Frozen shoulder manipulation?

[Shugardrawers]

Has anyone ever had a manipulation under anesthesia for a frozen shoulder? My dr seems to think that's the reason I'm still having pain an year after my rotator cuff repair. Now he wants to do this. It sounds absolutely barbaric. Just wondering if it actually works.

 

[kdibattista]

I have never heard of doing it under anesthesia. If I were you, I would look into Myofascial Release. Here is some info:

http://www.myofascialreleaseclinic.com/frozenshoulder.htm

Good luck

 

[antmaril]

I suffered from frozen shoulder several years ago. I was referred to an orthopedic surgeon for possible manipulation. The orthopedic doctor was very much against it. I got the feeling he thought it was barbaric was well.

I had weeks of physical therapy and two cortisone shots (which didn't help at all). At the end of physical therapy, I was told it would just take time. Eventually, it eased up and I've been fine since. I do not have full range of motion in that arm, but it's about 90% and not problematic.

Good luck. I know it is very painful!

 

[UMTerp]

I also had frozen shoulder a few years ago. Physical therapy worked for me but it hurt like you know what to do some of those exercises. I'm back to normal now. Good luck!

UMTerp

 

[Shugardrawers]

I would LOVE not to do this but I'm kind of stuck. Backstory: I injured my rotator cuff at work so of course I have to do what they tell me or I don't get the treatment paid for. The law says reasonable treatment is anything widely accepted and practiced by the general medical community of the specialist treating your injury. While some people don't like it, it's still widely accepted. If I don't do it, they won't pay for any further treatment and my personal insurance won't pick up the costs. Rock-meet hard place.

In looking around the net I've found lots of forums where the patients had very mixed reactions. Some had wonderful results. Others just want their arm amputed at this point. And here's the kicker: if it doesn't seem to work, THEY BLAME THE PATIENT!!! Nope, couldn't possibly be anything else, nope, couldn't have done it wrong. YOU aren't doing your aggressive PT.

I've had more medical procedures than I can count. I've never been afraid of one. I'm terrified of this one.

 

[brittsmum1998]

I go to physical therapy one to two times per week for frozen shoulder. It helps, I had problems sleeping, waking in pain etc. My therapist does the hot ultrasound and its taken the pain basically away. I still have limited mobility but she says that could take up to two yrs to go away. Ask about the heat ultrasound.

 

[Camicar]

My dh's frozen shoulder 'thawed' with a combination of heat ultrasound and PT, which included nightly home sessions as well.

 

[DawnCt1]

I have a frozen shoulder that is gradually resolving through months of physical therapy and since the spring, nautilaus at the health club. The problem as I understand it, that sometimes with manipulation under anesthesia, you can obtain a "release" but that the manipulation itself can cause more imflamation and it can get "refrozen". The physical therapist told me that eventually all frozen shoulders "resolve" on their own in 18 months to 5 years, PT hastens the process. Well, thats a long time to have a frozen shoulder of course. I would get an orthopods opinion from a different practice and see what he thinks. Shoulders "freeze" because its an inflamatory response to the trauma. The original trauma or the trauma of surgery. I met a lady the other day who said that her husband took her on a cruise and she "hung" by her arm in the deep end of the salt water pool several times a day. She is convinced that the weight and the salt water "cured" her shoulder. Well, there was no doubt about it. Her shoulder is cured. She is a lot older than me and she has better range of motion than I do. So who knows. I wouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth for sure. Good luck. I know you were helpful to me when I was preparing for my surgery. I still appreciated it.

 

[mudnuri]

I'm not really sure what you guys mean by frozen shoulder......

DBF had his left rotator cuff done in January- with pretty bad results- he ended up having more damage to his bicept tendon, and has had a cortisone injection since, as well as pt, ultrasound therapy etc...

when they did his right shoulder in May, they went in differently- the scars are closer- to minimize the bicept tendon damage, and the outcome was about 50% better. We go back to the surgeon on Monday, and I'm guessing he will get an injection in his right arm.

Now, about workmans compensation-you do NOT have to do what the surgeon recommends- you can use your own surgeon, get your own opinion etc... There is nothing that states you HAVE to have surgery- when there are other options for treatment. DBF had the choice, surgery or cortisone. he went surgery- and now has cortisone anyway...Basically if he went just cortisone, he'd be having surgery in 2-3 years anyway.

The point I'm trying to make is- do NOT do this if your not comfortable with the possible outcome, they can not deny you medical coverage because you decided a different therapy route. Trust me on this, DBF has been out of work since Sept 2006, and I've filed and WON 2 different appeals with the state labor and industry division.

Brandy

 

[Honu]

I had intensive PT for about 6 months and the first few months were dreadful. I had to be medicated 24/7. But the treatments worked. I have full motion and no pain now.

Will they not let you attempt PT first?

 

[DawnCt1]

I would LOVE not to do this but I'm kind of stuck. Backstory: I injured my rotator cuff at work so of course I have to do what they tell me or I don't get the treatment paid for. The law says reasonable treatment is anything widely accepted and practiced by the general medical community of the specialist treating your injury. While some people don't like it, it's still widely accepted. If I don't do it, they won't pay for any further treatment and my personal insurance won't pick up the costs. Rock-meet hard place.



.

What is most widely accepted as a first approach to frozen shoulder is physical therapy. I would insist on that first.

 

[Shugardrawers]

That's the problem. PT has only been somewhat successful. It'll be a year on the 10th since my surgery and I've been doing PT since shortly after and still am. Frankly, I think there's something else wrong because the ROM isn't all that bad except for extreme internal rotation, no way that's happening. My problem really is pain in weight bearing and extension. I've had that since the day of the surgery. Wouldn't a frozen shoulder have much more limited ROM?

Mudnuri, google frozen shoulder manipulation and it'll explain what it is and how you get it. He basically wants to dislocate my shoulder and tear apart the scar tissue from my rotator cuff repair. Luckily you're under general anesthesia but I can't stomach the idea at all. I really want another opinion but I've been begging for one for months and the insurance company hasn't arranged it yet. In VA you can only see another Dr with the permission of your claims adjustor or a judge.

I'm going to try to file an emergency judicial appeal Monday. That way they can't discharge me for refusing medical treatment. Hopefully the judge will order a 2nd opinion.

 

[DawnCt1]

. Wouldn't a frozen shoulder have much more limited ROM?

.

No, My internal rotation is almost "normal". External rotation still has a ways to go. I guess it depends upon where the scar tissue in the cuff ends up. I am an impatient person. I asked my surgeon if he wouldn't just put me to sleep and move it where its supposed to be. He wouldn't. He felt it would be counterproductive.

 

[wvjovifan]

I had this done last Summer. Started out with frozen shoulder, had 3 cortisone shots and weeks and weeks of PT with some relief. Orthopedic surgeon decided to do manipulation under anesthesia. You don't feel anything as you are out cold for a short period of time. They did a nerve block on me and my arm was in a sling for about 2 days. After that cleared up there was no pain or side effects and I was off work for 3 weeks . Still had limited motion so finally had an MRI done and discovered I had a partial tear of the rotator cuff. They scheduled me for surgery and Ortho thought he could repair it with orthoscopic surgery. Once he got in there, the tear was worse than expected and he had to cut. That took 8 - 10 weeks to recover with PT but since I had already been in PT for months, my recovery was 100% much earlier than expected. I now have no pain at all and 100% range of motion so it was all worth it in the long run!!

 

[DawnCt1]

I had this done last Summer. Started out with frozen shoulder, had 3 cortisone shots and weeks and weeks of PT with some relief. Orthopedic surgeon decided to do manipulation under anesthesia. You don't feel anything as you are out cold for a short period of time. They did a nerve block on me and my arm was in a sling for about 2 days. After that cleared up there was no pain or side effects and I was off work for 3 weeks . Still had limited motion so finally had an MRI done and discovered I had a partial tear of the rotator cuff. They scheduled me for surgery and Ortho thought he could repair it with orthoscopic surgery. Once he got in there, the tear was worse than expected and he had to cut. That took 8 - 10 weeks to recover with PT but since I had already been in PT for months, my recovery was 100% much earlier than expected. I now have no pain at all and 100% range of motion so it was all worth it in the long run!!

That's a great story. I would have never believed that a shoulder would be such a pain in the BUTT! Glad that yours turned out so well. I am getting there.

 

[wvjovifan]

That's a great story. I would have never believed that a shoulder would be such a pain in the BUTT! Glad that yours turned out so well. I am getting there.

Shoulders are definitely pains in the butt!!!! That was one long adventure for me!!! Before all this they thought maybe I had a pinched nerve so I went thru all that torture testing first!!! PT actually thawed my frozen shoulder, but I just couldn't get the range of motion back. So glad they finally did an MRI!!! Good luck to you and hang in there!!!!

 

[FranP]

Had almost a year of PT, with all the ultrasound and heat therapy - recovered about 80% ROM but couldn't then (more than 15 years ago) and still can't hook my bra in back. The doctor asked me what I couldn't do - I thought a minute and said, hook my bra in back, reach the top shelf in the kitchen and clean the very top of the mirror in the bathroom - but had no pain otherwise. He said, he could operate, but it would get me about 1 inch in motion and take another 6 months in PT. He and I both felt that what I had was enough - and it was - no paid and bras that hook in front!!!!

 

[acadia1960]

I am a physical therapist aide, & see this condition all the time. Shoulders take a long time to heal, no matter what you do. Be patient, & do all the exercises, self massages, heat or ice the Physical Therapist tells you to do. I tore my rotator cuff Feb 2006, just a small tear, did not require surgery. Had 4 months of PT, cortizone shot, did all my exercises, etc, & still was over a year before that shoulder felt good. Frozen shoulder can take a long time, & is so painful. I feel so bad for some of our patients, & always try to pamper & encourage them.