Do You Think Non-Dis Vets are Beginning to Notice Penny-Pinching?

[jkh36619]

If Disney wants only one-and-done visitors--which I don't believe they do or why would they still be selling DVC, for example--but, even so, if this is what they wanted, that'd be tremendously short-sighted of them.

Yes, the DISboard is a place for us devotees, but nearly everyone with enough money to spend on a vacation is on some kind of social media. And word of mouth speaks louder than any advertising campaign possibly could.

How could Disney possibly not want their one-time-only guests to go home and tell their friends and contacts what a terrific place WDW is? How, sure, it's pricey, but you get so much for your money and this, that, and the other are amazing. And maybe some of those one-time-only guests become repeat visitors and/or DVC owners.

The only one-and-done visitor I know is my SIL. To be accurate, she was actually twice-and-done, since she took both her DDs there on separate trips. She did zero research, stayed at an All Stars even though she could easily have afforded the Poly, for example, didn't know about or use FP, and when she talks about the trip, mentions only the swimming pool. I seriously doubt this is the kind of person WDW wants coming to the parks. She spent practically no money while there, didn't even have a TS meal, and would never go back. She cannot understand what it is I like so much about WDW and it's impossible to explain it to her.

What I'm trying to get across is that it seems to be that WDW is very dependent on its repeat guests. If all they wanted were wealthy families with $25K to spend on a week-long vacation, they wouldn't advertise, they wouldn't offer discounts--yes, they still do--and they'd probably close the parks at 4 pm every day, since they wouldn't want to spend the money on CMs.

Exactly, They have DVC and 36,000 rooms to fill. You don't fill those with one and done visitors.

 

[Jrb1979]

Exactly, They have DVC and 36,000 rooms to fill. You don't fill those with one and done visitors.

While true they certainly aren't doing a good job lately of attracting people to come more often.

 

[MaC410]

The prices of things are absurd but that's not what truly makes me sad and frustrated. It's all the lost benefits that drives me the most crazy. No more magical express that made us feel like our vacation truly started and we were in the "Disney Bubble" the moment we arrived at the airport. No more evening extra magic hours unless staying at an insanely priced deluxe resort. No more FastPass+ that allowed us to basically do any ride (except for the hugely popular ones) whenever we wanted with minimal wait and allowed us to do them multiple times a day without much wait. It's these things that really put a damper on our desire to return. The only thing that's making us feel like we still want to go is that my wife and I had our first kid a few months ago and our ways of doing Disney World was going to change anyway where we couldn't really utilize those benefits in the same way on future trips. It's just really depressing seeing how much has been taken away.

 

[dez1978]

The greed comment is trash.

A publicly traded company increasing its top line by driving new income isn’t greedy. I legitimately don’t understand how anyone can reasonably believe this to be true. Is it honestly your position that they should give you more for less?

It’s always the good old days of what Disney used to give me compared to now… go to your local MLB park and tell me what food, parking and merchandise costs look like compared to the 90s.

I don't think they should give me more for less. But I do think if they are going to charge more than ever before it shouldn't be for a lesser experience. If they were giving the same quality of customer service, food, entertainment etc as prepandemic and charging more for it, i'd probably be ok with that. But to have LESS of all of that and still charge more is a problem. Sure the prices have gone up at local restaraunts, but the product/service quality is the same. Charging more for less is not the same. And to say that its to enhance the guest experience is obviously bull, because even ppl who've not been on these boards are noticing and not happy.

 

[MaC410]

I don't think they should give me more for less. But I do think if they are going to charge more than ever before it shouldn't be for a lesser experience. If they were giving the same quality of customer service, food, entertainment etc as prepandemic and charging more for it, i'd probably be ok with that. But to have LESS of all of that and still charge more is a problem. Sure the prices have gone up at local restaraunts, but the product/service quality is the same. Charging more for less is not the same. And to say that its to enhance the guest experience is obviously bull, because even ppl who've not been on these boards are noticing and not happy.

Yeah this is the problem. Nobody is expecting more for less. What we should expect is at least the same for more because price increasing is unfortunately just something that happens everywhere. It's the constant removal of things that aren't replaced or "free" things changed to worse systems at an extra charge that is making people upset.

 

[New Mouse]

Yeah. I pay for everything everywhere. Nothing is free. The price to replace every single dropped Mickey bar with a "free" one is baked into the price of everybody else's vacation.
But it looks free for the customers that get an extra one instead of outraging all the other guests that are paying for it. We have always paid for fast pass, but genie costing money has people feeling some type of way. Perception is a hell of a thing.

Which is why it's odd they didn't just hide those costs for genie elsewhere.

 

[PaladinButters]

Which is why it's odd they didn't just hide those costs for genie elsewhere.

It's in the next ticket increase. We'll be paying twice.

 

[Chilbert]

Yeah this is the problem. Nobody is expecting more for less. What we should expect is at least the same for more because price increasing is unfortunately just something that happens everywhere. It's the constant removal of things that aren't replaced or "free" things changed to worse systems at an extra charge that is making people upset.

I remember a few years ago, a big Annual Pass price increase (but wait, we now include Photopass making it a great deal). Now they raise the price and strip the Photopass back out and charge for it separately again. The magic is now all about making things disappear.

While Walt always wanted to "plus it", it is obvious that the only thing Chapek wants to "plus" are the prices.

 

[HashberryOTG]

Which is why it's odd they didn't just hide those costs for genie elsewhere.

I think it's all about perspective. Some people didn't even use it, whether that be out of not knowing, didn't matter to them, whatever the case might be. By making it a separate charge, we all have the choice if we want it or not. If they bake it into a price, we all pay for it whether we want it or not. Prices were going up anyways, but likely would have went up just that little bit more to take that choice away from me and have me pay it whether I want it or not.

 

[jujubiee4]

The prices of things are absurd but that's not what truly makes me sad and frustrated. It's all the lost benefits that drives me the most crazy. No more magical express that made us feel like our vacation truly started and we were in the "Disney Bubble" the moment we arrived at the airport. No more evening extra magic hours unless staying at an insanely priced deluxe resort.

Out of everything lost....and there are many things, I hate with a passion they are not open late
anymore. Growing up we would stay until midnight 1 am or later! Anyone remember those days?

Flying cross country I do not want to get up 4 am our time to head to the parks on a "vacation".
When the late night hours were open to EVERYONE we didn't have to do that. Heck even their
"extended hours" for deluxe is nothing to write home about.

 

[Arielfan98]

I don't think they should give me more for less. But I do think if they are going to charge more than ever before it shouldn't be for a lesser experience. If they were giving the same quality of customer service, food, entertainment etc as prepandemic and charging more for it, i'd probably be ok with that. But to have LESS of all of that and still charge more is a problem. Sure the prices have gone up at local restaraunts, but the product/service quality is the same. Charging more for less is not the same. And to say that its to enhance the guest experience is obviously bull, because even ppl who've not been on these boards are noticing and not happy.

Well said.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

If Disney wants only one-and-done visitors--which I don't believe they do or why would they still be selling DVC, for example--but, even so, if this is what they wanted, that'd be tremendously short-sighted of them.

Yes, the DISboard is a place for us devotees, but nearly everyone with enough money to spend on a vacation is on some kind of social media. And word of mouth speaks louder than any advertising campaign possibly could.

How could Disney possibly not want their one-time-only guests to go home and tell their friends and contacts what a terrific place WDW is? How, sure, it's pricey, but you get so much for your money and this, that, and the other are amazing. And maybe some of those one-time-only guests become repeat visitors and/or DVC owners.

The only one-and-done visitor I know is my SIL. To be accurate, she was actually twice-and-done, since she took both her DDs there on separate trips. She did zero research, stayed at an All Stars even though she could easily have afforded the Poly, for example, didn't know about or use FP, and when she talks about the trip, mentions only the swimming pool. I seriously doubt this is the kind of person WDW wants coming to the parks. She spent practically no money while there, didn't even have a TS meal, and would never go back. She cannot understand what it is I like so much about WDW and it's impossible to explain it to her.

What I'm trying to get across is that it seems to be that WDW is very dependent on its repeat guests. If all they wanted were wealthy families with $25K to spend on a week-long vacation, they wouldn't advertise, they wouldn't offer discounts--yes, they still do--and they'd probably close the parks at 4 pm every day, since they wouldn't want to spend the money on CMs.

I think it depends on the guests, DVC is securing stays from a long term commitment, they get their money no matter what happens, that would be a bad decision to move on from that.

I think you're missing the point, that Disney has a loyal base, and they are constantly adding, and dropping certain demographics, (for instance, families with young children v families with adult children) who aren't hardos. Disney doesn't need word of mouth, you're kidding yourself if you think they do, ( if someone said they had a miserable time at Disney, i'm pretty sure people would look at them sideways, if they said it was too expensive, i think everyone would acknowledge that they already knew that haha). I think you'd be hard pressed to find a child in America who didn't know/ want to visit Disney world, and for most parents, that's enough to book a trip.

I believe the statistics say that 20% of WDW guests are repeat, and Disney Land is the opposite, i could be wrong, but i'm pretty sure i read that. It makes sense when you think about it, there are literally 1000's of vacation spots all over the world, why would most people be beholden to WDW. Most every company offers discounts throughout the year, it's basic business, when business is typically lacking, have a "sale" to drive up revenue. The price of a cast member is a drop in the bucket for what they make off each guest, so that again would be bad business.

I'm not saying Disney has a plan to make everyone a 1 time visitor, (repeat business is always important) what I'm saying is, if that is indeed what their information is telling them, then jacking up the price makes sense, because they probably won't be coming back again anyways

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Yeah this is the problem. Nobody is expecting more for less. What we should expect is at least the same for more because price increasing is unfortunately just something that happens everywhere. It's the constant removal of things that aren't replaced or "free" things changed to worse systems at an extra charge that is making people upset.

This is why i don't think Disney should have ever offered perks in the first place. They would never be able to pivot away from them, because people would be in an uproar because that was something that they priced into their trip, and now it's being taken away. It really is a lose lose situation for them.

I think Disney has had to cut back on a lot because of Covid, there are problems all over the country with hiring right now, and they lost a lot of experienced staff when Poop hit the fan, (we can argue about whether or not they should have released so many CM's, but that's beside the point). I do think a lot will return over the next few years, but it is going to take time to recover. I don't know about you, but i've noticed the change in pretty much any hospitality establishment, so this is not unique to Disney. People have a lot of personal admiration for Disney, and can't wrap their minds around hard business decisions that make changes to something they love so much, which seems to come out as anger, and spite. I think everyone just needs to take a deep breath

 

[Chilbert]

This is why i don't think Disney should have ever offered perks in the first place. They would never be able to pivot away from them, because people would be in an uproar because that was something that they priced into their trip, and now it's being taken away. It really is a lose lose situation for them.

It's ironic that many years ago I worked for a Disney CEO who was famous for saying "once you give someone something for free, you will never be able to charge for it again..."

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

It's ironic that many years ago I worked for a Disney CEO who was famous for saying "once you give someone something for free, you will never be able to charge for it again..."

I don't disagree, it just drives me a little nutty that people can't understand that it was a free "perk" and not something that Disney always offered, or had to continue to offer. Give it a few years, and people will move on and talk about the good ol days, they've done it before, (paper fast passes to FP+) and they'll do it again.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

There may be a supply chain issue but providing a plastic bag instead of the sturdier case is undoubtedly saving Disney money. If they weren’t penny pinching they could provide a voucher for a free bag when they become available or a discount for the bags they sell. It definitely comes across as a cost cutting move.

Wrong.

Disney is offering a 10% discount on the lightsabers right now, which is *far* more than the value of the junky bags they used to provide. They're losing money on this.

 

[Beer Me]

Wrong.

Disney is offering a 10% discount on the lightsabers right now, which is *far* more than the value of the junky bags they used to provide. They're losing money on this.

That news came out after I made my comment. Kudos to disney for doing something good for their customers and combatting some of the bad PR.

 

[MaC410]

This is why i don't think Disney should have ever offered perks in the first place. They would never be able to pivot away from them, because people would be in an uproar because that was something that they priced into their trip, and now it's being taken away. It really is a lose lose situation for them.

I think Disney has had to cut back on a lot because of Covid, there are problems all over the country with hiring right now, and they lost a lot of experienced staff when Poop hit the fan, (we can argue about whether or not they should have released so many CM's, but that's beside the point). I do think a lot will return over the next few years, but it is going to take time to recover. I don't know about you, but i've noticed the change in pretty much any hospitality establishment, so this is not unique to Disney. People have a lot of personal admiration for Disney, and can't wrap their minds around hard business decisions that make changes to something they love so much, which seems to come out as anger, and spite. I think everyone just needs to take a deep breath

Here's the thing... Sure, there's probably a lot of business decisions that needed to be made because of problems caused by Covid and I can understand those. But there's also things that at least are seeming to be done because Covid gave them the opportunity to do it as sad as that sounds. There's really no excuse for the change in the fastpass system other then looking to get more money out of people and give them less. They have probably been itching to be able to take away "free" fastpasses for years and Covid gave them the chance to take it away and bring it back for some service they'll claim is better for the guest experience but charge them for it. Nothing anyone says will ever change my opinion on this. That may seem stubborn but this specific change has really angered me because it feels like they used Covid to their advantage to get more money out of people and give them less.

 

[Jrb1979]

Here's the thing... Sure, there's probably a lot of business decisions that needed to be made because of problems caused by Covid and I can understand those. But there's also things that at least are seeming to be done because Covid gave them the opportunity to do it as sad as that sounds. There's really no excuse for the change in the fastpass system other then looking to get more money out of people and give them less. They have probably been itching to be able to take away "free" fastpasses for years and Covid gave them the chance to take it away and bring it back for some service they'll claim is better for the guest experience but charge them for it. Nothing anyone says will ever change my opinion on this. That may seem stubborn but this specific change has really angered me because it feels like they used Covid to their advantage to get more money out of people and give them less.

You can add Magic Express to that as well. A lot of the cuts were things they always wanted to do. You can add limiting APs as well.

 

[Arielfan98]

You can add Magic Express to that as well. A lot of the cuts were things they always wanted to do. You can add limiting APs as well.

I agree. Some perks I understood them taking away such as the free dining plan with the appetizers and desserts. Disney was definitely losing money by having guests get so much free food. Heck, I was even happy to pay for the dining plan for the sake of convenance. At least food is understandable because we all need to eat and it was an optional service.

This is why i don't think Disney should have ever offered perks in the first place. They would never be able to pivot away from them, because people would be in an uproar because that was something that they priced into their trip, and now it's being taken away. It really is a lose lose situation for them.

I think Disney has had to cut back on a lot because of Covid, there are problems all over the country with hiring right now, and they lost a lot of experienced staff when Poop hit the fan, (we can argue about whether or not they should have released so many CM's, but that's beside the point). I do think a lot will return over the next few years, but it is going to take time to recover. I don't know about you, but i've noticed the change in pretty much any hospitality establishment, so this is not unique to Disney. People have a lot of personal admiration for Disney, and can't wrap their minds around hard business decisions that make changes to something they love so much, which seems to come out as anger, and spite. I think everyone just needs to take a deep breath

For arguments sake, I will agree with you even though I personally disagree. Think about all the non-cost related changes Disney has made. Sure, if you really wanted to, you could link money to anything. Let's talk about the magic and stellar service. That doesn't rly cost them extra. Oh yeah, let's not forget resort parking. Again, sure you could argue that Disney has to pay for parking lot maintenance....but let's think about it, I don't think it's my problem to pay for parking lot maintenance if I'm already paying $$$ to come here. Disney should find more creative and appealing ways to market their upcharges. Charging cars per night as opposed to per stay? That is ridiculous. Changing of the times with business practices would fairly suggest to me that they charge a car per stay, not per night. So if I'm parking 1 car at my hotel for the duration of 8 nights, I pay one flat rate for 8 nights. If Disney did fine without charging parking in the past, I'm sure they could do just fine without it or at least with the flat rate I stated above, and if I recall correctly, this was prior pandemic. ALSO, let's not forget that it doesn't make sense to charge guests at more deluxe hotels more money to park per night. Yes, from a money perspective you'd think wealthier guests will afford higher parking rates, but this again speaks to the issue of returning guests. If I'm spending $$$ on a wdw vacation and already paying for a deluxe hotel room, I DO not want to return to this. Why not go to the cheaper hotel that has cheaper parking?