FP + What we know and what we want to know

[dadddio]

I didn't want to book FP+ yet.... I know it's not up yet..

Others have been able to pull up the button and FP+ info on the app...
I would really like to read through it myself.. However I still have not be able to find what they have been talking about..

I'm not sure if this is b/c they have packages booked? Or within 60days of their trips...

It seems some can pull it up and some can't... I just wanted the treks and conditions others have be reading through direct from disney.... That's all...

I can't pull up a FP+ button in the app. The terms of service that some have mentioned, however, is available. Click 'more', 'privacy & legal', 'Disney Park Experience Terms and Conditions'.

 

[Robo]

Actually, by staggering the amount of FP+s that are released in advance and holding some until same-day, two things would happen:

1. The very same number of desirable FP+ positions would be made available, and
2. These fastpasses would still be available beyond 60 days prior, allowing more people to benefit from FP+. This would, therefore, increase FP+ satisfaction, especially among the important 'passholder' and 'local, non-tourist' groups.

That puts us back a lot closer to square one, doesn't it?

The "regular" FP system (still in use at Disneyland) offered fair and equitable FP opportunities to all guests who simply went to the park and got them.

 

[dadddio]

There were reports that the iOS app (NOT the Android app) had a FastPass+ button when looking at the attractions, but it didn't work (called up a error screen or something). No one can book anything yet.

I'm in the iOS app right now. When I pull up an attraction, it shows me the current FP return window and the current wait time. It doesn't have a FP+ button.

Just an FYI.

 

[doconeill]

I'm in the iOS app right now. When I pull up an attraction, it shows me the current FP return window and the current wait time. It doesn't have a FP+ button.

Just an FYI.

Someone reported that the button had disappeared as well. Seems it was premature.

 

[dadddio]

1- I'd never say "couldn't," but logically they have already maxed-out the "E-ticket" attractions due to their super popularity.

It occurs to me that that statement isn't quite accurate. There are certain times of the week and day that a person can pretty much walk on these attractions and the rides are run at these times with empty seats. It seems that FP+ could be used to drive demand to this supply.

 

[ThornXBL]

I don't believe that the bolded bit is correct.

The off-site guests get a 'ticket with features of touch'. This would be an RFID card, not a tyvek card. In my mind, statements like this make it pretty clear that the old FP system is going away pretty quickly.

While I agree that this whole thing sounds like a harbinger of doom for the old FP system, guests would still have the option of using their Tyvek tickets if they have them, or else the existing FP machines would be unusable by all guests. You can trade in a Tyvek for a 'ticket with features of touch' if you want the new MyMagic+ stuff.

Now, it will be interesting to see if resort packages w/ tickets force you in to using the bands and preventing you from using old FPs. I am guessing they would. I am already planning my next trip to be a Room-Only deal with Tyvek tickets from Undercover Tourist, but I am curious to see how this all unfolds.

 

[Robo]

While I agree that this whole thing sounds like a harbinger of doom for the old FP system, guests would still have the option of using their Tyvek tickets if they have them, or else the existing FP machines would be unusable by all guests...

There has been lots of discussion about this.

It's safe to put your money in the long-term (say, a year or so) that the conventional ticket/FP machines won't
be an option.

 

[Robo]

1- I'd never say "couldn't," but logically they have already maxed-out the "E-ticket" attractions due to their super popularity.

It occurs to me that that statement isn't quite accurate. There are certain times of the week and day that a person can pretty much walk on these attractions and the rides are run at these times with empty seats. It seems that FP+ could be used to drive demand to this supply.

You are likely misunderstanding my meaning.

 

[dadddio]

That puts us back a lot closer to square one, doesn't it?

That depends on what you believe the goal of MyMagic+ is.

I'm of the camp that believes that it is to turn visitors into wowwed visitors by better helping them manage their park time, adding extra wow, and getting them to buy things now and return to buy again. AP holders and locals who have little prayer of riding what they want to ride are less likely to come back and spend again compared to those who have a chance at obtaining a same-day FP for their favorite rides.

I donubt that going to FP+ is change for change sake. Nor is it completely throwing away the current FP schema, given that many (most?) guests see the current FP model as a useful benefit. I believe that the end game is to add to the benefits of FP, not take away from it. The only way to truly accomplish this is to offer some amount of quality same-day FPs, in my opinion.

 

[dadddio]

While I agree that this whole thing sounds like a harbinger of doom for the old FP system, guests would still have the option of using their Tyvek tickets if they have them, or else the existing FP machines would be unusable by all guests. You can trade in a Tyvek for a 'ticket with features of touch' if you want the new MyMagic+ stuff.

Now, it will be interesting to see if resort packages w/ tickets force you in to using the bands and preventing you from using old FPs. I am guessing they would. I am already planning my next trip to be a Room-Only deal with Tyvek tickets from Undercover Tourist, but I am curious to see how this all unfolds.

That's the thing. We don't even know if the current FP machines will exist. The official stuff that has been posted says something to the effect of 'people can opt out of using FP+'. To my knowledge, it doesn't say that they will be able to still use old-school FP.

 

[Robo]

That depends on what you believe the goal of MyMagic+ is.

If you want to talk about what you think the goal of Disney's program is, that's cool.

But, why did you specifically quote me about the accuracy of my saying that the most popular attractions are currently "maxed-out" in their vehicle numbers and loading speed?

 

[dadddio]

You are likely misunderstanding my meaning.

I guess that 'maxed out' could have some other meaning. I took it to mean that 'the ride couldn't support any more riders than currently ride it'.

 

[ThornXBL]

That's the thing. We don't even know if the current FP machines will exist. The official stuff that has been posted says something to the effect of 'people can opt out of using FP+'. To my knowledge, it doesn't say that they will be able to still use old-school FP.

I was just going by the Terms mentioning that using FP+ meant you couldn't use standard FP. It implies that standard FP will be around temporarily.

How temporarily, we will have to see.

My next trip will be my first since the change to FP return time enforcement, so I'm already working out how much that impacts us. My youngest sibling is 16 so we did a lot of FP-running back in the day. Usually ended the night with a stash of spare FPs to hand out to random strangers we saw a few hours before the park closed. That was always fun to do.

 

[Lorilais_mommie]

I can't pull up a FP+ button in the app. The terms of service that some have mentioned, however, is available. Click 'more', 'privacy & legal', 'Disney Park Experience Terms and Conditions'.

Found it!!!! Finally.... thank you guys soo much..

.

 

[seashoreCM]

I guess that 'maxed out' could have some other meaning. I took it to mean that 'the ride couldn't support any more riders than currently ride it'.

You are correct.

 

[dadddio]

If you want to talk about what you think the goal of Disney's program is, that's cool.

But, why did you specifically quote me about the accuracy of my saying that the most popular attractions are currently "maxed-out" in their vehicle numbers and loading speed?

Because you guys were talking about whether these rides were at capacity. You seemed to be taking the postion that they were by saying that they were 'maxed out'. I brought up the fact that they do have excess capacity that the FP+ process might be able to drive guests to. (FP+ is the thread topic, after all.)

 

[Robo]

I guess that 'maxed out' could have some other meaning. I took it to mean that 'the ride couldn't support any more riders than currently ride it'.

For rides like TSM, Soarin', Space Mtn., EE, and maybe a few more, for the most part, that is the case.

I'm not talking about, say, 8AM EMH, mid-Jan.
I'm talking in general daily terms.

 

[WillAustin]

Someone reported that the button had disappeared as well. Seems it was premature.

I'm running it on my iPad right now. "Select FastPass+" button is still there, and still takes you to a calendar that errors out.

I do have a trip within the next 30 days though, so that might matter.

 

[doconeill]

Because you guys were talking about whether these rides were at capacity. You seemed to be taking the postion that they were by saying that they were 'maxed out'. I brought up the fact that they do have excess capacity that the FP+ process might be able to drive guests to. (FP+ is the thread topic, after all.)

I don't know of ANY time when Soarin', TSM, and the other E-ticket attractions need people directed towards them. Aside from the first few minutes of the day, they run pretty much flat out except on REALLY slow days.

 

[mousermerf]

For rides like TSM, Soarin', Space Mtn., EE, and maybe a few more, for the most part, that is the case.

I'm not talking about, say, 8AM EMH, mid-Jan.
I'm talking in general daily terms.

Actually.. it's not..

The rides as designed have a theoretical maximum capacity - commonly referred to as the THRC - Theoretical Hourly Rider Count. This is different than the OHRC - the Operational Hourly Rider Count.

Those two numbers are never the same. Why? Because the THRC works off mathetical calculations that include load/unload that spans an hour and averages the result (the THRC may calculate a 40 person vehicle unloading "on the hour" and thus gives each hour 20 guests equally, whereas in reality it unloads 5 seconds before or after giving the full 40 to a particular hour) and guests don't fill every seat nor do CMs and sometime rides get delayed or don't dispatch perfectly.

Heck, in a theater with bench seats it could be that there's bigger butts than ancitipated (or lots of little ones even.)

OHRC can be both above or below THRC.

The gap between the two numbers is known as Utilization. It's a percentage - the percentage of THRC actually achieved via the OHRC. Disney considers rides with very low utilization levels to be strains on their operational budgets. They do, already, change the number of operational units (and thereby change the THRC) to match predicted crowd levels. This allows them to do maintenance work on vehicles, staff lower, and etc..

Most notably you'll see them not running all the cars at the Speedway in MK, more duplicitous you -might- notice that Star Tours is only loading 4 of the available six vehicles despite the line being an hour long. Disney considers some waits to be acceptable.

At the same time, they have (as i mentioned above) increased the THRC of several attractions over the last 12-24 months in anticipation of the FP+ system. Minor tweaks add a few more guests per hour. Flumes chug water slightly faster, complex ride systems are reprogrammed to move a little quicker, etc.. They know they need the capacity with more people expecting to get on right-away via FP+.

They have also increased the number of FP's allowed at attractions from the previously set ratios. It used to be set to a near walk-on at all times.. it's now an anticipated and "acceptable" 5-10min wait, with 15mins not be unheard of on a normal day.