Fast Pass to become "Pay for Play"?

[Tarzan]

Honestly, no. For a corporation, loyalty is an asset (it's a form of good will), and it valued based on how well it translates to long-term shareholder value. I know folks who shop at Whole Foods Market every week, but just to buy what's on sale. That's not loyalty to a business. Then there are the folks who will shop at Whole Foods Market every week, even though it is more expensive, buying everything they need there, even though the only things that are really "better" at Whole Foods are the perishables. That loyalty has a much higher value to a business.

I wasn't going to add to this thread again but I made the point early on that somebody staying in a value for 2 weeks annually would spend more at WDW than someone staying in a deluxe for 1 week every 6 years. Your argument makes no sense. Somebody doing a weekly shop for sale items would indeed spend much less than somebody doing a full weekly shop at regular prices. That is not a true comparison though. For one thing, you haven't taken account of the fact that the value resort guests will spend a total of 84 days onsite buying food, souvenirs and park admission in addition to their accommodation costs. The deluxe guests would spend just 7 days onsite during the same period. So the "sale shopper" is infact buying much more often and not everything is at a reduced price, merely the accommodation.

I do stay at value resorts as it is the only way that I can visit every year for 2 weeks at a time. If Disney do alter the way Fastpasses are distributed it will not stop me from visiting as I always visit off-season so could manage without it. I do think that there has to be a more equal way to distribute them though and would feel sorry for families visiting during peak periods with no real chance of riding everything they want to.

 

[lllovell]

Right - But they won't get the same, and THAT is exactly the point. We all know the Values and Moderates won't be completely left out. But still, it's the Deluxes that will be getting the best of it.

No arguement from me on that - but if you got the same number of fast passes that you can currently use in a day (for my family, it has never been more than 3) and you could SCHEDULE when you got to use them, would you feel second class knowing that someone else who spend HUNDREDS more than you (sometimes on one night's accomidations) got 1 or 2 more? Or would you be thrilled to be able to not have to rush to the FP booth only to see that you won't still be at the park at 4 pm when the tickets are printing for (sometimes as early as 10 am it seems like 4 pm output times come up during peak visits).

 

[waltsdouble]

For the past several years I couldn't get a villa for my family, (once you've stayed in a two bedroom villa, you always want to go back)this fall we had no problem, first time in ten years I got the week I wanted. With the large number of value resorts, maybe the high end resorts are not filling up. This might be a way Disney is looking to lure more people to the high end resorts

 

[BostonRob]

the value resort guests will spend a total of 84 days onsite buying food, souvenirs and park admission in addition to their accommodation costs. The deluxe guests would spend just 7 days onsite during the same period.

But here's another angle to this argument. Suppose value resorts are sold out. I don't know when you travel. But suppose you travel in July. And suppose the Value Resorts are booked to capacity every July. Then, it doesn't matter to Disney if you're staying there for two weeks every year, because if you weren't, somebody else would - and Disney still makes the same money. So, in effect, Disney isn't making ANY money off of you. But, if you stayed at a Deluxe, even if it was only once every 6 years, if that hotel isn't booked to capacity, then Disney would be making money from you that they wouldn't be making if your weren't there.

I know this argument seems a bit convoluted, but if you proceed from the premise that this entire plan is designed to sell more Deluxe rooms (my theory), then it begins to make sense.

 

[Miss Inga Depointe]

It's because people who are paying more for Item A are getting more of Item B, and there is no way of getting more of Item B alone. I don't think anyone has a problem with the idea of getting more for paying more. But when the only way to get more is to pay more for something else that you don't want or need in the first place, it's naturally going to frustrate some people.

Then why aren't people upset about magical express? Isn't it the same thing? It's a perk but we're certainly not getting it for free. And we're paying for it even if we don't use it.

 

[disneyw/kids]

Is this really going to happing or is it just rumor. I honestly would like the concept because we stay in Deluxe each time and I would go more often (we have annual passes) if you could book fastpasses from the room and get multiples so you could plan your day. We always go off season but with this new fast pass system I would go during peak season also.

 

[JABEAR]

Then why aren't people upset about magical express? Isn't it the same thing? It's a perk but we're certainly not getting it for free. And we're paying for it even if we don't use it.

It is a perk for ANYONE staying in on Disney property. If this is what Fast Pass is going to it should be offered to all Resort Guests. It doesn't matter if you stay in the most expensive resort for 20 days or the least expensive for 3 days.

BTW.....It is not something we are "paying for" per say. Resort prices haven't gone up since adding ME, and ticket prices have gone down for longer stays. Yes in some round about way guests are paying for the service, however, it is at no extra cost to the guest from previous prices.

 

[jultomzach]

From an economic point of view Disney has to balance the dilemna of offering perks to on-site guests with not offending day guests. Yes, you all may pay more to stay on-site but you are not the ONLY guests of Disney. What about all the Florida residents with annual passes that make day trips? Location is one of the greatest "perks" of staying on-site. I have done both on and off-site. Disney is aware that BOTH times, I was a guest. In order for me to return, I have to feel valued as a customer. I certainly expected more advantages when I stayed on property but the "I deserve more perks" attitude of on-site guests can been translated to "more important".....that attitude is offensive to day guests. Disney is very aware of EVERYBODY that comes through ther turnstiles. If they weren't aware, they would just close the parks to day guests. Disney is between a rock and a hard place.

 

[LeoGrrrrl1982]

I think it is fair to let the resort guests sign up for their passes...even to let say the people in deluxes have one number all the way down to non onsite guests having another allowable number per day. It would actually help to allow everyone their fair share of passes.
I think though that once the resort guests have signed up THATS it...no more inside the park beyond what they signed up for.

Someone earlier said that we all pay park admission so we should all have fast pass access and i whole heartedly agree with this! However onsite guests DO pay quite alot an having an extra perk like extra fast passes and fast pass scheduling might be ok.

 

[SuperGurl]

I always believed though,that Walt Disney wanted the park to be the same for the rich or the poor,the young or the old.

This is what I thought also. I know that WDW is not the first business to do what they doing but from what I read about Walt, I don't think this is something that he'd approve.

 

[Tarzan]

But here's another angle to this argument. Suppose value resorts are sold out. I don't know when you travel. But suppose you travel in July. And suppose the Value Resorts are booked to capacity every July. Then, it doesn't matter to Disney if you're staying there for two weeks every year, because if you weren't, somebody else would - and Disney still makes the same money. So, in effect, Disney isn't making ANY money off of you. But, if you stayed at a Deluxe, even if it was only once every 6 years, if that hotel isn't booked to capacity, then Disney would be making money from you that they wouldn't be making if your weren't there.

I agree with your argument, but did state in my post that I travel during the slower times of year. I am filling an empty room rather than using a room that another family would love to stay in. Travelling during the quieter times does of course mean that my accommodation is even cheaper, but as the parks and resorts are not as busy it means I shop more and use table service restaurants much more than I would during the busy season when it can be difficult to get a PS or even to comfortably look around a store. I can understand why some people are very upset about the idea that Disney may do this, but I honestly don't mind if deluxe guests get more perks. I'll still be enjoying myself at WDW on a regular basis, I might just have to plan my time more carefully.

P.S. I promise I'll let this thread die now

 

[susy]

I am reading this thread for the first time and it's 5:30 am. You know how when you first wake up things seem "not real" or "dreamilke"? That's exactly what this thread seems like. A lot of nonsense.

 

[taximomfor4]

What about people who rent multiple rooms at a value or moderate, instead of fitting everyone into one room at a deluxe? They may be actually paying more money. Do they get fewer FP, or more?

I was wondering this exact same thing!

 

[DebbieB]

Is this really going to happing or is it just rumor. I honestly would like the concept because we stay in Deluxe each time and I would go more often (we have annual passes) if you could book fastpasses from the room and get multiples so you could plan your day. We always go off season but with this new fast pass system I would go during peak season also.

Disney has just applied for a patent for their idea (so no one else steals it). I believe there was a lawsuit with Universal when fastpass first came out, over who thought of it first and if one stole the other's idea. They have not announced a plan to implement it.

 

[suevee]

I haven't read all of this post but isn't this just a version of what Universal does with it's hotels and head of the line access for their hotel guests? WDW has many more resorts that Universal. It would be impossible to give head of the line access to every resort room they have. So a tier system would make them more competitive with Universal's head of the line system while increasing the occupancy of their more expensive resorts.

 

[Mady/Sophiemom]

I haven't read all of this post but isn't this just a version of what Universal does with it's hotels and head of the line access for their hotel guests? WDW has many more resorts that Universal. It would be impossible to give head of the line access to every resort room they have. So a tier system would make them more competitive with Universal's head of the line system while increasing the occupancy of their more expensive resorts.

Yes it is, but what kinda stinks:

Universal started the program that way. Is WDW now taking away something that was available to everyone?

Also Universal gives the same to all resort guests. True, they do not have as many rooms, but they do not give Park Perks based on how much you spend on your room.

Most here are saying, and I somewhat agree- Is it fair to offer more at the parks to guests, who have paid more for the room, or should their ammenities end at their resort?

My opinion: The special fast pass should be offered to whoever wants to pay for that option. It could be an add-on to the park ticket for whoever wants to purchase it.

I said before several pages back, and have now had time to discuss w/ DH- We may be tempted to stay deluxe if it gets you more at the parks. However our trips, would be shorter, and further apart- Disney would be losing in the longrun, w/ our family. I know we will spend more for our 2 value resort vacations this year, than 1 deluxe one.

 

[seashoreCM]

2 years ago after being in the FP lane for K. Safari for over an hour we got close enough to see what the problem was. The CM was taking 4 times the people from the stand-by line. I understand both lines were long, but I thought this was crazy. :

That's a goof.

Too bad someone did not point it out earlier.

BTW "4 times" is a Fastpass magic number, the FP lane is often scheduled to get 4 times the service of the regular lane although the proportions can vary from one ride to another and from one time to another.

Disney hints:
http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/disney.htm

About 20 years ago I was visiting Universal Studios in California and a cast member was facing the approaching crowd announcing that <something> was to the left (his left and the crowd's right) confusing all the people. I didn't know what to say off the top of my head and was also trying to hold my position in the crowd, in hindsight I should have written down something on a slip of paper and handed that to him "Psst -- shouldn't you be telling them to go to their right rather than the left?"

Last WDW trip: Mid May 2005, just got back.

 

[tlbwriter]

Then why aren't people upset about magical express? Isn't it the same thing? It's a perk but we're certainly not getting it for free. And we're paying for it even if we don't use it.

I did say something about it earlier. We are paying for it, whether we use it or not (and those who say "no, it's free!" are being naive). I'm not using it on my next trip, so I'm subsidizing it for someone else. But that's life. Someone else is subsidizing another activity I'm using, so it probably all evens out in the end.

 

[A Mickeyfan]

I haven't read all of these posts so forgive me if I am saying something that has been said already. There are those of you that feel since you are spending $1500 on your "vacation trip" that you should be entitled to more than the guest spending $300, my opinion here is, you may be coming once during the year & spending that $1500, but there are others like me that go many, many times during the year & end up spending way more than that! So you give Disney $1500 for your one trip, but I give them around $3,000 over the course of the year (staying onsite at values & mods). I spend more than you, but you should get the "extra" perk & I don't???? If it is a money thing that Disney is doing & they want you to spend more, they should start giving some sort of "reward" to the "frequent guest" not just the once per year guest. Do it the way the airlines do.... Just in this last year alone (since June 04), I have gone for 14 days in June, (had ressies for Aug & Sept but had to cancel because hurricanes hit us) 4-October, 5-December, 4-Jan, 4-Feb, 4-March, 3-April & my next trip is May 29th-June 11th. All of these trips amount up to a pretty penny & if Disney is going to get that way with the Fast Pass, it just isn't fair. My money is worth just as much as someone else's.. if not more, but Disney isn't getting it in one lump sum, they are getting it spred over the year.

 

[tlbwriter]

I have a problem with your analogy because you are trying to compare it to things that wont happen.

Well, that's what an analogy is - it compares different things. Sometimes they're actual, and sometimes they're hypothetical. But this entire thread is hypothetical, so I'm surprised you're having a hard time with it.

You also are making the same assumption again and again that the value resorts (and moderates) will NOT get good benefit from this. The way I read it, ALL RESORTS will get some benefits.

We'll have to wait and see. I don't think this assumption has anything to do with my main point, which you still don't seem to get.

You think that it will only benefit those at the very top of the ladder. This seperation in beliefs makes the rest of the points mute.

Either it will benefit them alone, or it will benefit them the most. That doesn't really change the core argument.

My point about the tickets is that not everyone can afford the best tickets now, so how is it different to say that people who spend different amounts of money on their onsite accomidations shouldn't be "purchasing" more than someone who is staying offsite?

And my point is, I don't care about how much anybody can afford. That has no place in this conversation AFAIC.

If I can purchase a ticket with all the extras and someone else can only purchase the basic ticket for length of stay and it cost me more money for my ticket overall but I get more benefits because each day I buy becomes cheaper, how is that not the same? I am spending more and getting a net day by day for less. Is that fair to the person that can only buy a one day non-hopping ticket on a per day comparison?

What does that have to do with anything? You get more for your ticket because you pay more for your ticket. Yes, you get a greater value when you buy more days. But really, what does that have to do with the topic at hand? The person who buys one day doesn't get the "volume discount." But they could get it if they wanted to, by spending more on their ticket. Under the plan as described, the person who wants to buy extra/better FPs cannot. They can only get it by spending more money on their resort. Don't say it's all the same, because it's not all the same. Giving enhanced FPs as a reward to those who stay in the more expensive resorts is completely different from letting anyone buy them as an add-on to their park tickets. Completely. And that's the point. It's not about "affording." It's about choice. It's about being able to spend more money on tickets to get better tickets, instead of spending more money on a resort to get better tickets.