been given full credit and wasn't you bet I would email the teacher and ask why. Why should he be penalized if he didn't do wrong?

Thank you! It blows my mind how many people think it should just be okay.

 

[princessmom29]

Count me as another one who thinks this should not be as big a deal as you are making it. It seems to me that you are looking for reasons to be critical of the teacher, and any little thing will do. DD gose to a similar small private school. There are 16 in her second grade class. I would not expect what you are from her teachers. She was recognized in chapel on Tuesday, and I got a note on Friday letting me know this. I didn't get bent out of shape about it, I just did what I could and sent my Mom in my place. I cannot imagine expecting a weeks notice for something like that? I also think it is unreasonable to be so bent out of shape that the teacher didn't email you as soon as she knew on Monday. Teachers are people, nad they have others in their lives that matter besides you and your child. I think we as parents forget this sometimes and expect teachers to be "on demand" all the time to fulfill our needs.

As for the reading log, it was clearly a miscommunication on BOTH your parts, and it seems to me the teacher is willing to meet you halfway in fixing it. I don't get why that isn't enough? I think it is more a case of you looking to find fault with the teacher.

 

[kt_mom]

Count me as another one who thinks this should not be as big a deal as you are making it. It seems to me that you are looking for reasons to be critical of the teacher, and any little thing will do. DD gose to a similar small private school. There are 16 in her second grade class. I would not expect what you are from her teachers. She was recognized in chapel on Tuesday, and I got a note on Friday letting me know this. I didn't get bent out of shape about it, I just did what I could and sent my Mom in my place. I cannot imagine expecting a weeks notice for something like that? I also think it is unreasonable to be so bent out of shape that the teacher didn't email you as soon as she knew on Monday. Teachers are people, nad they have others in their lives that matter besides you and your child. I think we as parents forget this sometimes and expect teachers to be "on demand" all the time to fulfill our needs.

As for the reading log, it was clearly a miscommunication on BOTH your parts, and it seems to me the teacher is willing to meet you halfway in fixing it. I don't get why that isn't enough? I think it is more a case of you looking to find fault with the teacher.

First of all, I never said it should be a weeks notice. I mentioned that I did get a weeks notice last year and that it was really nice. I think a note on friday for a tuesday event is plenty of time and is better than 5pm Tuesday night for a wednesday event when the teacher did know on Monday. I'm not asking for detailed itenerary that would have taken hours or even a half hour to put together. I would have been happy if she had just mentioned it to DD who I know would have come home and told me right away. It takes about 20seconds to jot a quick note on the homework pad.

And I guess I should just be okay that the teacher mistakenly gave DD an F and C on two of her assignments, through no fault of DD's. And then when asked to look into it and correct she only corrects one and tries to blame teh mistake on me? and of course that's me just looking for fault with the teacher. I guess your okay if you kids do their best and then get F's because of the teachers lack of organization? I realize when you are thinking 1 point or 2 points off it doesn't sound so bad. But when you look at what the grade is, in this case an F and a C, I find it hard to believe that none of the other parents on this board with question that.

I did not express my frustration to the teacher at all. My email simply and nicely asked her to look into why the assignments were graded as late. The teachers return email gives the impression that she is just doing the correction to appease me as opposed to becuase it was graded wrong. And I left it at that with the teacher. I didn't email her back and tell her she was wrong. Instead I made of note to keep at home of what reading DD did and when the teacher took it out of DD's notebook and graded it. I will keep my own log at home for if this happens again in the future.

The whole chapel thing was a side issue and probably more irritating becuase it was part of the email about the grades. If it had happened at a different time it probably wouldn't have bothered me as much as it did. But I am truly amazed at how many people would not have an issue with the teacher giving their child a failing grade on an assignment by mistake. But yet focus on the fact that I stick the notebook back in DD's bookbag when I'm done with it. I guess I just have different priorities then some of the readers here.