ECVs and Wheelchairs in Line

[iuki]

I use an ECV and have encountered the "dirty looks" and rude comments when in line for buses or attractions at the theme parks. Unless someone qualifies for GAC status, if Disney would have ques at all bus stops and make the lines accessible to ECVs and then allow them priority boarding when their turn comes up, it would help to alleviate all the hostility to those in ECVs. The same with the lines at the parks. I feel very uncomfortable - as though I'm cutting in line. In fact, my family stand in line rather than get on the bus with my husband and me. It would probably dissuade those, who really don't need to rent a wheelchair or ECV, from renting one, just to get "front-line" privileges.

Any opinions on this? And please, be nice in your response.

iuki

 

[Tinker Bell Fan]

In the past we too have endured the looks. DH uses an ECV and in the past you wouldn't be able to tell he couldn't walk 50 feet without being in severe pain just by looking at him. He has vascular & cardiac problems.

This past July he had an above the knee amputation and by Christmas we hope he'll have a prosthesis. When we go in April 2011 (for our 20th anniversary) - he will most likely still use the ECV and I'm sure if anyone gives him a dirty look he might take off his leg and throw it at them.

But seriously - we ignore the dirty looks. Giving someone in an ECV or wheelchair a dirty look is just being rude - they have rights just like those who do not need one. Just because they can't "see" the handicap doesn't mean it doesn't exist! That is the way DH & I were brought up.

DH & I were at a local farmers market one Sunday and we were in line waiting to purchase some veggies. A 'lady' jumped in front of us. DH decided to move off to get out of the way and I said to the 'lady' - "excuse me but we were here first" she said "yeah I know, but you know how handicapped people are they take so much time and I'm in a hurry." I smiled and said "really? Hmmm my husband had to have his leg amputated and he doesn't consider himself as 'handicapped' just disabled. By looking at you I'm guessing your handicap is mental?" She stood there with her mouth open as the cashier asked for the next in line, which I promptly went to the cashier while the others in line started clapping. I was just so happy that DH had NOT heard what that 'lady' said (who by the way high-tailed it to another stand)! Funny thing is I didn't say it rudely, but more as if I was concerned for her. (sorry for going off topic there).

 

[iuki]

In the past we too have endured the looks. DH uses an ECV and in the past you wouldn't be able to tell he couldn't walk 50 feet without being in severe pain just by looking at him. He has vascular & cardiac problems.

This past July he had an above the knee amputation and by Christmas we hope he'll have a prosthesis. When we go in April 2011 (for our 20th anniversary) - he will most likely still use the ECV and I'm sure if anyone gives him a dirty look he might take off his leg and throw it at them.

But seriously - we ignore the dirty looks. Giving someone in an ECV or wheelchair a dirty look is just being rude - they have rights just like those who do not need one. Just because they can't "see" the handicap doesn't mean it doesn't exist! That is the way DH & I were brought up.

DH & I were at a local farmers market one Sunday and we were in line waiting to purchase some veggies. A 'lady' jumped in front of us. DH decided to move off to get out of the way and I said to the 'lady' - "excuse me but we were here first" she said "yeah I know, but you know how handicapped people are they take so much time and I'm in a hurry." I smiled and said "really? Hmmm my husband had to have his leg amputated and he doesn't consider himself as 'handicapped' just disabled. By looking at you I'm guessing your handicap is mental?" She stood there with her mouth open as the cashier asked for the next in line, which I promptly went to the cashier while the others in line started clapping. I was just so happy that DH had NOT heard what that 'lady' said (who by the way high-tailed it to another stand)! Funny thing is I didn't say it rudely, but more as if I was concerned for her. (sorry for going off topic there).

Loved the way you handled that person. And, you're right, you can't always tell why someone is using an ECV. With your husband's amputated leg, it's obvious. What is so funny is that in my case, I look fine, but am in a lot of pain when walking. I have a handicapped parking permit, but people always assume the parking permit is for my husband. He lost his arm due to electrical burns as a former lineman, and the left side of his neck and his left leg are disfigured from burn scars and skin grafts - and yet, he can walk and actually worries and takes care of me. Whenever I tell him I feel guilty, he says that's how he felt when I took care of him when he got burned. Therefore, I don't judge people by how they look.

iuki

 

[littlepeppers]

I think a lot of people have questions about ECV users because they have seen those that abuse them in the parks. You know, the ones who take turns walkins, playing, goofing off...... on them. There are people who are evil & would do anything to cheat the system. They don't even mind the cost of the EVC. I'm sure the cost isn't bad when split between the lot of them.

My DDad is coming with us & he should really be using an EVC, but his pride gets in the way. He would rather missout on keeping up w/ us than ride in something he needs b/c his liver and spleen are shot. He tires very easily, but wants to see the grandkids light up one more time. His disease is starting to progress more rapidly and the big turn for the worse could be anyday.

Disney does need to change their bus EVC set up and line EVC set up. The people who need the EVCs usually don't mind waiting their turn. A change in the EVC set up would stop those that abuse the EVC for sole purpose of cheating the system that was intended to help people who need help.

 

[Bete]

in the handicap line especially when the bus has started boarding the regular line. Once the regular line starts boarding you have to wait for the next bus even though you are there. That can be at least a half hour.

Another example is if we have two in our party with an ECV and/or wheelchair. We choose to be together and if someone is in front of us taking one spot then we wait for another bus. Who wants to be split up?

I see it going both ways. Sometimes we wait longer and sometimes we don't.

Another comment: I don't think you have to have a handicap to rent an ECV; it's a matter of choice if you are willing to pay for one. Some enjoy touring the parks that way. For some it's a matter of convenience and it's a time saver. They can walk, but do so very slowly and so an ECV helps them out. Whether they should be in a handicap line that's a hard one to answer.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

My DDad is coming with us & he should really be using an ECV, but his pride gets in the way. He would rather miss out on keeping up w/ us than ride in something he needs b/c his liver and spleen are shot. He tires very easily, but wants to see the grandkids light up one more time. His disease is starting to progress more rapidly and the big turn for the worse could be any day.

Please ask the following questions. Here are the suggested answers to go with them.

1. Are you disabled (even temporarily)? Yes.

2. Do the people you are traveling with, such as your family, know you are disabled? Yes.

3. Do you expect to meet anyone you know during this trip who may not know you are disabled. Probably No!

4. Do you expect to meet a bunch of people who you will probably never meet again in your life? Probably yes!

5. Is there any reason at all that you should care what these people think about you? Absolutely No!!

6. Will using a wheelchair or ECV make for a better vacation for you and your family? Absolutely YES!

 

[Mike Bartenhagen]

I use an ECV and have encountered the "dirty looks" and rude comments when in line for buses or attractions at the theme parks. Unless someone qualifies for GAC status, if Disney would have ques at all bus stops and make the lines accessible to ECVs and then allow them priority boarding when their turn comes up, it would help to alleviate all the hostility to those in ECVs. The same with the lines at the parks. I feel very uncomfortable - as though I'm cutting in line. In fact, my family stand in line rather than get on the bus with my husband and me. It would probably dissuade those, who really don't need to rent a wheelchair or ECV, from renting one, just to get "front-line" privileges.

Any opinions on this? And please, be nice in your response.

iuki

We have actually encountered the opposite. My 8 year old son has a wheelchair and 99% of the people we cross paths with at WDW are very kind and considerate, I am sure the other 1% are just jerks in general and not specific to us. It probably makes a difference that we go to the parks in Oct when crowds are light and I am sure many see a chair as different than an ECV and the fact that he's a child probably makes a difference. I do agree with you that at times we feel uncomfortable, as if we are cutting in line, and much prefer the rides where we just push Broc's chair through the regular line like every one else.

Mike

 

[Eeyore5]

I think a lot of people have questions about ECV users because they have seen those that abuse them in the parks. You know, the ones who take turns walkins, playing, goofing off...... on them. There are people who are evil & would do anything to cheat the system. They don't even mind the cost of the EVC. I'm sure the cost isn't bad when split between the lot of them.

My DDad is coming with us & he should really be using an EVC, but his pride gets in the way. He would rather missout on keeping up w/ us than ride in something he needs b/c his liver and spleen are shot. He tires very easily, but wants to see the grandkids light up one more time. His disease is starting to progress more rapidly and the big turn for the worse could be anyday.

Disney does need to change their bus EVC set up and line EVC set up. The people who need the EVCs usually don't mind waiting their turn. A change in the EVC set up would stop those that abuse the EVC for sole purpose of cheating the system that was intended to help people who need help.

My mom and I are both mildly disabled. Neither one of us need an ECV all day but neither one of us can walk all day either. We will be switching off. Switching off doesn't mean people are abusing the system.

 

[littlepeppers]

Please ask the following questions. Here are the suggested answers to go with them.

1. Are you disabled (even temporarily)? Yes.

2. Do the people you are traveling with, such as your family, know you are disabled? Yes.

3. Do you expect to meet anyone you know during this trip who may not know you are disabled. Probably No!

4. Do you expect to meet a bunch of people who you will probably never meet again in your life? Probably yes!

5. Is there any reason at all that you should care what these people think about you? Absolutely No!!

6. Will using a wheelchair or ECV make for a better vacation for you and your family? Absolutely YES!

You & me both know my DDad should use one, but how do you get him to set his pride aside? Hard headed cajun.

 

[littlepeppers]

My mom and I are both mildly disabled. Neither one of us need an ECV all day but neither one of us can walk all day either. We will be switching off. Switching off doesn't mean people are abusing the system.

Not the people who need them, but the ones who play on them.

 

[SueM in MN]

I think a lot of people have questions about ECV users because they have seen those that abuse them in the parks. You know, the ones who take turns walkins, playing, goofing off...... on them. There are people who are evil & would do anything to cheat the system. They don't even mind the cost of the EVC. I'm sure the cost isn't bad when split between the lot of them.

My DDad is coming with us & he should really be using an EVC, but his pride gets in the way. He would rather missout on keeping up w/ us than ride in something he needs b/c his liver and spleen are shot. He tires very easily, but wants to see the grandkids light up one more time. His disease is starting to progress more rapidly and the big turn for the worse could be anyday.

Disney does need to change their bus EVC set up and line EVC set up. The people who need the EVCs usually don't mind waiting their turn. A change in the EVC set up would stop those that abuse the EVC for sole purpose of cheating the system that was intended to help people who need help.

]Not the people who need them, but the ones who play on them.[/B]

The problem is that no one can tell from looking who needs them and who doesn't.
Just sharing one, just 'playing' doesn't mean the person doesn't need one. Some people may be going too fast, cutting in or appearing to be 'playing'.
That just means they might not be using the ECV as responsibly as they should, not that they don't need it.

There are many people who may not need an ECV in their everyday life, but do need it for a trip to WDW. I think that is the case for the majority of the people who are renting ECVs.
I don't think too many people will pay the cost (both money and aggrevation) to rent an ECV if they don't need it.

Most of the attractions have Mainstream Access, where the line is accessible. For those that don't, there is something about the line or access that makes it not accessible. Sometimes it's because the regular boarding area boards on one side of a track and the exit is on the other side of the car, on the other side of the track.
If someone is using an ECV because they can't walk more than 50 feet or because they can't walk more than 3 miles in a day, they are still going to need to use that line/access if they have an ECV in line.

And, some of the 'resentment' comes from people who misinterpret what they see. I've seen threads where people say they saw someone who 'went to the front of the line' or in a 'special line' for the Safari or for one of the many theater attractions like Indiana Jones. The last time we went on the Safari was a few weeks ago and while it is true that we got pulled off before the regular line got to board, the people in the 'regular line' were boarded way before we were because we waited for the accessible tram.
For show, yes you do often get into a special line, but that is because there are limited numbers of wheelchair/ECV spots. They need to know how many spots are filled so that they don't have more guests coming into the area than there are spots.

 

[Brandi1leigh]

I am anticipating some dirty looks when my mom and I go next year. Neither of us use an ECV in "real" life, but there is a lot more physical activity at WDW. Both my mom and I look healthy (although we are both pooh sized); however; she has severe arthritis in her feet, making it impossible to walk long distances. I have end stage renal disease and have dialysis three times a week. No kidney function means I have a lot of health issues that you can't see just by looking at me. I'm not concerned with dirty looks for me, I can ignore them. But I am afraid it will hurt my mom. On her good days, we intend to park the ECV outside of rides and wait in line, but I can definitely see how people might think we don't really "need" the ECV when we hop on and off of them. Luckily, we will have a car and won't need to take Disney transportation. When I went in 2008, one of our group was on an ECV and loading and unloading on the buses was always stressful. I don't want to subject my parents to that. I want the trip to be as magical as possible for them, because we rarely travel as a family. My experience in 2008 echoes what I've read from most others here on the boards, some lines were cut a little shorter, but most we waited just as long or longer--only in a different place.

Sorry for the long post, I'm just a little nervous about the ECV experience.

 

[Agri]

My mom is in a wheelchair and we deal with the same thing. She had brain surgery, so I can't leave her alone in the chair while I stand in line. Our compromise is that if the line is long, we wait for a few buses to go and then we go get in front. If people give us dirty looks or say something, we tell them we waited for x amount of buses to go before "jumping" in line. If they get real nasty, mom takes off her hat and shows them her scar and says that she had brain surgery and we're doing the best we can. LOL

I don't like how the lines are handled for the buses at all. We know we can just jump in front if the line is miles long and we don't like that - its not right.

We don't have problems on rides because a lot of the ones we like to go on have wheelchair-accessible lines and we don't skip any of it, or just part of it like on TSMM. It's not our fault some rides weren't engineered with accessibility in mind.

The worst, honestly, is trying to get through a park or down a ramp. A lot of people ignore anything you say and just look behind and see a wheelchair person and act like "whatever" - then get ticked if you can't help but run into them if they slow down or just stop suddenly. People (and their kids) seem to think that they can just cut in front of a wheelchair (and walk slowly or stop altogether) and the wheelchair person should slow down or stop for them. I can't tell you how many times we've been told "Well, little Johnny doesn't know any better" when we nearly hit a kid. Our response? They need to teach little Johnny not to run off and stop in front of a wheelchair.

 

[iuki]

I think a lot of people have questions about ECV users because they have seen those that abuse them in the parks. You know, the ones who take turns walkins, playing, goofing off...... on them. There are people who are evil & would do anything to cheat the system. They don't even mind the cost of the EVC. I'm sure the cost isn't bad when split between the lot of them.

My DDad is coming with us & he should really be using an EVC, but his pride gets in the way. He would rather missout on keeping up w/ us than ride in something he needs b/c his liver and spleen are shot. He tires very easily, but wants to see the grandkids light up one more time. His disease is starting to progress more rapidly and the big turn for the worse could be anyday.

Disney does need to change their bus EVC set up and line EVC set up. The people who need the EVCs usually don't mind waiting their turn. A change in the EVC set up would stop those that abuse the EVC for sole purpose of cheating the system that was intended to help people who need help.

My mom and I are both mildly disabled. Neither one of us need an ECV all day but neither one of us can walk all day either. We will be switching off. Switching off doesn't mean people are abusing the system.

The problem is that no one can tell from looking who needs them and who doesn't.
Just sharing one, just 'playing' doesn't mean the person doesn't need one. Some people may be going too fast, cutting in or appearing to be 'playing'.
That just means they might not be using the ECV as responsibly as they should, not that they don't need it.

There are many people who may not need an ECV in their everyday life, but do need it for a trip to WDW. I think that is the case for the majority of the people who are renting ECVs.
I don't think too many people will pay the cost (both money and aggrevation) to rent an ECV if they don't need it.

You're right - there are just a few. I agree with littlepeppers, however, that there are those who do abuse the system. We personally witnessed and overheard a young couple say, "okay, whose turn to play the cripple" and laughed. They weren't aware we were sitting in the lobby of the resort where we could see and hear them.

Most of the attractions have Mainstream Access, where the line is accessible. For those that don't, there is something about the line or access that makes it not accessible. Sometimes it's because the regular boarding area boards on one side of a track and the exit is on the other side of the car, on the other side of the track.
If someone is using an ECV because they can't walk more than 50 feet or because they can't walk more than 3 miles in a day, they are still going to need to use that line/access if they have an ECV in line.

And, some of the 'resentment' comes from people who misinterpret what they see. I've seen threads where people say they saw someone who 'went to the front of the line' or in a 'special line' for the Safari or for one of the many theater attractions like Indiana Jones. The last time we went on the Safari was a few weeks ago and while it is true that we got pulled off before the regular line got to board, the people in the 'regular line' were boarded way before we were because we waited for the accessible tram.
For show, yes you do often get into a special line, but that is because there are limited numbers of wheelchair/ECV spots. They need to know how many spots are filled so that they don't have more guests coming into the area than there are spots.

And everone is right that at times we have to wait for several buses before we can get on. Also, if we arrive when there are a number of people already at the bus stop, we tell the driver that we'll wait for the next bus and to take the others.

Thanks for all the respectful input.

iuki

P.S. - I just ordered an ECV (Go Go Elite Traveler Plus) that I purhased online from SpinLife.com. The ECV and the website were selected based on recommendations on this forum.

Thanks to all of you.

 

[Eeyore5]

I am anticipating some dirty looks when my mom and I go next year. Neither of us use an ECV in "real" life, but there is a lot more physical activity at WDW. Both my mom and I look healthy (although we are both pooh sized); however; she has severe arthritis in her feet, making it impossible to walk long distances. I have end stage renal disease and have dialysis three times a week. No kidney function means I have a lot of health issues that you can't see just by looking at me. I'm not concerned with dirty looks for me, I can ignore them. But I am afraid it will hurt my mom. On her good days, we intend to park the ECV outside of rides and wait in line, but I can definitely see how people might think we don't really "need" the ECV when we hop on and off of them. Luckily, we will have a car and won't need to take Disney transportation. When I went in 2008, one of our group was on an ECV and loading and unloading on the buses was always stressful. I don't want to subject my parents to that. I want the trip to be as magical as possible for them, because we rarely travel as a family. My experience in 2008 echoes what I've read from most others here on the boards, some lines were cut a little shorter, but most we waited just as long or longer--only in a different place.

Sorry for the long post, I'm just a little nervous about the ECV experience.

My mom and I are overweight and both used an ECV 2 years ago. We both have mild disabilities but only need an ECV at Disney. We were having too much fun to notice what others thought most of the time. Focus on the fun you are having and enjoy the freedom to move easily. Someone else on this board (can't remember who) has said there is a difference between surviving Disney and enjoying it. I strongly agree with this. Have a great time and if you run into people with attitude it helps to ignore them or smile and say hi. And keep in mind, some people with a grumpy look may have an upset tummy or other issue so it may have nothing to do with you at all.

 

[maroo]

Not the people who need them, but the ones who play on them.

I don't guess this comment would apply to children...

But I went with a Make a Wish family last year to Disney and their son has a form of cancer. He doesn't look disabled or even sick. We would push him in a wheelchair through the park and right up to the exit line, since he had the Wish Trip pass...and we got some dirty looks and people not understanding why a child would JUMP out of the wheelchair and RUN to the ride! And with front of the line access!?!?!

Yes, he is sick. And he needs a wheelchair because he gets way too tired if he walks in the parks all day. And he certainly "earned" his Wish Trip with his life threatening illness and tons of medical procedures and crap in his short life.

I guess I say that...just to say...things are not always what they seem. I really try to give people a break in the parks. I used to look at people, too...and wonder what was going on...but the past few years have taught me that you never really know what is going on with someone else and it just makes more sense to pay attention to your own friends and family and have a good time where you are. It is a lot less stressful that way, too.

 

[lisam427]

this past september we went to disney and stayed at carribean beach. it is true i am pooh sized, but i went with recent a knee injury (dislocated knee from a fall) and needed use of an ECV. the one night my family and i were at the bus stop to go to my resort from the magic kingdom. there was a horrible downpour that night and to top it all off my evc was almost out of power. there had to be about 60 people waiting for busses. there was me and another evc. just as i was about half way on the ramp to get on my bus my the evc died and a wave of water came from above and soaked me. as that happened every person waiting cheered and clapped and made comments that it served me right since i cut them in line. i even heard comments about i am only using the scooter because i am overweight, too lazy to walk, and want to skip everyone. how sad! how ignorant!!!!

 

[POOHsie]

I was in line at Captain Jack's for a 9 pm dinner. I have my own scooter. I was there with my DD and her BF. I overheard the hostess tell the server she was giving her our seating. The server complained, loud enough for me to hear, that she didn't like to wait on "wheelchairs." Now what the heck does that mean? I may have a bum leg, but I was paying for the entire service and I ordered drinks for all three, plus left 20% tip. What was her beef with serving me, other than I appeared in a scooter?

I don't like being the butt of some cheap-shot comment, like I must be sub-human or something.

 

[wendylovesdisney]

The problem is that no one can tell from looking who needs them and who doesn't.
There are many people who may not need an ECV in their everyday life, but do need it for a trip to WDW.

Well said!

 

[wendylovesdisney]

this past september we went to disney and stayed at carribean beach. it is true i am pooh sized, but i went with recent a knee injury (dislocated knee from a fall) and needed use of an ECV. the one night my family and i were at the bus stop to go to my resort from the magic kingdom. there was a horrible downpour that night and to top it all off my evc was almost out of power. there had to be about 60 people waiting for busses. there was me and another evc. just as i was about half way on the ramp to get on my bus my the evc died and a wave of water came from above and soaked me. as that happened every person waiting cheered and clapped and made comments that it served me right since i cut them in line. i even heard comments about i am only using the scooter because i am overweight, too lazy to walk, and want to skip everyone. how sad! how ignorant!!!!

Oh my goodness, how sad! Hugs to you!