FP--- Disney has become too regimented

[magicbob]

How about just wanting to ride both top attractions in a given park with FP? Does that indicate a sense of entitlement?

Of course it does!

 

[famy27]

No people seemed mad that they couldn't RD, start grabbing FP for a ride, then lather rense repeat, i was attempting to point out FP- or not, that was going to be harder to do or at least fewer times with increase in guests in the parks. FP+ i dont see as the cause for the issue of increased waits. I have said i wish they had both systems so folks that dont RD can rest assured they can FP a big ride.

My 10 comment was being absurd on purpose to statements that FP+ is the worst solution, that is all. People are assigning causation to the FP+ system where none may exist, there is insufficient available facts to support a link.

I actually posted a glowing review of FP+ after my first trip using it in October 2013. This was during the pre-tiers period, while paper FPs were still available and off-siters weren't on the system yet. I loved getting to EP on arrival day with FPs booked for Soarin', TT, and MS at 6, 7, and 8:00. I loved sleeping in and going to HS with ToT, RNRC, and TSMM already booked and no running of the bulls. Tiers 100% changed my opinion of the system. Pretty much any benefit that the system had for me was eliminated with the introduction of tiers. FP+ was pretty much a wash at AK, as we only used it normally for two rides (KS and EE). We'd sometimes re-ride KS, so it was a bit of downgrade, but that wasn't significant. At MK, there were generally FPs well into the afternoon and evening for most of the headliners, so we never worried as much about RD there. I also don't think FP+ is as much of a problem in MK. We got 12 FP+s at MK on one day in June 2014. But the tiers are a deal breaker for me. I know why the tiers exist, but I think that Disney was irresponsible in introducing FP+ when they knew tiering was necessary. They needed to build the rides first and then add FP+ at a later time.

 

[Chitownpeeps91]

What is the 5th gate mentioned
Quite a few posts ago?

Lots of reasons we do not like fast pass plus. At the end of the day Disney spent a lot of money on this so it is staying. We are not. We will be spending our vacation dollars elsewhere.

 

[lauradis]

No Disney needs to get rid of all "free" fast pass systems and go to a full paid only limited tickets per day, just like every other amusement park on the planet.

They have one actually it's called the vip tour. 360-500 hr for min of 6 hrs up too ten guest.

 

[Kbee]

I find it amusing to read the daily FP+ gripe threads blaming it for ruining spontaneous trips while people totally ignore or discount the effect of ever rising crowd levels and virtually no increase in attractions to spread the crowds out. If it wasnt for FP, you can forget about getting on most rides without an hour wait, and with FP-, you had to get to the park at RD and sprint to the machine to get your headliner ticket. Now many on here love RD, and it is superior, but they dont care that some of us have small children (or spouses) who sleep in, or we also like nighttime entertainment so doing 14 hour days isnt an option. I bet last year my family rides half as many rides as we did without FP+ except for the two days we RD.

We never ever went to a park at RD and never had an issue getting FP- for headliners, even TSM and Soarin, and I definitely don't sprint LOL. We havent been since right before FP+ was available to everyone but I'm not really excited about having to pick my rides 2 months in advance, that just isn't how we like to vacation which is why we haven't been back since.



OP, I agree with you for the most part.

 

[WillAustin]

Because many fisrt timers might also be last timers if people just stood in lines all day, people in lines also cant buy junk in shops.

I think Disney is prioritizing first-timers and once-in-a-lifetimers over repeat guest. It's pretty obvious based on their choices. I can say we always spent far more than the average first-time guests in each of our repeat trips. Always on-site deluxe and signature dining most nights. However, that has changed since FP+ has been rolled out. We now spend far less time in the parks and less money at the resorts than we used to. FP+ allows us to get in, ride our rides, and get out.

 

[MolonLabe]

Sorry but I don't agree at least not for what we like to do. Crowds at Disney have gone up and down over the years we've attended(and since Im in my 50's and have been going since I was a young child I can go way way back .) Never ever ever on slow days did we see lines like we did at the end of Sept on what were not headliners but secondary attractions. People may not want to accept that fp+ caused this but there is no other logical explanation.

It isn't a coincidence that rides like POTC that were virtual walk ons for years prior to FP+ are now 20-30 minute wait times at best (for off peak seasons like the trip I just returned from last week).

Being able to FP- 3-4 headliners and do the rest standby in one day (open to close) was possible under the old FP system on off peak days.

Under FP+, unless you are utilizing other systems, such as scambands and VIP tourguides, you are lucky to hit 60% of the attractions.

This is a clear case of throwing the baby out with the bath water.

 

[Planogirl]

I think Disney is prioritizing first-timers and once-in-a-lifetimers over repeat guest. It's pretty obvious based on their choices. I can say we always spent far more than the average first-time guests in each of our repeat trips. Always on-site deluxe and signature dining most nights. However, that has changed since FP+ has been rolled out. We now spend far less time in the parks and less money at the resorts than we used to. FP+ allows us to get in, ride our rides, and get out.

That is what we did. We hit rope drop, then rode our three rides and maybe a few less popular things and then we were done. There's other things to do outside the parks.

 

[Astridia]

You can complain all you want here, but as long as attendance numbers keep increasing, Disney will think they have made the correct choice. Just by reading this thread you can tell that there is no clear consensus among INFORMED Disney customers of whether FP+ is a good thing or a bad thing. The vast majority of people who go to Disney do not read this forum (or probably any other forum), they go to Disney have their fun, then repeat. So how does Disney make its judgement - they look at the bottom line.

I also think Disney is performing an awful lot of guest surveys. We saw CM's posted at ride exits woho were asking about the attraction and the queues. I'm glad to see this, it shows that Disney is concerned about the impact of FP+ on the guest experience.

 

[SeilerBird]

SNever ever ever on slow days did we see lines like we did at the end of Sept on what were not headliners but secondary attractions. People may not want to accept that fp+ caused this but there is no other logical explanation.

So the increase in attendance has nothing to do with longer lines?

 

[SeilerBird]

I also think Disney is performing an awful lot of guest surveys. We saw CM's posted at ride exits woho were asking about the attraction and the queues. I'm glad to see this, it shows that Disney is concerned about the impact of FP+ on the guest experience.

Disney could care less about your opinion in these surveys. They want your email address so they can spam you to death. I was approached last week for a survey and the second question was what was my email address. When I refused to give it out I became a nonperson. No more interest in my opinions. Disney is the king of spam. They make AARP look like beginners.

 

[cakebaker]

Disney could care less about your opinion in these surveys. They want your email address so they can spam you to death. I was approached last week for a survey and the second question was what was my email address. When I refused to give it out I became a nonperson. No more interest in my opinions. Disney is the king of spam. They make AARP look like beginners.

That's not what they're doing. lol

They don't conduct long surveys in the parks. They ask a very few questions, then usually by the time you return home, there's an email survey waiting for you. If you don't want to give them your email, they can't send you a survey.

 

[lauradis]

Disney could care less about your opinion in these surveys. They want your email address so they can spam you to death. I was approached last week for a survey and the second question was what was my email address. When I refused to give it out I became a nonperson. No more interest in my opinions. Disney is the king of spam. They make AARP look like beginners.

hmm well I have
1. work email
2. facebook email
3. spam, email
4. disney email

 

[Jennasis]

Lots of things contributing to long lines:

Larger crowds
FP+
Lack of capacity

The problem is that Disney is doing precious little to address these problems. And what they ARE doing is so painfully slow to happen that I want to pull my hair out. Heck it took 18 months to build a parking garage....I have no faith in their timetable.

I like to think of Fastpass+ as the answer to a question that nobody asked.

 

[mom2rtk]

Lots of things contributing to long lines:

Larger crowds
FP+
Lack of capacity

The problem is that Disney is doing precious little to address these problems. And what they ARE doing is so painfully slow to happen that I want to pull my hair out. Heck it took 18 months to build a parking garage....I have no faith in their timetable.

I like to think of Fastpass+ as the answer to a question that nobody asked.

BINGO.

Increased crowds are not something that just snuck up on Disney. They have entire departments dedicated to making that happen. They run promotions to make that happen. They very purposely set out to increase crowds at the same time they chose a ride rationing system instead of adding new attractions to keep up with the crowds. Forget extra new rides. I just want enough to keep up with the growth they are profiting from.

 

[cjparker0110]

When I first heard of FP a decade ago I didn't like the idea. Even worse was the way it you could get one FP and could not get a new one until that ride time. If you came in and got a late FP time for a hot ride, you did not get any others all day long. In a couple of years I'll be trying the new system. I still don't care too much for it except for one thing: when I was there in 2005-2007, the line for Soarin' was ALWAYS 2 hours (no exaggeration). I only rode it with FP. Honestly, other than that, i don't really care. I expect to wait in line when I get to a park. I grew up near Busch Gardens Williamsburg and King's Dominion and went multiple times every year. I also went to WDW every 2-3 years growing up. I never saw lines as a problem...even when they took up an hour. No matter how you plan, you will NEVER accomplish everything you want to do at WDW in a single trip.

So what am I getting at here? Well, I guess I'm just saying that FP is fine, but it's not necessary. It does not cut down the standby line simply because you still have the same number of people riding. Some of them are in standby, and some in FP. Numbers are the same so if you don't FP, you still wait. Utilize the FP for what it's meant for: saving time on your must dos and big attractions. Don't let them dominate your day. Plan accordingly and wait for everything else as if you always have. Remember that the crowd indicator is always an estimate: it can be heavier than predicted.

Don't let it discourage you from going to WDW> Instead, just play it by ear and know that crowd levels change throughout the day.

 

[mom2rtk]

When I first heard of FP a decade ago I didn't like the idea. Even worse was the way it you could get one FP and could not get a new one until that ride time. If you came in and got a late FP time for a hot ride, you did not get any others all day long. In a couple of years I'll be trying the new system. I still don't care too much for it except for one thing: when I was there in 2005-2007, the line for Soarin' was ALWAYS 2 hours (no exaggeration). I only rode it with FP. Honestly, other than that, i don't really care. I expect to wait in line when I get to a park. I grew up near Busch Gardens Williamsburg and King's Dominion and went multiple times every year. I also went to WDW every 2-3 years growing up. I never saw lines as a problem...even when they took up an hour. No matter how you plan, you will NEVER accomplish everything you want to do at WDW in a single trip.

So what am I getting at here? Well, I guess I'm just saying that FP is fine, but it's not necessary. It does not cut down the standby line simply because you still have the same number of people riding. Some of them are in standby, and some in FP. Numbers are the same so if you don't FP, you still wait. Utilize the FP for what it's meant for: saving time on your must dos and big attractions. Don't let them dominate your day. Plan accordingly and wait for everything else as if you always have. Remember that the crowd indicator is always an estimate: it can be heavier than predicted.

Don't let it discourage you from going to WDW> Instead, just play it by ear and know that crowd levels change throughout the day.

Not sure if it was like it from day 1, but the entire time we used legacy FP you could always get a new FP either when your window opened or 2 hours later, whichever came first.

And while I agree that adding FP to attractions increases the standby wait, the real issue with Soarin is the lack of other attractions in the park. Just witness Soarin at DCA where lines are steady, but nowhere near what they are at Epcot.

It used to be very easy to use FP for just the must do big attractions. But it used to only be offered on must do big attractions. Now that they added it to all sorts of secondary attractions, you can choose not to use it, but you are choosing at that point to allow anyone with a FP to be prioritized over you.

 

[indyumd]

Maybe this makes me a jerk, but I love hearing people say they will never vacation at Disney again. I hope thats true. It just means fewer people to compete with the rides I want to ride and the places I want to eat.

 

[cjparker0110]

What I meant is sometimes you get to the park early and get an FP for Soarin (as example) and it was for 5 pm. By time your window came open there were no FPs left to be had. If you got an earlier time you could usually get one. I don't think I ever managed to get three. But then again, I didn't mind waiting in lines so it wasn't a big deal.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Yes you could walk over to get a FP, but if you didnt RD on any headliner normally you are late afternoon or possibly out of luck on TSMM. Now true FP+ you are 2 people for 3 rides, you were also 2 people for FP-, but just that many depending on how many you grabbed. But more people absolutely means more SB wait. 2012 to 2013 in MK alone was 3k more people in the parks per day. It is up 5 to 6k daily in the last 5 years or so, 1 new ride and 1 new character meet during that time i think. In HS while not 6k more daily, some rise, while attractions are less. I have not seen the rise from 2013 to 2014 yet, but that could push MK averages to 7k to 9k over the last 6 years, how cant that make SB higher everywhere, not all those are doing 7DMT or A&E.

We rarely made RD, usually getting to a park 30-45 mins after opening. We did.not sprint to legacy machines, we did.not use fp runners, and we had no issues at all getting headliner fps.

I don't say this as "mourning" legacy, or expecting it to ever come back (I don't). I say it because the hyperbole of "you had to be there at RD and sprint to a fp machine if you wanted any headliner fp" is just as wrong as the hyperbole about fp+.

Am I saying that it was never the case that fps ran out so early? No, of course not. as with all wdw touring, it depended on when you visited.

As for what I'd change...I have no issue eith the fp system going electronic. I just dislike the prebooking. If it were a same day system, I'd like it better. I think they could have made the fp+ bookable from anywhere on wdw property (using GPS verification as they did with the mobile magic app), but using the same rules as legacy (1 fp at a time, get the next one when the window opens or 2 hrs, whichever comes first). The people who couldn't make rd, or didn't want to, could still book their fp from their hotel, you could book for a park you werent actually in, and those that wanted it would still have a clean slate every morning.