Ever canceled a trip because kids didn't earn it?

[PollyannaMom]

Actually, that’s the worst part and not eligible for ‘kudos’. Making big threats is not noteworthy. It’s telling your kids that you’re crazy people who take away big things for minor infractions. You may eventually get cooperation and compliance but what have you lost? Kids need to trust their parents to lead them. Not be frightened to piss them off.

I didn't give kudos for making a big threat. (In fact, I said I wouldn't personally threaten loss of a trip.) But I did reassure him that following through on a threat already made is not something to feel guilty for. (Obviously, we're all taking about threats regarding loss of privileges, not physical abuse.)

I've always tried very hard not to make threats that I wasn't comfortable following through on. But I think that if you do decide to make a threat that you are comfortable with, you have to follow through on it or that's how you lose trust. - Your kids will not take your next threat (or your next 27!) seriously, because they know 'you don't always mean it'.

So with flights and days off work and reservations the lesson being taught....goes out the window because the trip would still go on?

I don't think everyone who said no is letting poor behavior go unanswered, just admitting that there are some things not on the chopping block as punishments for them. - Whether it's for financial reasons or personal ones, they would simply choose a different consequence.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I don't think everyone who said no is letting poor behavior go unanswered, just admitting that there are some things not on the chopping block as punishments for them. - Whether it's for financial reasons or personal ones, they would simply choose a different consequence.

I def. wasn't saying that. I think perhaps you've misunderstood what I was saying. I said in my earlier comments that there would always be consequences to be had for poor behavior growing up. And I totally mentioned about financial and time off and whatnot in my own experience so I already get that-- personally

I'm speaking to the line of thinking that if it didn't include flights, reservations or time off from work (which are things multiple posters mentioned they wouldn't cancel a trip for or that they would consider it a bigger deal if it included those things) that the lesson being taught becomes the most important thing. But when more is at stake the lesson isn't the most important thing because other things come into play. I'm not saying that's not what simply happens as part of parenting...I'm simply saying I view it as an interesting line of thinking especially as it comes across as rationalizing things when at the same time saying the "I'm teaching a lesson"-the lesson in question may be a lesser punishment when more is at stake.

For my experience growing up the trip or vacation just wouldn't have been cancelled under the scenario given by the OP. A different consequence than canceling would have been put forth whether it was a several hour drive or a flight because the event in question was still a trip/vacation. That part I understand in that not everyone views things as trips or vacations.

 

[amberpi]

I'm using your post as an example so don't think I'm picking on you It's been said a few times throughout the thread.

This line of thinking is interesting to me because it ignores the original premise (in your case teaching about respect, in other people's cases standing their ground and a few other reasons) in favor of looking at it from reasons outside of those things.

So with flights and days off work and reservations the lesson being taught....goes out the window because the trip would still go on? Mostly asking as a rhetorical question so don't feel like you have to defend your choices just musing aloud I do think part of it is how people define their trips though for sure.

Now some posters have said to the heck with it the other things don't matter they'll cancel anyways so I'm not speaking towards that.

Absolutely no offense here. Maybe we’re doing it wrong and I can be open to suggestion if it makes me a better parent!

To me that’s a much bigger and rarer thing in the kids lives for a big trip than one of our decently frequent little overnight or weekend trips. It would have to be something serious to take away a whole big family trip. The kids are probably too young to have such strict rules, but I applaud parents who stick to their guns in general.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Absolutely no offense here. Maybe we’re doing it wrong and I can be open to suggestion if it makes me a better parent!

To me that’s a much bigger and rarer thing in the kids lives for a big trip than one of our decently frequent little overnight or weekend trips. It would have to be something serious to take away a whole big family trip. The kids are probably too young to have such strict rules, but I applaud parents who stick to their guns in general.

Yup for you it comes down to definition of what constitutes a trip or a vacation

 

[PollyannaMom]

I def. wasn't saying that. I think perhaps you've misunderstood what I was saying. I said in my earlier comments that there would always be consequences to be had for poor behavior growing up. And I totally mentioned about financial and time off and whatnot in my own experience so I already get that-- personally

Oh, I didn't mean to pick on you or anything! I was gone all day and missed a lot of the thread. - I was answering the quote alert I got, so I kind or skimmed quite a lot in between and read the last post, which happened to be yours.

I do agree with you that people make different decisions based on the cost and time commitment of the activity, but I just see that as an extension of "let the punishment fit the crime". Losing a distant vacation booked way in advance is a huge consequence. Losing a spur-of-the-moment weekend somewhere close is much smaller. The same offense might very well be weightier than the small thing but not as important as the big thing.

 

[jiminyC_fan]

This thread is too long to read but I would just like to say that it sounds like great parenting to me. I am sorry that you had to make a decision that ended up affecting you as well but as parents we sometimes need to teach our kids the hard way even if it means we are disappointed as well.

 

[LSUmiss]

I'm using your post as an example so don't think I'm picking on you It's been said a few times throughout the thread.

This line of thinking is interesting to me because it ignores the original premise (in your case teaching about respect, in other people's cases standing their ground and a few other reasons) in favor of looking at it from reasons outside of those things.

So with flights and days off work and reservations the lesson being taught....goes out the window because the trip would still go on? Mostly asking as a rhetorical question so don't feel like you have to defend your choices just musing aloud I do think part of it is how people define their trips though for sure.

Now some posters have said to the heck with it the other things don't matter they'll cancel anyways so I'm not speaking towards that.

I think ppl who aren’t willing to cancel wouldn’t ever threaten that as a consequence.

 

[Southernmiss]

I'm using your post as an example so don't think I'm picking on you It's been said a few times throughout the thread.

This line of thinking is interesting to me because it ignores the original premise (in your case teaching about respect, in other people's cases standing their ground and a few other reasons) in favor of looking at it from reasons outside of those things.

So with flights and days off work and reservations the lesson being taught....goes out the window because the trip would still go on? Mostly asking as a rhetorical question so don't feel like you have to defend your choices just musing aloud I do think part of it is how people define their trips though for sure.

Now some posters have said to the heck with it the other things don't matter they'll cancel anyways so I'm not speaking towards that.

Exactly. Even a weekend away was a real treat for our family. Taking that away would never have crossed my mind.

I still go back to other ways of handling the situation. Not letting things pile up, tell kids a day ahead of time about expectations and times of expected departure. In the OP, Dad came home and the messes for the month had to be picked up. That's the issue.

I know for me, telling me (and my husband for that matter) you've got to have all this done (which to kids, probably looked like more than it was) by noon, we would have balked.

There was one day that I headed out with my 4 to be a tourist in our own area for the day. The kids started fighting in the backseat about 2 miles away from home, so I turned around and we went home.

We had major hurricane Katrina later that year, some of the things we headed out to see/do are not there anymore. Adds a different kind of consequence to their behavior.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I think ppl who aren’t willing to cancel wouldn’t ever threaten that as a consequence.

Well that's not true. People absolutely said they would cancel this "trip" but not that "trip". If you mean they wouldn't threaten if it included reservations, plane tickets, time off then yes that's true from what people said but that was really my whole point.

I'm not speaking towards people who don't use cancelation of a trip as a consequence I was speaking to the people who use it selectively. For at least some like was discussed with amberpi they don't consider X a trip so it follows different rules.

 

[wenrob]

Follow through should have been happening long before it got to canceling something because chores weren’t done. IMO not getting the trip wasn’t a consequence, it was choice they made. Chores are something that just need to be done. The consequence for not doing them should be being sent back to do them until they are done. Putting a reward on the table for doing them puts the power in their hands.

To answer the question, I don’t make threats I don’t intend to keep. I do not threaten things like vacation, Christmas, Birthdays etc. It would have to be something really out of hand for me to go there.

 

[Gracedis1]

Yes when my son was younger he pushed his sister off a play house in the yard. We were supposed to go to the fair that day but did not allow him to go. His sister and I went, had a great time, showed off her souvenir, etc. He got the message and never did it again.

 

[ronandannette]

The thing I've found interesting about this thread is that people have focused in on tidying up v.s. a weekend trip to Disney. I guess that's because of the title, but really the issue here is disciplining for disobedience. It really doesn't matter if it's doing chores or following house rules or behaving in a certain way. I guess "obedience" is an antiquated concept but that's what's at the root of it. Simple instructions, clearly stated and well within their capabilities, yet the OP's kids chose to behave differently. Call me a grumpy old bat (or an authoritative parent - those words are synonyms in my dictionary) but I believe kids, especially young ones, should comply with their parent's requests.

 

[LSUmiss]

The thing I've found interesting about this thread is that people have focused in on tidying up v.s. a weekend trip to Disney. I guess that's because of the title, but really the issue here is disciplining for disobedience. It really doesn't matter if it's doing chores or following house rules or behaving in a certain way. I guess "obedience" is an antiquated concept but that's what's at the root of it. Simple instructions, clearly stated and well within their capabilities, yet the OP's kids chose to behave differently. Call me a grumpy old bat (or an authoritative parent - those words are synonyms in my dictionary) but I believe kids, especially young ones, should comply with their parent's requests.

What you described is authoritarian.

 

[dez1978]

I'd have someone come stay with the kids while I went on an adult only trip.

 

[pahoben]

What you described is authoritarian.

Should we have a family vote to determine if trips to the grocery store are primarily to buy candy, cookies, and ice cream and not to buy any vegetables at all? With two children and two parents how do we decide a 2-2 split vote in a non authoritarian manner. Heaven forbid we would ever use any semblance of authority to make decisions for our children.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Should we have a family vote to determine if trips to the grocery store are primarily to buy candy, cookies, and ice cream and not to buy any vegetables at all? With two children and two parents how do we decide a 2-2 split vote in a non authoritarian manner. Heaven forbid we would ever use any semblance of authority to make decisions for our children.

There's a difference in authoritative parenting style and authoritarian style.

Blind obediance without any sort of discussion is more characteristic of authoritarian style whereas authoritative is more about set standards with room for growing autonomy.

Aside from that your example you've used I'm assuming you are saying it for shock value because those aren't near the scenarios people are talking about.

 

[ronandannette]

There's a difference in authoritative parenting style and authoritarian style.
Blind obediance without any sort of discussion is more characteristic of authoritarian style whereas authoritative is more about set standards with room for growing autonomy.
Aside from that your example you've used I'm assuming you are saying it for shock value because those aren't near the scenarios people are talking about.

No, you're right, they aren't. What the actual scenario was is children given clear expectations to do something they were capable of doing. Maybe they didn't feel like it just then...more likely they (like lots of our kids) had gradually been given more and more latitude to the point they felt free to ignore their parent's instruction. The OP recognized that and made a hard decision to effect a decisive course correction. Authoritarian? Fine with me...

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Simple instructions, clearly stated and well within their capabilities, yet the OP's kids chose to behave differently.

I don't really see an issue with saying "if you get x done we'll do this" as a generality. But I do think it's different when you say "if we get this done by noon we'll go to x"--that sets up the stage for possible failure right off the bat (and for some parents that's the goal at the time--not speaking about the OP there though).

You can have well-adjusted kids who are normally quite well behaved (and the OP said they were good kids) and they have a bad day or are feeling a lot of pressure to get it done and then emotions run high. Whatever punishment the OP decided is their decision that doesn't change that to me it would have been at least somewhat different in my mind had it been like a day or two ahead of it and say "if you get your chores done by x we'll do y".

No, you're right, they aren't. What the actual scenario was is children given clear expectations to do something they were capable of doing. Maybe they didn't feel like it just then...more likely they (like lots of our kids) had gradually been given more and more latitude to the point they felt free to ignore their parent's instruction. The OP recognized that and made a hard decision to effect a decisive course correction. Authoritarian? Fine with me...

I think I would probably describe the OP more like authoritative, but what you described which prompted the comment was more like authoritarian style. There's a difference.

Maybe put another way it's how you use your authority which can be part of the difference in parenting styles.

 

[ronandannette]

I don't really see an issue with saying "if you get x done we'll do this" as a generality. But I do think it's different when you say "if we get this done by noon we'll go to x"--that sets up the stage for possible failure right off the bat (and for some parents that's the goal at the time--not speaking about the OP there though).

You can have well-adjusted kids who are normally quite well behaved (and the OP said they were good kids) and they have a bad day or are feeling a lot of pressure to get it done and then emotions run high. Whatever punishment the OP decided is their decision that doesn't change that to me it would have been at least somewhat different in my mind had it been like a day or two ahead of it and say "if you get your chores done by x we'll do y".


I think I would probably describe the OP more like authoritative, but what you described which prompted the comment was more like authoritarian style. There's a difference.

Maybe put another way it's how you use your authority which can be part of the difference in parenting styles.

Well, like I said, I guess the words "obedience" and "discipline" can only be seen as negative to some.

 

[RamblingMad]

Then leave them at home with someone to watch them and go yourselves. Why ruin your vacation?