FP + What we know and what we want to know

[JaimeA]

Folks really do seem to be reading what they want out of comments..

The large group of people tested all could use both.. most did not choose to do so.

If I read what I wanted I wouldn't have asked you to correct me if I misunderstood your answer. So thank you for the answer, it cleared that up.

Sent from my iPad using DISBoards

 

[doconeill]

We are training the future repeat customers... they are our children.

This has been mulling around in my head for a few days, actually...we constantly hear that the majority of guests to WDW are first timers - who really will know nothing about FP, FP+, MyMagic+, etc. and will likely still be just as much in the dark.

The flipside to that is that return visitors are the minority - and that a lot of visitors never return. And we on the boards would be an even greater minority...

Are they trying to change the demographic? Get some of those "once-and-dones" converted?

 

[doggydoc]

It is EASY to believe that is their goal. It is VERY DIFFICULT to ACCEPT. IT won't make people happy. But it might get them out of lines and into stores (or as Mom2rtk keeps saying - in lines at U/IoA)

It will make me very unhappy and definitely will make me rethink my plans

Yes, I think the people who say everything is going to be ok, its not that big of a deal are still hoping that we same day FP+ opportunity in addition to the Advance FP+. I have to agree if we get three advance FP+, we can use them on multiple e-tickets, and then we have the ability to pull more in the park. It would be great for everything other than having to plan way in advance for TSMM (Missyrose's recent post).

This is the only way FP+ will be an improvement and the only way I can see this not being a PR nightmare for Disney. Even though
DisFans and our ilk on other sites are certainly a minority we are an EXTREMELY vocal minority and we are obviously VERY plugged into online social media. Minority or not that is a powerful demographic. Universal will trip all over themselves to promote their advantage with the unlimited express pass for on-site guests.

Actually, this is a solid plan!

And sadly appears more and more to be the one I will adopt.

If what mousermerf asserts is true we probably won't go to Disney more than 3-4 out of 10 days. My DD loves Disney but I can pretty much guarantee that when faced with the choice of of RnRC ONCE or Dragon Challenge as many times as her poor old dad can stand, she'll choose trying to make dad puke any day of the week(except her birthday CRT @ MK no options).

Again I ask those of you that think this will be a positive for Disney: How is this going to make Disney's system appear favorable over the system at Universal? This is an important point because Disney clearly stated that this was to be an experience enhancement better than adding more rides (see comments on not engaging in ride wars blah, blah, blah) I would argue that FP- is a hands down better perk than US ExpressPass it's free yeah, but the best part is NO RESTRICTIONS other than those incurred by crowds. You can ride the rides as many times as you can get FP's for and then go to another park that evening and do it again. It's a great perk! I think it is a better choice than even the US onsite Express Unlimited, but only because it's Disney and there are EMH and some intangibles involved with staying at Disney. FP+ as described(3 only, 1 park, 1 e-ride) isn't even competitive with the for-pay ExpressPass at US. If they aren't going to compete on rides, how is FP+ a superior experience enhancement to what US offers?

1 final thought. I can almost see the point that this will improve the experience for new guests during busy times, but I go in September. In slower times how is this system going to do anything but drive people into the standby lines?

 

[finedice]

This has been mulling around in my head for a few days, actually...we constantly hear that the majority of guests to WDW are first timers - who really will know nothing about FP, FP+, MyMagic+, etc. and will likely still be just as much in the dark.

The flipside to that is that return visitors are the minority - and that a lot of visitors never return. And we on the boards would be an even greater minority...

Are they trying to change the demographic? Get some of those "once-and-dones" converted?

In the hospitality business, it is widely believed and accepted that repeat business is the most important of any kind. While 1st time visitors may be the majority (as in any restaurant or hotel), it is the repeat customers, the positive reviews they generate, AND the guests they turn on to it that fuel those 1st time visits, and in fact, represent a significant percentage of revenue that means the difference between the red and the black ink.

 

[bcrook]

It will make me very unhappy and definitely will make me rethink my plans




This is the only way FP+ will be an improvement and the only way I can see this not being a PR nightmare for Disney. Even though
DisFans and our ilk on other sites are certainly a minority we are an EXTREMELY vocal minority and we are obviously VERY plugged into online social media. Minority or not that is a powerful demographic. Universal will trip all over themselves to promote their advantage with the unlimited express pass for on-site guests.



And sadly appears more and more to be the one I will adopt.

If what mousermerf asserts is true we probably won't go to Disney more than 3-4 out of 10 days. My DD loves Disney but I can pretty much guarantee that when faced with the choice of of RnRC ONCE or Dragon Challenge as many times as her poor old dad can stand, she'll choose trying to make dad puke any day of the week(except her birthday CRT @ MK no options).

Again I ask those of you that think this will be a positive for Disney: How is this going to make Disney's system appear favorable over the system at Universal? This is an important point because Disney clearly stated that this was to be an experience enhancement better than adding more rides (see comments on not engaging in ride wars blah, blah, blah) I would argue that FP- is a hands down better perk than US ExpressPass it's free yeah, but the best part is NO RESTRICTIONS other than those incurred by crowds. You can ride the rides as many times as you can get FP's for and then go to another park that evening and do it again. It's a great perk! I think it is a better choice than even the US onsite Express Unlimited, but only because it's Disney and there are EMH and some intangibles involved with staying at Disney. FP+ as described(3 only, 1 park, 1 e-ride) isn't even competitive with the for-pay ExpressPass at US. If they aren't going to compete on rides, how is FP+ a superior experience enhancement to what US offers?

1 final thought. I can almost see the point that this will improve the experience for new guests during busy times, but I go in September. In slower times how is this system going to do anything but drive people into the standby lines?

These are good questions. My family has talked about this a lot. Disney has a lot tricks up their sleeves. It is clear in the articles that Disney is confident that people will enjoy their non-e-ticket rides more, this is a way to re-market their existing infrastructure. Their plan to use "surprise and delight" bonus fastpasses is ingenious! The customized, personalized experiences will make people ooh and ahhh. The first timers will gush about the talking seagull, the haunted mansion queue, the Jungle Cruise props - and if Mr. Potato Head starts personalizing his jokes in that standby line at Toy Story Midway Mania - watch out - people will passing up Fastpass and wait in standby. Right now my son is planning on doing standby at Test Track just do the design a car part.

All of these things will get old pretty quickly. But it will be enough to get everybody back for a second visit. Then they finish the Mine Coaster in 2014 - and boom another reason to return.

 

[mom2rtk]

Do they know _why_ they chose not to? And which did they choose not to do? (I'm assuming they chose not to use regular FP)

I think that's fairly clear. Because I was there. Of all the days they ran this test, only one really was a high enough crowd day to need fastpasses for headliners.

My first day in the parks on this vacation, I kept trying to make a phone call. I thought I would pull the phone out the minute we got stopped in a line. But we never did stop. We just kept walking onto ride after ride.

Saturday 12/15 in the MK was really the only really high crowd day of the entire test period. I anticipated as such which is why I suggested to my friend that she choose that as her FP+ day in the MK. And we successfully pulled Fps all day while they also squeezed in their FP+ stops.

Had the need been there, I'm sure the presence (or absence) of the ability to pull regular FP would have been front and center in people's minds.

 

[mom2rtk]

Then they drop Avatarland in 2015 - and boom another reason to return.

Uh, maybe.

 

[bcrook]

Uh, maybe.

Just play along...

 

[mom2rtk]

Just play along...

....... well, for the sake of disucssion........could we focus instead on the opening of the mine coaster in 2014?

 

[MAGICFOR2]

We are training the future repeat customers... they are our children.

So true! Mine are grown and they have been explaining to their friends how to "do" Disney as we say at home. Now we will have to find a new way to "do" Disney. Or not.

 

[bcrook]

....... well, for the sake of disucssion........could we focus instead on the opening of the mine coaster in 2014?

Anything for you!

 

[MAGICFOR2]

Because as far as I have read they haven't said you can't. We don't even know if the 3 prescheduled FP's will be the only ones we get yet. You keep posting as if you have some kind of inside knowledge. If you do then share it or at least let us know how you got it. we might be more likely to give your arguments weight.

I don't know where it came from, but I saw it - I think on the "other" thread about this -
But there were screen shots posted of people who brought up the WDW My Experience site, where it gave you lists of what you could choose, and as Mousemerf said, it would let you pick 2 out of list A and 1 out of List B - they put the E tickets on List A so you only got to choose 2 of them. List B was pretty much who cares? for us.

I believe shortly after that people trying to get to that screen found that it had been taken down.

Other who got to test the system described a similar scenario. So that is why this has been repeated and repeated ad naseum here. There is still the possibility that Disney isn't sure how they will handle it, so they took it down - OR they want to find a way to "spin it" before they announce it again.

 

[doconeill]

I don't know where it came from, but I saw it - I think on the "other" thread about this -
But there were screen shots posted of people who brought up the WDW My Experience site, where it gave you lists of what you could choose, and as Mousemerf said, it would let you pick 2 out of list A and 1 out of List B - they put the E tickets on List A so you only got to choose 2 of them. List B was pretty much who cares? for us.

I believe shortly after that people trying to get to that screen found that it had been taken down.

Other who got to test the system described a similar scenario. So that is why this has been repeated and repeated ad naseum here. There is still the possibility that Disney isn't sure how they will handle it, so they took it down - OR they want to find a way to "spin it" before they announce it again.

The only screenshots I've seen were of very early prototypes.

The tiers I've seen mentioned came from the most recent tests.

Note that they've been testing a limited-pick two-tiered system for several years - first with the Birthday Fastpass cards in 2009, and then the Give A Disney Day cards in 2010, before the NextGen testing started. So they've been thinking about a tiered system for quite a while.

 

[g-dad66]

Disney knows exactly what the FP+ and FP- usage was among those tested.

I appreciate all the info that you are letting us in on, but this one has me scratching my head a bit.

I can see that Disney could completely track the FP+ usage (and non-usage) of those tested.

But how did Disney track what regular FPs were pulled and used (or not used) by those same guests? Or was there simply a follow-up questionnaire where these guests reported what regular FPs they used?

 

[Disney_Princess83]

Interesting.

But my point remains: (1) Say, FPs for TSM currently run out by 11:00 am, so those who arrive later are out of luck. (2) With FP+, FPs for TSM will run out at some point (say, 10 days prior to park day.. or 5 days, or 2 days, or whatever...), so those who try to get a FP+ for TSM after that point will be out of luck.

But maybe there will be fewer complaints with the new system? Do procrastinators complain less than sleepyheads do?

As I said, I guess time will tell.

Our family is both so we are well and truly in trouble

Personally, we have a few days scheduled but mostly, we keep many free days. We wake up and see how we feel in the morning and choose a park. As are AP holders so we can park hop as well. That's why FP+ wouldn't work for us, we don't want to feel like we're "tied" down to MK because we have rides booked there. ADR's you can work around, we have in the past did a breakfast ADR at CRT and then hopped over to AK because that's where we felt like going when we woke up. We rarely make lunch reservations for this very reason.

I would opt out of FP+ if that meant we could continue using regular FP. However we don't even know if regular FP will continue to be offered or how it might be affected with FP+. We actually used FP much less on our previous trip because we hated feeling we were tied to a particular section of the park, waiting for our FP time. It caused so much stress because we were constantly looking at our watches, that we mostly just rode standby or came back. For us personally, I'm not sure how well FP+ would work and I can't wait to find out actual information from Disney when they release it. Until then, no one really knows what will happen with the sysem.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

I appreciate all the info that you are letting us in on, but this one has me scratching my head a bit.

I can see that Disney could completely track the FP+ usage (and non-usage) of those tested.

But how did Disney track what regular FPs were pulled and used (or not used) by those same guests? Or was there simply a follow-up questionnaire where these guests reported what regular FPs they used?

If they knew their park ticket ID, then they could.

 

[doconeill]

If they knew their park ticket ID, then they could.

Unless they were doing something special during the tests, they wouldn't be able to know if the regular FP was actually used, only if they took one.

 

[doggydoc]

I don't know where it came from, but I saw it - I think on the "other" thread about this -
But there were screen shots posted of people who brought up the WDW My Experience site, where it gave you lists of what you could choose, and as Mousemerf said, it would let you pick 2 out of list A and 1 out of List B - they put the E tickets on List A so you only got to choose 2 of them. List B was pretty much who cares? for us.

I believe shortly after that people trying to get to that screen found that it had been taken down.

If that's where the info came from why be so secretive about it mousermerf?

Other who got to test the system described a similar scenario. So that is why this has been repeated and repeated ad naseum here. There is still the possibility that Disney isn't sure how they will handle it, so they took it down - OR they want to find a way to "spin it" before they announce it again.

There's no way I can see to spin this as a positive change as described here. And no matter how fun the queues are no first-timer will care if Universals experience appears superior and large numbers of previous visitors go on line and scream about how lame the new system is.

 

[mom2rtk]

Just play along...

LOL, you really did change it!

In spite of all these discussions, I think we all know I'm coming back to see the mine coaster and Fantasyland in its finished form.

But I will add, the shape that trip takes will depend very much on how things shake out with FP+. It could be a trip where Disney captures every penny of a 10 day rip, as they did this past December. Or I could go for a short 3 or 4 day trip where they capture every penny (of a diminshed total) or I could go with the plan I outlined earlier where all Disney gets is a much diminished portion of some greater total, with US getting the lion's share.

And before any of you go crazy on me..... I know Disney won't care if I spend less. But I don't care. I can only control what I do. If I'm part of a bigger trend sending a message to Disney, great. If I'm an outlier..... then so be it. It wouldn't be the first time and it won't be the last time.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

Unless they were doing something special during the tests, they wouldn't be able to know if the regular FP was actually used, only if they took one.

No, they couldn't tell if it was used but they'd be able to see they they took a FP. So the intent to use it was there, even if they didn't make it back to the ride.