Do you all ever get jealous of non-savers?

[crisi]

We decided to go international because we wanted a for sure thing and a healthy baby. The process for adopting a domestic infant is not a sure thing - birth mothers usually pick their babies parents, and that can take years - or never happen. Also, about half of those situations are "disrupted" - meaning the birthmother decides to parent the child herself. While there are a lot of kids domestically available - in our state there are no infants available - even special needs or non-white infants are adopted quickly - and most often by their foster parents who enter the foster care system for that reason. The kids that are available through the state have almost universally been abused - mentally, physically or sexually and almost always come in sibling groups. While I admire people who parent these kids (regardless of if they can have bio kids), it is a calling beyond normal parenting.

The process for international adoption will vary depending on what state you are in, which agency you use, and what country you adopt from. For Korea, no travel is required - we picked up our son at the airport. For Columbia, six weeks in Columbia is required to complete the adoption. For much of Eastern Europe, two trips are required. For Korea, we were not required to have a dossier assembled and translated, for China you are. Some adoptions are very expensive, some are less expensive - none are cheap. However, considering that labor and delivery costs, plus six months of care, plus transportation from Korea, plus care and counseling for his birthmom, plus our own homestudy, plus extra money went into South Korea's system to take care of kids who won't be adopted or had greater medical needs than our son - we thought ours was pretty reasonably priced

If I were starting now, I'd do some internet research and call a few local agencies. The agencies will have you attend an orientation. Attend a couple - that will give you an idea of how different agencies do things - some are very focused on International, some on domestic, some have longer timelines, some are more expensive.

 

[Amirah95]

You will definitely find it very very hard to get a baby to adopt (birth to 2 years) here in the US, but there are so many children here over the ages of 2 who need good homes. My parents adopted three brothers (they are now 12, 15 and 17 years of age) and they are great up to this point. My parents also knew they could have had acquired some very undesireable children, but they took the chance anyway and now they say that they are blessed.

I have to do some research regarding the health of overseas children vs. American children up for adoption. I think the main reason for people adopting outside the United States because it's easier and convenient.

Every child, no matter where he/she lives, deserves a good home. So which ever way some may decide to go it is still a good public service.

 

[wuv tigger]

Originally posted by Amirah95
Why adopt children from another country when we have many children here in the US needing good homes? When we inquired about adopting an Asian child a few years ago (when they said we couldn't have children--go figure!) they said the entire bill can come out to 25k not including the several trips you need to take over to there to those other countries.

What is the process?

Tanya,

Several potential reasons:

1. International is a surer thing. There is a more defined timeline and not as much waiting. Can be as little as 6 months for some countries.

2. No birth parent issues. Most international children are orphans or abandoned. There are no issues dealing with birth parents and some people prefer this.

3. More choice. You usually have more choice about the children. There are more available and you can choose boy or girl for instance.

4. Timing. Most available children in the US are older, black/biracial, or special needs. If you are looking for a healthy white infant the wait can be several years or never.

5. Cost is about the same. Our second adoption was about $19k when everything was completed.

The process varies by country, but basically is the same as the domestic process -paperwork, criminal checks, home study, interviews, etc. plus you usually have to make at least one visit to appear before the judge in the foreign country.

Hope this helps.

David

 

[weezer64]

I have to add another thought to this conversation....

I have children on both ends of the spectrum...one who has recently graduated high school, one just entering high school, and one who is just starting kindergarten.

I have always FIRMLY believed that being a SAHM is the best and you could not convince me otherwise. My "dreams" and "aspirations" have always been to be a mother, a wife. My dreams go no further than that and I'm quite content in my role.

I had working parents growing up and got into LOTS of trouble and had quite a bit of resentment when DM decided to enter the workforce. I loved coming home from school to smell dinner cooking and having my mom there to ask about my day. Then *boom* I'm coming home to an empty house and I was having to do my mother's jobs.

So this is probably the root of my cemented opinion.

HOWEVER....

I didn't say it was the RIGHT opinion.

Sure, I am able to be here for them and I love it. I have always raised my children to expect to go to college, as if there were no choice. That lasted until my DD's senior year. She had/has a serious boyfriend who "takes care of her". Guess what? Her plans for college went down the drain, she moved in with him, she doesn't have a job. I have been torn up about this and there is one thing that is just echoing thru my head............

She sees ME as having a man take care of me, and she wants to be like dear old mom. Shopping at the mall, going out to lunch with the girls, the FUN stuff. (of course she ignores the WORK involved) I am thinking now that I have not provided her with the role model of a working woman, therefore why college? I, the SAHM, am the role model!

So quickly...I have changed how I talk around the house. I do LOTS of volunteer work and I've never really brought my children into that or explained what I do to them. I just do it. Well, for the past year I have been calling it "work"......Mom has to go to "work". DD5 doesn't realize there isn't a paycheck involved. She just sees that I'm leaving to go to "work".

I guess my point is this....

It's all about balance. I DO see working moms who put work first and it disgusts me. The biggest gift we can give our children is our time and the time we have with them is SO fleeting, trust me I know. But the majority of the moms I see who are working, make the time. My DH works and HE makes the time......and DD is just as close with him as she is with me.

I could have a lot more 'things' if I did work....but I'm not interested. We each have a passion, something to give to the world. For me, it's being fully immersed in my family 24/7. For others it could be being a nurse and easing someone's suffering, or a teacher that teaches my children how to read.......

We are all valuable assets to society and we should all be proud of our roles.

I applaud anyone who goes with their gut and lives their dream.....be it working or not.

 

[Amirah95]

You know what...I have been thinking about this topic of the SAHM and if I could be a SAHM I think I would be. It's not an option FOR ME now because I have done too much to not have a career. DH and I put children on the backburner to further our education and to start our careers and only started trying to have a child after 10 years of marriage. I had no idea it would get harder as you got older but we are blessed with one.

I think about all the time I could have and could spend with my DD...I barely see my DH! I guess there is a trade off with everything you do in life. That's why I make it my business to have at least two vacations per year to spend with my family, like going to DISNEY WORLD!

 

[Took]

As a community college faculty member, I want to suggest that those either looking down the road at college expenses or those that are facing those expenses now consider the local community college as an alternative to expensive universities (for the first two years, at any rate). A little investigating into the quality and cost of courses at the local cc's may well prove worth the effort. Not every cc offers equally good programs in every area, but most offer a good number of courses that are equivalent to those offered by more expensive schools (sometimes, as many students will attest, the freshman experience is even better since faculty generally can spend more one-on-one time with students). The savings, in most cases, is tremendous.

Again, it's important to do your homework. Talk to faculty at the school and get a feel for what they can offer your child. Our school offers "honors" courses for excellent students that really do mimic anything I've seen (as student and teacher) at state universities.

Oh, yeah, and part of our "savings" is the knowledge that our DD can attend either my cc or my DH's (50 miles away) for free.

 

[Amirah95]

Yes! My DD can attend my college or her DH's college for free too because we are both college professors.

Hey Took, what dept are you in? Do you do any research work? I'm in the Psychology and Sociology depts and my DH is in the Math dept. We also do research for the state of NJ.

 

[crisi]

Amirah,

You may want to be aware that the question "why did you adopt from overseas when there are so many kids in need of homes here" reads to a lot of adopted parents like the following: "Why did you have bio kids when there are a lot of kids in need of parents already born."

I didn't adopt to help a child. I adopted out of the completely selfish motive of having a child and being a parent. Had I selflessly wanted merely to help, I could have done a lot of other things than adopt a healthy South Korean infant. I certainly did not adopt out of a desire for "public service" any more than anyone else gave birth to their children out of a sense that they were obligated to do some "greater good."

I know you don't mean to come off as insensitive or offensive - and I am certainly not offended. But I know a lot of adoptive parents who would be spitting blood over your comments and I thought you might want to know before you unintetionally offended someone.

 

[Amirah95]

Crisi,

You did get offended because if you didn't you wouldn't have responded to my post telling me you were not offended by it. I was just asking a simple question. I have once looked into adopting a child overseas and yes, it was because I desperately wanted a child and that was the quickest solution for me as well as for others. After I got pregnant (thankfully), I got rid of the idea and thought about adopting one here because for "me" it would be a public service. It is very true that there are many children in the USA who need good homes so I'm standing by that.

I certainly did not intentionally try to offend anyone who has adopted a child outside of the USA and I apologize if you think I did.

 

[lilpritch04]

OK, we're not quite *savers* yet because when we got married I took on a lot of DH's debt and we are paying that off--we should be done by next March!!!

Anyway, it is really hard for us not to spend because so many of our friends just go out and buy things all the time. Right now, we all make about the same amount of money, but they have much nicer things and are always upgrading! We too would have more money if we weren't paying off his CC but not enough to live like they do. I know that they have large amounts of debt--they all seem to talk freely about it--and I'm not jealous of that, I just wish I had the nice new things!

It is especially hard not to splurge when DH's twin bro buys, buys, buys and then asks why we don't have anything. Oh well. We will be happy when we retire 10 years before they do!!

We are trying really hard to break out of our generation--the generation that uses plastic for everything because you can't take it with you! Once we pay off everything that will only mean more money each month to our retirement plans and a few dollars here and there for a nice dinner out.

 

[crisi]

Huh? No I wasn't offended, but I am offended by people telling me what my feelings are.

If its such a great public service, why haven't you gone out and adopted one of those needy children instead of having bio kids? Those needy kids still have needs - your fertility isn't the point.

 

[Amirah95]

If you let it go...then I'll let it go.

 

[Lisa P.]

...debt and we are paying that off--we should be done by next March!!! ... Once we pay off everything that will only mean more money each month to our retirement plans and a few dollars here and there for a nice dinner out.

Awesome. You will LOVE living without debt! Guard it.

We are trying really hard to break out of our generation--the generation that uses plastic for everything because you can't take it with you!

I agree, lilpritch04, this is hard to do. But once you get used to this way of living and looking at purchases, it becomes much easier to continue. Three things have made me more aware of how much we actually have so we don't want for much more.

One is decluttering our home. When tossing so much out, and having to get rid of something everytime we get something new to take its place, I have seen how very much we've purchased that we really didn't need. Life was actually no different after all those splurges than when we thought we "had" to have them in the first place.

The second is seeing that we have enjoyed what we have saved for so much more by avoiding money stresses. It has really changed the level of relaxation in our home! This has included some wonderful trips too... on a budget! For some time, I thought that I'd like to splurge a bit more on trips if it didn't mean debt & money worries.

Then the third one kicked in... we meet more and more people who cannot afford any extras. People who have battled one family or health crisis after another for so many years that their options for spending have virtually all been eliminated. Often, they've made a conscious decision to do what is best, knowing it was going to be devastating financially. We've watched as God has still provided once in a while for a splurge in their lives, when others have shared their good fortune with these struggling families. All this has made us more appreciative and focused on how we've been blessed rather than on how we've sacrificed or "missed out." It's funny how we can so easily feel let down when not getting "the best" of something... only to later realize that it didn't mean anything at all in the bigger scheme of things - nothing at all.

Enjoy your hard-earned "win" in March!!!

 

[BethR]

It seems as if this thread has gone far astray from discussing the "saving" lifestyle.

I am going to close this thread. If someone would like to restart it, please feel free, but please remember to keep to the topic at hand, and to keep personal comments to e-mail or Private Message.

Thank you.