FP+... who hates it

[JimmyV]

The only thing I hate about FP+ is the tiering system in Epcot in Hollywood Studios.

It is, quite honestly, the only way Disney could make this flawed system work until more headliner attractions are built. How many off site FP+ lovers would change their tune if Epcot were not a tiered park and every FP for Soarin' and Test Track were gone by the 30 day mark? There is plenty of angst and hand-wringing over getting FPs for A&E, 7DMT, fireworks and parades. Imagine the storm that would brew if Soarin', Test Track, TSMM, RnR and ToT were added to that list of "hard/impossible to get FPs". If all of these attractions were scarfed up the way A&E get scarfed up, an awful lot of "lovers" would be converted to "haters". Tiering is the only thing that prevents this from happening.

 

[JimmyV]

i define it by people that would get fastpasses and hoard them to use one after the other later in the day instead of going during the 1hr window.

Mathematically, this does not add up. A FP, once pulled from the machine, is in the hands of the "owner" and no longer available to anyone else. If you are not the owner of the FP, then it doesn't impact your day one iota if the owner uses the FP at 10:00 a.m., 12:00 p.m. or 6:00 p.m.. All that matters to you is that the finite number of FPs has been depleted by one. A person who used 3 FPs during the proper time did not alter your riding schedule any differently than a person who used 3 FPs later in the day in succession. In fact, if you went to ride Space Mountain during the hour that the person with the FP should have ridden it, but that person didn't return until much later, you actually netted a windfall because there was one less FP person to cut you off during the time that you rode .

And incidentally, this is exactly why Disney not only "tolerated" the fact that FPs could be used at any time after the window opened, its CMs actively promoted that strategy to anyone who asked or had a question about missing parades or ADRs, or for whatever other reason might have been out there. Disney understood that using FPs later in the day did not harm anyone else's visit. They just started enforcing the window in preparation for FP+ which requires a much more rigid adherence to the time slots.

 

[Luckybee]

I dislike FP+ very much.. There is not a ride anywhere that I will wait for 30 mins. 20 is pushing my limits.. Those of you who will say, why do you go to disney then,, I go because my wife loves disney, and i enjoy it very much... First trip 1996 was almost my last, waited 45 mins for splash, bout the same for space.. I hated it said I wouldn't go back. Then DW tells me, theres a new thing called fast pass, doesn't cost extra, I agreed to give it another try.. Loved it.. enough that my family has been back almost every year since..
Guess what.. I could go, ride everything I wanted, and not stand in line for usually more than 10 to 15 mins.. Granted we have always gone in slow times usually mid oct, week after thanksgiving...
I never ran for a fast pass once, unless walking at rope drop to an attraction counts as running.. Never had more than one fast pass at a time. Never used one after it expired, could still easily use 6 to 8 in a day... and we could usually walk right on mansion, pirates, etc with minimal waits..
I know there are no longer the slow times we were used too.. but we still could ride most rides with a 15 to 20 min wait.. Went for 4 days end of january, was only able to land one sdmt and that was for later in the evening... I'm sure if we had been staying for a week to 10 days we could have done better.. I don't think people will find as much available at 60 days if they are only going to be there for 3 or 4 days..
Fast pass + did not allow us to change plans like we could in the past, one day we decided to go to epcot instead of hs, the only thing we could get a fast pass for that we had any interest in was SE. which had always been a walk on for us.. As far as scheduling 4th FP the only options that were available were rides that we always walked on before..
Did it ruin our trip no, Did we have to settle for doing a lot less then we were used too,, YES... Will we be back yes reservations for oct, but if we continue to have our experiences go down and the price go up we will have to rethink in the future,,,,,,,,,,,,

Just have to say that you sound very much like dh and I.

 

[Mambo Junkie]

I have gone to Disney almost every year since 1972, sometimes twice a year. The past 8 years, because of skyrocketing costs, we've cut back to every other year (the exception being we went twice in 2010 and 2013). Using my last experience as a reference, I am seriously reconsidering my Disney vacations. I write this with great sadness, because I have always been a huge WDW fan. This past trip I spent nearly triple what I have in past years, and did about 1/3 to 1/2 of what I normally do, plus I was rushed the whole time, not to mention the stress of pre-planning.

 

[Alfalfa]

I have gone to Disney almost every year since 1972, sometimes twice a year. The past 8 years, because of skyrocketing costs, we've cut back to every other year (the exception being we went twice in 2010 and 2013). Using my last experience as a reference, I am seriously reconsidering my Disney vacations. I write this with great sadness, because I have always been a huge WDW fan. This past trip I spent nearly triple what I have in past years, and did about 1/3 to 1/2 of what I normally do, plus I was rushed the whole time, not to mention the stress of pre-planning.

Where did the "More for Less" poster go? I found one of the threads but it's closed and I was really looking forward to reading more about that.

 

[SnackCredit]

It is, quite honestly, the only way Disney could make this flawed system work until more headliner attractions are built.

Actually, Epcot's tiering system makes a bit more sense, as Soarin and Test Track are the two biggest thrill rides and there are plenty of solid tier 2 choices. Hollywood Studios puts too many decent attractions into tier 1, making many parties waste an FP on tier 2 scraps that have a tiny standby wait anyway.

 

[lustergirl]

I consider myself fortunate. I am going in 36 days on a solo trip. I already made my fast pass selections online and got what I wanted. I say I am fortunate because I don't ride the thrill rides so don't have to sweat over not getting FP for those.

 

[Disneylover99]

And incidentally, this is exactly why Disney not only "tolerated" the fact that FPs could be used at any time after the window opened, its CMs actively promoted that strategy to anyone who asked or had a question about missing parades or ADRs, or for whatever other reason might have been out there. Disney understood that using FPs later in the day did not harm anyone else's visit. They just started enforcing the window in preparation for FP+ which requires a much more rigid adherence to the time slots.

I agree. It was actually a Disney CM who let me know I could and should use my FP at any time back in 2010 during my first trip back in many years. In no way was I a "hoarder" or "abuser" of the system.

 

[Mkrop]

I always followed the return time rule, too, and managed to use more than 3 fastpasses in a day. On average, we used 5, on a really good day, up to 8 or 9. So no, I didn't abuse the system and there were many more guests who knew how to use the sytem to their advantage, within the rules.

And I feel like many are learning the ins and outs of this system to get the most bang for the buck. There are many guests who have no clue that you do not know have to take the 3 that WDW suggests for your first 3 FP+s, and yet others know the "trick" that you can go in and then change your selection. Are they a wise user or an "abuser"? Should they not just take what WDW gives them? No they found a way that works within the parameters of the system and make the best use of FPs that works with their touring style. Just like the folks who used FP- after the window, it was allowed so why would they not utilize this option to make the most of their day. There are throw away rooms now etc, all kinds of things that people are using to their advantage that WDW is allowing, it is what it is ( and no we have never booked a throwaway room)

Mathematically, this does not add up. A FP, once pulled from the machine, is in the hands of the "owner" and no longer available to anyone else. If you are not the owner of the FP, then it doesn't impact your day one iota if the owner uses the FP at 10:00 a.m., 12:00 p.m. or 6:00 p.m.. All that matters to you is that the finite number of FPs has been depleted by one. A person who used 3 FPs during the proper time did not alter your riding schedule any differently than a person who used 3 FPs later in the day in succession. In fact, if you went to ride Space Mountain during the hour that the person with the FP should have ridden it, but that person didn't return until much later, you actually netted a windfall because there was one less FP person to cut you off during the time that you rode .

And incidentally, this is exactly why Disney not only "tolerated" the fact that FPs could be used at any time after the window opened, its CMs actively promoted that strategy to anyone who asked or had a question about missing parades or ADRs, or for whatever other reason might have been out there. Disney understood that using FPs later in the day did not harm anyone else's visit. They just started enforcing the window in preparation for FP+ which requires a much more rigid adherence to the time slots.

Exactly I never truly understood what the issue was...If I am not in line from 2-3 for Space, then the guest who did show up then gets to ride sooner. To me it was always a wash, there were only so many FP-s on a given day.

 

[Shaden]

We preferred the legacy FP system over FP+ as we experience fewer attractions overall under FP+.

Basically, we kept an eye on when we were eligible to pull our next FP, so typically we were able to pull 8-10 per day. We always traveled in the fall, and other than our Soarin' and TSM FPs that were pulled more than an hour or so after park opening, our FP return times were typically 40-60 minutes in the future. Especially at the MK, we never experienced return times that were 2 hours or more in the future. FP was spectacular...we'd get to a land, pull a headliner FP, do something with short or no wait, pull another FP as soon as we could, then use our FP, then do a SB ride or whatever, lather, rinse repeat, as we made our way through the park. There was no criss-crossing, no running. I was the "runner" but while I was pulling FPs, my husband and kids were hitting the bathrooms, getting a snack, or, if we were in Fantasyland, riding the Carousel (because I don't do things that go in circles).

FP+ has made RD more important for us, and the first two hours in the parks are more rushed than they were before. We now know that if we're traveling any time that is even moderately busy, once 11:00 hits, we're going to be excluded from most rides because the lines will be too long for us (more than 20 minutes; 30 minutes is usually our max). So while under FP we knew that we could leisurely make our way through the parks through the day, now we're cramming as much in during the first two hours as possible. So that's a pretty significant change for us. Those first two hours never felt so necessary in the past. We're getting up earlier more days now than we did under the old system.

Edited out some stuff, because the particulars didn't apply to our case ... this is EXACTLY us. And we figured out this way to tour without the DisBoards or a touring guide or anything.

Very simple.

In fact we found ourselves crisscrossing the parks far more under FP+ than under Legacy FP, use an FP, head back to the kiosk, wait in line (sometimes short, sometimes longer) see what's available, then head there ... often across the park. Then back to a kiosk, wait in line, see what's available, head back out, often across the park.

 

[Mkrop]

Edited out some stuff, because the particulars didn't apply to our case ... this is EXACTLY us. And we figured out this way to tour without the DisBoards or a touring guide or anything.

Very simple.

In fact we found ourselves crisscrossing the parks far more under FP+ than under Legacy FP, us an FP, head back to the kiosk, wait in line (sometimes short, sometimes longer) see what's available, then head there ... often across the park. Then back to a kiosk, wait in line, see what's available, head back out, often across the park.

this was us as well esp in MK! We were never near a kiosk when we wanted to try and get addl FP+s. Like we got off BTMRR and had to treck it all the way back to JC to get a FP for Barnstormer, so we walked all the way to Barnstormer. Now we were there Christmas week so pickings were slim, so the selection was not there to pick something closer, we had to take what was available.

 

[jade1]

The kiosk lines were minimal first week of March if interested.

 

[capegirl]

Just got back after two weeks and the first week FP availability was pretty good, even same day - and SB waits were nice and low for many attractions. I think even Touring Plans revised their crowd level estimates downward for that week.

The second week, though, was the exact opposite. FP's were gone very quickly and by late morning/early afternoon selections were poor. I felt sorry for the people standing in long lines at the kiosks knowing that when they go their turn they were only going to find attractions that they probably could have spent less time the SB line than to stand in line getting an FP for it.

Between a couple of weeks in Nov/Dec and a couple of weeks this month, I'm seeing a pattern - when crowds are low and SB lines are short, FP selection is pretty good even same day. When crowds are higher (7+) and SB lines are longer the FP selection is pretty poor very quickly - and a lot of the headliners are gone a day or two before.

Definitely takes more planning than it used to.

As to the comment about long kiosk lines, I took this picture Thursday (3/19) at MK:

View attachment 83673


.

I believe the old saying
'a picture is worth a thousand words' would apply to this photo. If I cannot enjoy any additional attractions in the park without waiting in such a kiosk line, me and my Mickey ears will head back to the resort pool, and I will not be eating or shopping in the stores on my way out of the park.

 

[Cormoran]

i define it by people that would get fastpasses and hoard them to use one after the other later in the day instead of going during the 1hr window.
going during the 1hr window was always the rule but it was not enforced.
i always followed the rule so i usually didn't get more than 3 fastpasses on any given day where as others would collect 10 and then use them later just because they "could".
i had no problem with them enforcing the rule but everyone that was abusing it then complained complained complained about having to follow the rule.
people that abused the system are now finding that they really cannot abuse it with FP+ and it angers them.
i like FP+ because it helps to make sure everyone is following the rule not just the honest people.

My family didn't repeatedly ride headliners. I also think it's interesting that you say there is no abuse of the new system. So you think booking throw away rooms to get an earlier booking window or creating a new MDE account with new MB's and then using MB's from a previous visit is not abusive?

I can only speak for my experiences and why I don't like FP+. But I also try to avoid speaking for people who are happy with the new system. I'm glad you're happy with the current system, but that doesn't mean that everyone who loved legacy is some type of an abuser.

 

[Tonyz]

What a great, original idea for a thread!

 

[disney world dreamer]

Mathematically, this does not add up. A FP, once pulled from the machine, is in the hands of the "owner" and no longer available to anyone else. If you are not the owner of the FP, then it doesn't impact your day one iota if the owner uses the FP at 10:00 a.m., 12:00 p.m. or 6:00 p.m.. All that matters to you is that the finite number of FPs has been depleted by one. A person who used 3 FPs during the proper time did not alter your riding schedule any differently than a person who used 3 FPs later in the day in succession. In fact, if you went to ride Space Mountain during the hour that the person with the FP should have ridden it, but that person didn't return until much later, you actually netted a windfall because there was one less FP person to cut you off during the time that you rode .

And incidentally, this is exactly why Disney not only "tolerated" the fact that FPs could be used at any time after the window opened, its CMs actively promoted that strategy to anyone who asked or had a question about missing parades or ADRs, or for whatever other reason might have been out there. Disney understood that using FPs later in the day did not harm anyone else's visit. They just started enforcing the window in preparation for FP+ which requires a much more rigid adherence to the time slots.

here is how it would impact me.
a group of guests gets a fastpass for splash mountain with a window from 1pm-2pm but does not use it.
i get a fastpass with a window of 5pm-6pm and i use it during my hour.
the group of 10 decides that they feel like going between 5pm-6pm.
so now in addition to everyone that got a fastpass with a return time of 5pm-6pm you have people that had an earlier return time also going durign that time.
that could very much so impact my wait time.
you have your opinion and i have mine and i don't feel that i should be attacked for it.

 

[Shaden]

The kiosk lines were minimal first week of March if interested.

I believe the old saying
'a picture is worth a thousand words' would apply to this photo. If I cannot enjoy any additional attractions in the park without waiting in such a kiosk line, me and my Mickey ears will head back to the resort pool, and I will not be eating or shopping in the stores on my way out of the park.

Or we could look at the HS Kiosk by ToT our last trip ... This was about 10:30 in the morning.



You can see it went right to the RnRC area entrance.



Took about 20 or 25 mins to reach the kiosks

And of course, there was nothing "Good" available .... "Limited" means gone, though some might appear if people cancel/miss them

 

[disney world dreamer]

that doesn't mean that everyone who loved legacy is some type of an abuser.

please don't misquote me.

 

[Disneylover99]

you have your opinion and i have mine and i don't feel that i should be attacked for it.

I don't think anyone is attacking you, but when you refer to people who used their fp's beyond their window as "hoarders" and "abusers" be prepared for a difference in opinion.

 

[disney world dreamer]

I don't think anyone is attacking you, but when you refer to people who used their fp's beyond their window as "hoarders" and "abusers" be prepared for a difference in opinion.

i would not have even posted my opinion about my definition of abusers but someone asked me a direct question about it so i answered.
i don't mind the difference of opinion.
i mind that some tore my answer to shreds just because it did not follow suit with their opinion.