Education budget cuts

[torinsmom]

That particular law did pass. While I know that the NJEA filed a lawsuit against this, I'm not sure if said lawsuit has been resolved.

This is today's news: Sweeney proposal. Teachers and other state employees (it's important to note that teachers are not state employees, but individual district employees) will be required to pay up to 30% of their health insurance premiums, based on their salaries.

Personally, I don't have a problem paying a portion of my health insurance premium (as a union member, oh the horror). However, I do believe it should be negotiated at the local level, since that is who we are employed by and have contracts with.

This is being kicked around in NC as well. They either want us to pay 100% of our health insurance, 30%, or they want to move everyone to a 70/30 plan(default is 80/20 now) That last option would be fine by me. I barely use my insurance anyway. In NC, teachers ARE state employees. We get a salary from the state and a local supplement from the county. I haven't heard mention of taking that yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if that is being thrown around as well.

 

[portocall]

I am quite aware that public sector employees pay taxes, but it is the private sector where the tax dollars originate. Public sector employees simply return a portion of the money they received from government back to government. Government got it from the private sector originally. States and municipalities need a strong private sector to provide the funds with which all government operates.

Um... like public sector employees don't spend their after tax dollars on private sector's businesses? Come on. We don't hoard our "publicly" earned dollars.

 

[snowy76]

My brother lives in Jersey and pays so much in property tax. What do they do with it all that other states don't do? I feel for you!

Can't speak for NJ but I live in NYS where I just paid $3K for county and state property taxes (and I will pay roughly another $3K in school taxes come June). I'm going to guess it's similar in NJ -- the VAST majority of the property tax dollars go toward federally-mandated programs. We have proportionally large percentages of people on all kinds of social programs and public assistance programs. NYS spends more on Medicaid than any other state.

Meanwhile, in schools we're paying for all kinds of non-instructional services for kids - many also of a social or economic nature. Folks, don't let those per-pupil numbers fool you - it's simply an average.

 

[golfgal]

I am quite aware that public sector employees pay taxes, but it is the private sector where the tax dollars originate. Public sector employees simply return a portion of the money they received from government back to government. Government got it from the private sector originally. States and municipalities need a strong private sector to provide the funds with which all government operates.

You make it sound like teachers don't pay taxes at all . You do realize that teachers pay their own salary, right?

This is being kicked around in NC as well. They either want us to pay 100% of our health insurance, 30%, or they want to move everyone to a 70/30 plan(default is 80/20 now) That last option would be fine by me. I barely use my insurance anyway. In NC, teachers ARE state employees. We get a salary from the state and a local supplement from the county. I haven't heard mention of taking that yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if that is being thrown around as well.

By 100%, do they mean they want you to pay 100% of your premiums? They have to pay at least 50% in order for the plan to be a group plan, unless NC has some exemption from that from federal law.

 

[tarheel618]

My own sister is a teacher and I respect the decision, but she knows not to whine about money in her profession since she had the exact same opportunities as me to earn $$$. You both made a choice, but not once did she whine that I make 4 times her salary. She knew going into it what it paid. Please stop your whining ad complaining. Sure it is noble, but frankly if the job was so undersireable then people would quit doing it and then the salary would rise to the level of the education.

If what you teach was so important then the private sector would pay to teach people in that field to fill the jobs. I work in consulting and we pay big $$$$ to teach young staffers how to do what we do. Public education is a right in the US and it is great standard, but if free commerce would be allowed to reign then only the best and brightest would be privately educated in skills deemed needed by private sector.

Don't take that I don't appreciate teachers, my sister is one but her life is pretty cush. She leaves work at 3pm and picks up my nephew and is home no later than 4:30. She gets off summers and all school breaks. Sure I make more money but I am at the office by 7:30am and usually don't leave before 6:30pm or 7pmand usually answer work emails and catch up on admin stuff after getting home when everyone else is asleep. I won't even go into the numerous business trips I make per month. I don't get summers off and I don't get off at 3pm. Sure teachers may have an hour or two of "home" work but they also get a planning period and leave at 3pm, so please quit crying woe is me.

Go into teaching because your want to, but quit the shock and horror about the pay.

Quit Whining YOU choose to work like this!

 

[torinsmom]

You make it sound like teachers don't pay taxes at all . You do realize that teachers pay their own salary, right?




By 100%, do they mean they want you to pay 100% of your premiums? They have to pay at least 50% in order for the plan to be a group plan, unless NC has some exemption from that from federal law.

What I understood was 100%, but I may be wrong. The actual bills have not been suggested(is that the word) officially yet.


Planning period? I get 35 minutes per day and three days a week that 35 minutes is a meeting with admin or the guidance counselor, etc. 5 min. of that time is spent getting the kids to specials and I have to go back a few minutes early to get them lined up. If I don't have a meeting, I go to the bathroom and then I have a whole 20 minutes to "plan". And we don't get a lunch break; we eat with the kids. And no teachers I know get off at 3pm. Our official hours at my school are 8:00-3:45, but most come in earlier and noone leaves by 3:45. I leave at 4:30, and would stay later if I didn't have a second job. I teach PreK/K, so I only have to do maybe 2-3 hours/week planning at home, but I can only imagine how much time a middle school teacher needs to plan.

Anytime a teacher tries to correct a misconception, they are seen as whining. If someone attacks you, do you just stand there and let them keep hitting you? I love what I do, but just like every job, there are things that suck.

 

[snowywhite89]

Well, on this one thing, we can agree! I firmly believe that if the things that you have mentioned happened in every child's life, a large part of the problem would be solved and we'd be able to reduce the amount of funding schools required. Think about it, if every child went to school well nourished, there would be no need for schools to provide free lunch and breakfast to students, saving a minimum of $16B nationwide!

I don't have a problem with feeding the kids. I would prefer we fed them 3 meals a day and cut out SNAP. Keep the at risk kids in school until after dinner. Use the time between school ending and dinner for homework.

I also want year round schools with shorter breaks and limited homework( other than reading) until the later grades. Our kids are really hurt by having the summers off.

 

[Rumpus]

Lets assume that the unions are correct and teachers should get the salaries that they all desire. In a perfect world, we would all get the salaries that we desire. How does one propose to pay for it? What should be done in those states that have huge deficits? (California, NY, Ct immediately come to mind)

 

[prncess674]

Quit Whining YOU choose to work like this!

I am not whining, I am compensated for those hours. Teachers don't work near the hours of a full time employee. I know that they *think* they do, but they don't. What other profession works only 9 month a year and gets off at 3pm and considers it full time?

 

[tarheel618]

I am not whining, I am compensated for those hours. Teachers don't work near the hours of a full time employee. I know that they *think* they do, but they don't. What other profession works only 9 month a year and gets off at 3pm and considers it full time?

Are you at work now? Does your employer know that you are Dising while working?

 

[sparklynails23]

Reading this thread, as a future teacher (especially in NC), broke my heart.

People should really value education and teachers more - we are teaching the future of the world. Your kids spend more time in school than they spend with you.

You need to work on your elementary Math skills.

 

[prncess674]

Are you at work now? Does your employer know that you are Dising while working?

I am not at work now, I am on one of the biz trips in another time zone. Besides, I am not banned from the internet while at work and as long as my clients are happy and they are only being billed for hours that I actually work for them I am free to do as I please. When you work for billable hours there is no clock to punch regarding when and where I get my work done.

 

[golfgal]

I am not whining, I am compensated for those hours. Teachers don't work near the hours of a full time employee. I know that they *think* they do, but they don't. What other profession works only 9 month a year and gets off at 3pm and considers it full time?

I don't know of a single teacher that is DONE at 3:00, let alone only works 9 months out of the year. If teachers really had that job I am sure no one would be "whining" about it.

Teachers certainly don't get out of town business trips where they can spend their time on internet chat boards and call it "billable hours" either

 

[Rumpus]

I don't know of a single teacher that is DONE at 3:00, let alone only works 9 months out of the year. If teachers really had that job I am sure no one would be "whining" about it.

Teachers certainly don't get out of town business trips where they can spend their time on internet chat boards and call it "billable hours" either

But every teacher had the option to chose a career that allowed them to do that. But lets assume that you are right, teachers work harder than anyone and they are paid pauper's wages, how do we pay for what they want each week in their paychecks and when they retire? Where does the money come from?

 

[prncess674]

Teachers certainly don't get out of town business trips where they can spend their time on internet chat boards and call it "billable hours" either

You need to work on your reading comprehension skills. I said I am NOT charging my client for this time.

 

[Kathi OD]

I am not at work now, I am on one of the biz trips in another time zone. Besides, I am not banned from the internet while at work and as long as my clients are happy and they are only being billed for hours that I actually work for them I am free to do as I please. When you work for billable hours there is no clock to punch regarding when and where I get my work done.

Well then, I guess you're not really *working* all those long hours you profess to work either.

 

[Rumpus]

I am fairly new here but it amazes me when a discussion turns personal as this one has. I don't see the point of asking a poster if she is on the net from work, if she is allowed to and implying that she is somehow cheating. I would assume that there is always someone on line who happens to be at work at some point. If their employer doesn't care, why should we? And why would it even come up in this discussion?

 

[FlightlessDuck]

Teachers don't work near the hours of a full time employee. I know that they *think* they do, but they don't. What other profession works only 9 month a year and gets off at 3pm and considers it full time?

7:30 - 3 is 7:30 hours. That's 30 minutes shy of a normal work day for a professional. That also doesn't count any teachers that stay after 3PM to do their grading, work an after school activity, or attend a meeting.

I am in a salaried position that requires a degree, so I'd say it's the same category as an educator. I get 25 days of PTO plus 8 holidays. so I work about 45 more days than the average teacher in my area (52*5 - 33 = 227, 184 - 2 personal days = 182). I also get paid 1.5 times what an average teacher does in my area with the same number of years experience in the same job (if you count per diem, since I work more days, it's still 1.24 times an average teacher). And I have a lower degree (BA vs MA). And I haven't gotten a raise in 2.5 years (if I did, I'd be making roughly 1.63 times).

In my position, I don't have to listen to whiny parents who deny their kid does anything wrong, deal with administrators who always take the side of the parents, or get my pay criticized daily by the public while being told I am lazy. So not only do I get paid more, I have less stress.

Somehow, I don't think that's fair.

 

[Kathi OD]

But every teacher had the option to chose a career that allowed them to do that. But lets assume that you are right, teachers work harder than anyone and they are paid pauper's wages, how do we pay for what they want each week in their paychecks and when they retire? Where does the money come from?

Likewise, those who chose to work in the private sector, could have opted to become public school teachers and get paid lavish salaries with awesome benefits.

FWIW, I don't get paid a pauper's salary. You might be surprised to learn I believe I make a good salary, along with having very good benefits, as my level of education and responsibilities should provide. It wasn't always this way. My first teaching position (back in the days of the dinosaurs) paid very little, nothing near what my level of education and job responsibilities should have commanded. While the benefits were good, they were not as good as many in the private sector.

Unfortunately, the money needed to pay all of us in the public sector must come from taxpayers. But honestly, those taxpayers (in general, maybe not you personally) are willing to pay obscene amounts of money on entertainment, designer clothing, outlandish vacations, McMansion-type houses, restaurant meals several nights a week, without giving a second thought to it, yet complain when it comes to spending on education and public safety. Seriously, which is more important? Season tickets to a professional football team's games, living in a 4,000 sq. ft (or larger house), carrying a Dolce & Gabbana bag, or the education of your child? Personally, I see a very large segment of my fellow citizens having their priorities in the wrong place.

 

[prncess674]

Well then, I guess you're not really *working* all those long hours you profess to work either.

Umm, not once did I say I work 24/7 and am never allowed a moment of free time. Trust me they squeeze every billable hour they can out of me, but I as stated previously, I don't punch a clock. I work when I need to work.

I am fairly new here but it amazes me when a discussion turns personal as this one has. I don't see the point of asking a poster if she is on the net from work, if she is allowed to and implying that she is somehow cheating. I would assume that there is always someone on line who happens to be at work at some point. If their employer doesn't care, why should we? And why would it even come up in this discussion?

agree!

7:30 - 3 is 7:30 hours. That's 30 minutes shy of a normal work day for a professional. That also doesn't count any teachers that stay after 3PM to do their grading, work an after school activity, or attend a meeting.

I am in a salaried position that requires a degree, so I'd say it's the same category as an educator. I get 25 days of PTO plus 8 holidays. so I work about 45 more days than the average teacher in my area (52*5 - 33 = 227, 184 - 2 personal days = 182). I also get paid 1.5 times what an average teacher does in my area with the same number of years experience in the same job (if you count per diem, since I work more days, it's still 1.24 times an average teacher). And I have a lower degree (BA vs MA). And I haven't gotten a raise in 2.5 years (if I did, I'd be making roughly 1.63 times).

In my position, I don't have to listen to whiny parents who deny their kid does anything wrong, deal with administrators who always take the side of the parents, or get my pay criticized daily by the public while being told I am lazy. So not only do I get paid more, I have less stress.

Somehow, I don't think that's fair.

Teachers are not required to have an MA. If teachers don't think the pay is fair in a free market society they are welcome to choose another profession that would pay more. Teaching is not indentured servitude.