Do you think that not taking a vacation is cheating your kids???

[design_mom]

I never said he wouldnt spend any time with us. I said some quality time meaning a lot of time spent enjoying each other, all four of us together.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to offend. I thought I was clear when I said you needed him out of the house to get "quality time" -- and I also quoted your original post where you said you needed him out of the house to get quality time. I never meant (and didn't think I implied) that he won't spend any time with you. I apologize if it came across that way.

 

[Ka' eo]

Yes, but her husband won't spend time with them unless they are on vacation. I suppose that if that were the case here, we might be desperate for a vacation, too.

Vacations are a good time, but whether you are talking about couples of families, spending quality and quantity time together should not be left for a once a year party. My opinion, of course.

My husband doesn't take vacations either. That is a completely different issue. If people want to, they can find a score of reasons why they are in debt and why they 'deserve' that vacation they do not have the cash for. This is just another excuse.

Because we have been careful and lived within our means, we can take a vacation, have it paid before we go and not question ourselves. I have learned that the only way to have a week uninterrupted is to schedule an out of town trip and then my husband will join us. He always is home on nights and weekends. My point is that you can solve situations without going into debt. Period.

Most of us understand that life is precious and short. Most of us are on this website are family people. So to assume folks advocating for being responsible and living within ones means do not comprehend the fragility of life or do not value quality family time smacks of a lack of insight.

This attitude of 'I am more enlightened because of my situation than you' is presumptuous and inaccurate and an excuse.

 

[daleswife]

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to offend. I thought I was clear when I said you needed him out of the house to get "quality time" -- and I also quoted your original post where you said you needed him out of the house to get quality time. I never meant (and didn't think I implied) that he won't spend any time with you. I apologize if it came across that way.

No apology needed, I just thought maybe you got the wrong impression by the way I posted it or something. sometimes on these boards you can post something innocent and have it blow up to something it was never meant to be.....

 

[bettymae1121]

While I am not speaking of an ill child, I do understand where the pp was coming from. My son did have some medical issues when he was a month old that I thank GOD every day that he outgrew.

We are not upside down on a mortgage, we are not behind on any bills for that matter, My question was a simple one and maybe could have been worded a little better than what it was. We can afford a vacation, but are thinking of not going so we can pay down some of the debt we have. But I dont want to cheat my kids out of some special family time that they will remember.

I agree that life is all about balance. DH and I have debt we are trying to pay off and we are taking a trip in April. My brother is getting married, he's in AZ and we're in IL. In addition to flying out for the wedding, we're adding on two days at Disneyland. Could that money go towards the debt? Of course. But paying it off a month or two sooner isn't worth missing my brother's wedding or taking a few days just for the two of us at a place we dearly love. We are paying down the debt, all our other bills are paid for. To us, it's worth the extra time it will take to pay down the debt. We're paying cash for the trip, it isn't being added to the CC, it's just we aren't using that money to pay extra to the CC. Now, if our bills weren't being paid for, that would be totally different.

As for the question of "do children deserve a vacation". Again, assuming basic needs are met and taking a trip won't hurt the families finances, I do believe that while "deserve" might be a bit strong of a word to use, I think parents with the means to do so should take vacations. There is something about being away from home and all the friends and interuptions, that you just can't replicate with a stay-cation. As many others have pointed out, it doesn't have to be an expensive trip, but I do think getting away from home is a key element.

Now, if money is an issue, then there is nothing wrong at all with stay-cations. If you can't even afford a stay-cation, then even a day at the local zoo on free admision day with a picnic lunch is better than nothing (and a lot of fun even if money isn't an issue!). But if a family can swing it, a trip away from home every year or two is a worthy goal.

 

[jodifla]

My husband doesn't take vacations either. That is a completely different issue. If people want to, they can find a score of reasons why they are in debt and why they 'deserve' that vacation they do not have the cash for. This is just another excuse.

Because we have been careful and lived within our means, we can take a vacation, have it paid before we go and not question ourselves. I have learned that the only way to have a week uninterrupted is to schedule an out of town trip and then my husband will join us. He always is home on nights and weekends. My point is that you can solve situations without going into debt. Period.

Most of us understand that life is precious and short. Most of us are on this website are family people. So to assume folks advocating for being responsible and living within ones means do not comprehend the fragility of life or do not value quality family time smacks of a lack of insight.

This attitude of 'I am more enlightened because of my situation than you' is presumptuous and inaccurate and an excuse.

That works both ways, though.

I think of the movies "Up" and "It's a Wonderful Life." Something always came up, and they never followed their dreams. While I realized those movies are saying something else, it ALWAYS bothers me about those movies.

To me travel is very, very, very important. Is that an "excuse?" I don't care if it is. I'd rather see the world and have some debt than not travel and be too old to do it, or have my kid be too old to appreciate all the fun things there are too do when you are young.

But I guess that's why I've been to England, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Hawaii as well as all over the U.S.

My parents didn't take me on but a couple of vacations in my life, and yeah, it bugged me, and yeah, I'm making up for it now.

 

[MrsPete]

I guess I don't fit in here at the Bargain Board, because I do prioritize family time over debt.

I don't think anyone has said anything to the contrary on this thread. Quite the opposite, in fact. Many ideas for fun at home have been thrown out there -- not necessarily the corny "staycation ideas" but more like just fun family things that can be done on a Saturday. A husband who's too busy to spend time with the kids outside of vacation DOES still eat dinner -- that's a start on family time.

One, it's about the only time my husband will take off work. He just doesn't take off a week to stay home and "staycation." Just won't happen.

That's not a budget item. Since I see in later posts you're saying that it isn't that he doesn't want to spend time with the kids -- rather, it's just that he stays busy and doesn't relax with them when he's home -- I'd suggest that you try to get the kids involved with doing things with him. Is he repairing a fence? Great time to teach the boys to use a saw. Is he painting a room? Kids love that. This isn't a vacation or a budget issue; it's about encouraging him to include the kids in things he's doing. And I bet if you plan an activity here and there (not a week's staycation, just an activity) like tickets to a baseball game, he'll be happy to go. Tickets to our minor-league baseball team are only $3 for general admission -- you can plan LOTS of little things like that, and that's quality family time. Some dads do that naturally, while others need a little nudge in that direction.

I hear this form of debt justification all the time. 10% of Americans are unemployed. The average length of time being unemployed is 30 weeks. I'd say "we're not promised tomorrow" applies to a job and income too.

Yes, that "we're not promised tomorrow" does cut both ways. It's important to spend time with our kids, but it's also important to save for their educations and our retirements NOW while we're employed and while the beauty of compound interest has years to work. Ditto for paying off the mortgage as soon as possible. We're not promised a job tomorrow. That doesn't mean that family time isn't important -- it means that we all have MULTIPLE important things on our plates, and we can't ignore any of them.

Going to an extreme in either direction is bad. You need a balance between work and family time, between saving and spending.

Guess I'm at a loss why you posted the question then????

Not necessarily talking about the OP, but many people post questions like this because they want to validate their own opinion. They want people to tell them that they're right.

To care for my elderly father back in Florida after we moved up to Michigan and, I had to travel back and forth every four months weeks or so. I ran up a fair amount of CC debt doing that. It was NOT something that could be 'put off" or "saved for." And I didn't want to use my emergency savings up for it. Or stop going of vacation with our family. Once we found out he was dying, the trips got even more frequent.

I'd say that situations like that are WHY YOU SAVE. You didn't realize that he was going to be sick and in need, but you do know that something's going to happen in your life and that something's going to require money. Of course you didn't have a "my dad might get sick" fund. But we should all have short-term savings. Maybe that money goes for a new roof or a new TV (like when lightning struck our house last year), or maybe it goes for something else . . . but you should have some money earmarked for unforseen circumstances, and you shouldn't feel badly about using it when things like this come up. You just make sure that once the emergency is past, you start replenishing that fund.

Balance, balance. For my family, the be-all end-all isn't to be debt free at the expense of everything else.

The point of being debt-free is that it buys you so much . . . security to know that the house in which you live is YOURs, freedom to accept a lower-paying job or fewer hours, and more money in the bank because you're not throwing money towards interest. It means not needing to choose between saving for the kids' college and your retirement. It means being able to take multiple trips every year without any guilt. Being debt-free buys you that balance you're advocating. Being debt-free isn't a be-all and end-all; rather, it's the key to so many other things -- things that matter tremendously.

 

[Ka' eo]

That works both ways, though.

I think of the movies "Up" and "It's a Wonderful Life." Something always came up, and they never followed their dreams. While I realized those movies are saying something else, it ALWAYS bothers me about those movies.

To me travel is very, very, very important. Is that an "excuse?" I don't care if it is. I'd rather see the world and have some debt than not travel and be too old to do it, or have my kid be too old to appreciate all the fun things there are too do when you are young.

But I guess that's why I've been to England, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Hawaii as well as all over the U.S.

My parents didn't take me on but a couple of vacations in my life, and yeah, it bugged me, and yeah, I'm making up for it now.

Travel is important to me as well. My kids have been to Hawaii, to WDW, out west and we are planning a trip to Mexico. What is an excuse and what I am reacting to is that this family went LAST YEAR, they have debt and people are enabling her to 'live for the moment' and not pay off debt. I disagree with this.

Assumptions keep flying here. Broken record. This is not about not taking vacations. This is about not going into debt and going on vacations. This is about saving for a vacation and going when you can afford it.

As far as it their 'dream' never occuring, the amount people spend in interest, penalties and late fees often equals if not surpasses the cost of a vacation.

We live in a highly superficial, materialistic society. People are are striving for status- cell phones, new expensive cars, flat screen tvs, ipods, designer clothes, lavish trips. It does not make people happier.

We live in the country and enjoy our beautiful acreage and small things like playing games by the fire, sledding, watching the olympics together. This time has been wonderful with our kids. They are no worse off because we haven't taken a trip for 2 years other than driving trips for a weekend here, or a cheap state park there. Our last trip was Hawaii. We are saving for Mexico and to do some work on the house. Our kids are itching for an adventure and want to go to Disney. So this year, we are going BUDGET, because we want to do other things with our money as well. They'll appreciate it a lot more than when we went every year.

I am not judging the OP. She can make her own choices, but encouraging people to have debt because 'you only live once' is not good advice, IMHO. My folks had that view, they still do, and they are still working in their 70s because of it. If I had not married my dh, I'd be making the same poor choices they did.

I will shut up now.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

My husband doesn't take vacations either. That is a completely different issue. If people want to, they can find a score of reasons why they are in debt and why they 'deserve' that vacation they do not have the cash for. This is just another excuse.

Because we have been careful and lived within our means, we can take a vacation, have it paid before we go and not question ourselves. I have learned that the only way to have a week uninterrupted is to schedule an out of town trip and then my husband will join us. He always is home on nights and weekends. My point is that you can solve situations without going into debt. Period.

Most of us understand that life is precious and short. Most of us are on this website are family people. So to assume folks advocating for being responsible and living within ones means do not comprehend the fragility of life or do not value quality family time smacks of a lack of insight.

This attitude of 'I am more enlightened because of my situation than you' is presumptuous and inaccurate and an excuse.

I absolutely agree. I don't think a vacation is a necessity at all.

After my son died we were in terrible debt. We "deserved" a vacation more than anyone, in theory. But it was 3 years paying off the hospitals and credit cards used in his treatment and necessary travel. My family survived. We still spent time together, even more so, as we were reminded how precious life is. I didn't start planning disney trips every 6 months in case I lost another child.

Every day should be treated like the last, in theory. We attempt to live this way.

 

[tinkerbelletreasure]

I agree with Ka'eo. I don't think people have to put off thier vacations until everything is paid off, mortgages and student loans do take a lot of time and can be beneficial in terms of being able to write off the interest on your taxes.
When I said the if you have debt, you can not afford it, I was of course not referring to just a mortgage because I sincerely doubt anyone with just a mortgage would be questioning whether they should go on a vacation or pay off debt. The fact that the OP is questioning it means that there is bad debt that is bothering her on some level.
And I agree that if the only way to spend "quality family time together " is to go away, that is not a budget issue. It's a choice to pick up the phone when it rings, or load yourself down with honey do's ect. To those people I would give the we are not guarenteed tomorrow speech. We are not guarenteed vacations either and it's a choice if you are going wait until one comes along to spend quality family time together.
The OPs question was whether she would be cheating her kids if she doesn't take them on vacation every year and the simple answer is no. Does that mean she should never take them vacations, no. She needs to figure out what kind fo schedule works best for her family and her budget issues. For my family it's a moderate/big vacation every other year with lots of weekend excusions and staycations in between.

 

[Planogirl]

I can see both sides.

My father was a saver and investor. He was determined to build up a good savings for retirement and to have no debt and he succeeded quite nicely. He also put off a great many dreams including a trip to England. The trouble is that he died suddenly before he could do any of those things that he hoped to do.

There can be too much emphasis placed on saving. My father could have easily afforded the trip to England but he always wanted to save more and more. My mother did take several trips after his death (but none to England).

I don't advocate a lot of debt by any means but if a person has SOME debt and is paying it without a problem, I don't see why going on a low cost trip is a big deal. I'm of course assuming that the trip doesn't add more debt.

Back to the original question, no you are not cheating your kids if you don't take them on vacation.

 

[Minnesota!]

I have to agree with the minority on this board. Life is short, kids are young once, family time is more than precious.

Vacations are critical to me and my family. A "staycation" will not and does not cut it. Really? What's new and exciting about seeing yet another lake? Yet another croweded Mall of America? A vacation to us takes us at least a few hours from home.

We try and do a week long winter vacation to somewhere warm and a weeklong summer vacation to somewhere up north. It's a part of our savings - 1/3 of what I save each month goes into a "vacation" account. 1/3 goes to a regular savings, and 1/3 goes to an "emergency" savings.

And you know what, we were up to our eyeballs in old debt up until last fall. 20K + on credit cards from our younger years. we didn't use our credit cards anymore, but the debt was still there. and we STILL traveled each year. It's how we live and it works for us.

We are debt free now...only the house remains. And some deferred student loans (that I still do make an interest payment on each month so I can stay ahead there). But you know what, it would NEVER stop us from vacationing where and when we want.

My dad and mom took us to WDW, to our cabin up north, to a resort here and there. But they saved for YEARS to have the time/adequate amount of money to do Seattle (taking the train from here). My dad died 3 months after he retired. They never got the chance.

 

[mumom95]

OP, you are not cheating your kids, so don't worry about that.

But that doesn't mean you can't take the vacation. It seems as though you are now living within your means (probably below your means). You were able to get that debt paid off without adding any more debt, which means you seem to have a good handle on your current finances. And I get the impression the debt you still have doesn't seem to be a burden on your family.

There is nothing wrong with some debt, as long as it isn't out of control and you are able to manage the debt. Some people on the DIS love to argue all debt is bad. That doesn't mean they are right, they aren't experts, they're just random people on a message board.

You have to decide what is going to make you (and your husband) happier: using the money to pay off some of the debt you have or using the money to take a bigger vacation this year. Neither choice is right or wrong. For some people having debt stresses them out. For some people not getting away on a vacation stresses them out. You just have to figure out which one makes you happier.

But when it comes to your kids, don't worry. You seem like a great mom and they'll be ok with whatever decision you make, because ultimately, having a happy mom will make the kids happy.

 

[wdwfan16]

That works both ways, though.

I think of the movies "Up" and "It's a Wonderful Life." Something always came up, and they never followed their dreams. While I realized those movies are saying something else, it ALWAYS bothers me about those movies.

To me travel is very, very, very important. Is that an "excuse?" I don't care if it is. I'd rather see the world and have some debt than not travel and be too old to do it, or have my kid be too old to appreciate all the fun things there are too do when you are young.

But I guess that's why I've been to England, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Hawaii as well as all over the U.S.

My parents didn't take me on but a couple of vacations in my life, and yeah, it bugged me, and yeah, I'm making up for it now.

You live in MI and you are telling us how bad it in there. Do you think some of them might have liked some of that vacation money in the bank so they did not lose thier homes?

Would you kid prefer to tell others about Italy or the home he still lives in? It is possible with your CC debt and a job los you could lose your home, as so many are in MI.

Really is it that hard to see how saving is a good thing? You can be a saver and still vacation. When your debt and vacations are preventing you from saving then your priorities are not in balance.

If you had some cash in the bank you could have bought those tickets without incurring CC debt. Just think of what you could have done with all that interest that you paid the CC company? That may have been another tirp to see your Dad or another night of vacation.

 

[pacrosby]

But you kind of never know, do you?

My wedding photographer had been an engineer. He had been healthy all of his life. They put off everything...vacations, etc. -- until he retired. And he retired on the young side, in his 50s. But two years after he retired, he got Parkinson's. And all those dreams went out the window in a flash. We were one of the few weddings he ever shot, and it had been a lifelong dream of his to be a photographer.

Balance, balance. For my family, the be-all end-all isn't to be debt free at the expense of everything else.

Thank you! I wouldn't think you'd have to spell that out for people but obviously you do. People get sick (and worse) every single day. It'd be nice to have a crystal ball but we don't.

I don't think ANYONE is advocating irresponsibility here. Just alittle common sense.

 

[avahoneybee]

After reading Ka'eos posts I feel like cancelling my trip and doing the budget staycation route this year. My kids are little but have been to Disney many times and have mentioned that they would like to go to other destinations (like England).

There is a part of me that wishes I didn't spend so much money and kept it in the bank for their education, or even spent 1/2 of what we did and took other trips to cheaper destinations. I don't know anyone's kids personally but mine are just as content staying in a nice hotel for 1 night and using the pool as they are taking a cruise through the islands. My family doesn't go into debt for vacations, but there are so many things you can do for little to no money which will make great memories.

I think people (the adults) need to admit to themselves that it's really not all about what the kids want, it's what they want.

 

[mumom95]

I think people (the adults) need to admit to themselves that it's really not all about what the kids want, it's what they want.

Oh, I have no problem admitting that. I love to travel, and when I do, I prefer to do it "nicer" than "cheaper". Now, I have done plenty of the cheap vacations too, and have loved those also because honestly I just love getting away with my family.


But yes, when we do the expensive vacations, I'm doing it for me as much (if not more) than the kids.

Now, my kids have stayed in expensive hotels and cheap hotels, and if they had their choice, they would stay in the expensive ones (given a choice between the All Stars and the Wilderness Lodge, my kids would pick Wilderness Lodge hands down). But, they never complain when we do the cheap places, they are just glad to be going away. The minute they start comlaining about the choice of hotel on vacation is the minute I stop taking them on vacation with me

 

[Ka' eo]

After reading Ka'eos posts I feel like cancelling my trip and doing the budget staycation route this year. My kids are little but have been to Disney many times and have mentioned that they would like to go to other destinations (like England).

There is a part of me that wishes I didn't spend so much money and kept it in the bank for their education, or even spent 1/2 of what we did and took other trips to cheaper destinations. I don't know anyone's kids personally but mine are just as content staying in a nice hotel for 1 night and using the pool as they are taking a cruise through the islands. My family doesn't go into debt for vacations, but there are so many things you can do for little to no money which will make great memories.

I think people (the adults) need to admit to themselves that it's really not all about what the kids want, it's what they want.

We have had great fun Ava! We rented a cabin by a lake. It cost a few hundred bucks, we had to drive to the OPs state for a reunion last summer and stayed at a state park for peanuts in a neat cabin, we went to NYC and saw Wicked (grandma paid for the tix! I found the cheap hotel room for $75 on hotwire and we took the Staten Island Ferry (which is FREE) to get a glimpse of the city and lady liberty instead of some expensive tour. We kayak, swim, go to museums....We could have afforded the Poly this year, but I canceled it and decided to go offsite, and we are doing an uber budget trip instead. The kids will be so happy with whatever we do and are focused on Blizzard Beach and which ride at MK we'll hit first, and I can plan a trip to Chichinitza and Tulum in the Yucatan for next year with some of the money we saved canceling the Poly. Our kids are still young, and my hope is to go to Europe in 2-3 years. I consider us very fortunate.

The one debt you won't ever hear me b--ch about is a student loan. Our graduate degrees more than paid for themselves.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Based on my childhood only - nobody NEEDS a vacation. Aside from a couple of trips to visit grandparents in another state, we went on ONE my entire time growing up - and three of us went on NONE.

My parents took adult trips, sure - but children need loving parents and good, caring upbringing. They don't "need" trips.

 

[jodifla]

You live in MI and you are telling us how bad it in there. Do you think some of them might have liked some of that vacation money in the bank so they did not lose thier homes?

Would you kid prefer to tell others about Italy or the home he still lives in? It is possible with your CC debt and a job los you could lose your home, as so many are in MI.

Really is it that hard to see how saving is a good thing? You can be a saver and still vacation. When your debt and vacations are preventing you from saving then your priorities are not in balance.

If you had some cash in the bank you could have bought those tickets without incurring CC debt. Just think of what you could have done with all that interest that you paid the CC company? That may have been another tirp to see your Dad or another night of vacation.

The thing is, once you lose your income, savings eventually run out. It's never enough. So no, I don't regret any of our vacations taken over the last 30 years. While trips years ago when we were young tended to be charged, these days we pay cash for them. (And remember I grew up next to WDW, so my trips there tended to be day trips when I was young.)

And we have quite a bit in savings. We have a college fund, both cash and prepaid tuition, several 401(k)s, two pension plans, and cash savings. We could last months, but probably not years. Truth is, no one could.

I'm not sure why you leaped to the conclusion we have no savings.

My point was life is about balance. So I'd be culling out some money for savings, and some money for vacations. I also try to take on extra work to pay for things extras these days.

I certainly agree you don't need huge blowout vacations every year...in fact for us, it was traveling with fun people that made for the best vacations, not necessarily where we stayed. For several years we went to a campground on the beach in Florida for a weekend, and I considered that a great vacation!

 

[Colleen27]

The thing is, once you lose your income, savings eventually run out. It's never enough. So no, I don't regret any of our vacations taken over the last 30 years. While trips years ago when we were young tended to be charged, these days we pay cash for them. (And remember I grew up next to WDW, so my trips there tended to be day trips when I was young.)

And we have quite a bit in savings. We have a college fund, both cash and prepaid tuition, several 401(k)s, two pension plans, and cash savings. We could last months, but probably not years. Truth is, no one could.

I'm not sure why you leaped to the conclusion we have no savings.

My point was life is about balance. So I'd be culling out some money for savings, and some money for vacations. I also try to take on extra work to pay for things extras these days.

I certainly agree you don't need huge blowout vacations every year...in fact for us, it was traveling with fun people that made for the best vacations, not necessarily where we stayed. For several years we went to a campground on the beach in Florida for a weekend, and I considered that a great vacation!

Exactly. I have to admit, seeing what we've been seeing around us over the last 2 years or so has made me rethink my financial priorities. At some point, I think you have to accept that you're reasonably well prepared and then put the worry aside and live a little.

I also think that conventional financial wisdom has it all backwards right now (apologies to the DR fans) - I think a lot of people would be better of to forget about the interest rates and long term costs and focus instead on real security in case the worst happens. Paying off a credit card saves on interest and fees; paying off a car or a home means that no one can take your means of transportation or your residence if you're out of work long enough to deplete your savings.